Part and new rings
Doctor Evil
DIYer can replace parts of a defective ring. If the defective part was at
the CU and it was replace with heavier cable, a new sub ring could be taken
from this. All within Part P. Or is it?
_________________________________________
Usenet Zone Free Binaries Usenet Server
More than 120,000 groups
Unlimited download
http://www.usenetzone.com to open account
RichardS
news:424d3957$1...@news.usenetzone.com...
> Part P specifically says a DIYer cannot install a complete new ring. A
> DIYer can replace parts of a defective ring. If the defective part was at
> the CU and it was replace with heavier cable, a new sub ring could be
taken
> from this. All within Part P. Or is it?
>
"Obviously" doing things with the CU should not be considered DIY. Pay the
money & get a pro in.
--
Richard Sampson
mail me at
richard at olifant d-ot co do-t uk
Doctor Evil
"RichardS" <no...@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
news:3b4rmfF...@individual.net...
> "Doctor Evil" <Min...@nospam.com> wrote in message
> news:424d3957$1...@news.usenetzone.com...
> > Part P specifically says a DIYer cannot install a complete new ring. A
> > DIYer can replace parts of a defective ring. If the defective part was
at
> > the CU and it was replace with heavier cable, a new sub ring could be
> taken
> > from this. All within Part P. Or is it?
>
> "Obviously" doing things with the CU should not be considered DIY. Pay
the
> money & get a pro in.
Replacing an mcb and replacing the whole CU are two very different things.
Did you notice?
Dave Plowman (News)
Doctor Evil <Min...@nospam.com> wrote:
> If the defective part was at the CU and it was replace with heavier
> cable, a new sub ring could be taken from this.
You haven't quite got to grips with electrics, have you?
--
*I must always remember that I'm unique, just like everyone else. *
Dave Plowman da...@davenoise.co.uk London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.
Andrew Gabriel
"Doctor Evil" <Min...@nospam.com> writes:
> Part P specifically says a DIYer cannot install a complete new ring. A
No it doesn't. A DIYer can still do everything. If you're going to
keep talking about Part P, for goodness sake take the time to sit
down and read it. It really isn't that difficult to understand.
> DIYer can replace parts of a defective ring. If the defective part was at
> the CU and it was replace with heavier cable, a new sub ring could be taken
> from this. All within Part P. Or is it?
In your case, you already said you would have to get a pro in.
--
Andrew Gabriel
Stuart
(Andrew Gabriel) wrote:
>In article <424d3957$1...@news.usenetzone.com>,
> "Doctor Evil" <Min...@nospam.com> writes:
>> Part P specifically says a DIYer cannot install a complete new ring. A
>
>No it doesn't. A DIYer can still do everything. If you're going to
>keep talking about Part P, for goodness sake take the time to sit
>down and read it. It really isn't that difficult to understand.
>
I think when he said that a diy'er can't do it he probably meant they
couldnt do it unrestricted by red tape not that they could not do it .
A bit like saying no-one can murder their mother..well,obviously they
can .it just ain't legal.lol
Stuart
Shift THELEVER to reply.
RichardS
>
> "RichardS" <no...@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
> news:3b4rmfF...@individual.net...
> > "Doctor Evil" <Min...@nospam.com> wrote in message
> > news:424d3957$1...@news.usenetzone.com...
> > > Part P specifically says a DIYer cannot install a complete new ring.
A
> > > DIYer can replace parts of a defective ring. If the defective part was
> at
> > > the CU and it was replace with heavier cable, a new sub ring could be
> > taken
> > > from this. All within Part P. Or is it?
> >
> > "Obviously" doing things with the CU should not be considered DIY. Pay
> the
> > money & get a pro in.
>
> Replacing an mcb and replacing the whole CU are two very different things.
> Did you notice?
>
Notice what? When did the MCB come into this? You can't fit them with a
hacksaw, you know.
Jeff
"Andrew Gabriel" <and...@cucumber.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:d2jht2$6bq$1...@sparta.btinternet.com...
This gets tedious - i am allowed to wire 3 phase, single phase and DC kit,
connect 350KVA generators, commission and fault find invertor drives and plc
control panels at work yet I can't run an extra socket in at home...Grrrrrr
But I presume I could change a washing m/c motor or a magnetron in my
microwave ?
If they ban working over a certain height (2 metres ? ) then where does that
leave window cleaners ?
And what about changing your brake pads/ disks on your car ? ...... surely a
lot more dangerous than fitting an extra socket !!!!
btw - I can fit an extra socket at work but not at home - bloody stupid or
what !!!!!
Regards Jeff
John Rumm
> Part P specifically says a DIYer cannot install a complete new ring. A
No, its installing a new "circuit" is within the scope of the
legislation. It does not mention "rings" as such.
> DIYer can replace parts of a defective ring. If the defective part was at
> the CU and it was replace with heavier cable, a new sub ring could be taken
> from this. All within Part P. Or is it?
What is a "sub ring"?
--
Cheers,
John.
/=================================================================\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\=================================================================/
Graham Jones
Why can't you fit an extra socket at home? Part P allows this except in
bathroom, kitchens and outdoors.
:::Jerry::::
"RichardS" <no...@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
news:3b4rmfF...@individual.net...
> news:424d3957$1...@news.usenetzone.com...
> > Part P specifically says a DIYer cannot install a complete new
ring. A
> > DIYer can replace parts of a defective ring. If the defective part
was at
> > the CU and it was replace with heavier cable, a new sub ring could
be
> taken
> > from this. All within Part P. Or is it?
> >
>
> "Obviously" doing things with the CU should not be considered DIY.
Pay the
> money & get a pro in.
>
What is different about the terminals that feeds the ring in a CU to
that of the terminals in the first socket along (in either direction)
? If the person is competent to cut the ring at the socket [1] and add
100 meters of extra cable why can't that be done at the CU, and if the
person is competent to design such an extension to the ring the person
will also be competent to install a new ring.
[1] or even before that point, like two feet from the CU.
RichardS
news:424d5412$0$33318$892e...@authen.white.readfreenews.net...
oh, I agree with you. Tongue firmly in cheek. I refer you to comments
previously made by DrIvel in the "Part P inspection..." thread...
Jeff
Graham Jones wrote :-
> Why can't you fit an extra socket at home? Part P allows this except in
> bathroom, kitchens and outdoors.
really ? .... so i can spur or break into the ring and install as many
sockets as i like except in the above locations ?
Regards Jeff
Christian McArdle
> DIYer can replace parts of a defective ring. If the defective part was at
> the CU and it was replace with heavier cable, a new sub ring could be
taken
> from this. All within Part P. Or is it?
There's no such thing as a sub ring, so it would suggest that it could not
be taken from this.
Part P doesn't ban anyone from doing any work. It just says that it comes
under building control and that people not registered with a guild must
apply for building control oversight (and presumably pay a fee at least ten
times the cost of the work).
Christian.
Christian McArdle
> sockets as i like except in the above locations ?
Well, as many as the wiring regulations will allow you to.
Christian.
Dave Plowman (News)
John Rumm <see.my.s...@nowhere.null> wrote:
> What is a "sub ring"?
Something he'd use for feeding all those above sink water heaters?
--
*Lottery: A tax on people who are bad at math.
John Rumm
> Nanny state - my god where will it all end.
May the 5th if you want! ;-)
Andy Hall
wrote:
>
>What is different about the terminals that feeds the ring in a CU to
>that of the terminals in the first socket along (in either direction)
>? If the person is competent to cut the ring at the socket [1] and add
>100 meters of extra cable why can't that be done at the CU, and if the
>person is competent to design such an extension to the ring the person
>will also be competent to install a new ring.
>
>[1] or even before that point, like two feet from the CU.
>
But Jerry...
You're making the fatal assumption that a) logic is implicit in the
legislation and b) that it is present in DrIvel's exposition of it.
--
.andy
To email, substitute .nospam with .gl
Andy Hall
>
>This gets tedious - i am allowed to wire 3 phase, single phase and DC kit,
>connect 350KVA generators, commission and fault find invertor drives and plc
>control panels at work yet I can't run an extra socket in at home...Grrrrrr
>But I presume I could change a washing m/c motor or a magnetron in my
>microwave ?
>
>If they ban working over a certain height (2 metres ? ) then where does that
>leave window cleaners ?
Paying tax like other firemen.
:::Jerry::::
"John Rumm" <see.my.s...@nowhere.null> wrote in message
news:424d65d4$0$94516$ed26...@ptn-nntp-reader01.plus.net...
> Parttime wrote:
>
> > Nanny state - my god where will it all end.
>
> May the 5th if you want! ;-)
>
<mode+pedantic>
Actually it will end on the 6th April [1], it's just that it might
re-start again on May 6th....
</mode>
[1] HMG *should* then become 'aparty-political', becoming nothing more
than a care-taking function.
Dave Stanton
> If they ban working over a certain height (2 metres ? ) then where does
> that leave window cleaners ?
>
I can answer that, having already seen a window cleaner at work the other
morning with a very large pole with a brush on the end connected to a pump
to clean second floor windows. Looked like commercial kit, not something
kocked up in the shed !!
Dave
--
For what we are about to balls up may common sense prevent us doing it
again
in the future!!
Dave Stanton
> kocked up in the shed !!
>
> Dave
That should be knocked up......oh I don't know <g>
:::Jerry::::
"Dave Stanton" <m...@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:pan.2005.04.01....@privacy.net...
>
> > kocked up in the shed !!
> >
> > Dave
>
> That should be knocked up......oh I don't know <g>
>
I think you had it right the first time, I can just see them using
that sort of gear in the Villages around here, what with all the 3ph
overhead distribution poles and wires feeding electricity to the
houses....
Andy Wade
> What is a "sub ring"?
It is a statement by the poster about the extent of his knowledge of
electric wiring.
It is also an anagram of Sir Bung, which could provide our kook with yet
another moniker.
--
Andy
Dave Stanton
> I think you had it right the first time, I can just see them using that
> sort of gear in the Villages around here, what with all the 3ph overhead
> distribution poles and wires feeding electricity to the houses....
It looked all plastic Jerry, but water, 3ph.......
Doctor Evil
"Dave Plowman (News)" <da...@davenoise.co.uk> wrote in message
news:4d54d37...@davenoise.co.uk...
> In article <424d5141$0$94522$ed26...@ptn-nntp-reader01.plus.net>,
> John Rumm <see.my.s...@nowhere.null> wrote:
> > What is a "sub ring"?
> Something he'd use for feeding all
> those above sink water heaters?
......my God, it is what you put around cabers for God's sake!!!!
Doctor Evil
"Stuart" <stuartT...@xpozure4u.plus.com> wrote in message
news:d9jq41hl4q4co4mp9...@4ax.com...
Stuart, this obvious logic passes them by. Sad but true.
Doctor Evil
> > If the defective part was at the
> > CU and it was replace with heavier
> > cable, a new sub ring could be taken from this.
...with a forlorn attempt at wisdom he ejaculates.....read this...
> You haven't quite got to grips with electrics, have you?
......does he have electric cabers?....is this the future?
Doctor Evil
"RichardS" <no...@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
Caber makers have been know to fit them with axes.
Doctor Evil
"Christian McArdle" <cmcar...@nospam.yahooxxxx.co.uk> wrote in message
news:424d59cd$0$294$ed9e...@reading.news.pipex.net...
> > Part P specifically says a DIYer cannot install a complete new ring. A
> > DIYer can replace parts of a defective ring. If the defective part was
at
> > the CU and it was replace with heavier cable, a new sub ring could be
> taken
> > from this. All within Part P. Or is it?
>
> There's no such thing as a sub ring, so it would suggest that it could not
> be taken from this.
There is. You can run a ring off a heavier cable ring. My garage has one.
Taken off the downstairs ring an exterior cable runs to the garage where
there is a garage CU and a lighting and power ring is run off this - two sub
rings. It is amazing how so many so-called electrical know-it-alls here,
yourself excluded, can't figure that out.
> Part P doesn't ban anyone from doing any work. It just says that it comes
> under building control and that people not registered with a guild must
> apply for building control oversight (and presumably pay a fee at least
ten
> times the cost of the work).
That is the sticking point - the cost, not the legislation which is pretty
well sound.
Doctor Evil
"John Rumm" <see.my.s...@nowhere.null> wrote in message
> Doctor Evil wrote:
>
> > Part P specifically says a DIYer cannot install a complete new ring. A
>
> No, its installing a new "circuit" is within the scope of the
> legislation. It does not mention "rings" as such.
>
> > DIYer can replace parts of a defective ring. If the defective part was
at
> > the CU and it was replace with heavier cable, a new sub ring could be
taken
> > from this. All within Part P. Or is it?
>
> What is a "sub ring"?
...erm...erm..would that not be a ring off a ring? There that is nice for
you, you didn't have to think.
Dave Plowman (News)
Doctor Evil <Min...@nospam.com> wrote:
> > There's no such thing as a sub ring, so it would suggest that it could
> > not be taken from this.
> There is. You can run a ring off a heavier cable ring. My garage has
> one. Taken off the downstairs ring an exterior cable runs to the garage
> where there is a garage CU and a lighting and power ring is run off this
> - two sub rings. It is amazing how so many so-called electrical
> know-it-alls here, yourself excluded, can't figure that out.
How does a final ring circuit run off a garage CU differ from a final ring
circuit run off the house one?
And a ring for lighting?
--
*The problem with the world is that everyone is a few drinks behind *
Dave Plowman (News)
> > Something he'd use for feeding all
> > those above sink water heaters?
> ......my God, it is what you put around cabers for God's sake!!!!
Some might well feel like putting a caber into your sub ring.
--
*Seen it all, done it all, can't remember most of it.
Doctor Evil
> In article <424e...@news.usenetzone.com>,
> Doctor Evil <Min...@nospam.com> wrote:
> > > There's no such thing as a sub ring, so it would suggest that it could
> > > not be taken from this.
>
> > There is. You can run a ring off a heavier cable ring. My garage has
> > one. Taken off the downstairs ring an exterior cable runs to the garage
> > where there is a garage CU and a lighting and power ring is run off this
> > - two sub rings. It is amazing how so many so-called electrical
> > know-it-alls here, yourself excluded, can't figure that out.
..a hard morning at the cabers and given him a brainwave...he storms....
> How does a final ring circuit
> run off a garage CU differ from a final ring
> circuit run off the house one?
>
> And a ring for lighting?
.......I will have to explain this in caber terms for him...you take a caber
from one ring, connect it via another caber to another ring...There that's
better for him...
Doctor Evil
> > > > What is a "sub ring"?
>
> > > Something he'd use for feeding all
> > > those above sink water heaters?
>
> > ......my God, it is what you
> > put around cabers for God's sake!!!!
.....he has an inkling which turns to a statement...read on...
> Some might well feel like
> putting a caber into your sub ring.
...that is what you do..... you put cabers all over the rings.....that is
better for him...he understands that better...
John Rumm
>>What is a "sub ring"?
>
>
> ...erm...erm..would that not be a ring off a ring? There that is nice for
> you, you didn't have to think.
And where in the OSG or BS7671 would one anticipate finding that little
bit of bodgery?
(I can tell you - in the section on fault finding cross linked ring
circuits!)