Connecting Yamaha P45 digital piano to 3rd Generation iPad

[Graeme]

Please help me help Wifey :-)

Wifey is using software on her iPad to learn the piano. The iPad hears
whatever she plays on the P45, and highlights errors. Works well, but
sometimes the iPad misses a note, so plan B is to hard wire the two
together, which is where we get lost.

The P45 has a 'square' type USB socket, and the iPad has a 30 pin (NOT
lightening) connector.

Reference to a Yamaha manual shows various connections, some of which
are marked 'MIDI data only - audio signal not supported'. We don't know
whether we need MIDI or signal or both. Anyone?

I *think* we need an iPad camera connector. Anyone know?

Finally, assuming we get the correct connector and it all works, will
the P45 charge the iPad battery whilst in use?

Thanks!
--
Graeme

[Dave Liquorice]

On Sat, 4 Mar 2017 13:06:45 +0000, Graeme wrote:

> Wifey is using software on her iPad to learn the piano. The iPad hears
> whatever she plays on the P45, and highlights errors. Works well, but
> sometimes the iPad misses a note, so plan B is to hard wire the two
> together, which is where we get lost.

So the iPad is listening to the sounds made by the piano?

Does the iPad have socket for a 3.5 mm headset, or even a microphone?
Apple, so it might not or if it does it'll be a propritary connector
or on that 30 pin jobbie. Google is your friend, you're looking for a
way to get an audio signal into the iPad in place of its internal
microphone.

The P45 has a headphone out but plugging headphones in cuts the loud
speakers, so you'd have to find some way of splitting the signal from
the P45 to amp/speakers (aux in on your HiFi) and to the input of the
iPad.
The input to the iPad is also likely to be low (microphone) level so
you'll need to attenuate the headphone signal before feeding to the
iPad. Not difficult, a small 10 k ohmn trimmer potentiometr will do.

MIDI is a serial data stream, common on electronic musical
instruments but I'd be very suprised if an iPad supports it.

The P45 expects to connect to a USB host ie a PC. An iPad also
expects to connect to a USB host. Does Apple have support of OTG
cables? Even if it does will the error checking software take input
from USB?

--
Cheers
Dave.

[misterroy]

this is mabe what you are after, I use an older one with the guitar
http://www.ikmultimedia.com/products/irigmidi2/

[Graeme]

In message <c2681c36-aaf9-472a...@googlegroups.com>,
misterroy <rgdav...@gmail.com> writes

>this is mabe what you are after, I use an older one with the guitar
>http://www.ikmultimedia.com/products/irigmidi2/

Thank you. That looks perfect but, at a hundred pounds, I could buy her
an android tablet and avoid compatibility issues forever!
--
Graeme

[Graeme]

In message <nyyfbegfubjuvyypb...@news.individual.net>,
Dave Liquorice <allsortsn...@howhill.com> writes

>On Sat, 4 Mar 2017 13:06:45 +0000, Graeme wrote:
>
>> Wifey is using software on her iPad to learn the piano. The iPad hears
>> whatever she plays on the P45, and highlights errors. Works well, but
>> sometimes the iPad misses a note, so plan B is to hard wire the two
>> together, which is where we get lost.
>
>So the iPad is listening to the sounds made by the piano?

Thanks Dave. I hear all that you say and, once again, regret buying an
Apple product. The iPad is great at what it does, but connecting it to
anything is a minefield of different connectors and iOS versions. We
have been doing quite a lot of reading, and there is a perfect device
available, which works only up to the iOS version one below hers.

My understanding is that the iPad hears individual notes perfectly, but
sometimes struggles with chords. Wifey is asking on a suitable support
group but, TBH, it really needs to be something simple that she can
easily plug and unplug as required, as she does not always use the iPad,
and does not always use the same app.

--
Graeme

[misterroy]

the i rig 1 might do it, less than a tenner on ebay

[Dave Liquorice]

On Sat, 4 Mar 2017 17:44:53 +0000, Graeme wrote:

> Thanks Dave. I hear all that you say and, once again, regret buying an
> Apple product. The iPad is great at what it does, but connecting it to
> anything is a minefield of different connectors and iOS versions.

That's sort of why I went down the KISS method of just shove audio
into the iPad. The MIDI route depends on the app(s) understanding
MIDI or converted to USB MIDI stream. It already understands audio.

> My understanding is that the iPad hears individual notes perfectly, but
> sometimes struggles with chords.

It may be worth playing with the volume of the piano and the position
of the iPad relative to the speakers. Maybe when a chord is played
the iPad is picking up key noise, particulary if it's resting on the
piano.

> TBH, it really needs to be something simple that she can easily plug and
> unplug as required, as she does not always use the iPad, and does not
> always use the same app.

Can't get much simpler that pulling a couple of plugs out.

--
Cheers
Dave.

[Graeme]

In message <nyyfbegfubjuvyypb...@news.individual.net>,
Dave Liquorice <allsortsn...@howhill.com> writes

Result! After much reading, we found a genuine (i.e. expensive) Apple
connector for the job, although it reminded me why I avoid Apple
products.

Anyway, 18 quid later, a connector arrived today, and works perfectly.
By way of a bonus, not only does the iPad now hear every note played,
but Wifey's 'score' when playing has increased so she is graded a little
higher than before.

Thanks for all the help.
--
Graeme

[Dave Liquorice]

On Thu, 16 Mar 2017 13:28:57 +0000, Graeme wrote:

> Result! After much reading, we found a genuine (i.e. expensive) Apple
> connector for the job, although it reminded me why I avoid Apple
> products.

Glad you found a solution and that it has improved things. Which hole
on the piano does it plg into?

--
Cheers
Dave.

[Graeme]

In message <nyyfbegfubjuvyypb...@news.individual.net>,
Dave Liquorice <allsortsn...@howhill.com> writes

I'm not clear on the terminology, but the piano socket is one of those
'square' USB holes I normally associate with printers and cameras. We
use a lead with that plug on one end and conventional USB plug on the
other. The adaptor itself has conventional USB socket on one end and
Apple 30 pin connector on the other. The App on the Apple immediately
recognised the piano connection.

--
Graeme

[Adrian Caspersz]

On 21/03/17 06:59, Graeme wrote:

> I'm not clear on the terminology, but the piano socket is one of those
> 'square' USB holes I normally associate with printers and cameras. We
> use a lead with that plug on one end and conventional USB plug on the
> other. The adaptor itself has conventional USB socket on one end and
> Apple 30 pin connector on the other. The App on the Apple immediately
> recognised the piano connection.
>

Sounds like it is the Apple Camera Connection kit. Their On-The-Go type
thing.

https://www.cnet.com/uk/how-to/secrets-of-the-ipad-camera-connection-kit/

--
Adrian C

[Graeme]

In message <ejcdna...@mid.individual.net>, Adrian Caspersz
<em...@here.invalid> writes

>On 21/03/17 06:59, Graeme wrote:
>
>> The adaptor itself has conventional USB socket on one end and
>> Apple 30 pin connector on the other.
>

>Sounds like it is the Apple Camera Connection kit. Their On-The-Go type
>thing.

Exactly so. Interesting to note that the connector will also allow use
of a USB keyboard.
--
Graeme

[Andy Burns]

Graeme wrote:

> Adrian Caspersz wrote:
>
>> Sounds like it is the Apple Camera Connection kit
>

> Exactly so. Interesting to note that the connector will also allow use
> of a USB keyboard.

Indeed, I thought the CCK literally only allowed cameras, and even then
only allowed importing photos from them, does it see it as a computer
keyboard (QWERTY etc) or as a MIDI keyboard?

[Roger Mills]

My (pure) guess is that works in the same way as an Android OTG cable -
for which Android has built-in support for dumb devices like mice and
(QWERTY) keyboards, but where you need a dedicated app to support other
devices.

I assume that connecting it to a camera or to a musical keyboard
requires a specific app for each device.

I use an OTG cable with my Android Nexus 10 tablet, and I can use that
in conjunction with a USB to MIDI adapter cable in order to connect to
the MIDI ports on a musical keyboard. I have an app which understands a
few basic MIDI commands, but I can't find anything really useful. What I
really want is a MIDI sequencer - similar to Cakewalk or Cubasis on a PC
- which would enable the Android tablet to play pre-existing MIDI files
(of which I have legion) on a MIDI keyboard or piano. There are
occasions when our choir pianist is unavailable for a rehearsal, and I
take my laptop along to 'play' the piano. It would be a lot easier if I
could use the tablet.

Has anyone come across any suitable Android apps for MIDI sequencing?
--
Cheers,
Roger
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[Andy Burns]

Roger Mills wrote:

> I use an OTG cable with my Android Nexus 10 tablet, and I can use that
> in conjunction with a USB to MIDI adapter cable

Yes but Android != Apple, and they usually think they know better what a
user shouldn't want to do ...

[Adrian Caspersz]

It'll be MIDI

http://www.akaipro.com/kb/article/1502

https://www.midi.org/articles/basic-of-usb

--
Adrian C

[an.go...@campus.fct.unl.pt]

Hello! Can I ask you what app your wife uses in her iPad? I have been looking for the same thing you described!

Thanks,
André

[Graeme]

In message <f2f9f99f-3773-4f2f...@googlegroups.com>,
an.go...@campus.fct.unl.pt writes

>Hello! Can I ask you what app your wife uses in her iPad? I have been
>looking for the same thing you described!

Simply Piano and Piano Maestro are her favourites, apparently. Very
happy bunny now that the connector has arrived, and works.
--
Graeme

[Smithjohns]

replying to Graeme, Smithjohns wrote:
Please could you give me a link to purchase the connector that worked for you.
Or failing that, a name, manufacturer etc.

--
for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/uk-diy/connecting-yamaha-p45-digital-piano-to-3rd-generation-ipad-1194583-.htm

[Graeme]

In message <7LT%A.91039$3k.4...@fx03.am4>, Smithjohns
<caedfaa9ed1216d60ef...@example.com> writes

>replying to Graeme, Smithjohns wrote:
>Please could you give me a link to purchase the connector that worked for you.
>Or failing that, a name, manufacturer etc.

I have looked back, and cannot find details - sorry. I have looked
through both Amazon and eBay purchases, but cannot find it. I must have
bought it direct from somewhere else. Do note though, that what works
or does not work seems to depend on iOS.

I wonder whether you will see this reply.
--
Graeme

[rick]

On 13/06/2017 16:44, Smithjohns wrote:
> replying to Graeme, Smithjohns wrote:
> Please could you give me a link to purchase the connector that worked
> for you.
> Or failing that, a name, manufacturer etc.
>

Last time I built any interfaces they used MIDI ... is this still the
standard used or has it moved on ?

[Tassos]

replying to Graeme, Tassos wrote:
The best value solution is the "Line 6 MIDI Mobilizer". You can find one if
you search starting from 15-20 $

[SimonT]

replying to Graeme, SimonT wrote:
I have just purchased the P45 and purchased an adaptor cable primarily to
charge the ipad. But this doesn't seem to work. Does it work with your ipad?