Need a new PSU (I think...)
none none
I am a bit of a novice, so please bear with me...
My P3 1GHz Gateway machine, that worked flawlessly for 24hr/day for the last
3 years, has suddenly started to make some loud noise. The noise sounds as
if it comes from a fan, but I am finding it difficult to locate its source -
it sounds as if it comes from either the CPU or the PSU fans (I think). The
noise is not continuous, but the periods of silence (i.e. as before) seem to
be getting shorter and shorter... (probably noisy for 90% of the time now).
I suspected dust to be the cause, so gave the inside a good (and careful)
sucking with my Dyson, but to no avail.
My questions are:
1. What is the best way to locate the source of the noise?
2. How easy/difficult is it to replace the CPU fan? and how easy would it be
to locate a replacement? (are they standard?)
3. If the problem proves to be the PSU, can I simply replace it with
another? What should I look for?
Many thanks in advance.
J.
John Jordan
none <no...@none.com> writes
>
>1. What is the best way to locate the source of the noise?
Stop one of the fans. Small CPU fans are usually easy to stop by
pressing your finger against the centre of the hub. Alternatively block
the fan before switching the power on or simply remove the cable, but
note that some motherboards won't boot without a CPU fan running.
Obviously you wouldn't want to leave the fan disabled for more than a
few minutes...
>2. How easy/difficult is it to replace the CPU fan? and how easy would it be
>to locate a replacement? (are they standard?)
If it's a square black plastic unit with a screw in each corner it's
probably standard. They're measured across the width or length rather
than screw->screw or diagonal. 50mm units are rather tricky to find
though. It's often easier to obtain a whole new heatsink.
>3. If the problem proves to be the PSU, can I simply replace it with
>another? What should I look for?
a) Yes, generally. Standard ATX PSUs are ~150x85mm, and smaller ones are
unusual outside desktop cases. Dell (and apparently Compaq) sometimes
use incompatible power connectors, but I don't think this is a problem
with Gateway.
b) I've never had any trouble with dirt-cheap 300W units in low-end
machines, but I'd probably get flamed for recommending that you buy one
:-)
--
John Jordan
Rob Morley
<snip>
> 1. What is the best way to locate the source of the noise?
Stop the fan with your finger and see if the noise stops. This is not a
good idea with high powered fans, as they can take a bit of your finger
off or break up, but it should be okay with any regular fan. Also don't
stop it for any longer than necessary - you may find that just a quick
tap on the hub is enough to quieten it for a moment. Once you've found
the problem you may be able to fix it (for a while at least) with a drop
of oil - just peel back the sticky label on the hub of the fan, apply a
drop of oil to the spindle and replace the label.
> 2. How easy/difficult is it to replace the CPU fan? and how easy would it be
> to locate a replacement? (are they standard?)
Probably just four self-tappers, probably easy, probably. If it's the
CPU fan you might want to buy or make an adapter that lets you use an
80mm fan instead of the 50/60mm that's on there ATM.
> 3. If the problem proves to be the PSU, can I simply replace it with
> another? What should I look for?
>
You could probably replace just the fan in the PSU, as they are usually
a standard size, but be aware that there are big volts inside and you
will probably need a soldering iron to do it neatly.
tHatDudeUK
"John Jordan" <jo...@jaj22.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:HyFBSzCIS38$Ew...@jaj22.demon.co.uk...
> Obviously you wouldn't want to leave the fan disabled for more than a
> few minutes...
A few seconds is all it takes is what we're told. However there is a
heatsink there.
One loud fan culprit is the NB fan.
Matt Dibb
> A few seconds is all it takes is what we're told. However there is a
> heatsink there.
You dont need to stop it usually, just press on the central hub slightly
to slow it down - if the noise changes/stops then thats the problem fan.
Incidentally, if the OPer finds the offending fan, it might be worth
trying to put a *small* blob of oil in the bearing to try and fix it as
sometimes this will work. Just peel back the sticker on the central hub
back a little to get to the bearing.
>
> One loud fan culprit is the NB fan.
>
>
I didn't think companies like Gateway/Compaq/Dell bothered with fans on
the north bridge. They tend to turn up on "performance" boards only as
far as I can tell.
Lee Blaver
> You could probably replace just the fan in the PSU, as they are usually
> a standard size, but be aware that there are big volts inside and you
> will probably need a soldering iron to do it neatly.
I'd certainly change a noisy PSU fan, but I reckon that if it's a budget
supply then it may be better just to change the whole PSU.
Reasoning behind this is that if the supply is old enough to wear out
the fan, then the undoubtedly cheap caps are probably near the end of
their life as well - even more so if the faulty fan has resulted in the
supply running too hot.
If it's a decent supply (or a special), I'd change both the fan and the
caps ;)
Lee
--
To reply use lee.blaver and ntlworld.com
TMack
"none none" <no...@none.com> wrote in message
news:1EJIb.14231$526....@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net...
> Hi all,
>
> I am a bit of a novice, so please bear with me...
>
> My P3 1GHz Gateway machine, that worked flawlessly for 24hr/day for the
last
> 3 years, has suddenly started to make some loud noise. The noise sounds as
> if it comes from a fan, but I am finding it difficult to locate its
source -
> it sounds as if it comes from either the CPU or the PSU fans (I think).
The
> noise is not continuous, but the periods of silence (i.e. as before) seem
to
> be getting shorter and shorter... (probably noisy for 90% of the time
now).
>
> I suspected dust to be the cause, so gave the inside a good (and careful)
> sucking with my Dyson, but to no avail.
>
> My questions are:
>
> 1. What is the best way to locate the source of the noise?
An old mechanic's tip - use a screwdriver (or a wooden spoon if you are
nervous about short-circuiting something) and press the tip of the
screwdriver (or end of the spoon handle) to the suspect part - NOT the fan
itself - the heatsink or casing. Press the other end to your ear - it will
act like a stethoscope and amplify the sound. Test each suspect part in
turn - the noisy one will be easy to find using this method.
If it is a fan - simply remove mounting screws and clean off dust. If the
fan is located in your psu REMOVE THE POWER LEAD then remove the screws
holding the cover on the psu (you will almost certainly need to remove the
psu to do this) and take off the cover to reveal the fan(s).
For 'sleeve bearing' type fans (most case fans and many cpu fans) there is a
label on centre of the fan -peel this back and it will usually reveal the
top of the fan's spindle (sometimes you need to remove a rubber plug before
you can see the spindle. The spindle is usally held in place by a a white
polythene circlip which can be prised off quite easily (don't lose it or any
rubber seals or washers below it). This will allow the spindle to be
removed from the casing for cleaning and lubrication of the spindle and the
'sleeve' that it rotates in. This will stop the noise and restore the fan
to full functionality. If it is a ball-bearing fan you will need to find
some way to get lubricant into the bearings - but if they are noisy this
will only provide temporary relief as the bearings and their 'races' (the
metal casings that they run in) will almost certainly have been damaged -
replacement is the best option although lubrication will usually provide a
few weeks of quieter running whilst you look for replacements.
Tony
Ric
just to point out the obvious: be *very* careful if you're going to open the
PSU as the capacitors in it store charge for a long time and it's
potentially lethal. if it *is* the PSU fan and your PSU isn't a weird shape
one you might find it easier to swap it for a new one for 15 quid or so...
ric
none none
I briefly stopped the CPU fan, and the noise persisted, so am I right in
assuming then that the culprit must be the PSU fan? (system has a couple of
CD drives - DVD and CD-RW, Firewire and 10/100 Ethernet cards, and a couple
of HDDs).
Looking at Ebuyer and Dabs it appears that a new PSU can be had for
relatively little, and for peace of mind I would rather buy the whole unit
new and replace.
The existing PSU is a 250W one, but I prefer to go for a 300W if possible.
The system is about to be partially retired, so there is no need for
anything too fancy as a replacement as it would only be used several times a
week for a few hours compared with 24h/day for the last 3 years.
How can I tell which PSU will be a suitable replacement?
For example I am interested in either
http://www.ebuyer.com/customer/products/index.html?action=c2hvd19wcm9kdWN0X292ZXJ2aWV3&product_uid=20083
or http://www.dabs.com/uk/productView.htm?quicklinx=28YP.
I put a few photos of my PSU on
http://www.villagephotos.com/pubbrowse.asp?selected=707116 if that helps to
establish what I need.
Many thanks again for all the help.
Cheers,
J.
"TMack" <REMOVETHECA...@bigfoot.com> wrote in message
news:bt1m8o$2encm$1...@ID-67499.news.uni-berlin.de...
John Jordan
<randomcharac...@btopenworld.com> writes
>
>"John Jordan" <jo...@jaj22.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
>news:HyFBSzCIS38$Ew...@jaj22.demon.co.uk...
>
>> Obviously you wouldn't want to leave the fan disabled for more than a
>> few minutes...
>
>A few seconds is all it takes is what we're told. However there is a
>heatsink there.
It's the difference between distributing 60W over a few grams of
semiconductor and distributing 60W over a 300g lump of metal. The
temperature doesn't rise at a dangerous rate with the fan disabled.
>One loud fan culprit is the NB fan.
And those horrible 40mm fans they used to put on low-end video cards.
--
John Jordan
Matt Dibb
> I put a few photos of my PSU on
> http://www.villagephotos.com/pubbrowse.asp?selected=707116 if that helps to
> establish what I need.
Looks like a standard ATX one, so any other ATX one should be fine.
I've never used the cheapo ebuyer ones, but at £7 quid you cant complain :-)
f...@rsfx.com
<REMOVETHECA...@bigfoot.com> wrote:
>
>"none none" <no...@none.com> wrote in message
>news:1EJIb.14231$526....@newsfep4-glfd.server.ntli.net...
>> Hi all,
>>
>> I am a bit of a novice, so please bear with me...
>>
>> My P3 1GHz Gateway machine, that worked flawlessly for 24hr/day for the
>last
>> 3 years, has suddenly started to make some loud noise. The noise sounds as
>> if it comes from a fan, but I am finding it difficult to locate its
>source -
>> it sounds as if it comes from either the CPU or the PSU fans (I think).
>The
>> noise is not continuous, but the periods of silence (i.e. as before) seem
>to
>> be getting shorter and shorter... (probably noisy for 90% of the time
>now).
>>
>> I suspected dust to be the cause, so gave the inside a good (and careful)
>> sucking with my Dyson, but to no avail.
>>
>> My questions are:
>>
>> 1. What is the best way to locate the source of the noise?
Mine's just started to do this aswell. I wait for it to warm up and
then give it a sharp whack on the metal mesh at the back and it
usually stops it making such a racket.
TMack
"Ric" <ne...@spamless.infobubble.co.uk> wrote in message
news:3ff48c88$0$13352$cc9e...@news-text.dial.pipex.com...
> TMack wrote:
SNIP!
> just to point out the obvious: be *very* careful if you're going to open
the
> PSU as the capacitors in it store charge for a long time and it's
> potentially lethal. if it *is* the PSU fan and your PSU isn't a weird
shape
> one you might find it easier to swap it for a new one for 15 quid or so...
>
> ric
Good point, I should have mentioned the capacitors - however, I have opened
many PSUs and never experienced a problem. Nevertheless there is a
theoretical risk - could get zapped but very unlikely to be 'lethal' - high
voltage but insufficient current, given the resistance of the human body
(unless you are working in a bath of salty water whilst holding onto the
pipework!). However, best to leave it unplugged overnight before opening.
Tony
none none
next to some ATX PSUs is says something like P4/AMD. Does that mean that
they are not suitable for my machine (a P3)?
TIA.
"Matt Dibb" <ju...@mdibb.net> wrote in message
news:bt27k1$2ib3m$1...@ID-120197.news.uni-berlin.de...
Tim Auton
Tony, many of the rest of us have played happily for years inside TVs
and PSUs with possibly lethal voltages inches from our fingers for
years, but *anybody* can read usenet and I for one try to ensure I
give the safest advice possible. What I do on my own workbench and
what I suggest others with an undetermined level of expertise do on
theirs are very different things.
I'm sat next to a PSU I have hacked into oblivion, I hacked it about 2
minutes after I unplugged it because I know what to touch and what not
to touch. I'd never recommend that same mod to someone with no
experience. Until someone knows what it and what isn't potentially
dangerous it's best for them to assume it's *all* dangerous.
Tim
--
The .sig is dead.
Tim Auton
Exactly, you can't complain when it takes your motherboard, CPU and
GFX card with it when it dies...
none none
"Tim Auton" <tim.auton@uton.[group sex without the y]> wrote in message
news:o8e9vvg23fgnaordn...@4ax.com...
Thanks for the tip Tim.
I agree, and I have no problem spending another 10-20 quid for my peace of
mind. My only problem is that I don't know which one to choose (both Dabs
and Ebuyer listings appear very thin on the detail side).
Rob Morley
none" no...@none.com says...
> One last question before I place an order:
>
> next to some ATX PSUs is says something like P4/AMD. Does that mean that
> they are not suitable for my machine (a P3)?
>
to use it.
Tim Auton
>"Tim Auton" <tim.auton@uton.[group sex without the y]> wrote in message
>news:o8e9vvg23fgnaordn...@4ax.com...
>> Matt Dibb <ju...@mdibb.net> wrote:
>> >none none wrote:
>> >> I put a few photos of my PSU on
>> >> http://www.villagephotos.com/pubbrowse.asp?selected=707116 if that
>helps to
>> >> establish what I need.
>> >
>> >Looks like a standard ATX one, so any other ATX one should be fine.
>> >I've never used the cheapo ebuyer ones, but at £7 quid you cant complain
>:-)
>>
>> Exactly, you can't complain when it takes your motherboard, CPU and
>> GFX card with it when it dies...
>
>Thanks for the tip Tim.
My lawyer advises me to add the following:
I wasn't talking specifically about cheap ebuyer PSUs, but PSUs in
general. Perhaps cheap ebuyer PSUs have over/under voltage protection
on all lines and use quality components throughout, but my experience
of cheap computer PSUs leads me to thing that cheap PSUs generally are
a false economy. They fail more frequently and fail more destructively
than quality PSUs.
>I agree, and I have no problem spending another 10-20 quid for my peace of
>mind. My only problem is that I don't know which one to choose (both Dabs
>and Ebuyer listings appear very thin on the detail side).
Try to look for the current ratings (Amps) on the individual output
lines. Find the manufacturer's product number and look it up on their
website. It's hard to work out what you need from that info (you'd
have to look up the current drain of every device you have in your PC)
but it is the fairest way of comparing PSUs output; the oft-quoted
wattage is the *input* - an efficient 350W PSU can supply more juice
to your PC's components than a more than an inefficient 400W, which
just produces more heat.
TMack
"Tim Auton" <tim.auton@uton.[group sex without the y]> wrote in message
Can't argue with that!
Tony
BWGames
> "none none" <no...@none.com> wrote:
>>"Tim Auton" <tim.auton@uton.[group sex without the y]> wrote in message
>>news:o8e9vvg23fgnaordn...@4ax.com...
>>> Matt Dibb <ju...@mdibb.net> wrote:
>>> >none none wrote:
>>> >> I put a few photos of my PSU on
>>> >> http://www.villagephotos.com/pubbrowse.asp?selected=707116 if that
>>helps to
>>> >> establish what I need.
>>> >
>>> >Looks like a standard ATX one, so any other ATX one should be fine.
>>> >I've never used the cheapo ebuyer ones, but at ?7 quid you cant complain
>>:-)
>>>
>>> Exactly, you can't complain when it takes your motherboard, CPU and
>>> GFX card with it when it dies...
>>
>>Thanks for the tip Tim.
>
> My lawyer advises me to add the following:
>
> I wasn't talking specifically about cheap ebuyer PSUs, but PSUs in
> general. Perhaps cheap ebuyer PSUs have over/under voltage protection
> on all lines and use quality components throughout, but my experience
> of cheap computer PSUs leads me to thing that cheap PSUs generally are
> a false economy. They fail more frequently and fail more destructively
> than quality PSUs.
Have to say, I got a case from eBuyer and it came with a ebuyer 300W PSU.
Thats powering my Radeon 9700 graphics, 2 hard disks, 3 dvd/cd/rw's etc,
Asus A7N8X mobo, 6fans and 2 CCFL's perfectly well...
Not that loud either IMO.
--
BWGames
to email change de.news to de-news
Tony Houghton
none none <no...@none.com> wrote:
> I agree, and I have no problem spending another 10-20 quid for my peace of
> mind. My only problem is that I don't know which one to choose (both Dabs
> and Ebuyer listings appear very thin on the detail side).
Q-Tec are quite popular, but the ones at eBuyer seem suspiciously cheap.
FSP/Sparkle and Enlight are meant to be quite good if you want to spend
a little less than on the likes of an Enermax or Antec.
--
My real address is in the Reply-To and includes the .nospam.
See <http://www.realh.co.uk/contact.html> for more reliable contact addresses.
Matt Dibb
>>Looks like a standard ATX one, so any other ATX one should be fine.
>>I've never used the cheapo ebuyer ones, but at £7 quid you cant complain :-)
>
>
> Exactly, you can't complain when it takes your motherboard, CPU and
> GFX card with it when it dies...
You cant complain when the 40 quid one does either :-) They are all
likely made in the same place with hte same components anyway ;-)
Mike Tomlinson
none <no...@none.com> writes
>I put a few photos of my PSU on
>http://www.villagephotos.com/pubbrowse.asp?selected=707116 if that helps to
>establish what I need.
Your existing power supply is made by Astec, which is a very good
quality brand. Do you really want to junk it and replace it with a
cheap and nasty Ebuyer one?
I'd replace the fan, personally. I can recommend Dorothy Bradbury:
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/dorothy.bradbury/panaflo.htm
Trevor Best
<jo...@jaj22.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>And those horrible 40mm fans they used to put on low-end video cards.
IME they usually stop with no ill effects :-)
--
A)bort, R)etry, I)nfluence with large hammer.