Finding a soakaway

[Bert Coules]

Somewhere under my back garden there's a soakaway pit, fed from a gutter
downpipe. I'd like to run a second feed to it from guttering newly fitted
to my garage, but I have to find it first. The garden is undeveloped, just
poor quality grass over a barely-leveled area of ground, so can be dug up
with no problems - but is there a method for locating the soakaway?

In the very centre of what passes for the lawn is a roughly square patch of
concrete some 12" x 12" with what looks like the base socket for a circular
dryer at its centre. I suppose there's a possibility that this was done
when the soakaway was installed, so perhaps that's a reasonable place to
start looking. Or perhaps I should wait for rain and employ a
water-diviner...

[David.WE.Roberts]

How old is the property?
Age + building regs should tell you the minimum distance from the house.

Best method?

Binary chop?

First dig down where the house downpipe is and locate the underground pipe
going to the soak away - expose enough to find the line of the pipe run,
then peg a cord out along that line.

Dig down about 3 metres out along the line in a long narrow slit trench at
right angles to the run, until you either find or don't find the pipe.

If you find the pipe, go out another 3 metres.

If you don't find the pipe, come in 1.5 metres (that is halfway between
the house and the 'lack of pipe').

When you have established a segment along the line where one end is 'pipe'
and the other end is 'not pipe' then you dig another slit trench in the
middle of the section - 'chop' the section in half.

Repeat using the ever smaller segments until you find the soakaway.

Allegedly more efficient than just digging a slit trench every metre along
the run, or exposing the complete pipe run.

Have fun.

Dave R

[Bert Coules]

Dave,

Thanks for that. The building is early sixties: I'll check about the
minimum distance. I'll also look to see if the location of the soakaway is
marked on the deeds: I suppose there's a chance.

Your "binary chop" approach sounds sensible.

Bert

[Tim Watts]

Either:

1) Buy a cheap waterproof chinese webcam on a 5m USB cable. Push down
pipe and see which direction it goes and how far.

I've done this...



2) Stick the hose down it and use a listening stick to find where on the
ground you can hear running water. I have not done this.

[Bert Coules]

Tim Watts wrote:

> 1) Buy a cheap waterproof chinese webcam on a 5m USB cable. Push down pipe
> and see which direction it goes and how far.

I can see how that could determine the distance, but how could I tell the
direction?

> 2) Stick the hose down it and use a listening stick to find where on the
> ground you can hear running water.

A listening stick presumably being something you hold to the ground at one
end and to your ear at the other?

Thanks for the thoughts.

Bert

[JimK]

Dowsing rods?

Jim K

[Tim Watts]

On 28/06/14 15:17, Bert Coules wrote:
> Tim Watts wrote:
>
>> 1) Buy a cheap waterproof chinese webcam on a 5m USB cable. Push down
>> pipe and see which direction it goes and how far.
>
> I can see how that could determine the distance, but how could I tell
> the direction?

Well, that is tricky... But it will tell you if you have any bends in
the pipe.

You should be able to estimate the starting direction when you see how
the cable goes down the bend.

A test hole near the start should confirm the direction accurately
enough to make a good estimate of the far end if it is a straight run.

>
>> 2) Stick the hose down it and use a listening stick to find where on
>> the ground you can hear running water.
>
> A listening stick presumably being something you hold to the ground at
> one end and to your ear at the other?

Indeed. The water companies still use them.

I guess this is really going to depend on what the ground is like as to
how well the sound comes through. OTOH a rounded end metal tube mop
handle might be worth a go and you might have one you can pull off a mop
for a test.

[Tim Watts]

On 28/06/14 15:37, JimK wrote:
> Dowsing rods?

Hazel twig or pair of bent coat hanger wire in biro tubes?

[Bert Coules]

I'm perfectly happy to try a spot of dowsing, but when there's enough water
in the soakaway to make it detectable, isn't there likely to be quite a lot
of water all over the place anyway? Won't my bent bits of coat hanger get
confused?

I suppose I could run a hose up to the gutter...

Bert

[Tim Watts]

Oh - so you don't have an open access point at ground level?

[Rod Speed]

Bert Coules <ma...@bertcoules.co.uk> wrote

> Tim Watts wrote

>> 1) Buy a cheap waterproof chinese webcam on a 5m USB cable.
>> Push down pipe and see which direction it goes and how far.

> I can see how that could determine the distance,
> but how could I tell the direction?

You should be able to see any bends.

[Bert Coules]

Tim Watts wrote:

> Oh - so you don't have an open access point at ground level?

No, the downpipe just disappears into the ground.

Bert

[PeterC]

On Sat, 28 Jun 2014 20:09:29 +0100, Tim Watts wrote:

>> A listening stick presumably being something you hold to the ground at
>> one end and to your ear at the other?
>
> Indeed. The water companies still use them.
>
> I guess this is really going to depend on what the ground is like as to
> how well the sound comes through. OTOH a rounded end metal tube mop
> handle might be worth a go and you might have one you can pull off a mop
> for a test.

An inspector from AW, trying to find a leak in my supply, used a solid stick
with a metal point (blunt cone, not sharp) at the bottom end and a sort of
very shallow cup for the top. A tube seems logical, but it gives the
'seashell' effect, so if the leak or sound is faint you hear your own blood
circulating (if you don't, the position of the soakaway is no longer
relevant!).
--
Peter.
The gods will stay away
whilst religions hold sway

[JimK]

/Tim Watts

On 28/06/14 15:37, JimK wrote:
> Dowsing rods?

Hazel twig or pair of bent coat hanger wire in biro tubes?/q

The latter are easier to fake with....:-)

Jim K

[Brian Gaff]

I suppose they used plastic papes then?

Brian

--
From the Sofa of Brian Gaff Reply address is active
"Bert Coules" <ma...@bertcoules.co.uk> wrote in message
news:U7CdnbrOYotTKzPO...@brightview.co.uk...

[Bert Coules]

Brian Gaff wrote:

> I suppose they used plastic pipes then?

I don't know, Brian. Early sixties, so I suppose it's a possibility. I'm
going to have a tentative dig at the base of the downpipe and see what I can
unearth.

Bert

[JimK]

/Tim Watts
- show quoted text -

Either:

1) Buy a cheap waterproof chinese webcam on a 5m USB cable. Push down
pipe and see which direction it goes and how far.

I've done this... /q

Gotta link to the USB camera plse?

Jim K

[Andy Burns]

JimK wrote:

> Tim Watts wrote:
>
>> Buy a cheap waterproof chinese webcam on a 5m USB cable. Push down
>> pipe and see which direction it goes and how far.
>

> Gotta link to the USB camera plse?

How do you keep track of which way up it is? I suppose a trickle of
water should give a clue ...

[Tim Watts]

Something like:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/m/221419377509

Search ebay for "5m USB camera" or "Waterproof USB camera".

Often from China, which is OK if you can wait 2 weeks for delivery. The
above claims to be a UK seller.

[Bert Coules]

Tim Watts wrote:

> Something like:
> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/m/221419377509

> The above claims to be a UK seller.

Thanks for the link. I just ordered one, and the estimated delivery date is
next Tuesday.

Bert

[Tim Watts]

Basically, yes...

[Bert Coules]

I should have said that I've discovered that the downpipe can be
disconnected, so using a camera has become feasible.

Bert

[Phil L]

"Bert Coules" <ma...@bertcoules.co.uk> wrote in message

news:i86dnS0wLZ06RTLO...@brightview.co.uk...

No possibility if it was built in the early sixties, even the early
seventies hadn't heard of plastic drains....I vaguely remember using them
for the first time in the mid eighties, and they hadn't been around for long
by then

[Bert Coules]

Phil L wrote:

> No possibility if it was built in the early sixties...

Oh right, thanks. I thought plastic had come in much earlier than that.

Bert

[Tim Lamb]

In message <iu2dna57j9cdqy3O...@brightview.co.uk>, Bert
Coules <ma...@bertcoules.co.uk> writes

>Phil L wrote:
>
>> No possibility if it was built in the early sixties...
>
>Oh right, thanks. I thought plastic had come in much earlier than that.

My first soakaway was around 1972 and I have no recollection of using
salt glaze pipe. No recollection of using plastic at that time either so
no help really:-)

--
Tim Lamb

[Rod Speed]

Phil L <neverc...@hotmail.com> wrote
> Bert Coules <ma...@bertcoules.co.uk> wrote

>> Brian Gaff wrote

>>> I suppose they used plastic pipes then?

>> I don't know, Brian. Early sixties, so I suppose it's a possibility.
>> I'm going to have a tentative dig at the base of the downpipe
>> and see what I can unearth.

> No possibility if it was built in the early sixties, even
> the early seventies hadn't heard of plastic drains....

That's not right, I used them myself for my roof drains in the
very early 70s. They weren't revolutionary new then either.

> I vaguely remember using them for the first time in the mid
> eighties, and they hadn't been around for long by then

That mangles the chronology.

[Rod Speed]

Tim Lamb <t...@marfordfarm.demon.co.uk> wrote
> Bert Coules <ma...@bertcoules.co.uk> wrote

>> Phil L wrote:

>>> No possibility if it was built in the early sixties...

>> Oh right, thanks. I thought plastic had come in much earlier than that.

> My first soakaway was around 1972 and I have no recollection of using
> salt glaze pipe. No recollection of using plastic at that time either so
> no help really:-)

I know I used plastic pipe before that. And it was to get
the roof water to the street gutter, not to a soakaway.

I used square plastic pipe in the holes in the full sized concrete
blocks for the verticals too, so there is nothing visible at all.

[charles]

In article <KENqK4CH...@marfordfarm.demon.co.uk>,

I buit an extension in 1972 which needed modification to the drains. No
sign of plastic; it was all Hepworth glazed pipe.

--
From KT24

Using a RISC OS computer running v5.18

[Tony Bryer]

On Sun, 29 Jun 2014 15:56:19 +0100 Phil L wrote :
> No possibility if it was built in the early sixties, even the early
> seventies hadn't heard of plastic drains....I vaguely remember using
> them for the first time in the mid eighties, and they hadn't been
> around for long by then

Marley PVC drainage was around when I was at uni 1971-74. Before PVC
the alternative to clay was pitch-fibre pipes: OK until the rats
started nibbling.

--
Tony Bryer, Greentram: 'Software to build on',
Melbourne, Australia www.greentram.com

[Mark]

On Sat, 28 Jun 2014 13:59:17 +0100, "Bert Coules"
<ma...@bertcoules.co.uk> wrote:

>Dave,
>
>Thanks for that. The building is early sixties: I'll check about the
>minimum distance. I'll also look to see if the location of the soakaway is
>marked on the deeds: I suppose there's a chance.

Are you sure it's a soakaway? IIRC storm drains were used mostly in
those days.

If it is a soakaway it may not be able to cope with the additional
water from another source.
--
(\__/) M.
(='.'=) If a man stands in a forest and no woman is around
(")_(") is he still wrong?

[Bert Coules]

Mark wrote:

> Are you sure it's a soakaway? IIRC storm drains were used mostly in
> those days.

That's an interesting point. To be honest, I'm hazy on the difference. I
must check.

> If it is a soakaway it may not be able to cope with the additional
> water from another source.

Yes, that point was raised by someone else. Once I know exactly (or even
approximately) what I'm dealing with, that's clearly a factor I'll have to
consider.

[freds...@gmail.com]

Can you not tap into the existing pipework close to the house once you've had an exploratory dig to discover its direction.
Alternatively once you know the direction run sewer rods up until they go no further. When you pull out the rods leave them screwed together then lay them along the line of the direction you have established. This should give you some indication of the location of the soakaway

[Bert Coules]

> Can you not tap into the existing pipework

> close to the house...?

That's not really practical, unfortunately, but thanks for the thought.
Your other suggestion is a good one too.

Bert

[Bert Coules]

I wrote:

> That's an interesting point. To be honest, I'm hazy on the difference.

Though on reflection, doesn't a storm drain invariably have an open grating
or similar at ground level? If that's the case then what I have isn't one.

Bert

[Rod Speed]

Bert Coules <ma...@bertcoules.co.uk> wrote
> Bert Coules <ma...@bertcoules.co.uk> wrote

>> That's an interesting point. To be honest, I'm hazy on the difference.

> Though on reflection, doesn't a storm drain invariably
> have an open grating or similar at ground level?

Nope, mine don't and I don't recall ever seeing any that do with houses.

[Mark]

IIRC normally there will be an inspection cover but it might be
covered up or not on even on your property.

[Bert Coules]

Rod Speed wrote:

> Nope, mine don't and I don't recall ever seeing any that do with houses.

Oh right, thanks.

Bert

[Phil L]

"Rod Speed" <rod.sp...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:c1bg8c...@mid.individual.net...

You are talking about plastic rainwater pipes, these have been around a lot
longer than underground plastic drainage

[Phil L]

"Rod Speed" <rod.sp...@gmail.com> wrote in message

news:c1bd5p...@mid.individual.net...

> Phil L <neverc...@hotmail.com> wrote
>> Bert Coules <ma...@bertcoules.co.uk> wrote
>>> Brian Gaff wrote
>
>>>> I suppose they used plastic pipes then?
>
>>> I don't know, Brian. Early sixties, so I suppose it's a possibility.
>>> I'm going to have a tentative dig at the base of the downpipe and see
>>> what I can unearth.
>
>> No possibility if it was built in the early sixties, even the early
>> seventies hadn't heard of plastic drains....
>
> That's not right, I used them myself for my roof drains in the very early
> 70s. They weren't revolutionary new then either.

Roof drains are very rarely underground.

>> I vaguely remember using them for the first time in the mid eighties, and
>> they hadn't been around for long by then
>
> That mangles the chronology.

Not really, they /may/ have been used in the mid to late seventies but
certainly not *early* seventies, and were only just coming onto the scene
properly ten years later

[robgraham]

Having a 1800's cottage probably updated in the 1920's with a septic tank and, I'm assuming, roof water soakaways, both of the latter having now become disfunctional, I would suggest that the OP may well find that trying to get a camera down the pipes could be nigh impossible due to sediment build up.

OK my original soakaways were some 80 years old, but the pipes were absolutely blocked with muck, and new soakaways - oversize lemonade bottle crates - have had to be installed. I've put in traps to try and reduce the muck concentration, though I'm not sure why as I will be shuffling off long before these 'soakaways' approach their life expectancy.

What I'm saying is that the OP should be aware that a soakaway built in the 60's might well be marginal now in capacity and that he may have to put in a new one.

[Rod Speed]

"Phil L" <neverc...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:myksv.489896$H24.3...@fx05.am4...

Nope.

> these have been around a lot longer than underground plastic drainage

He's talking about rainwater to the soakaway.

[Rod Speed]

"Phil L" <neverc...@hotmail.com> wrote in message

news:RAksv.403379$Dy.3...@fx21.am4...

>
> "Rod Speed" <rod.sp...@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:c1bd5p...@mid.individual.net...
>> Phil L <neverc...@hotmail.com> wrote
>>> Bert Coules <ma...@bertcoules.co.uk> wrote
>>>> Brian Gaff wrote
>>
>>>>> I suppose they used plastic pipes then?
>>
>>>> I don't know, Brian. Early sixties, so I suppose it's a possibility.
>>>> I'm going to have a tentative dig at the base of the downpipe and see
>>>> what I can unearth.
>>
>>> No possibility if it was built in the early sixties, even the early
>>> seventies hadn't heard of plastic drains....
>>
>> That's not right, I used them myself for my roof drains in the very early
>> 70s. They weren't revolutionary new then either.

> Roof drains are very rarely underground.

They have to be to get from the bottom of the downpipe to the gutter or
soakaway.

>>> I vaguely remember using them for the first time in the mid eighties,
>>> and they hadn't been around for long by then

>> That mangles the chronology.

> Not really, they /may/ have been used in the mid to late seventies but
> certainly not *early* seventies,

Mine was, in the very early 70s. I moved in in 73.

> and were only just coming onto the scene properly ten years later

Bullshit. Everyone was using them in the very early 70s
because I worked out how to do the simpler stuff like
that by walking around the new subdivision full of
new houses being built walking thru the half built
houses looking at how stuff like that was done.

[Bert Coules]

Rob, thanks for the warning. As it happens, my under-a-tenner USB camera
arrived just a few minutes ago, so I'll give it a try today.

Bert

[Tim Watts]

If the end gets clagged with dirt, run a hose down it at the same time -
I found that worked quite well :)

[Bert Coules]

Well, there's been progress of a sort. First, I excavated the house end of
the pipework to try to determine the angle of the run. This was the result:

http://tinyurl.com/mmjxyyh

It doesn't show up well in the picture but the pipe is corrugated and looks
as if it might be bendable. Certainly it seems to curve downwards away from
the entry level. I can't determine what it's made of.

Next I tried the USB camera. The cable was too flexible to be used to feed
the camera down the pipe, so I attached it to the end of an extending rule.
I got almost exactly ten feet along the pipe before I reached what seemed to
be a dead end. The camera did feed back a picture but it wasn't good enough
(or perhaps wasn't well-lit enough) to see exactly what was going on.

So I laid a batten along what seemed to be the straight course of the pipe
and dug down at the ten foot mark. And I found - earth. And a lot of
stones, but that would be true wherever you dig in this garden.

Either I haven't dug deep enough, or the pipe is flexible and bends
annoyingly off to one side or the other. If that's the case then it could
go almost anywhere...

Bert

[Bert Coules]

Update:

I just dug down at the five feet mark along the same line. Nothing but
earth and stones.

It's too hot for any more digging, so I'm giving up for today. Off now to
play with the camera in a marginally less messy environment...

Bert

[RobertL]

On Saturday, June 28, 2014 1:47:41 PM UTC+1, David.WE.Roberts wrote:
> On Sat, 28 Jun 2014 13:36:27 +0100, Bert Coules wrote:
>
>

> Binary chop?
>
>
>
> First dig down where the house downpipe is and locate the underground pipe
> going to the soak away - expose enough to find the line of the pipe run,
> then peg a cord out along that line.
>
>
> Dig down about 3 metres out along the line in a long narrow slit trench at
> right angles to the run, until you either find or don't find the pipe.

> If you find the pipe, go out another 3 metres.


Ah, but that's not a binary chop. for a binary chop you decide on two limits where the soakaway can be and mark them: initially you put the the "far marker" at the end of the garden and the "near marker" at the place where you have exposed the pipe. You dig halfway between the markers. if you find pipe you move the 'far' marker to that point, if you don't find pipe you move the near marker to that point. Then you repeat, always digging half way between the current markers. This finds the soakaway with the minimum number of digs.

If you garden is, say, 32 metres long it will take at most 5 digs to get within 1 metre of the soakaway.

Robert

[RobertL]

On Sunday, June 29, 2014 11:31:14 AM UTC+1, Bert Coules wrote:
> I should have said that I've discovered that the downpipe can be
>
> disconnected, so using a camera has become feasible.


or just poke a rod along it.

Robert

t

[RobertL]

On Tuesday, July 1, 2014 2:56:25 PM UTC+1, Bert Coules wrote:
> Update:
>
>
>
> I just dug down at the five feet mark along the same line. Nothing but
> earth and stones.

Could "earth and a lot of stones" be the soakaway?

Robert

[Phil L]

"Rod Speed" <rod.sp...@gmail.com> wrote in message

news:c1ea49...@mid.individual.net...

>
>
> "Phil L" <neverc...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:RAksv.403379$Dy.3...@fx21.am4...
>>
>> "Rod Speed" <rod.sp...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:c1bd5p...@mid.individual.net...
>>> Phil L <neverc...@hotmail.com> wrote
>>>> Bert Coules <ma...@bertcoules.co.uk> wrote
>>>>> Brian Gaff wrote
>>>
>>>>>> I suppose they used plastic pipes then?
>>>
>>>>> I don't know, Brian. Early sixties, so I suppose it's a possibility.
>>>>> I'm going to have a tentative dig at the base of the downpipe and see
>>>>> what I can unearth.
>>>
>>>> No possibility if it was built in the early sixties, even the early
>>>> seventies hadn't heard of plastic drains....
>>>
>>> That's not right, I used them myself for my roof drains in the very
>>> early 70s. They weren't revolutionary new then either.
>
>> Roof drains are very rarely underground.
>
> They have to be to get from the bottom of the downpipe to the gutter or
> soakaway.

Yes, the downpipe is plastic and empties into a drain, where this drain then
goes is debatable, it can go into a watercourse, a soakaway or into the
sewers

>
>>>> I vaguely remember using them for the first time in the mid eighties,
>>>> and they hadn't been around for long by then
>
>>> That mangles the chronology.
>
>> Not really, they /may/ have been used in the mid to late seventies but
>> certainly not *early* seventies,
>
> Mine was, in the very early 70s. I moved in in 73.
>
>> and were only just coming onto the scene properly ten years later
>
> Bullshit. Everyone was using them in the very early 70s
> because I worked out how to do the simpler stuff like
> that by walking around the new subdivision full of
> new houses being built walking thru the half built
> houses looking at how stuff like that was done.

And what diameter were these underground plastic drains?

My bet is that someone decided to use the plastic downpipe as a continuation
into a soakaway, that is *not* underground plastic drains - the material is
totally unsuitable for being used underground

[Bert Coules]

"RobertL" wrote:

> Could "earth and a lot of stones" be the soakaway?

An appealing thought, but if you dig down *anywhere* in my garden you find
earth and a lot of stones. Of course it could be that the entire garden is
the soakaway...

Bert

[Phil L]

"Rod Speed" <rod.sp...@gmail.com> wrote in message

news:c1bg8c...@mid.individual.net...

These are plastic underground drains:
http://snipurl.com/292dtsx


The square stuff you are referring to:
http://www.floplast.co.uk/uploads/images/pages/Image_2.jpg

Is not underground drains.

You, or someone else may have laid it underground in the 70's or even 60's
but it it wasn't and still isn't classed as underground drainage

[Phil L]

"Bert Coules" <ma...@bertcoules.co.uk> wrote in message
news:k4SdnQMpv9LvQC_O...@brightview.co.uk...

Instead of digging lots of holes, I'd be tempted to just dig just one, IE
make a new soakaway and run your pipe into it

[Bert Coules]

"Phil L" wrote:

> Instead of digging lots of holes, I'd be tempted to just dig just one, IE

> make a new soakaway and run your pipe into it.

A logical suggestion, though of course the "just one" hole would be
considerably larger, and probably involve a good deal more digging, than
even quite a few small ones.

Bert

[Rod Speed]

"Phil L" <neverc...@hotmail.com> wrote in message

news:n_Asv.950$JT7...@fx27.am4...

>
> "Rod Speed" <rod.sp...@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:c1ea49...@mid.individual.net...
>>
>>
>> "Phil L" <neverc...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:RAksv.403379$Dy.3...@fx21.am4...
>>>
>>> "Rod Speed" <rod.sp...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>> news:c1bd5p...@mid.individual.net...
>>>> Phil L <neverc...@hotmail.com> wrote
>>>>> Bert Coules <ma...@bertcoules.co.uk> wrote
>>>>>> Brian Gaff wrote
>>>>
>>>>>>> I suppose they used plastic pipes then?
>>>>
>>>>>> I don't know, Brian. Early sixties, so I suppose it's a possibility.
>>>>>> I'm going to have a tentative dig at the base of the downpipe and see
>>>>>> what I can unearth.
>>>>
>>>>> No possibility if it was built in the early sixties, even the early
>>>>> seventies hadn't heard of plastic drains....
>>>>
>>>> That's not right, I used them myself for my roof drains in the very
>>>> early 70s. They weren't revolutionary new then either.
>>
>>> Roof drains are very rarely underground.
>>
>> They have to be to get from the bottom of the downpipe to the gutter or
>> soakaway.
>
> Yes, the downpipe is plastic and empties into a drain, where this drain
> then goes is debatable, it can go into a watercourse, a soakaway or into
> the sewers

And I know the drain was plastic because I put that plastic drain in the
ditch
I dug for it.

>>>>> I vaguely remember using them for the first time in the mid eighties,
>>>>> and they hadn't been around for long by then
>>
>>>> That mangles the chronology.
>>
>>> Not really, they /may/ have been used in the mid to late seventies but
>>> certainly not *early* seventies,
>>
>> Mine was, in the very early 70s. I moved in in 73.
>>
>>> and were only just coming onto the scene properly ten years later
>>
>> Bullshit. Everyone was using them in the very early 70s
>> because I worked out how to do the simpler stuff like
>> that by walking around the new subdivision full of
>> new houses being built walking thru the half built
>> houses looking at how stuff like that was done.

> And what diameter were these underground plastic drains?

4"

> My bet is that someone decided to use the plastic downpipe as a
> continuation into a soakaway,

You're wrong and you can check that today because
you can walk around the streets and see where the
plastic drain comes thru the concrete curb into the
gutter with most of them 40+ years later.

> that is *not* underground plastic drains - the material is totally
> unsuitable for being used underground

Bullshit. It works fine.

[Rod Speed]

"Phil L" <neverc...@hotmail.com> wrote in message

news:cfBsv.2844$YB....@fx28.am4...

>
> "Rod Speed" <rod.sp...@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:c1bg8c...@mid.individual.net...
>> Tim Lamb <t...@marfordfarm.demon.co.uk> wrote
>>> Bert Coules <ma...@bertcoules.co.uk> wrote
>>>> Phil L wrote:
>>
>>>>> No possibility if it was built in the early sixties...
>>
>>>> Oh right, thanks. I thought plastic had come in much earlier than
>>>> that.
>>
>>> My first soakaway was around 1972 and I have no recollection of using
>>> salt glaze pipe. No recollection of using plastic at that time either so
>>> no help really:-)
>>
>> I know I used plastic pipe before that. And it was to get the roof water
>> to the street gutter, not to a soakaway.
>> I used square plastic pipe in the holes in the full sized concrete
>> blocks for the verticals too, so there is nothing visible at all.
>
> These are plastic underground drains:
> http://snipurl.com/292dtsx

So much for your stupid claim that they can't be used underground.

> The square stuff you are referring to:
> http://www.floplast.co.uk/uploads/images/pages/Image_2.jpg

Yes.

> Is not underground drains.

Never said it was. I used a square to round adapter to join the
square stuff to the round underground PLASTIC drains that you
show in your first. I didn�t have a gully like you show in your
first, there is a direct connection between the vertical square
tube and the round underground PLASTIC drain.

> You, or someone else may have laid it underground in the 70's

Yes, the very early 70s.

> or even 60's

No, because I moved there in 69.

> but it it wasn't and still isn't classed as underground drainage

Bullshit. Everyone used that plastic rainwater drainage when
I did mine, copying theirs. You can still see it to this day where
the underground PLASTIC drains come thru the broken out kerb
section into the street gutters. In those days the council required
roof drainage to either go into the street gutters or a soakaway.

[RobertL]

is the pipe perforated perhaps?

Robert

[Bert Coules]

"RobertL" wrote:

> Is the pipe perforated perhaps?

Possibly, though not in the (admittedly short and upward-facing) length that
I've so far unearthed.

I have to leave the job now for about a week. With luck, by the time I get
back to it there might have been some rain to make the ground a bit softer.

Bert

[Mark]

On Mon, 30 Jun 2014 15:01:50 -0700 (PDT), robgraham
<robkg...@btinternet.com> wrote:

>What I'm saying is that the OP should be aware that a soakaway built in the 60's might well be marginal now in capacity and that he may have to put in a new one.

FWIW some soakaways here installed in the 2000's are now clogged up
(And no I didn't install them).

[JimK]

How deep did you dig?

Jim K

[Phil L]

"Rod Speed" <rod.sp...@gmail.com> wrote in message

news:c1gs8m...@mid.individual.net...

> show in your first. I didn�t have a gully like you show in your

> first, there is a direct connection between the vertical square
> tube and the round underground PLASTIC drain.
>
>> You, or someone else may have laid it underground in the 70's
>
> Yes, the very early 70s.
>
>> or even 60's
>
> No, because I moved there in 69.
>
>> but it it wasn't and still isn't classed as underground drainage
>
> Bullshit. Everyone used that plastic rainwater drainage when
> I did mine, copying theirs. You can still see it to this day where
> the underground PLASTIC drains come thru the broken out kerb
> section into the street gutters. In those days the council required
> roof drainage to either go into the street gutters or a soakaway.

I know the context you are referring to, I've done it that way myself dozens
of times, when there's a short run, a few metres to the garden wall and it
goes through and onto the pavement, not when it stays underground and
terminates at a soakaway.

[Phil L]

> You're wrong and you can check that today because
> you can walk around the streets and see where the
> plastic drain comes thru the concrete curb into the
> gutter with most of them 40+ years later.
>
>> that is *not* underground plastic drains - the material is totally
>> unsuitable for being used underground
>
> Bullshit. It works fine.
>

It might work perfectly, but it's four inch plastic soil stack you are
referring to

[Rod Speed]

"Phil L" <neverc...@hotmail.com> wrote in message

news:QlXsv.1930$F23....@fx22.am4...

>> show in your first. I didn�t have a gully like you show in your

>> first, there is a direct connection between the vertical square
>> tube and the round underground PLASTIC drain.
>>
>>> You, or someone else may have laid it underground in the 70's
>>
>> Yes, the very early 70s.
>>
>>> or even 60's
>>
>> No, because I moved there in 69.
>>
>>> but it it wasn't and still isn't classed as underground drainage
>>
>> Bullshit. Everyone used that plastic rainwater drainage when
>> I did mine, copying theirs. You can still see it to this day where
>> the underground PLASTIC drains come thru the broken out kerb
>> section into the street gutters. In those days the council required
>> roof drainage to either go into the street gutters or a soakaway.

> I know the context you are referring to,

You don�t actually.

> I've done it that way myself dozens of times, when there's a short run, a
> few metres to the garden wall and it goes through and onto the pavement,

Ours all go underground from the house wall
to the street gutter and go thru the KERB with
a gap broken in the kerb. And since you arent
allowed to build the house any closer than
30' from the kerb, its ALWAYS more than a few
meters underground from the wall to the kerb.

> not when it stays underground

Ours always does when it goes to the kerb.

> and terminates at a soakaway.

The length of PLASTIC pipe under the ground is
generally longer when it goes to the kerb than
when when it goes to a soakaway just because
the soakaway is generally in the back yard and
that doesn�t have to be 30' from the back wall
of the house. We normally only use a soakaway
when when the block of land slopes down from
the kerb so you cant use a drain to the kerb
underground from the bottom of the front wall.

[Rod Speed]

Phil L <neverc...@hotmail.com> wrote

You're wrong, again. Its plastic underground pipe.

We use the square stuff down the walls for rain water.

[Bert Coules]

JimK wrote:

> How deep did you dig?

Fifteen, maybe eighteen inches. Not enough?

Bert

[JimK]

Dunno but if it's on a 1 in 80 say then you could calc what depth at what distance? & check other calcs for various inclinations.

Jim K