Damp Floor?
Gordon Henderson
which used to be on the outside of the house, and we think used to be
the original kitchen, but we reckon some 60 years ago an additional
covered alleyway was built outside it, making a corridor into the barn at
the side of the house which is now the kitchen... House is c250 years old.
Anyway, when we lifted the old carpet they found some blue plasticy
stuff under it (like very thin foam - like the sort of stuff you might
lay under laminate flooring), then about 3 layers of brown paper then
a cement floor.
And at a few spots the paper was damp and mouldy )-:
The damp appears to be in lines where the cement looks like it's cracked -
according to a local builder it's typical here to put a layer of cement
over old flagstones which are on dirt - no DPM.
House insurance won't cover any work on it - I guess we got cheap insurance.
A few photos here:
http://unicorn.drogon.net/20100813_001.jpg
http://unicorn.drogon.net/20100813_002.jpg
http://unicorn.drogon.net/20100813_003.jpg
I scraped the paper up last night and it more or less immediately
dried. We've never smelt any sort of mustyness in that room, nor felt
the carpets being damp. It's been raining here today and there's no sign
of any dampness coming up...
(currently have some off-cuts covering bits of it and not noticing
any issues)
We think the old carpet was there for at least 15 years, and we suspect
they knew about this - there's also a few blobs of what looks like
bitumen over the floor too....
So... Bit stuck here about what to do - most thoughts seem to be that
if the underlay we're using is breathable (it is - local stuff made with
recycled tyres and felt) and the carpet is also breathable (it's hessian
backed) and wool, then we'll probably be OK. The amount of water that's
come up has to be less than a cupfull over the years, but since the paper
had plastic on-top, it's never been able to dry out. The walls are fine
- and there was even a lot of dry dust under the skirting boards where
they were sanded down 3 years ago - so I don't think it's quite at the
swimming pool level yet!
One suggestion we had was to put battons down and floorboards on-top,
with ventilation grids at the ends - and while that's do-able, it will
raise the floor, requiring some steps into and out of it (2 doors and
a set of stairs), but others have said just to carpet it anyway, or do
as previous did with paper and plastic, then the underlay & carpet?
Anyone seen anything like this before?
Any suggestions welcome...
Gordon
Tabby
> So... Getting new carpets fitted and the chaps came to the dining room -
> which used to be on the outside of the house, and we think used to be
> the original kitchen, but we reckon some 60 years ago an additional
> covered alleyway was built outside it, making a corridor into the barn at
> the side of the house which is now the kitchen... House is c250 years old.
>
> Anyway, when we lifted the old carpet they found some blue plasticy
> stuff under it (like very thin foam - like the sort of stuff you might
> lay under laminate flooring), then about 3 layers of brown paper then
> a cement floor.
>
> And at a few spots the paper was damp and mouldy )-:
>
> The damp appears to be in lines where the cement looks like it's cracked -
> according to a local builder it's typical here to put a layer of cement
> over old flagstones which are on dirt - no DPM.
>
> House insurance won't cover any work on it - I guess we got cheap insurance.
>
> A few photos here:
>
Like you say it sounds like all it needs is porous carpet & underlay.
NT
The Natural Philosopher
rather than letting it shove moisture into your house where it will
generate condensation possibilities. And rot the carpet locally, and for
sure stain it. DAMHIKT.
Tabby
wrote:
All depends how bad it is. A slab that stays dry enough with porous
carpet can get positively wet if plastic covered, the OP's looks a
fair bit drier than that. Choose underlay carefully though, or dont
have any.
NT
Jim K
> So... Getting new carpets fitted and the chaps came to the dining room -
> which used to be on the outside of the house, and we think used to be
> the original kitchen, but we reckon some 60 years ago an additional
> covered alleyway was built outside it, making a corridor into the barn at
> the side of the house which is now the kitchen... House is c250 years old.
>
> Anyway, when we lifted the old carpet they found some blue plasticy
> stuff under it (like very thin foam - like the sort of stuff you might
> lay under laminate flooring), then about 3 layers of brown paper then
> a cement floor.
>
> And at a few spots the paper was damp and mouldy )-:
>
> The damp appears to be in lines where the cement looks like it's cracked -
> according to a local builder it's typical here to put a layer of cement
> over old flagstones which are on dirt - no DPM.
>
> House insurance won't cover any work on it - I guess we got cheap insurance.
>
> A few photos here:
>
if you wanted to "sort" it as opposed to masking it again (which could
work fine) have a google for "epoxy DPM" that cold be applied to the
entire surface of the floor.
Cheers
Jim K
Jules Richardson
> I scraped the paper up last night and it more or less immediately dried.
> We've never smelt any sort of mustyness in that room, nor felt the
> carpets being damp. It's been raining here today and there's no sign of
> any dampness coming up...
One thing I've found is that it can come and go - our basement floor's
been dry for the last couple of years, but this year we've had a little
damp coming up in certain small patches through hairline* cracks in the
slab (and it has been a lot wetter this year than previous years).
* I can't even see them, but they must be there :-)
Personally I'd seal it with something (either liquid stuff or plastic
sheet), just to be sure.
cheers
Jules
TheScullster
"Gordon Henderson" wrote
Not strictly meant to stop on-going moisture, but if it can't handle the
quantities you've mentioned I'd be surprised:
http://www.f-ball.co.uk/product_detail.asp?product=F76&catID=damp
Phil
js.b1
SBR the floor (liberally) - it is both a binder & waterproofer.
Everbuild BlackJack DPM the floor (3x) - bitumen & latex combined.
Then ask EverBuild what you can put on top (I can not recall, they may
say a sheet of plastic & underlay).
Tommy Walsh did that with a cement slab.
The alternative is rip it up, but it is not easy or cheap re MOT, sand
blinding, DPM, insulation, cement, screed etc.
Tabby
The sane option is to leave it completely alone. With the plastic
removed it'll be far drier.
NT
Tim Watts
wibbled on Sunday 15 August 2010 09:25
> if you wanted to "sort" it as opposed to masking it again (which could
> work fine) have a google for "epoxy DPM" that cold be applied to the
> entire surface of the floor.
For that, I can recommend F Ball Stopgap F75. For carpeting, it would need
no further over treatment, but for sticking tiles down you'd need to go over
with 3+mm of Stopgap 300.
I used F75 and it is pretty simple if you are just going over otherwise firm
screed.
However, a loose lay of heavy gauge DPM plastic overlapped about 6" at the
joints and taped would probably work OK for a fraction of the price. The
screed would get damp but nothing above would care.
Cheers
Tim
--
Tim Watts
Managers, politicians and environmentalists: Nature's carbon buffer.
Tim Watts
wibbled on Monday 16 August 2010 17:37
The only caution I would give with using bitumen is that if anyone ever
wants to stick anything else down that requires a non bitumen adhesive (eg
tiles, maybe vinyl), then they are rather stuffed (as I was) and will
probably have to do something drastic to get rid of it.
I'd definately go for either epoxy DPM or loose lay DPM.
js.b1
> The only caution I would give with using bitumen is that if anyone ever
> wants to stick anything else down that requires a non bitumen adhesive (eg
> tiles, maybe vinyl), then they are rather stuffed (as I was) and will
> probably have to do something drastic to get rid of it.
You know you love asphalt covered concrete :-)
> I'd definately go for either epoxy DPM or loose lay DPM.
Epoxy DPM is probably the best solution, loose DPM the cheapest.
Whatever, damp and carpets do not mix if anyone has any respiratory or
allergy issues.