Fitting a chimney box / soot door thingy

Lobster

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May 20, 2012, 2:44:09 PM5/20/12

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The chimney sweep who swept our chimney last winter warned us he
couldn't do a proper job because the chimney is dog-legged, and needed a
soor door installing in the chimney breast to facilitate access to the
awkward bit of flue. and basically warned us against using the fire
until this was sorted out. So the tuit has been rounded...

Has anyone fitted one of these things? Here's an example:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/120541433027
Doesn't look too complicated?
How do work out where to open up the chinney breast, though? We have a
cast-iron stove with doors in the fireplace, so you can't really see
anything up the chimney. Also, the fireplace is on a party-wall, so no
chance of doing it from outside.

Presumably you take out bricks over three courses, I'm guessing ideally
at the dog-leg or at least on the non-vertical section of flue? Do you
use normal mortar? Anything else I need to know?

Can it usually be done through the *side* of the chimney breast? I'm
guessing (again) the brickwork would be much thicker there?; although
cosmetically it would be preferable.

Thanks
David

Nick Odell

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May 20, 2012, 5:38:59 PM5/20/12

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I no nuffink about this but I'm guessing the reason you haven't been
flooded with replies is because more information is needed. For
example, does the stove burn wood, coal or something else? Is this a
new build house where the designer never expected the chimney to be
put to serious work or an old cottage that's been pumping out smoke
and soot without a problem for hundreds of years? Stuff like that.

Nick

Lobster

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May 20, 2012, 6:09:10 PM5/20/12

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It burns whatever we stick on it; ie coal and logs basically.

The house is celebrating its 100th birthday this year as it happens.
Clearly the chimney and chimney breast has been in place all that time,
though the fireplace itself, although predating our tenure, is not
original - probably 1970s?

The fire certainly smokes quite badly now, and I think it's got worse
with time, which would tie in with a flue being clogged by un-sweepable
soot. Hard to say how much it was used, and with what fuel, before we
started using it.

David

Dave Liquorice

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May 20, 2012, 7:17:56 PM5/20/12

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On Sun, 20 May 2012 23:09:10 +0100, Lobster wrote:

> The house is celebrating its 100th birthday this year as it happens.

<snip>

> The fire certainly smokes quite badly now,

Have the windows/doors been changed windows to units with decent
seals? If so the air supply for the fire/chimney has effectively been
cut off unless some additional ventilation into that room has been
provided.

> ... and I think it's got worse with time, which would tie in with a flue

> being clogged by un-sweepable soot.

Well I guess it depends on how much of dog leg you have. Not a
chimney expert but very few chimneys are straight up, most have dog
leg in them if only so the flue passes up the side of the fireplace
directly above them in upstairs room(s).

I wouldn't expect a flue to be built at that time that wasn't
sweepable or with a dog leg that would clog. Of course it might be
constructed so that you'd clear the dog leg from an open fire place
rather than having a stove fitted. Which sort of raises the question
of why the chimney didn't have a liner installed when the stove was
fitted.

--
Cheers
Dave.

harry

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May 21, 2012, 2:07:03 AM5/21/12

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The thinnest brickwork is usually on the front/rear of the chimney
breast.
It'd not usually considered a good idea to have a cleaning door on a
masonry chimney indoors in case there is a leak & you get CO in the
house. Normally they are outdoors.

There might be a chimney lining or on the other hand it may need
lining.

You might have tar formed inthe chimney from burning logs. Mostly you
get it in the last coupleof feet of the chimney (ie right up high).
Sometimes it;s quite soft, sometimes it's like highway asphalt.
You need t get a chimney expert to have a look but it could all end up
quite expensive.

Tim Lamb

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May 21, 2012, 3:57:41 AM5/21/12

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In message <nyyfbegfubjuvyypb...@srv1.howhill.co.uk>, Dave
Liquorice <allsortsn...@howhill.co.uk> writes

I actually removed just such a soot box when we took out the old kitchen
range. The chimney opening was closed off with a very wide register
plate below the corbelling and had a separate sliding access plate for
sweeping. The chimney is no longer used so I can't report any problems.

regards
>

--
Tim Lamb

Lobster

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May 21, 2012, 4:48:32 AM5/21/12

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On 21/05/2012 00:17, Dave Liquorice wrote:
> On Sun, 20 May 2012 23:09:10 +0100, Lobster wrote:
>
>> The house is celebrating its 100th birthday this year as it happens.
> <snip>
>> The fire certainly smokes quite badly now,
>
> Have the windows/doors been changed windows to units with decent
> seals? If so the air supply for the fire/chimney has effectively been
> cut off unless some additional ventilation into that room has been
> provided.

In fact several of the glass panes in the doors have fallen out and need
replacing (on the cards while the room is being refurbed) so no, it's
definitely not sealed. (It does have ventilation from below the doors,
which presumably suffices in normal operation?)

>> ... and I think it's got worse with time, which would tie in with a flue
>> being clogged by un-sweepable soot.
>
> Well I guess it depends on how much of dog leg you have. Not a
> chimney expert but very few chimneys are straight up, most have dog
> leg in them if only so the flue passes up the side of the fireplace
> directly above them in upstairs room(s).
>
> I wouldn't expect a flue to be built at that time that wasn't
> sweepable or with a dog leg that would clog. Of course it might be
> constructed so that you'd clear the dog leg from an open fire place
> rather than having a stove fitted.

Probably right - presumably it's been swept adequately in the past,
during the century it's been there

Which sort of raises the question
> of why the chimney didn't have a liner installed when the stove was
> fitted.

Pass. But whatever, presumably the sootbox thing as recommended by the
sweep, is the simplest way forward now.

David

Lobster

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May 21, 2012, 4:52:29 AM5/21/12

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On 21/05/2012 07:07, harry wrote:
> On May 20, 7:44 pm, Lobster<davidlobsterpot...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> The chimney sweep who swept our chimney last winter warned us he
>> couldn't do a proper job because the chimney is dog-legged, and needed a
>> soor door installing in the chimney breast to facilitate access to the
>> awkward bit of flue. and basically warned us against using the fire
>> until this was sorted out. So the tuit has been rounded...
>>
>> Has anyone fitted one of these things? Here's an example:http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/120541433027
>> Doesn't look too complicated?
>> How do work out where to open up the chinney breast, though? We have a
>> cast-iron stove with doors in the fireplace, so you can't really see
>> anything up the chimney. Also, the fireplace is on a party-wall, so no
>> chance of doing it from outside.
>>
>> Presumably you take out bricks over three courses, I'm guessing ideally
>> at the dog-leg or at least on the non-vertical section of flue? Do you
>> use normal mortar? Anything else I need to know?
>>
>> Can it usually be done through the *side* of the chimney breast? I'm
>> guessing (again) the brickwork would be much thicker there?; although
>> cosmetically it would be preferable.
>

> The thinnest brickwork is usually on the front/rear of the chimney
> breast.
> It'd not usually considered a good idea to have a cleaning door on a

> masonry chimney indoors in case there is a leak& you get CO in the

> house. Normally they are outdoors.

I've certainly seen them indoors before; and the one I flagged above as
an example says it's suitable for indoor use and is double-sealed.
FWIW...