Fixing leak behind bath taps

[Terry Pinnell]

Despite all my efforts I'm getting water seeping down behind my bath
taps and damaging the kitchen ceiling below. There's only about 1 cm
to work in between the taps and the tiles, so getting that sticky
white caulking stuff in place is difficult. Twice now, I thought I'd
successfully done it, only to get leaking again after a couple of
weeks of showers.

Close examination shows what seem to be tiny gaps, between the
caulking and the horizontal surface of the bath. As if it's not
sticking, but 'lifting' off. A few similar gaps where the caulking
meets the vertical tiles.

I'm not going to attempt caulking again. Can anyone recommend some
other product I can use please? I'm wondering whether simple 'plaster
filler' or whatever it's called would work? Or some sort of glue?

Any suggestions would be much appreciated please.

--
Terry, East Grinstead, UK

[Andy Cap]

Does the bath move at all, when you take a shower ? If it's not solid,
getting a good seal is impossible. I've always provided additional
support underneath the bath.

Andy C

[Tim Watts]

On 06/11/15 07:04, Terry Pinnell wrote:

I sealed my bath before fitting the taps. But it should be possible with.

First I would scrape out what's there. Totally.

Then go over with a silicone remover liquid.

The scrub it with a brush.

Then scrub again with isopropyl alcohol.

In this case, I'd not bother with silicone as it is clearly a
"difficult" location. Try Geocell TheWorks in white or clear. It's a
sealant, but it's not silicone and it has way superior adhesion. You
should be able to get the nozzle behind the taps from each side.

Masking tape is in order as it is very difficult to remove overspill.


If that doesn't work, the next option is to glue on one of those L
shaped edging strips which should work and can be held in reserve.

[Lobster]

On 06 Nov 2015, Andy Cap <snruwf...@trashmail.net> grunted:

> On 06/11/15 07:04, Terry Pinnell wrote:
>> Despite all my efforts I'm getting water seeping down behind my bath
>> taps and damaging the kitchen ceiling below. There's only about 1 cm
>> to work in between the taps and the tiles, so getting that sticky
>> white caulking stuff in place is difficult. Twice now, I thought I'd
>> successfully done it, only to get leaking again after a couple of
>> weeks of showers.
>>
>> Close examination shows what seem to be tiny gaps, between the
>> caulking and the horizontal surface of the bath. As if it's not
>> sticking, but 'lifting' off. A few similar gaps where the caulking
>> meets the vertical tiles.

Presumably you are using proper bathroom-grade silicone sealant, not
decorator's caulk?

If so, sounds like the surfaces aren't properly clean and dry - sounds
plausible to me, given that it's the hardest area to clean which is giving
you trouble. Have you got rid of all traces of any old sealant, dirt etc?
Give a final thorough clean to the surface of the bath with meths (if it's
a plastic bath) or better, acetone (but only if it's not plastic!)

>> I'm not going to attempt caulking again. Can anyone recommend some
>> other product I can use please? I'm wondering whether simple 'plaster
>> filler' or whatever it's called would work? Or some sort of glue?

Silicone sealant is definitely the only product to consider.

> Does the bath move at all, when you take a shower ? If it's not solid,
> getting a good seal is impossible. I've always provided additional
> support underneath the bath.

Always a good idea to half-fill the bath with water before sealing, so if
there is an increased gap caused by movement under the extra weight, this
gets filled with silicone. (I sealed a bath last weekend as it happens,
and have just realised I completely forgot to do that. Bollocks!)

--
David

[David Lang]

I've used this before stuck down with 'Sticks Like'.

http://www.diy.com/departments/homelux-pvc-white-bath-seal-
l175m/38123_BQ.prd

[Lobster]

On 06 Nov 2015, Tim Watts <tw_u...@dionic.net> grunted:

> In this case, I'd not bother with silicone as it is clearly a
> "difficult" location. Try Geocell TheWorks in white or clear. It's a
> sealant, but it's not silicone and it has way superior adhesion.

Hmm. never heard of that (further to my previous post). Interesting!

--
David

[Tim Watts]

I used the brown version to seal the gaps between timbers in mahogany
framed windows and also the gap between timber and tiled sill. On the
advice of a carpenter.

1.5 years later it's still doing the job, on a south facing window. In
summer, it goes concave as the joints open (wood dries out). In autumn
on, it goes convex as the wood expands slightly. It's clearly having to
work for its living as evidenced by the fact the previous attempts to
seal the gaps all fell out.

It's not as "pretty" as silicone - tends to have a matt finish, but
you'd not see that with the clear and probably not noticeable with the
white.

[Dave Liquorice]

On Fri, 6 Nov 2015 07:53:20 +0000, Andy Cap wrote:

> Does the bath move at all, when you take a shower ? If it's not solid,

> ...

It'll move even if it looks solid. Plastic will deform under the load
fo what 1/4 of tonne (100 l water plus human). Cast iron probably
won't but the floor may well have a little "give".

Fill the bath before you seal it (with silicone sealant) and keep it
full for 24 hours so the silicone is fully cured. If you empty the
bath before the silicone has cured it'll just get squidged out of the
way. The idea is to have the gap as large as possible let the sealant
cure then release the load putting the sealant into compression
(which it is good at), not tension (which it isn't good at).

--
Cheers
Dave.

[Muddymike]

+1

Mike

[Muddymike]

Google search "Bath quadrant" if you have a large gap it is far better than
just silicone. Fit with the bath full.

Mike

[Andy Cap]

As well as reinforcing the base, I also put a batten on the walls to
support the edges but it's a bit late for the OP to do that ! The edges
of my bath don't move, even if you stand on them.

[John Rumm]

On 06/11/2015 08:10, Lobster wrote:

> Always a good idea to half-fill the bath with water before sealing, so if
> there is an increased gap caused by movement under the extra weight, this
> gets filled with silicone. (I sealed a bath last weekend as it happens,
> and have just realised I completely forgot to do that. Bollocks!)

And don't drain the water until the silicone is fully cured. That then
leave the bead of silicone under compression when the bath is empty, and
relaxed when full, rather than relaxed when empty and stretched when full.


--
Cheers,

John.

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\=================================================================/

[Tim Watts]

I did the same after the excellent advice here some years ago. I even
managed to make an open structural frame for the free side, which also
serves as something to screw the panel to.

[Chris J Dixon]

Andy Cap wrote:

>As well as reinforcing the base, I also put a batten on the walls to
>support the edges but it's a bit late for the OP to do that ! The edges
>of my bath don't move, even if you stand on them.

My bath fitters put a generous bead of sealant between the bath
and the wall, as it was offered up, which seemed a useful move,
as it probably helps minimise movement, and acts as a backup to
the actual seal to the tiles, which 11 years on is still sound,
though I have made a mental note that it is probably due for
renewal.

Chris
--
Chris J Dixon Nottingham UK
ch...@cdixon.me.uk

Plant amazing Acers.

[RayL12]

To add; Though it may sound like a silly question, is it tiling you
are adhering to?

There is also a possibility that water is getting through the tap to
bath seal.

I had a bath put in. The taps were secure. However, it wasn't obvious
that the holes cut for the tap were much too large and that the taps
were not actually crimping the bath itself but were clamped to the
wooden bracing board beneath. It wasn't obvious until the taps loosened
as the wood transformed.



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[Capitol]

Lobster wrote:
>
> Silicone sealant is definitely the only product to consider.
>

That's interesting, as I've had very good results with acrylic
filler. I do also use silicone.

[Phil L]

"Terry Pinnell" <m...@somewhere.invalid> wrote in message
news:ptio3b18b4m6vvm46...@4ax.com...

Clean the area off properly, make sure there's no sign of any sealant or
anything else.
Make sure it's completely dry, use tissue paper and keep wiping it until
there's no damp or residue showing on the tissue, then apply bathroom
silicone, caulking is water based and not suitable for this purpose.

Also, I had a leak in exactly the same place last year, the sealant was
sound and there were no gaps, it turned out that the water was dripping
through the holes where the taps are - the tightening nuts underneath
were'nt sealed properly, so take your bath panel off once you've sealed it
as mentioned above and spray the shower on the taps from above, have a close
look using a torch and check the underside of the taps with tissue paper for
signs of water

[DerbyBorn]

"Phil L" <neverc...@hotmail.com> wrote in
news:Jj0%x.44518$6i2....@fx35.am4:

+1

[Graham Nye]

On 2015-11-06 11:39, Phil L wrote:

> Also, I had a leak in exactly the same place last year, the sealant was
> sound and there were no gaps, it turned out that the water was dripping
> through the holes where the taps are - the tightening nuts underneath
> were'nt sealed properly, so take your bath panel off once you've sealed it
> as mentioned above and spray the shower on the taps from above, have a close
> look using a torch and check the underside of the taps with tissue paper for
> signs of water

After I hadn't been able to reseal the bath the plumber found that the wooden
block the mixer tap was secured to had rotted so the tap wasn't secure. (It
wasn't loose enough to visibly wobble though.)



--
Graham Nye
news(a)thenyes.org.uk

[Terry Pinnell]

Thanks all, much appreciate the suggestions.

I hadn't considered the (now rather obvious!) downward bath movement
issue, which I now realise must be the cause of the 'lifting' I
mentioned.

In my impatience yesterday I bought another sealant, Homebase's
'Superior General Purpose Sealant. I used the caulking gun with an
improvised 5" extension to paint this transparent stuff liberally -
but over the existing sealant! Also around the tap 'washer'.

I should have added that I'm very apprehensive about attempting
removal of the plastic bath panel. I had to buy a fairly expensive
replacement from a 'legacy' supplier last year as the original (30
years old) was badly cracked and no longer available from any normal
supplier. I had a devil of a job getting it on and I'm worried that
removal carries a high risk of cracking it. I *think* I sort of wedged
it on, flexing with upward force from the bottom while sliding it very
slowly inward along the bathroom carpet.

Because of the difficulty of easy inspection under the bath, after
repairing the kitchen ceiling a couple of weeks ago, I invested
several days making a 'damp detector' to warn me of any re-occurrence.
(The only aspect of DIY that I'm confident about stems from my hobby
of practical electronics/electrics.) The sensor is made of bare wires
inside a sheet of blotting paper, inserted through a temporary hole in
the ceiling plasterboard and spread out roughly over the area where
the drips from the tap area occurred. Its electrical resistance drops
when damp and provides the input to my circuit, triggering a loud
alarm. That went off around 06:00 a few days ago while I was
showering. And prompted my original post.

As the sensor is in the corner directly above the gas boiler, it dries
fairly quickly, so the device is now monitoring again. My first shower
since my crude sealing was completed this morning without drama. But I
realise I'm on borrowed time!

[newshound]

On 06/11/2015 07:59, Tim Watts wrote:

I was going to suggest that, but the other comment about routes past the
taps is also worth checking.