Bricking up an external door
ARWadsworth
expose the existing wall cavity or do you just brick up the gap (with it's
own cavity)?
--
Adam
The Natural Philosopher
You probably will find the cavity exists anyway on a modernish house
right up to the frame.
I would definitely open it up and remove alternate half bricks etc to
get a good continuos cavity and brick key. But then it would be my house.
Quick'n'dirty if I was a builder on a budget..
>
Tim Watts
> ARWadsworth wrote:
>> When you are bricking up an external door are you supposed to "open
>> up" and expose the existing wall cavity or do you just brick up the
>> gap (with it's own cavity)?
>>
>>
>
> You probably will find the cavity exists anyway on a modernish house
> right up to the frame.
>
> I would definitely open it up and remove alternate half bricks etc to
> get a good continuos cavity and brick key. But then it would be my house.
>
Yes - it's not hard.
Angle grinder (really! ;-> ) to cut the mortar between the half bricks,
and remove. You can key both sides in an hour or less. Hammer and
bolster would work too but not quite as quick.
Pack mortar in tight with a bit of wood on these when building up the
wall and it will be a very strong joint.
I did the same to extend a wall by a foot (also a door opening that was
moved along a bit).
> Quick'n'dirty if I was a builder on a budget..
They will be... Metal strip if you're lucky (though that is a fairly
strong solution) or a couple of nails banged in if they are really cheap
bastards.
Tim Watts
> Pack mortar in tight with a bit of wood on these when building up the
> wall and it will be a very strong joint.
I forgot to add - when I did my wall extension, I also inverted the new
bricks where they keyed in so I had a frog facing a frog - fully packed
with mortar.
That's probably over engineered for a full doorway bricking up but as I
was adding a little wibbly bit on the end of a wall, it was necessary to
make the joint really solid...
ARWadsworth
> On 04/10/10 19:46, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>> ARWadsworth wrote:
>>> When you are bricking up an external door are you supposed to "open
>>> up" and expose the existing wall cavity or do you just brick up the
>>> gap (with it's own cavity)?
>>>
>>>
>>
>> You probably will find the cavity exists anyway on a modernish house
>> right up to the frame.
>>
>> I would definitely open it up and remove alternate half bricks etc to
>> get a good continuos cavity and brick key. But then it would be my
>> house.
>
> Yes - it's not hard.
>
> Angle grinder (really! ;-> ) to cut the mortar between the half
> bricks, and remove. You can key both sides in an hour or less. Hammer
> and bolster would work too but not quite as quick.
I guess that there is already some sort of vertical DPM in place around the
door.
Opening up the cavity is no big deal.
I will need to hold back the existing cavity wall insulation whilst cutting
back. I believe that it will be a wool filled insulation.
>
> They will be... Metal strip if you're lucky (though that is a fairly
> strong solution) or a couple of nails banged in if they are really
> cheap bastards.
It might be the metal strips for the external part of the wall. It is not
brick but concrete bricks. The idea is to brick up the old door and then
render the new brickwork to look like it was concrete bricks.
--
Adam
Andrew Gabriel
"ARWadsworth" <adamwa...@blueyonder.co.uk> writes:
> door.
>
> Opening up the cavity is no big deal.
>
> I will need to hold back the existing cavity wall insulation whilst cutting
> back. I believe that it will be a wool filled insulation.
That will probably just stay put.
Be thankful it's not tiny polystyrene balls...
--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]
Tim Watts
> In article<5Vqqo.44797$Wp7....@newsfe24.ams2>,
> "ARWadsworth"<adamwa...@blueyonder.co.uk> writes:
>> door.
>>
>> Opening up the cavity is no big deal.
>>
>> I will need to hold back the existing cavity wall insulation whilst cutting
>> back. I believe that it will be a wool filled insulation.
>
> That will probably just stay put.
> Be thankful it's not tiny polystyrene balls...
>
Yes - I can personally confirm that wool (or blown fibre) does not tend
to fall out - much at least. It's worth having a bit of glass wool to
hand (old tank jacket is a good source if there's one down the tip) and
just stuff a bit back as you go. But mostly it is pretty stable.
harry
> > "ARWadsworth"<adamwadswo...@blueyonder.co.uk> writes:
> >> door.
>
> >> Opening up the cavity is no big deal.
>
> >> I will need to hold back the existing cavity wall insulation whilst cutting
> >> back. I believe that it will be a wool filled insulation.
>
> > That will probably just stay put.
> > Be thankful it's not tiny polystyrene balls...
>
> Yes - I can personally confirm that wool (or blown fibre) does not tend
> to fall out - much at least. It's worth having a bit of glass wool to
> hand (old tank jacket is a good source if there's one down the tip) and
> just stuff a bit back as you go. But mostly it is pretty stable.
Mineral wool cavity wall insulation (blown and bats) are treated with
a moisture repellent to prevent water tracking across the cavity. Get
proper cavity wall bats from your local builder's merchant.
The benifit of opening the cavity is it removes a thermal bridge to
the cavity that would otherwise be left. There is no other advantage.
There is a vertical damp proof course in the brickwork.
Modern houses tend not to have a brickwork return in window and door
openings. They have a cavity closer that is usually plastic with a bit
of insulation attached. These are cheaper to install and remove the
thermal bridge. There is no point in removing this. If you feel the
need to attach your new brick/blockwork to the old you can buy screw-
in "wall starters".
harry
Further to above, if your house is very old it may have no insulation
at all in the cavity. If it is very new it may have a "partial fill"
system, ie ridgid boards fastened to the inner leaf of brickwork by
clips on the wall ties. This is only likly on houses less then ten/
fifteen years old.
Things will start to become apparent when you remove the door frame.
Martin Bonner
> Further to above, if your house is very old it may have no insulation
> at all in the cavity.
http://www.aecb.net/forum/index.php?topic=561.0 suggests cavity wall
construction moved east across the country between mid-19th and
mid-20th century. I'm from Cambridge, and would have guessed they
became common in the 50's.
Cavity wall insulation didn't become required until the 70's, which is
hardly "very old". In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if the majority
of our housing stock predates cavity wall insulation.
ARWadsworth
> On 4 Oct, 23:08, Tim Watts <t...@dionic.net> wrote:
>> On 04/10/10 22:26, Andrew Gabriel wrote:
>>
>>> In article<5Vqqo.44797$Wp7.21...@newsfe24.ams2>,
>>> "ARWadsworth"<adamwadswo...@blueyonder.co.uk> writes:
>>>> door.
>>
>>>> Opening up the cavity is no big deal.
>>
>>>> I will need to hold back the existing cavity wall insulation
>>>> whilst cutting back. I believe that it will be a wool filled
>>>> insulation.
>>
>>> That will probably just stay put.
>>> Be thankful it's not tiny polystyrene balls...
>>
>> Yes - I can personally confirm that wool (or blown fibre) does not
>> tend to fall out - much at least. It's worth having a bit of glass
>> wool to hand (old tank jacket is a good source if there's one down
>> the tip) and just stuff a bit back as you go. But mostly it is
>> pretty stable.
>
> Mineral wool cavity wall insulation (blown and bats) are treated with
> a moisture repellent to prevent water tracking across the cavity. Get
> proper cavity wall bats from your local builder's merchant.
> The benifit of opening the cavity is it removes a thermal bridge to
> the cavity that would otherwise be left. There is no other advantage.
> There is a vertical damp proof course in the brickwork.
I am assuming that the house in question has a vertical dpm of some sort
(built around 1955 but NOT with normal bricks). It certainly has got cavity
wall insulation (installed 11 months ago just in time for cold snap we had).
I would feel happier by opening up the cavity before bricking the hole up.
Cheers
--
Adam
harry
>
> - Show quoted text -
You should, to avoid the thermal bridge.
Roger Mills
>
> Cavity wall insulation didn't become required until the 70's, which is
> hardly "very old". In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if the majority
> of our housing stock predates cavity wall insulation.
I'm sure you're right. That doesn't necessarily mean that the majority
of the housing stock is *still* uninsulated because a hell of a lot of
cavities have been filled retrospectively (and not just by dentists). <g>
--
Cheers,
Roger
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Tim Watts
> On 4 Oct, 23:08, Tim Watts<t...@dionic.net> wrote:
>> On 04/10/10 22:26, Andrew Gabriel wrote:
>>
>>> In article<5Vqqo.44797$Wp7.21...@newsfe24.ams2>,
>>> "ARWadsworth"<adamwadswo...@blueyonder.co.uk> writes:
>>>> door.
>>
>>>> Opening up the cavity is no big deal.
>>
>>>> I will need to hold back the existing cavity wall insulation whilst cutting
>>>> back. I believe that it will be a wool filled insulation.
>>
>>> That will probably just stay put.
>>> Be thankful it's not tiny polystyrene balls...
>>
>> Yes - I can personally confirm that wool (or blown fibre) does not tend
>> to fall out - much at least. It's worth having a bit of glass wool to
>> hand (old tank jacket is a good source if there's one down the tip) and
>> just stuff a bit back as you go. But mostly it is pretty stable.
>
> Mineral wool cavity wall insulation (blown and bats) are treated with
> a moisture repellent to prevent water tracking across the cavity. Get
> proper cavity wall bats from your local builder's merchant.
I dare say that is true - but for a bit of patching up, I don't think it
will make any difference. The worst that will happen is the moisture
from a couple of sq feet of outer leaf will track slowly to the inner
leaf where it will spread out over a much larger area and dissipate.
I can see problems if bodging a large area like this, but for a few bits
of infill...
dennis@home
"Martin Bonner" <martin...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:9e19b76f-af2f-4830...@c10g2000yqh.googlegroups.com...
> Cavity wall insulation didn't become required until the 70's,
It wasn't required in the early eighties.
Until about three years ago I had the only house with cavity wall insulation
in the street and I had to pay for that in 1981 just after the house was
built. Quite a few have been done now its subsidised. I can't moan though, I
have saved many times the cost in thirty years.
Nutkey
wrote:
> "Martin Bonner" <martinfro...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
>
> news:9e19b76f-af2f-4830...@c10g2000yqh.googlegroups.com...
>
> > Cavity wall insulation didn't become required until the 70's,
>
> It wasn't required in the early eighties.
> Until about three years ago I had the only house with cavity wall insulation
> in the street and I had to pay for that in 1981 just after the house was
> built. Quite a few have been done now its subsidised. I can't moan though, I
Now it's subsidised... My dad popped round to see a neighbour last
night. Rang me up afterwards to tell me that she's having cavity wall
insulation put in for free (she's an OAP).
Trouble is, she has solid walls. I think I might go round with my dad
to watch....
The Natural Philosopher
Oh, sorry, that's 'renewable energy'..;-)
dennis@home
"Nutkey" <jbb...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:c182a530-24ab-4cf0...@f6g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...
Watch from outside.. they will drill holes through the wall and fill the
room with insulation.
ARWadsworth
Now that would be fun if they were still using the expanding foam type of
cavity wall insulation.
--
Adam