Gas piping
Jennifer Skilling
We had a new kitchen installed by a "reputable" company. Since the new
gas hob was in a different position, on a different wall to the old gas
cooker some new piping was required. It turns out that what they did was
to put an elbow on the original pipe about 4 inches above the floor and
run the pipe, unsupported or fixed in any way, round under the cabinets
to come up and feed the hob. Unfortunately the vertical section and
about 6 inches on the horizontal run is behind our washing machine
which, when the fitter shoved it in place, has bent the pipe through
about 30 degrees. This left the (vibrating and shaking) washing machine
leaning against a bent pipe. Luckily the washing machine gave up the
ghost first so we found the bent pipe. Obviously this is not OK.
My question is, should the gas pipe not be under the floor so that it
comes up where it is required? If not shouldn't it be fixed in some way?
It is some consolation that we have not paid for the installation of the
kitchen so I have some leverage if I need it.
While I'm on the subject, said kitchen also has new sockets where the
cable is only embedded in the plaster where it shows, behind the
cabinets the cables are exposed, is this OK?
Thanks
Jennifer
Ed Sirett
>Not really DIY, but a question about good practise in running gas pipes.
>
>We had a new kitchen installed by a "reputable" company. Since the new
>gas hob was in a different position, on a different wall to the old gas
>cooker some new piping was required. It turns out that what they did was
>to put an elbow on the original pipe about 4 inches above the floor and
>run the pipe, unsupported or fixed in any way, round under the cabinets
>to come up and feed the hob. Unfortunately the vertical section and
>about 6 inches on the horizontal run is behind our washing machine
>which, when the fitter shoved it in place, has bent the pipe through
>about 30 degrees. This left the (vibrating and shaking) washing machine
>leaning against a bent pipe. Luckily the washing machine gave up the
>ghost first so we found the bent pipe. Obviously this is not OK.
>
include some reference to the way pipes should be laid out.
IMHO this means adequate tethering so that the pipe's movement is limited
when it is accidentally touched.
It would also be inconceivable that the regs don't specify some requirment
to protect the pipe work/ choose a route that keeps the pipe from damage.
It strikes me that good practice would be to have the pipework neatly
clipped to the wall and that will protect it from the washing machine.
>My question is, should the gas pipe not be under the floor so that it
>comes up where it is required? If not shouldn't it be fixed in some way?
>
I don't see that under the units is a no no and simplifies the installation
but the work has to be done right.
>
>It is some consolation that we have not paid for the installation of the
>kitchen so I have some leverage if I need it.
>
Perhaps someone will give you the relevant chapter and verse from the gas
regs, if appropriate whoever did the pipework might be guilty of making a
(potentially) dangerous installation. Corgi and/or the HSE might be
interested, that would be some leverage.
Normal domestic electric cables are PVC insulated and sheathed, these
_require_ no further mechanincal protection for most routes indoors.
Whether or not they are in plaster conduits or tunking is a matter of
aesthetics.
They do have to run vertically or horizontally to from fittings when buried.
They also have to be secured adequately unless there is no possibility of
them being disturbed.
HTH
Ed Sirett
Property Maintainer - North London.
John
Jennifer Skilling <J.Ski...@chemeng.ed.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:389AAA21...@chemeng.ed.ac.uk...
> Not really DIY, but a question about good practise in running gas pipes.
>
> We had a new kitchen installed by a "reputable" company. Since the new
> gas hob was in a different position, on a different wall to the old gas
> cooker some new piping was required. It turns out that what they did was
> to put an elbow on the original pipe about 4 inches above the floor and
> run the pipe, unsupported or fixed in any way, round under the cabinets
> to come up and feed the hob. Unfortunately the vertical section and
> about 6 inches on the horizontal run is behind our washing machine
> which, when the fitter shoved it in place, has bent the pipe through
> about 30 degrees. This left the (vibrating and shaking) washing machine
> leaning against a bent pipe. Luckily the washing machine gave up the
> ghost first so we found the bent pipe. Obviously this is not OK.
No it's not. There is nothing to prevent the pipe being run in the space
under the units but the pipe should be adequately supported and clipped.
For 15mm pipe the tabled spacing is to be no more than 1.5 metres between
clips when run horizontally, or 2 metres when run vertically. In addition
the pipe should be routed to take account adverse situations (such as being
abraded by a vibrating machine). In most situstions such as you describe
the washing machine has a rear (skirting) recess close to the floor so if
the gas pipe had to cross its path its should have been taken into account
and run to pass within this recess or otherwise protected. Of course the
gas fitter may not have seen the washing machine and left site before
washing machine fitter arived?????
BTW did he/she install an isolation valve of some description in the gas
supply adjacent to the hob as required by the gas regs?
>
> My question is, should the gas pipe not be under the floor so that it
> comes up where it is required? If not shouldn't it be fixed in some way?
Under the floor is one option but the route taken is "satisfactory" subject
to the above
>
> It is some consolation that we have not paid for the installation of the
> kitchen so I have some leverage if I need it.
Good - I expect you will. Certainly the gas pipe will need securing
properly and possibly replacing where damaged. If the firm aren't keen on
putting this right a call to ask CORGI to look at the job may work wonders
with their attitude.
>
> While I'm on the subject, said kitchen also has new sockets where the
> cable is only embedded in the plaster where it shows, behind the
> cabinets the cables are exposed, is this OK?
Its common practice amongst the kitchen fitting industry. The hidden cable
does usually require clipping to the wall etc and its only let into the
plaster where it rises above the worktop.
>
> Thanks
>
> Jennifer
>
HTH
Simon Avery
Hello Jennifer
JS> Not really DIY, but a question about good practise in running gas
JS> pipes.
Note I know little about this subject, so ignore my advice if someone
comes along who looks like they know more. :)
JS> My question is, should the gas pipe not be under the floor so that
JS> it comes up where it is required? If not shouldn't it be fixed in
JS> some way?
It should be fixed securely so that no flexing occurs that might damage
a joint, fairly common-sense stuff.
JS> It is some consolation that we have not paid for the installation
JS> of the kitchen so I have some leverage if I need it.
I would get them back ASAP to re-fix the pipe at a better position, and
possibly guarded against such a thing happenning again. (Fixed tight to
the bottom corner of the wall?)
JS> While I'm on the subject, said kitchen also has new sockets where
JS> the cable is only embedded in the plaster where it shows, behind
JS> the cabinets the cables are exposed, is this OK?
Not sure what you mean, is the cable fitted in a trough dug out of the
plaster and not covered over? If so, I'd get them to tidy it up when
they revisit to do your gas pipe.
--
Simon Avery, Devon, UK
Jon Rouse
>
>No it's not. There is nothing to prevent the pipe being run in the space
>under the units but the pipe should be adequately supported and clipped.
I wondered about this, as our gas installers ran the gas pipe externally
from the meter to the boiler, with a branch thorugh the wall to the hob. I
would much prefer to run it internally behind the kitchen units, as people
keep driving into the outisde bit, but I thought that if you ran gas pipes
in a void (which the space behind kitchen units must be) it had to be
adequately ventilated?
>BTW did he/she install an isolation valve of some description in the gas
>supply adjacent to the hob as required by the gas regs?
Does installing the hob with a bayonet cooker connector count?
--
The views expressed are my own, and may not necessarily reflect those of my
employer.
Douglas de Lacey
>
> > so we found the bent pipe. Obviously this is not OK.
>
> under the units but the pipe should be adequately supported and clipped.
Is the person from HSE reading this thread? Perhaps it's CORGI fitters
who should be banned!
Douglas de Lacey.
Jon Rouse
>Is the person from HSE reading this thread? Perhaps it's CORGI fitters
>who should be banned!
Has anyone had an acknowledgement (or even a peep) out of the HSE person who
posted the original message asking for feedback? I both e-mailed (from home)
and wrote to them but have not received a response.
Nick Nelson
> Douglas de Lacey wrote in message <389ECC...@cam.ac.uk>...
>
> >Is the person from HSE reading this thread? Perhaps it's CORGI fitters
> >who should be banned!
>
> Has anyone had an acknowledgement (or even a peep) out of the HSE person who
> posted the original message asking for feedback? I both e-mailed (from home)
> and wrote to them but have not received a response.
I had an acknowledgement this afternoon, but I
don't know when it was sent.
Nick.
Roger Chapman
from "Jon Rouse" <rou...@nospam.postoffice.co.uk> contains these words:
> Has anyone had an acknowledgement (or even a peep) out of the HSE person who
> posted the original message asking for feedback? I both e-mailed (from home)
> and wrote to them but have not received a response.
Mine turned up in the same download as this message. I e-mailed my
response 2 or 3 days before the deadline.
Roger
Richard Gethin
<rou...@nospam.postoffice.co.uk> writes
>Does installing the hob with a bayonet cooker connector count?
should be plumbed in rigid pipe with a local isolating valve.
I have heard that it was not OK to run gas pipes behind kitchen units,
something to do with access?
I wonder if John (karoo) could clear up these points???
--
Rich
Jon Rouse
>AFAIK, using a flexible hose for a fixed hob is not the done thing, it
>should be plumbed in rigid pipe with a local isolating valve.
Wasn't there something daft like flexible hoses were actually "rigid pipe"
because they were steel lined?