Seeking your opinion.

[David Brooks]

My real-life friend, Jon, took delivery of a brand-new MacBook Pro today. 🙂

By the time I spoke to him, he had bought and installed this software:-

https://turnkeypoint.com/product/office-2021-home-business-for-mac/?c=36ed69b578b4

Do YOU think he was wise to snap up this bargain?

--
David B.

[Joel]

David Brooks <D...@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:

>My real-life friend, Jon, took delivery of a brand-new MacBook Pro today. ?

>
>By the time I spoke to him, he had bought and installed this software:-
>
>https://turnkeypoint.com/product/office-2021-home-business-for-mac/?c=36ed69b578b4
>
>Do YOU think he was wise to snap up this bargain?

It *could* be a legit license for the product - but I still would not
do it, even if that is so.

--
Joel Crump

[David Brooks]

Thanks, Joel.

I checked with VirusTotal
https://www.virustotal.com/gui/url/1f9442c3110c00c2c698c0bbffd372018d925de1a02230743089c895903633f6/details

Although the business web page says they are in Spain, VT says the
server is in the USA.

https://turnkeypoint.com/contact-us/?c=36ed69b578b4

"If something seems too good to be true, it probably is"!

[Joel]

My preference is to obtain software licenses *directly* from the maker
of the software, which is usually possible nowadays.

--
Joel Crump

[David Brooks]

A very sensible route to follow!

Thanks.

[Snit]

On May 20, 2022 at 1:59:57 PM MST, "David Brooks" wrote
<hjThK.1133818$sb1.2...@fx11.ams1>:

Does he have need for it?

--
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They cannot use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel somehow superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.

[T]

1/10th cost. I smell a rat!

Use Libre Office. If you can't stand it (and I'd
understand that reaction), then fork out the
monopoly price for M$ Office.

[David Brooks]

On 21/05/2022 08:05, T wrote:
> On 5/20/22 13:59, David Brooks wrote:
>> My real-life friend, Jon, took delivery of a brand-new MacBook Pro
>> today. 🙂
>>
>> By the time I spoke to him, he had bought and installed this software:-
>>
>> https://turnkeypoint.com/product/office-2021-home-business-for-mac/?c=36ed69b578b4
>>
>>
>> Do YOU think he was wise to snap up this bargain?
>>
>
> 1/10th cost.  I smell a rat!

Me too!

What harm can it do though - to install and run a 'knock-off' product
like this? He's done it before on a Windows laptop with no ill effect.

> Use Libre Office. If you can't stand it (and I'd
> understand that reaction), then fork out the
> monopoly price for M$ Office.

If I REALLY needed one of the component parts, I'd buy it through the
Apple App store (All are available to download).

The 'real McCoy' product may be bought here:-
https://www.currys.co.uk/products/microsoft-office-home-and-business-2021-lifetime-for-1-user-10230883.html

But, as you say, it is ten times the price!

--
David

[David Brooks]

On 21/05/2022 00:51, Snit wrote:
> On May 20, 2022 at 1:59:57 PM MST, "David Brooks" wrote
> <hjThK.1133818$sb1.2...@fx11.ams1>:
>
>> My real-life friend, Jon, took delivery of a brand-new MacBook Pro today. 🙂
>>
>> By the time I spoke to him, he had bought and installed this software:-
>>
>> https://turnkeypoint.com/product/office-2021-home-business-for-mac/?c=36ed69b578b4
>>
>> Do YOU think he was wise to snap up this bargain?
>
> Does he have need for it?

Probably not! I'm not sure what difference that makes though. It cannot
be legitimate if it's one tenth of the normal retail price.

Supporting criminal activity is disesteemed. I don't do it.

[FromTheRafters]

David Brooks wrote :

> On 21/05/2022 08:05, T wrote:
>> On 5/20/22 13:59, David Brooks wrote:
>>> My real-life friend, Jon, took delivery of a brand-new MacBook Pro today.

>>> ?

>>>
>>> By the time I spoke to him, he had bought and installed this software:-
>>>
>>> https://turnkeypoint.com/product/office-2021-home-business-for-mac/?c=36ed69b578b4
>>>
>>>
>>> Do YOU think he was wise to snap up this bargain?
>>>
>>
>> 1/10th cost.  I smell a rat!
>
> Me too!
>
> What harm can it do though - to install and run a 'knock-off' product
> like this? He's done it before on a Windows laptop with no ill effect.

They could have secretly bundled some spyware or adware in the program
itself or in the installer.

[David Brooks]

That's my thinking.

How will he ever know? The computer is lightning fast as you already
know yourself.

[FromTheRafters]

A traffic monitor could help with that. Adware infiltrates and spyware
exfiltrates each causing traffic. Nothing but brain chemistry will
quell that 'hinky' feeling though, it 'could' always be tunneling.

<cue Twilight Zone theme>

[Snit]

On May 21, 2022 at 12:34:21 AM MST, "David Brooks" wrote
<2C0iK.1133927$sb1.1...@fx11.ams1>:

I know there is a gray market for such keys... have read about it in the past.
If I recall it is not technically illegal but generally frowned upon.

[Helmut Achterberg]

It looks like what the OP posted were simply links to Microsoft Keys.
That means the application is DL from MS and then the key is used to activate it.

Usually these are surplus keys sold by corporations to jobbers who market them. MOST TIMES, they
are legit, but some sketchy folks are out there but it's a matter of the key working or not.
Malware is not part of it unless they offer a download site for the software itself.

HTH,

--
Helmut
"If you don't like Linux, you might tick incorrectly"

[T]

On 5/21/22 00:22, David Brooks wrote:
>> 1/10th cost.  I smell a rat!
>
> Me too!
>
> What harm can it do though - to install and run a 'knock-off' product
> like this?  He's done it before on a Windows laptop with no ill effect.

Also keep in mind that this could be pirate and
there is that pesky commandment not to steal.
Buying stolen goods is just as bad a steeling it
yourself.

Or it could be a fire sale for some economic
calamity that befell the guy. But those are
usually just one off sales, not groups of
the same item

[FromTheRafters]

Helmut Achterberg brought next idea :

Can such a key be revoked?

[Joel]

T <T...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>On 5/21/22 00:22, David Brooks wrote:
>
>>> 1/10th cost.  I smell a rat!
>>
>> Me too!
>>
>> What harm can it do though - to install and run a 'knock-off' product
>> like this?  He's done it before on a Windows laptop with no ill effect.
>
>Also keep in mind that this could be pirate and
>there is that pesky commandment not to steal.
>Buying stolen goods is just as bad a steeling it
>yourself.

Let's assume, for a moment, that it's a legit key, being resold by
this third party. Can you guarantee that they haven't sold the same
key, to someone else? If I deal with Microsoft directly, I *know*
that I'm the only one who bought that key.

--
Joel Crump

[Helmut Achterberg]

Yes it can but it is very rare.
Microsoft is like the corner drug dealer. Get the people hooked and then collect.
They count on people upgrading hardware to the point where the key no longer works.

[Wolffan]

On 21 May 2022, Joel wrote
(in article<bsii8ht8bref44rf4...@4ax.com>):

It appears to be an enterprise key. Typically those keys are authorized for
at least hundreds, more typically thousands, of users, and if the company
which bought the enterprise key has some left over they can either keep them
around as spares (what I do) or sell the excess. You can get an enterprise
key with several thousand installs very cheaply indeed. The larger the buy,
the cheaper on a per user basis. Someone may have access to a few
dozen/hundred user keys from an enterprise buy, and is selling them. So long
as the total installs doesn’t go over the limit for that particular key,
they should be good.

Now, if the company which bought the enterprise key doesn’t know that the
user installs are being sold, they may try to activate additional users, and
sooner or later will run over the limit... and MS will be upset. And will
revoke the old key, giving the company a replacement key, while waiting to
see who calls in to report that their bought and paid for copy of MS
Application X isn’t working any more. If, however, the keys are being sold
by a legit source which simply doesn’t need all the installs, then the
buyers are golden. This kind of thing isn’t new, it’s been going on since
MS introduced keys decades ago. I still have theoretically working enterprise
keys for Vista. (I wasn’t the one who bought far too many licenses, I just
inherited them...)

[Joel]

I'd much prefer to just do it the honest way.

--
Joel Crump

[Wolffan]

On 21 May 2022, Joel wrote

(in article<ceoi8h96v5n575pe7...@4ax.com>):

It is honest, if the seller has permission to sell the excess. I wouldn’t,
I’d keep the excess as spares. A lot of people order a few hundred extra
licenses and sell the excess. And make a profit on it. MS doesn’t care.

[T]

On 5/21/22 14:57, Wolffan wrote:
> If, however, the keys are being sold
> by a legit source which simply doesn’t need all the installs, then the
> buyers are golden

That would depend on the license agreement. Most of
them are for you (or your company) only

[T]

1+

[T]

In that case, the guy had better come clean and show documentation as to
him being allow to do that.

[David Brooks]

Your thoughts on this are much appreciated, Helmut.

I've also asked for views, here:-
https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/msoffice/forum/all/product-purchase-query-can-you-help/fec7638f-5daa-4246-9af8-b7764c3ab5a9

It's beginning to sound as if nothing nefarious is afoot!

I have read here; has anyone else? https://turnkeypoint.com/faqs/

Everything sounds bonio fido! :-D

[David Brooks]

On 21/05/2022 21:24, T wrote:
> On 5/21/22 00:22, David Brooks wrote:
>>> 1/10th cost.  I smell a rat!
>>
>> Me too!
>>
>> What harm can it do though - to install and run a 'knock-off' product
>> like this?  He's done it before on a Windows laptop with no ill effect.
>
> Also keep in mind that this could be pirate and
> there is that pesky commandment not to steal.

> Buying stolen goods is just as bad a stealing it
> yourself.

I completely accept what you say, 'T'.

> Or it could be a fire sale for some economic
> calamity  that befell the guy.  But those are
> usually just one off sales, not groups of
> the same item

It appears to be a commercial operation:-

See:- https://turnkeypoint.com/faqs/

[Wolffan]

On 21 May 2022, T wrote
(in article <t6bq0m$6sn$1...@dont-email.me>):

yep. that’s one reason why I usually keep any excess. Sometimes it can be
possible to get permission to sell excess licenses. It depends on how badly
the local sales guy needs your future business.

[Wolffan]

On 21 May 2022, T wrote

(in article <t6bq3c$6sn$3...@dont-email.me>):

Either he’s legit, in which case he doesn’t need to prove anything to
John Public (just to MS) or he’s not, in which case MS will get upset and
the keys will be revoked. And, if he’s not legit, it’s trivial to
generate a nice official-looking document. Do you know what kind of
documentation MS requires for those who sell on excess license keys? I do...
and it’s trivial to set up exact copies in Publish (easier in a _real_
desktop publishing app, of course, like Quark or InDesign) and such copies
would be nearly impossible to detect... until MS revokes the license.

Basically, you can either believe he’s legit or not. If he is, you get
cheap MS software. If he isn’t, you get cheap MS software for a while,
until MS revokes the key. Depending on what software it is, MS may never
bother revoking the key; older copies of Office and Windows, for example, are
no longer supported, which means that the license key servers are turned off
at MS. I have some perfectly legit Vista keys, purchased from MS over a
decade ago, by the guy who had my job before I got it. They can’t be used
directly, as the Vista key servers are turned off. I can and have contacted
MS and used a few as Win 10 keys. Or, rather, MS gave me new keys that worked
with Win 10, the Vista servers are off and will stay off. Several older
machines have been upgraded to the extent that the old key breaks; a call to
MS fixes that. (I made it quite clear that I wasn’t paying even one penny
more, and that it was a choice of them updating the key so it worked or my
putting Ubuntu on the old box, either way MS wasn’t getting any more money.
They updated the key. The fact that the company has a _lot_ of licenses for
Windows and Office had something to do with that; we’re a _large_ customer.
John Public at home might have had a bit more trouble, though.)