pan connector leak at soil pipe end

[gall...@gmail.com]

I have fitted a new pan connector (as the old one was leaking badly at the pan end) but it leaks slightly at the soil pipe. It's a straight horizontal connection. The pipe is a 100mm pipe, and the pan connector has a 100mm end. But, the joint didn't feel tight. The instructions are to use PVC glue, which I did, and it still leaks a little. Should I use some other mastic/silicone instead? Or can I stop the leak without dismantling the joint again?

[edaler...@gmail.com]

Ah. the pvc they will be reffering to is PVC cement used on solvent weld pipes. Comes in tins with a brush to apply.
All the pan connectors I use narrow down to 90mm (never measured) fit into the plain end of the 100 mm pipe and has a large rubber finned gasket that seals but allows plenty of movement to align

[Tim Watts]

On 07/02/15 21:41, edaler...@gmail.com wrote:
> Ah. the pvc they will be reffering to is PVC cement used on solvent weld pipes. Comes in tins with a brush to apply.
> All the pan connectors I use narrow down to 90mm (never measured) fit into the plain end of the 100 mm pipe and has a large rubber finned gasket that seals but allows plenty of movement to align
>

There is one pan connector that is 110mm all te way and can be solvent
welded, or pushfitted into a suitable 110mm joint. I know, I have one.

But they are rare. I like them, it's full bore almost immediately.

Mine is solvent welded to a short extension which then plugs into a tee
(the AAV being on the top of the tee).

Here you go:

http://tinypic.com/r/261g42c/8

gallense - is yours like that?

[edaler...@gmail.com]

I might have done you a disservice, I had PVA on my mind

[Andrew Gabriel]

In article <21ad0346-8bcc-4738...@googlegroups.com>,

edaler...@gmail.com writes:
> Ah. the pvc they will be reffering to is PVC cement used on solvent weld pipes. Comes in tins with a brush to apply.
> All the pan connectors I use narrow down to 90mm (never measured) fit into the plain end of the 100 mm pipe and has a large rubber finned gasket that seals but allows plenty of movement to align

Can the OP point to a picture of the pan connector?
They aren't usually glued at all.

If you have solvent welded two pieces of PVC together, forget about
ever trying to take them apart again.

For assembly of the finned rubber gasket joint, lubricate the rubber
with wet soap so it slides easily. The soap will wash away or dry up
so it doesn't continue to slide around for long once it's in place,
but can still be pulled apart again if necessary.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

[Ian Jackson]

In message <6457e612-d597-4e18...@googlegroups.com>,
gall...@gmail.com writes

Other advice read.

What about a quick fix by binding it with self-amalgamating tape? It
seems to have worked for me.
--
Ian

[Bruno]

On Sat, 07 Feb 2015 23:58:00 +0000, Ian Jackson wrote:

> What about a quick fix by binding it with self-amalgamating tape? It
> seems to have worked for me.

Maybe you were lucky. I wouldn't even consider it.

[Seamus Gallen]

On Saturday, February 7, 2015 at 9:33:18 PM UTC+1, Seamus Gallen wrote:
> I have fitted a new pan connector (as the old one was leaking badly at the pan end) but it leaks slightly at the soil pipe. It's a straight horizontal connection. The pipe is a 100mm pipe, and the pan connector has a 100mm end. But, the joint didn't feel tight. The instructions are to use PVC glue, which I did, and it still leaks a little. Should I use some other mastic/silicone instead? Or can I stop the leak without dismantling the joint again?

Thanks a lot for the replies.

Here's a link to a photo:
https://plus.google.com/photos/114829337180450704648/albums/6113443645730802625?banner=pwa&authkey=CJ6Q_bLf4PqwggE

The pan is to the left. The soil pipe in the wall is to the right. It says "glue" not cement on the tube, and it's not brushable. It's also been lying around for a few years and may be past its best. I can't try taking it apart again until tomorrow due to visitors. I dread it being "welded" together.
There are no fins on this fitting. To the right of the collar (just at the wall) is a piece an inch or so long, 100mm diameter per the package. Beyond that, it narrows to 93mm for another inch or so.
I'm in France and this was the only fitting that I could find that would fit. The only straight rigid one was too short. All the others had bends. I went to three DIY/Builders Providers.
The packaging instruction is to use PVC glue on the soil pipe end.
In the event that it can't be separated, is there a substance that I could apply behind that collar that would stop the leak?

Thanks again.

[Ian Jackson]

In message <a429cb78-94bd-494a...@googlegroups.com>,
Seamus Gallen <gall...@gmail.com> writes

Presumably the soil pipe is inside the connector? If so, a large jubilee
clip should work. If necessary, before the final tighten, carefully
often the adapter slightly with a hot air gun.
--
Ian

[Seamus Gallen]

No!! The soil pipe is flush with the wall. The connector goes into it, 100mm into 100mm, with PVC glue added to both surfaces, and a leak to follow. And, the possibility that it can't be dis-assembled!

[Ian Jackson]

In message <9e5b8b25-8305-4530...@googlegroups.com>,
Seamus Gallen <gall...@gmail.com> writes

In that case, I doubt if you can do much from the outside.

I hesitate to suggest it, but if the joint is slack, what, about
dismantling, beefing up the diameter of the connector with
self-amalgamating tape and re-assembling?
--
Ian

[edaler...@gmail.com]

Ahh
Only flex pan connectors I have used fit into plain end pipe with those finned gaskets.

summat like this
http://www.victoriaplumb.com/Bathroom-Accessories/Plumbing-Accessories/Connectors/Flexi-Pan-Connector_1695.html?utm_source=Google&utm_medium=cpc&network=Google&utm_campaign=ShoppingCampaigns&_$ja=tsid:46973%7Ccgn:Connectors%7Ckw:Flexi+Pan+Connector&_$$ja=cgid:17787273425|tsid:47485|cid:212650985|lid:123184796705|nw:g|crid:58614099545|rnd:3744436491501987058|dvc:c|adp:1o1|bku:1&mkwid=ofc49KGH&gclid=CKrPifv20sMCFVMatAodoXsA6A

I can think of no add on to really give along lasting solution.
Wait see if anyone else has a better answer

Is that white rigid section embeded in wall part of the fitting you got?
The pipework will be 110mm external.And I can imagine they do make one that terminates in 110, but it would join via a noraml staight connector ,or stock length of pipe both that has its own gasket,
I was going to suggest if the flexi is pipeholded rotaing it, but if its solvent welded theres no chance

[edaler...@gmail.com]

I actually think you do have correct part, alas they did not give you the rubber seal.
its implied the mating surfaces are just the edges of the the 110, if its 110 to 110

93mm spigot into 104mm internal of pipe makes sense.(gasket seal differnce)

[edaler...@gmail.com]

Don't happen to have the removed fitting do you?
Presumably it just pulled out from the wall

[Andrew Gabriel]

In article <9e5b8b25-8305-4530...@googlegroups.com>,

Seamus Gallen <gall...@gmail.com> writes:
> On Sunday, February 8, 2015 at 2:48:01 PM UTC+1, Ian Jackson wrote:
>> In message <a429cb78-94bd-494a...@googlegroups.com>,
>> Seamus Gallen <gall...@gmail.com> writes

If you can't disassemble it, all I can think of is trying to seal
the leak. You can do this from both inside and outside. You will
need some PVC cement (which is PVC dissolved in solvent - you might
be able to make some by collecting some PVC sawdust and dissolving
it in the solvent you used).

Disconnect and move the toilet out of the way. You should be able
to reach into the pipe and feel the inside join. Dry this thoroughly
with kitchen roll and leave it to finish off drying in the air.
Similarly, dry off the outside of the joint.

Then paint the PVC cement along the joint, both inside and outside
the pipe. I would be very careful to keep it off the concertina
section which is very thin and might dissolve. Hopefully this will
go into the crack and set, sealing it. When the solvent has
evaporated, if there's still a crack along the joint, probably
worth repeating.

The solvent is nasty stuff - don't breath it in and work with the
windows flung wide open.

I'm really doubting this concertina section was meant to be solvent
welded in place. They don't last forever, and it would make
replacement very difficult.

[Seamus Gallen]

The section that's welded (if it is welded!) is not concertina type. Beyond the collar that you see next to the wall there is a smooth 100mm section followed by a smooth 93mm section, each an inch long, protruding into the soil pipe in the wall. The PVC glue is on the 100mm piece and also on the soil pipe. But, it leaks a little.
If I can get it apart, what do I use instead of PVC glue?
If I can't get it apart, I'll try and caulk it somehow. Your suggestion may be the best. I presume that the pan spigot end will come apart and reassemble without damage.
Thanks.

[edaler...@gmail.com]

the pan connector on the toilet will come apart easy peasy and reseal blindfold.

At least you don't have to remove toilet to have another go!
The original plumber did you no favours with the soil pipes being off set
Like I say the connection into the pipe in the wall usually narrows to a spigot that goes 4 inch inside the fixed pipe work.
Maybe them frenchies do it different

[Andrew Gabriel]

In article <84e0c508-cb99-4003...@googlegroups.com>,

Seamus Gallen <gall...@gmail.com> writes:
> The section that's welded (if it is welded!) is not concertina type. Beyond the collar that you see next to the wall there is a smooth 100mm section followed by a smooth 93mm section, each an inch long, protruding into the soil pipe in the wall. The PVC glue is on the 100mm piece and also on the soil pipe. But, it leaks a little.
> If I can get it apart, what do I use instead of PVC glue?

I'm not sure exactly what they're called on the containers, as
I don't have either of them handy here at the moment.
One is just PVC solvent.
The other is PVC dissolved in PVC solvent, which I think may be
referred to as PVC solvent cement sometimes.

The first one is normally used with PVC electrical conduit, and
not with PVC plumbing, and doesn't work at all with ABS plumbing.
It is quite a thin liquid. I suspect it might work with PVC
plumbing, but only if the joint is a very close/tight fit on a
dry test assembly.

The second one is normally used with PVC and ABS plumbing.
(You won't find ABS pipework this large, but if it says it also
works with ABS, you probably have the right stuff.) The dissolved
PVC acts as a filler to help make the joint waterproof (and is
necessary for it to work at all with ABS).

> If I can't get it apart, I'll try and caulk it somehow. Your suggestion may be the best. I presume that the pan spigot end will come apart and reassemble without damage.

That's a rubber seal, right? If so, if it's new, there shouldn't
be any problem. Wet the rubber sealing surface with plain soap to
make assembly easy and reduce chance of any damage.

[edaler...@gmail.com]

I do have a tub of it in front of me.....Solvent Cement.
Also says unopened shelf life is 12 months.
Abrade both surfaces with sandpaper, then clean with cleaning solvent.( I never have used cleaning solvent)

[edaler...@gmail.com]

If even an inch of the circumferance has glued it won't come out without destroying it.
In which case, I guess I would clean and dry the joint and with a new pot of solvent cement,its pretty gloopy, lap some on the joint.Leave to set, then repeat.You should be able to do without removing toilet.
Hope for best..if its watertight, I'd make good with white sanitary sealant, comes in 330ml tubes, belt n braces.Smooth with washing up liquid on your finger

Don't know how loose the joint felt,but solvent weld pipes and sockets fit to a hairsbreath,its only a smear of adhesive that holds em.
The fact that you got the old fitting out,implies it was not stuck with adhesive.

[edaler...@gmail.com]

might be baffling my self,but absolutley don't put the cement on the flexible section of the pipework.I would try Plumbers Mait in that situation.

[Seamus Gallen]

They certainly do it differently. The old fitting was glued to the inside of the soil pipe. It took a long while lying on the floor to get it out. I used a tool designed for opening iPhones and a mallet and progressed inch by inch! But, there is no real offset; it's quite straight, hard to see on the photo.

[Seamus Gallen]

Thanks for all your detail, Andrew.
It's stuck fast, whatever glue is on it, and in whatever state.
So, I'm going with your idea to fill around it on the inside. I hadn't thought of that. It's quite easy to reach, if a little smelly. I'm off to the shop now to get some suitable substance. Silicone based??