RHEL 3 software installation

[andy.bo...@micross.com]

I have inherited some old computers that use RHEL 3 (Taroon).
Updating to a more modern o/s is not possible (the hardware is unusual).

I would like to install 2 software packages rcs and subversion.

redhat-config-packages wants to update packages other than what I specified.

I can use rpm but do not know how to fix software dependencies.

yum is not installed on the system.

How can I install *only* yum or rcs or subversion without updating anything else?

I am reasonable with fedora but RHEL 3 is a bit old for me.

Any help will be gratefully appreciated.

Thanks Andy.

[c...@isbd.net]

You'll have to find versions of yum or rcs for RHEL 3, if you don't
you will *have* to install dependencies. Do RedHat keep archives of
old distributions? You may find what you need there.

--
Chris Green
·

[Martin Gregorie]

On Mon, 16 May 2016 04:26:27 -0700, andy.botterill wrote:

> I have inherited some old computers that use RHEL 3 (Taroon).
> Updating to a more modern o/s is not possible (the hardware is unusual).
>
> I would like to install 2 software packages rcs and subversion.
>
> redhat-config-packages wants to update packages other than what I
> specified.
>

Thats not at all surprising: libraries get enhanced and bugfixed and so
you shouldn't expect a binary package to install on a much older version
of the distro without there being broken dependencies.

> How can I install *only* yum or rcs or subversion without updating
> anything else?
>

Since you want to install these packages rather than upgrading them, you
may find it easier to get the sources and compile them since doing this
will side-step binary dependency problems. However, this does require
that you already have a functional compiler collection installed on at
least one of your RHEL 3 systems and that:

- you are comfortable using it compiling and testing C programs (both RCS
and subversion are written in C)

- you have the usual set of compiler tools:

- rcs needs autoMake and, possibly, configure

- svn needs autoconf and libtool

- you are prepared to find and fix any API incompatibilities the compiler
throws up

Disclaimer: the above comes from a very rapid look at their websites: I
haven't read the README/INSTALL file for either. rcs is supported and
downloaded on the GNU website, SVN by Apache.

Apologies if I'm telling you what you already know, but you didn't say
anything about the depth of your development and/or sysadmin experience.

HTH


--
martin@ | Martin Gregorie
gregorie. | Essex, UK
org |

[Nigel Wade]

On 16/05/16 12:26, andy.bo...@micross.com wrote:
> I have inherited some old computers that use RHEL 3 (Taroon).

RH3 is historical.
I haven't used an RH3 system for many a long year.
Can you still get packages from RH3?

> Updating to a more modern o/s is not possible (the hardware is unusual).
>
> I would like to install 2 software packages rcs and subversion.
>
> redhat-config-packages wants to update packages other than what I specified.

Can't you just deselect them? Are they packages other than those required by svn/rcs?

What is redhat-config-packages pointing to as a source of the RPMs? From what I remember it would only ever load from
RHN, not from a local source. Does RHN still provide RHEL3 rpms? My oldest RH system is RHEL4, and that's no longer on
subscription to RHN, so all the RHN stuff has been deleted in accordance with the license terms.

>
> I can use rpm but do not know how to fix software dependencies.

That's what redhat-config-packages is supposed to do for you.

>
> yum is not installed on the system.

IIRC yum did not appear on RHEL until RHEL5.
I have yum installed on a RHEL4 system, but that's an FC3 rpm.

>
> How can I install *only* yum or rcs or subversion without updating anything else?

If RHN can't do it for you you will have to resolve the dependencies yourself.

Use "rpm -q -R -p package.rpm" to get a list of requirements.
Use "rpm --whatprovides requirement" to find what package you need.

From a RH4 system, with subversion installed:

# rpm -q --requires subversion
apr >= 0.9.7

apr-util >= 0.9.7
db4 >= 4.2.52
libapr-0.so.0()(64bit)
libaprutil-0.so.0()(64bit)
libc.so.6()(64bit)
libc.so.6(GLIBC_2.2.5)(64bit)
libc.so.6(GLIBC_2.3)(64bit)
libcom_err.so.2()(64bit)
libcrypt.so.1()(64bit)
libcrypto.so.4()(64bit)
libdb-4.2.so()(64bit)
libdl.so.2()(64bit)
libexpat.so.0()(64bit)
libgssapi_krb5.so.2()(64bit)
libk5crypto.so.3()(64bit)
libkrb5.so.3()(64bit)
liblber-2.2.so.7()(64bit)
libldap-2.2.so.7()(64bit)
libm.so.6()(64bit)
libneon.so.24()(64bit)
libpthread.so.0()(64bit)
libpthread.so.0(GLIBC_2.2.5)(64bit)
libresolv.so.2()(64bit)
librt.so.1()(64bit)
libssl.so.4()(64bit)
libsvn_client-1.so.0()(64bit)
libsvn_delta-1.so.0()(64bit)
libsvn_diff-1.so.0()(64bit)
libsvn_fs-1.so.0()(64bit)
libsvn_fs_base-1.so.0()(64bit)
libsvn_fs_fs-1.so.0()(64bit)
libsvn_ra-1.so.0()(64bit)
libsvn_ra_dav-1.so.0()(64bit)
libsvn_ra_local-1.so.0()(64bit)
libsvn_ra_svn-1.so.0()(64bit)
libsvn_repos-1.so.0()(64bit)
libsvn_subr-1.so.0()(64bit)
libsvn_wc-1.so.0()(64bit)
libz.so.1()(64bit)
neon >= 0.24.7
rpmlib(CompressedFileNames) <= 3.0.4-1
rpmlib(PayloadFilesHavePrefix) <= 4.0-1

then, to find the packages needed,

# rpm -q --whatprovides apr
apr-0.9.4-24.5
apr-0.9.12-1

etc.

and hope you can find an RPM somewhere to meet the requirement. For RHEL3 that could be a challenge.
You may be able to locate a historical vault somewhere which is hanging on to an archive of CentOS 3, or FC3.

Your best shot for svn may be:
http://the.earth.li/pub/subversion/summersoft.fay.ar.us/pub/subversion/latest/1.4.4/rhel-3/

>
> I am reasonable with fedora but RHEL 3 is a bit old for me.

It's certainly forging back the frontiers of history.
Welcome to 2000's Linux.

[andy.bo...@micross.com]

On Monday, 16 May 2016 13:51:33 UTC+1, Martin Gregorie wrote:
> On Mon, 16 May 2016 04:26:27 -0700, andy.botterill wrote:
>
> > I have inherited some old computers that use RHEL 3 (Taroon).
> > Updating to a more modern o/s is not possible (the hardware is unusual).
> >
> > I would like to install 2 software packages rcs and subversion.
> >
> > redhat-config-packages wants to update packages other than what I
> > specified.
> >
> Thats not at all surprising: libraries get enhanced and bugfixed and so
> you shouldn't expect a binary package to install on a much older version
> of the distro without there being broken dependencies.

The software was insisting on changing these files which is too much risk for me.

>
> > How can I install *only* yum or rcs or subversion without updating
> > anything else?
> >
> Since you want to install these packages rather than upgrading them, you
> may find it easier to get the sources and compile them since doing this
> will side-step binary dependency problems. However, this does require
> that you already have a functional compiler collection installed on at
> least one of your RHEL 3 systems and that:
>
> - you are comfortable using it compiling and testing C programs (both RCS
> and subversion are written in C)
>
> - you have the usual set of compiler tools:
>
> - rcs needs autoMake and, possibly, configure
>
> - svn needs autoconf and libtool
>
> - you are prepared to find and fix any API incompatibilities the compiler
> throws up

Thats what I was expecting. In that situation RCS is probably the simplest to install as it is only one rpm. That's what I was expecting.

>
> Disclaimer: the above comes from a very rapid look at their websites: I
> haven't read the README/INSTALL file for either. rcs is supported and
> downloaded on the GNU website, SVN by Apache.
>
> Apologies if I'm telling you what you already know, but you didn't say
> anything about the depth of your development and/or sysadmin experience.

Fedora (long time) home system sysadmin. RHEL virtually 0. Can do C programming. Quality of code is debatable.

[andy.bo...@micross.com]

On Monday, 16 May 2016 15:25:37 UTC+1, Nigel Wade wrote:

> On 16/05/16 12:26, andy.botterill wrote:
> > I have inherited some old computers that use RHEL 3 (Taroon).
>
>

> > Updating to a more modern o/s is not possible (the hardware is unusual).
> >
> > I would like to install 2 software packages rcs and subversion.
> >
> > redhat-config-packages wants to update packages other than what I specified.
>
> Can't you just deselect them? Are they packages other than those required by svn/rcs?

There were no options so I took the cautious route and stopped.

>
> What is redhat-config-packages pointing to as a source of the RPMs? From what I remember it would only ever load from
> RHN, not from a local source. Does RHN still provide RHEL3 rpms? My oldest RH system is RHEL4, and that's no longer on
> subscription to RHN, so all the RHN stuff has been deleted in accordance with the license terms.

Oh I didn't know that.

>
> >
> > I can use rpm but do not know how to fix software dependencies.
>
> That's what redhat-config-packages is supposed to do for you.
>
>
> >
> > yum is not installed on the system.
>
> IIRC yum did not appear on RHEL until RHEL5.
> I have yum installed on a RHEL4 system, but that's an FC3 rpm.
>
> >
> > How can I install *only* yum or rcs or subversion without updating anything else?
>
> If RHN can't do it for you you will have to resolve the dependencies yourself.
>
> Use "rpm -q -R -p package.rpm" to get a list of requirements.
> Use "rpm --whatprovides requirement" to find what package you need.

Ah that is the method to use, thanks.

I'll raise you SunOS 5.5.1 .........

I'll see if I can get the revision control to work.

I have sort of a game plan now.

Thank you.

[Martin Gregorie]

As rcs isn't currently installed, why not grab the tarball and try
building it from source?

The worst can happen is that it won't build. If that's the case you won't
have lost anything apart from the time needed to do the download and
attempted install.

The README files for GNU projects are normally easy enough to follow and
in any case programs of that age generally don't have many dependencies.

If the failures are due to other uninstalled libraries, etc. then web
searches and/or reading manpages on a current Fedora system should let
you find their sources and get them installed before trying again with
rcs.

[Martin Gregorie]

I should have added that, if I can't find a package for a program I need,
this is exactly what I do.

So far its worked for pulling in unsupported applications onto my main
Fedora systems and (later) for porting them to my RaspberryPi, which runs
Raspbian, a Debian clone.

[andy.bo...@micross.com]

I have installed RCS which went smoothly. Phew.
I will lead my colleagues into the light (and revision control).

I may spend more time on a different (ATE) system to get subversion working.
I'm not doing that today.....later.

Thank you gents from andy (formerly plymouth2.demon.co.uk).
The plymouth2 account still works but that is for home use.

[Martin Gregorie]

On Wed, 18 May 2016 09:36:40 -0700, andy.botterill wrote:

> On Tuesday, 17 May 2016 00:03:55 UTC+1, Martin Gregorie wrote:
>> On Mon, 16 May 2016 18:12:12 +0000, Martin Gregorie wrote:
>>
>> > On Mon, 16 May 2016 09:54:27 -0700, andy.botterill wrote:
>
>> So far its worked for pulling in unsupported applications onto my main
>> Fedora systems and (later) for porting them to my RaspberryPi, which
>> runs Raspbian, a Debian clone.
>
> I have installed RCS which went smoothly. Phew.
> I will lead my colleagues into the light (and revision control).
>
> I may spend more time on a different (ATE) system to get subversion
> working.
> I'm not doing that today.....later.
>

You may find it useful to look at cvs.

From what I've read about rcs, cvs is pretty much an incremental
improvement on it and, because it also uses bog-standard directory
structures for its main repository, it has to be fairly simple internally
and probably doesn't have many external dependencies.

I've used cvs for years and find it generally simple to use. It does
sometimes get confused, but that's always been easily fixed by judicious
use of standard tools such as chown, chmod and friends.

It supports the use of a master repository on a central server and
handles version branching (needed if any work has to be done where the
repository is inaccessable) and makes a fairly good fist of merging
branches when the remotely modified code has to be pulled back into the
main development.

[Chris]

<andy.bo...@micross.com> wrote:
> On Tuesday, 17 May 2016 00:03:55 UTC+1, Martin Gregorie wrote:
>> On Mon, 16 May 2016 18:12:12 +0000, Martin Gregorie wrote:
>>
>>> On Mon, 16 May 2016 09:54:27 -0700, andy.botterill wrote:
>
>> So far its worked for pulling in unsupported applications onto my main
>> Fedora systems and (later) for porting them to my RaspberryPi, which runs
>> Raspbian, a Debian clone.
>
> I have installed RCS which went smoothly. Phew.
> I will lead my colleagues into the light (and revision control).
>
> I may spend more time on a different (ATE) system to get subversion working.
> I'm not doing that today.....later.

If you want to really bring your colleagues into the light, you should
introduce them to git. This is a VCS for today not the 1980s. It solves
many problems and limitations found in cvs and svn plus doesn't require a
separate repository installed.

It was developed by Linus Torvalds and the Linux kernel project uses it -
as do hundreds of other OSS projects.

It's very lightweight with few dependencies. Although, it is newer that
Rhel 3 so may not work at all on something that old.

[Richard Kettlewell]

andy.bo...@micross.com writes:
> Martin Gregorie wrote:

>> Martin Gregorie wrote:
>>> andy.botterill wrote:
>> So far its worked for pulling in unsupported applications onto my main
>> Fedora systems and (later) for porting them to my RaspberryPi, which runs
>> Raspbian, a Debian clone.
>
> I have installed RCS which went smoothly. Phew.
> I will lead my colleagues into the light (and revision control).

Forget RCS (and CVS and Subversion), go straight to git.

--
http://www.greenend.org.uk/rjk/

[gm...@plymouth2.demon.co.uk]

On Thursday, May 19, 2016 at 9:00:52 AM UTC+1, Richard Kettlewell wrote:
>
> > Martin Gregorie wrote:
> >> Martin Gregorie wrote:
> >>> andy.botterill wrote:
> >> So far its worked for pulling in unsupported applications onto my main
> >> Fedora systems and (later) for porting them to my RaspberryPi, which runs
> >> Raspbian, a Debian clone.
> >
> > I have installed RCS which went smoothly. Phew.
> > I will lead my colleagues into the light (and revision control).
>
> Forget RCS (and CVS and Subversion), go straight to git.

I have used RCS for more than 5 years so it is simple to just do it.

Subversion I've used for 1 year in a previous job and 6 months at home. I have the subversion book. That should be low ish risk.

Making a big jump to git sorry I don't have the time or the appetite for risk.

My official job is test development. I'm doing unix system administration to enable me to do that work using good practices.

Revision control is good practice (the flavour is a judgement call).

I probably should buy (if such a thing exists) a good book on RHEL 3.

[home account]
>
> --
> http://www.greenend.org.uk/rjk/

[Martin Gregorie]

On Thu, 19 May 2016 13:06:57 -0700, gmail wrote:

> I probably should buy (if such a thing exists) a good book on RHEL 3.
>

I'll pass on that question (I've never used RHEL3), but don't forget that
the O'Reilly 'Lion book', "UNIX Systems Programming for SVR4" is still an
extremely useful reference source despite its age: it covers almost
everything in the current C standard library that you're likely to need
when writing user-level programs. The only stuff I've needed in the last
several years that wasn't in it was the the programming interface for the
dynamic linking loader: dlopen(), dlclose(), dlsym() and friends.

[The Real Doctor]

On 16/05/16 18:09, andy.bo...@micross.com wrote:
> I'll raise you SunOS 5.5.1 .........

I was once asked to install something on a PDP-11 running a version of
Unix so old that "man make" simply returned something along the lines of
"If you need help with this, see Dennis Ritchie in Room 1036".

Ian