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New cold water loft tank - tank connector problem
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David Hearn
Aug 22, 2012, 4:36:49 AM8/22/12
to
I'm after some advice as to how to sort out a problem I've got myself into.
Got a new 50 gallon cold water loft tank which I'm in the process of
fitting. I was trying to use brass 22mm compression tank connectors
(http://www.screwfix.com/p/yorkshire-kuterlite-tank-coupler-650-22mm/47957)
which I now question the wisdom of. I drilled two 29mm holes to fit the
two feeds (one to hot tank, other to cold). I'm also replacing the 4
gallon CH header tank - so drilled 29mm hole for that one too.
These connectors have two 'pins' or lugs on the back (this link shows
similar product's lugs:
http://www.screwfix.com/p/yorkshire-kuterlite-tank-coupler-650-15mm/30234)
- consequently, when trying to do up the compression joint, I cannot
stop the connector turning before the olive is compressed - even using a
pump wrench on the lugs at the back.
You can get a special tool
(http://www.amazon.co.uk/Monument-MON83-Tank-Connector-Fitting/dp/B000X2CSMI)
but having done up other 22mm compression joints and seen the force I've
needed, I fail to see how it could adequately work (without two pairs of
strong hands).
I've seen people talking online about SpeedFit 22mm tank connectors
being the way to go, and I thought that would be ideal - however, I then
found that they require 36/38mm holes cut in the tank. I'm concerned
whether I could cleanly expand the existing hole - the hole saw worked
fine the pilot drill fitted, but I'm concerned whether I could keep it
in one place without the pilot having anything to centre on.
I've also seen other 22mm compression tank connectors (which I would
hope would fit existing 29mm hole) which have hex shapes on the rear of
the connector:
http://www.screwfix.com/p/conex-tank-coupler-321-22mm/69785
http://www.screwfix.com/p/tank-coupler-22mm/36982
However, I'm concerned that they're quite slim hex nuts, and whether I
could properly get the compression joint made without the inner
spanner/wrench slipping and damaging the tank. Would these fit the same
hole as the one I got?
I've seen solder ring tank connectors
(http://www.screwfix.com/p/yorkshire-solder-ring-tank-coupler-yp5-22mm-x/59617
- presumably the nut goes inside the tank) - but at �14.99 each (I need
3), it's very expensive! Would this fit the existing 29mm hole?
I've also seen a copper push-fit tank connector
(http://www.screwfix.com/p/yorkshire-tectite-sprint-tank-coupling-22mm-x/97469
- again I presume the nut goes internally). Would this fit the existing
29mm hole? This seems a more reasonable price, but would I need any
tools? I've not used any type of push-fit before. Can I just cut a
22mm copper pipe and push in? Is this one demountable (with/without tools)?
I really appreciate people's advice on this one. I'd allowed the
weekend for the job, but it took longer. Currently we're without hot
water until it's finished.
Thanks
David
Got a new 50 gallon cold water loft tank which I'm in the process of
fitting. I was trying to use brass 22mm compression tank connectors
(http://www.screwfix.com/p/yorkshire-kuterlite-tank-coupler-650-22mm/47957)
which I now question the wisdom of. I drilled two 29mm holes to fit the
two feeds (one to hot tank, other to cold). I'm also replacing the 4
gallon CH header tank - so drilled 29mm hole for that one too.
These connectors have two 'pins' or lugs on the back (this link shows
similar product's lugs:
http://www.screwfix.com/p/yorkshire-kuterlite-tank-coupler-650-15mm/30234)
- consequently, when trying to do up the compression joint, I cannot
stop the connector turning before the olive is compressed - even using a
pump wrench on the lugs at the back.
You can get a special tool
(http://www.amazon.co.uk/Monument-MON83-Tank-Connector-Fitting/dp/B000X2CSMI)
but having done up other 22mm compression joints and seen the force I've
needed, I fail to see how it could adequately work (without two pairs of
strong hands).
I've seen people talking online about SpeedFit 22mm tank connectors
being the way to go, and I thought that would be ideal - however, I then
found that they require 36/38mm holes cut in the tank. I'm concerned
whether I could cleanly expand the existing hole - the hole saw worked
fine the pilot drill fitted, but I'm concerned whether I could keep it
in one place without the pilot having anything to centre on.
I've also seen other 22mm compression tank connectors (which I would
hope would fit existing 29mm hole) which have hex shapes on the rear of
the connector:
http://www.screwfix.com/p/conex-tank-coupler-321-22mm/69785
http://www.screwfix.com/p/tank-coupler-22mm/36982
However, I'm concerned that they're quite slim hex nuts, and whether I
could properly get the compression joint made without the inner
spanner/wrench slipping and damaging the tank. Would these fit the same
hole as the one I got?
I've seen solder ring tank connectors
(http://www.screwfix.com/p/yorkshire-solder-ring-tank-coupler-yp5-22mm-x/59617
- presumably the nut goes inside the tank) - but at �14.99 each (I need
3), it's very expensive! Would this fit the existing 29mm hole?
I've also seen a copper push-fit tank connector
(http://www.screwfix.com/p/yorkshire-tectite-sprint-tank-coupling-22mm-x/97469
- again I presume the nut goes internally). Would this fit the existing
29mm hole? This seems a more reasonable price, but would I need any
tools? I've not used any type of push-fit before. Can I just cut a
22mm copper pipe and push in? Is this one demountable (with/without tools)?
I really appreciate people's advice on this one. I'd allowed the
weekend for the job, but it took longer. Currently we're without hot
water until it's finished.
Thanks
David
fred
Aug 22, 2012, 5:07:03 AM8/22/12
to
In article <a9jk12...@mid.individual.net>, David Hearn
<newsg...@NOswampieSPAM.org.uk> writes
I was going to suggest putting any old bit of flat bar between the lugs
but that could result in a bit too much shear given the extra leverage.
The 22mm compression shouldn't take too much force to do up, if it does
then smear a tiny amount of silicone grease round the threads and around
the outside of the olive to lube it up as it tightens. If no silicone
grease you could use a wrap or two of ptfe tape (only to lube the
threads and olive outer) but if anyone sees that you will probably be
branded as the punter who doesn't know how compression fittings work.
I've not needed to go this far before and assume that once you have the
tool made the joint will nip up fine.
--
fred
it's a ba-na-na . . . .
<newsg...@NOswampieSPAM.org.uk> writes
>I'm after some advice as to how to sort out a problem I've got myself into.
>
>Got a new 50 gallon cold water loft tank which I'm in the process of
>fitting. I was trying to use brass 22mm compression tank connectors
>(http://www.screwfix.com/p/yorkshire-kuterlite-tank-coupler-650-22mm/47957)
>which I now question the wisdom of. I drilled two 29mm holes to fit the
>two feeds (one to hot tank, other to cold). I'm also replacing the 4
>gallon CH header tank - so drilled 29mm hole for that one too.
>
>These connectors have two 'pins' or lugs on the back (this link shows
>similar product's lugs:
>http://www.screwfix.com/p/yorkshire-kuterlite-tank-coupler-650-15mm/30234)
>- consequently, when trying to do up the compression joint, I cannot
>stop the connector turning before the olive is compressed - even using a
>pump wrench on the lugs at the back.
>
>You can get a special tool
>(http://www.amazon.co.uk/Monument-MON83-Tank-Connector-
>Fitting/dp/B000X2CSMI)
>but having done up other 22mm compression joints and seen the force I've
>needed, I fail to see how it could adequately work (without two pairs of
>strong hands).
>
Make your own tool, 2mm flat bar with 2 holes drilled to match the lugs.
>
>Got a new 50 gallon cold water loft tank which I'm in the process of
>fitting. I was trying to use brass 22mm compression tank connectors
>(http://www.screwfix.com/p/yorkshire-kuterlite-tank-coupler-650-22mm/47957)
>which I now question the wisdom of. I drilled two 29mm holes to fit the
>two feeds (one to hot tank, other to cold). I'm also replacing the 4
>gallon CH header tank - so drilled 29mm hole for that one too.
>
>These connectors have two 'pins' or lugs on the back (this link shows
>similar product's lugs:
>http://www.screwfix.com/p/yorkshire-kuterlite-tank-coupler-650-15mm/30234)
>- consequently, when trying to do up the compression joint, I cannot
>stop the connector turning before the olive is compressed - even using a
>pump wrench on the lugs at the back.
>
>You can get a special tool
>(http://www.amazon.co.uk/Monument-MON83-Tank-Connector-
>Fitting/dp/B000X2CSMI)
>but having done up other 22mm compression joints and seen the force I've
>needed, I fail to see how it could adequately work (without two pairs of
>strong hands).
>
I was going to suggest putting any old bit of flat bar between the lugs
but that could result in a bit too much shear given the extra leverage.
The 22mm compression shouldn't take too much force to do up, if it does
then smear a tiny amount of silicone grease round the threads and around
the outside of the olive to lube it up as it tightens. If no silicone
grease you could use a wrap or two of ptfe tape (only to lube the
threads and olive outer) but if anyone sees that you will probably be
branded as the punter who doesn't know how compression fittings work.
I've not needed to go this far before and assume that once you have the
tool made the joint will nip up fine.
--
fred
it's a ba-na-na . . . .
Andy Cap
Aug 22, 2012, 5:11:35 AM8/22/12
to
conical cutter like this Ebay - 221111840773
Andy C
Grimly Curmudgeon
Aug 22, 2012, 7:38:42 AM8/22/12
to
On Wed, 22 Aug 2012 09:36:49 +0100, David Hearn
<newsg...@NOswampieSPAM.org.uk> wrote:
>These connectors have two 'pins' or lugs on the back (this link shows
>similar product's lugs:
>http://www.screwfix.com/p/yorkshire-kuterlite-tank-coupler-650-15mm/30234)
>- consequently, when trying to do up the compression joint, I cannot
>stop the connector turning before the olive is compressed - even using a
>pump wrench on the lugs at the back.
You tighten up the connector on the tank first - tight as fuck.
<newsg...@NOswampieSPAM.org.uk> wrote:
>These connectors have two 'pins' or lugs on the back (this link shows
>similar product's lugs:
>http://www.screwfix.com/p/yorkshire-kuterlite-tank-coupler-650-15mm/30234)
>- consequently, when trying to do up the compression joint, I cannot
>stop the connector turning before the olive is compressed - even using a
>pump wrench on the lugs at the back.
You then use a dummy straight or angle connector to tighten the olive
on the pipe then use that tightened olive/pipe on the tank connector,
while keeping the tank fitting from turning by using the tool on the
back of it - either use the special tool or a large adjustable spanner
closed down to fit the lugs.
Use a wrap of ptfe or a smear of Boss White or similar on the olive.
Dave Liquorice
Aug 22, 2012, 7:33:08 AM8/22/12
to
On Wed, 22 Aug 2012 09:36:49 +0100, David Hearn wrote:
> when trying to do up the compression joint, I cannot stop the connector
> turning before the olive is compressed - even using a pump wrench on
> the lugs at the back.
Surprised, compression is normally just hand tight plus 1/2 to 3/4 of a
> when trying to do up the compression joint, I cannot stop the connector
> turning before the olive is compressed - even using a pump wrench on
> the lugs at the back.
turn. As others have pointed out have you lubricated the olive/threads,
I'd use a smear of Boss Green rather than silcone grease or PTFE tape.
--
Cheers
Dave.
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