replacing timeswitch for boiler
Virgin Newsgroups
heating of the hot water in the house
It has recently gone faulty and now we have to manually switch on to get the
boiler to switch on. (as the nights are getting colder this means that first
one up in the house every morning rushes down stairs to turn the boler on
(and at the same time central heating swiches on))
It obviously needs replacing and i have come across the model Danfoss
Randall 103E7
http://www.heatingcontrolsonline.co.uk/danfoss-randall-103e7-p-154.html
Am i correct in thinking this can be used as a replacement?
The advantage of the electronic version is that according to the manual at
http://www.heatingcontrolsonline.co.uk/instructions/103e7.pdf you can have
different start times for different days of week (ie we could programme for
slightly later at weekends when we get up later and slightly earlier on a
monday when i get up at 5am to catch train)
Can anyone confirm that my assumptions are correct and that i can switch out
a 103 and replace with a 103E7?
I have read that the same backplate etc is used so does this mean that
"switching" is something a "competent" person can do. If not can anyone
recommend someone in Whitefield area (between manchester and Bury). Should i
be looking for an electrician or a central heating specialist?
Dave Plowman (News)
Virgin Newsgroups <scfisher_listSPAM@SPAM_ntlworld.co.uk> wrote:
> I have read that the same backplate etc is used so does this mean that
> "switching" is something a "competent" person can do. If not can anyone
> recommend someone in Whitefield area (between manchester and Bury).
> Should i be looking for an electrician or a central heating specialist?
Even if it isn't a direct swop it's something any half competent
electrician should be able to do in his sleep. ;-)
--
*If at first you don't succeed, destroy all evidence that you tried *
Dave Plowman da...@davenoise.co.uk London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.
ARWadsworth
"Virgin Newsgroups" <scfisher_listSPAM@SPAM_ntlworld.co.uk> wrote in message
news:OrACm.25515$Rj7....@newsfe28.ams2...
>i have a Danfoss-randall 103 electromechanical t/s which controls the
>heating of the hot water in the house
>
> It has recently gone faulty and now we have to manually switch on to get
> the boiler to switch on. (as the nights are getting colder this means that
> first one up in the house every morning rushes down stairs to turn the
> boler on (and at the same time central heating swiches on))
>
> It obviously needs replacing and i have come across the model Danfoss
> Randall 103E7
> http://www.heatingcontrolsonline.co.uk/danfoss-randall-103e7-p-154.html
>
> Am i correct in thinking this can be used as a replacement?
>
> The advantage of the electronic version is that according to the manual at
> http://www.heatingcontrolsonline.co.uk/instructions/103e7.pdf you can have
> different start times for different days of week (ie we could programme
> for slightly later at weekends when we get up later and slightly earlier
> on a monday when i get up at 5am to catch train)
>
> Can anyone confirm that my assumptions are correct and that i can switch
> out a 103 and replace with a 103E7?
Yes it is a straight swap. Turn the power to the boiler off, remove the 103
from the backplate and replace it with the 103E7 and turn power back on.
Adam
ARWadsworth
"Dave Plowman (News)" <da...@davenoise.co.uk> wrote in message
news:50ac15b...@davenoise.co.uk...
And some swaps are nightmares. Imagine if the old programmer has been
tiled/plastered around then try getting it off the wall without damaging
anything.
Adam
Roger Mills
Virgin Newsgroups <scfisher_listSPAM@SPAM_ntlworld.co.uk> wrote:
As others have said, this is a direct replacement for your current timer.
*However*, it's only a single channel device - and doesn't provide
independent timing for hot water and central heating.
How is your system configured? Is it capable of independent control of HW
and CH? Are there any motorised valves? Does the pump run all the time the
boiler is on, or only for the CH? Is there a room stat? If you answer these
questions, we might be able to suggest ways of making the whole thing
operate more efficiently - without costing the earth to implement.
--
Cheers,
Roger
______
Email address maintained for newsgroup use only, and not regularly
monitored.. Messages sent to it may not be read for several weeks.
PLEASE REPLY TO NEWSGROUP!
Virgin Newsgroups
"Roger Mills" <watt....@googlemail.com> wrote in message
news:7k0jvdF...@mid.individual.net...
The existing contoller heats the hot water and radiators at the same time.
If we want to turn the radiators off then we need to turn the room
thermostat in the hallway to off which means only the hot water is heated.
I believe the room thermostat is connected to a moroised valve which closes
off the central heating when the room thermostat in hallway is turned down,
I assumed that replacing with the electronic version of the randal 103 would
mean that life carries on the same (ie no independant control of the CH)
from the timer. The only advantage that we wouild get with the electronic
version would be 3 on/offs per day and could have different timings for each
day of the week. Yes it would be nice to have independant control of CH and
HW but i cannot believe this would be very cheap to implement on current
system!!
geoff
<scfisher_listSPAM@SPAM_ntlworld.co.uk> writes
>i have a Danfoss-randall 103 electromechanical t/s which controls the
>heating of the hot water in the house
>
>It has recently gone faulty and now we have to manually switch on to
>get the boiler to switch on. (as the nights are getting colder this
>means that first one up in the house every morning rushes down stairs
>to turn the boler on (and at the same time central heating swiches on))
>
>It obviously needs replacing and i have come across the model Danfoss
>Randall 103E7
>http://www.heatingcontrolsonline.co.uk/danfoss-randall-103e7-p-154.html
>
>Am i correct in thinking this can be used as a replacement?
>
>The advantage of the electronic version is that according to the manual
>at http://www.heatingcontrolsonline.co.uk/instructions/103e7.pdf you
>can have different start times for different days of week (ie we could
>programme for slightly later at weekends when we get up later and
>slightly earlier on a monday when i get up at 5am to catch train)
>
>Can anyone confirm that my assumptions are correct and that i can
>switch out a 103 and replace with a 103E7?
>
--
geoff
ARWadsworth
Then something needs to change if you want better controls.
It should be possible to install a two channel programmer. The CH and HW may
not be independant as you may have to have HW on when you call for CH but a
single channel programmer to control both is a waste of money.
Adam
Roger Mills
What curently stops the hot water from getting too hot - is there a
thermostat on the cylinder? If so, what does it control? Does the pump run
when *just* the hot water is on, without central heating?
Chances are that you are wasting a lot of gas keeping the boiler hot when it
doesn't need to be hot - and that some updated controls would pay for
themselves in a relatively short period. Depending on what you've actually
got - and you haven't really told us yet - you could probably transform your
system for less than a couple of hundred quid in valves, stats, etc. Of
course, if you have to pay someone to fit them, the cost will be higher -
but this *is* a DIY group!
Michael Chare
news:h0GCm.25708$cV4....@newsfe01.ams2...
>
Danfoss make the TP9000 which is a two channel programmable thermostat.
One channel switches the hot water off and on preferably inconjuction with
hot water thermostat.
The other channel controls the central heating using a remote temperature
sensor. The sensor would replace an existing room thermostat.
--
Michael Chare
petek
My system sounds exactly like yours - the timeswitch merely controls
the boiler on/off, while the roomstat in the hall controls the pump
and hence the CH. If we want HW only we just turn the roomstat down.
Incidentally we don't have a motorised valve, the roomstat just
switches off the pump and the HW is gravity fed.
I have recently faced the same dilemma. Should I just change the
existing Danfoss 103 mechanical switch to an electronic version
(Danfoss 103E5) or update the whole system to control HW and CH
separately. I have just fitted new kitchen cupboards and re-tiled the
kitchen so I decided against updating the system as it would have
probably involved new wiring and disturbing the new tiles, so I just
fitted the Danfoss 103E5 instead of the old 103.
It's a doddle - assuming someone hasn't been lazy and tiled round the
old switch and grouted it in, as it needs to slide upwards to remove
it from the backplate. Then just fit the new switch in it's place on
the old backplate. The connections are all plugged in when you slide
the new switch in place so no messing about with disconnecting and re-
connecting wires etc.
Lots of significant price variations on the new switch on t'internet
by the way - I just used the cheapest and it was delivered in 48hrs.
Pete
Dave Plowman (News)
Virgin Newsgroups <scfisher_listSPAM@SPAM_ntlworld.co.uk> wrote:
> The existing contoller heats the hot water and radiators at the same
> time. If we want to turn the radiators off then we need to turn the
> room thermostat in the hallway to off which means only the hot water is
> heated.
> I believe the room thermostat is connected to a moroised valve which
> closes off the central heating when the room thermostat in hallway is
> turned down,
Are you sure there is a motorised valve? It's just that with fully pumped
systems it's usual to provide independant control. Only means a few feet
of extra wire. Older systems often relied on gravity circulation to heat
the water.
> I assumed that replacing with the electronic version of the randal 103
> would mean that life carries on the same (ie no independant control of
> the CH) from the timer. The only advantage that we wouild get with the
> electronic version would be 3 on/offs per day and could have different
> timings for each day of the week. Yes it would be nice to have
> independant control of CH and HW but i cannot believe this would be
> very cheap to implement on current system!!
It's only a bit of rewiring if you do have a fully pumped system. If you
have an electrical thermostat on the storage cylinder it likely will be
fully pumped.
--
*Parenthetical remarks (however relevant) are (usually) unnecessary *
Dave Plowman da...@davenoise.co.uk London SW
Roger Mills
> In article <h0GCm.25708$cV4....@newsfe01.ams2>,
> Virgin Newsgroups <scfisher_listSPAM@SPAM_ntlworld.co.uk> wrote:
>> The existing contoller heats the hot water and radiators at the same
>> time. If we want to turn the radiators off then we need to turn the
>> room thermostat in the hallway to off which means only the hot water
>> is heated.
>
>> I believe the room thermostat is connected to a moroised valve which
>> closes off the central heating when the room thermostat in hallway is
>> turned down,
>
> Are you sure there is a motorised valve? It's just that with fully
> pumped systems it's usual to provide independant control. Only means
> a few feet of extra wire. Older systems often relied on gravity
> circulation to heat the water.
>
>> I assumed that replacing with the electronic version of the randal
>> 103 would mean that life carries on the same (ie no independant
>> control of the CH) from the timer. The only advantage that we wouild
>> get with the electronic version would be 3 on/offs per day and could
>> have different timings for each day of the week. Yes it would be
>> nice to have independant control of CH and HW but i cannot believe
>> this would be very cheap to implement on current system!!
>
> It's only a bit of rewiring if you do have a fully pumped system. If
> you have an electrical thermostat on the storage cylinder it likely
> will be fully pumped.
And even if it's gravity HW and pumped CH, it's not rocket science to
convert it to a C-Plan system, using a motorised valve in the HW circuit and
a tank stat on the cylinder. That way, you get:
* the ability to have HW and CH on at different times
* the ability to run the radiators hotter (by turning up the boiler stat)
without the risk of the HW getting too hot
* boiler interlock - so that the boiler is turned off when both HW and CH
demands are met, rather than wasting energy by cycling on its own stat
Well worth doing, in my book!
ARWadsworth
"Dave Plowman (News)" <da...@davenoise.co.uk> wrote in message
news:50ac665...@davenoise.co.uk...
I do come along quite a few fully pumped but badly controlled systems at
work.
Basically the programmer operates the same way as a gravity system ie HW
must be on when CH is on. The HW output of the programmer fires the pump and
the CH output controls a 2 port valve to allow water around the radiators.
A real bodge job when you consider how little to would take to turn it into
an S plan
Adam
bruck...@tiscali.co.uk
When going on holiday it would be great to be able program thw Danfoss to switch the whole sytem off but have it come on again say 2 days before my return. I think this is possible with the E7 but is it possible with the E5?