Death by DEFRA
Roy Bailey
appeared in the Sunday Telegraph. The matter has been the subject of much
discussion - as you might expect - on the ukcider mailing list. A petition is
being organised by Geoff Morris of Orchard, Hive And Vine, Leominster, to be
handed over at the Houses of Parliament next Tuesday 20th.
Any lobbing of your MP that concerned subscribers to this newsgroup can do will
be helpful.
In case you think I am biased, this will not affect me as I get my fruit from
domestic growers.
* * *
ANCIENT APPLE ORCHARDS FACE BONFIRE AS BLIGHT OF FARM PAYOUTS BITES
GROWERS PLAN TO DIG UP RURAL TREASURES AS PAYMENT SCHEME REMOVES INCENTIVES
John Vidal
Monday March 29, 2004
The Guardian
Donkey Orchard on the edge of Kingsbury Episcopi in Somerset has been in
Rodney Male's family for almost 200 years and the two-hectare field of
ancient cider apple trees with evocative names such as Old Morgan sweets,
Kingston Black and Newton Wonders, would in many countries be classed as a
national treasure.
The orchard's crooked, hollow-trunked trees have great bushes of mistletoe
in their high branches and many house jackdaws, woodpeckers and rooks. Lambs
and ponies graze under the trees, which in a few weeks' time will be a blaze
of soft pink and white blossoms.
But the exquisite old English orchard, celebrated since Celtic times and
promoted by modern governments and tourist boards, is under a threat which
some rank as the ecological equivalent of the dissolution of the
monasteries.
This autumn hundreds of orchard owners around Britain will reluctantly call
in contractors to grub up and burn their trees. Donkey Orchard will fall, so
will its only slightly less venerable neighbours Boar's Field and Orchard
Anne.
Mr Male and the other growers fully appreciate the environmental, cultural
and landscape value of their trees but say they have got no option because
of the government's proposed farm payment scheme. If felled before January 1
orchards will be classed as "farmland" and be worth an automatic yearly £340
a hectare, in perpetuity; but any left standing will be worth no more than
the land value and, crucially, will not be considered for farm payments.
"I can't afford not to rip them out," said Mr Male, whose great grandfather
planted Donkey Orchard in the early 1800s. "Just one apple tree in a field
may class it as an orchard, and that will mean no payment, ever. People like
me will clear out all the old, less productive orchards. Plenty are thinking
of it. We're obviously not going to risk keeping them."
The scheme, claimed by the Department for Environment, Food and Rural
Affairs (Defra) to reward environmental good practice rather than
production, will be paid according to acreage in England. But although
people growing sugar beet, potato and asparagus - crops with no great
environmental benefit - will be rewarded, uniquely in Europe Britain has
chosen to exclude orchards.
Apple, plum and cherry growers, who have never received state subsidies, say
they are less worried about the acreage payments than the loss in capital
value of their farms and smallholdings.
"We will see the biggest bonfires since foot and mouth disease, only they'll
smell better," said John Thatcher, who runs Thatchers' cider works in
Shepton Mallet and buys in thousands of tonnes of apples a year. "Orchards
have to be rotated. But we won't get any payments when we grow other crops
on the same land."
Julian Temperley, owner of 150 acres (60 hectares) of traditional cider
apple orchards and Britain's largest cider distillery, in Kingsbury
Episcopi, said: "What's the government got against old orchards? This is
going to be an environmental, landscape and wildlife disaster."
Simon Russell, spokesman for the National Association of Cider Makers and
Matthew Clark's, Britain's second largest commercial cider makers, said:
"There is a real risk that people with older orchards will now grub them
up."
The potential loss of the old orchards will add to the vertiginous decline
of fruit growing in Britain over the past 50 years. From an estimated 80,000
hectares given over to orchards in 1945, there are now just 20,000 left and
perhaps 1,000-2,000 hectares of traditionally managed ones grazed by animals
for six months of the year.
In the past five years, according to Defra, more than 10% of all British
orchards have been lost. From 1,500 registered apple and pear growers in
1987, there are now just 500. Counties such as Essex, Cornwall and Kent -
the latter once known as the "garden of England" for its orchards - have
lost up to 90% of their fruit trees.
At least 60% of all orchards were lost in the past 30 years largely because
supermarkets preferred to buy just one or two varieties in bulk from France,
the US and New Zealand. "The price of apples has hardly risen in 10 years.
There are now just five commercial apple farms left in the whole
south-west," said William Hebditch, of New Cross farm in South Petherton,
Somerset.
The loss of one old orchard can mean the extinction of an apple variety,
said Sue Clifford, of Common Ground. "You don't just lose trees. You lose
the recipes, the songs, the work, the festivals, the landscape, and all the
wisdom gathered over generations of how you grow them."
The apple is Britain's national fruit. The Celts worshipped it, Glastonbury
was called Avalon, "the Isle of Apples", every cottage had a tree or two,
and for generations farmworkers were paid in cider. Britain's national apple
register lists more than 6,000 varieties of English apples, some, it is
thought, local to just a single parish or even a farm, and all developed to
grow well in particular soil conditions.
But according to a Friends of the Earth survey, only 38% of the apples sold
last year in Tesco and Asda, the country's biggest chains, were British,
while convenience stores scored lower, with 27%.
"Buyers want lorry-loads of the same product, the same size, same price,
week in, week out, which, with our traditional English varieties, is very
difficult to do," said John Breach, chairman of the British Independent
Fruit Growers Association.
Mr Temperley thinks it is not too late to alter the payment scheme and avoid
felling. "Safeguarding the orchards would cost perhaps a million pounds,
about 0.01% of the total agriculture package. I can point to 50 acres near
Kingsbury alone which will be felled this autumn - the most traditional
orchards left in Britain. They harbour wildlife, give employment and are far
more interesting in every way than grassland. The county will be a poorer
place without them."
Yesterday the government said it was taking the issue up with the European
commission. "We are aware of the concerns and are in discussion with the
commission and with fruit growers," said a spokesman for Defra.
Core facts History of UK's favourite fruit
·Apples originated in the Middle East more than 4,000 years ago
·The Greeks and Romans referred to apples as symbols of love and beauty.
When the Romans invaded England they brought methods of cultivating apples
with them.
·The Celtic word for apple, abhall, persists in many placenames, and some
towns and cities have associations with fruit trees. Norwich was described
in Tudor times as "either a city in an orchard or an orchard in a city".
·There was a demise in apple growing from the 13th century but this was
reversed by Henry VIII, who instructed his fruiterer, Richard Harris, to
establish the first large-scale orchards at Teynham, Kent, and to scour the
known world for the best varieties.
·The Victorian explorers found new varieties, and more than 6,000 varieties
have been recorded growing in England.
·Roughly one in three apples sold in Britain is homegrown. Supermarkets sell
70% of all apples in the UK. Many supermarkets sell about eight varieties -
double the range they had on their shelves five years ago.
* * *
--
Roy Bailey - Proprietor
The Lambourn Valley Cider Company
(Real cider from the Royal County)
<www.lambournvalleycider.co.uk>
Jim Webster
"Roy Bailey" <ne...@westberks.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:xgWSuyA6...@westberks.demon.co.uk...
> Mr Male and the other growers fully appreciate the environmental, cultural
> and landscape value of their trees but say they have got no option because
> of the government's proposed farm payment scheme. If felled before January
1
> orchards will be classed as "farmland" and be worth an automatic yearly
£340
> a hectare, in perpetuity
this is nonsense. The SFP is not going to be more than £216 or £211 per
hectare, and is guaranteed to reduce, probably to around £150 by 2012.
But with more accession countries coming in in 2008 (from memory) it could
well drop faster and is unlikely to last much past 2012
Jim Webster
Charles Francis
<ne...@westberks.demon.co.uk> writes
>Donkey Orchard on the edge of Kingsbury Episcopi in Somerset has been in
>Rodney Male's family for almost 200 years and the two-hectare field of
>ancient cider apple trees with evocative names such as Old Morgan sweets,
>Kingston Black and Newton Wonders, would in many countries be classed as a
>national treasure.
A poor start. The English are peculiarly sentimental about such things.
In any other country it wouldn't be a story.
Regards
--
Charles Francis
Jane Gillett
Probably true but the sentimental attitude helps to give us an environment
pleasant to live in in several aspects and I shall be sorry to see all the
orchards lost. Particularly as it seems to be generated entirely by yet
another apparently random government decision, one probably taken by people
who have little practical experience of what they are talking about without
adequate thought for the consequences.
I suppose I should ask, for the sake of completeness, is there a practical
reason - other than saving money?
Jane
> Regards
--
Jane G : j.gi...@stertfarm.co.uk : S Devon
Oz
>Probably true but the sentimental attitude helps to give us an environment
>pleasant to live in in several aspects and I shall be sorry to see all the
>orchards lost. Particularly as it seems to be generated entirely by yet
>another apparently random government decision, one probably taken by people
>who have little practical experience of what they are talking about without
>adequate thought for the consequences.
>
>I suppose I should ask, for the sake of completeness, is there a practical
>reason - other than saving money?
I am baffled. Whether they do or don;t get the money will have no effect
on whether they keep the orchards or not.
The cash is decoupled.
--
Oz
This post is worth absolutely nothing and is probably fallacious.
DEMON address no longer in use.
BTOPENWORLD address about to cease.
>>Use o...@farmeroz.port995.com (whitelist check on first post)<<
Jim Webster
"Oz" <o...@farmeroz.port995.com> wrote in message
news:yMMDrUG7...@farmeroz.port995.com...
> Jane Gillett <j.gi...@stertfarm.co.uk> writes
> >Probably true but the sentimental attitude helps to give us an
environment
> >pleasant to live in in several aspects and I shall be sorry to see all
the
> >orchards lost. Particularly as it seems to be generated entirely by yet
> >another apparently random government decision, one probably taken by
people
> >who have little practical experience of what they are talking about
without
> >adequate thought for the consequences.
> >
> >I suppose I should ask, for the sake of completeness, is there a
practical
> >reason - other than saving money?
>
> I am baffled. Whether they do or don;t get the money will have no effect
> on whether they keep the orchards or not.
>
> The cash is decoupled.
either way, if an orchard can only be saved for £300 a hectare then to be
perfectly honest, it is on its uppers anyway.
Jim Webster
Roy Bailey
>In article <xgWSuyA6...@westberks.demon.co.uk>, Roy Bailey
><ne...@westberks.demon.co.uk> writes
>>Donkey Orchard on the edge of Kingsbury Episcopi in Somerset has been in
>>Rodney Male's family for almost 200 years and the two-hectare field of
>>ancient cider apple trees with evocative names such as Old Morgan sweets,
>>Kingston Black and Newton Wonders, would in many countries be classed as a
>>national treasure.
>
>A poor start. The English are peculiarly sentimental about such things.
>
apples and perry pears are forced to cut down their orchards to balance their
books, then the craft cider makers will lose their supplies and distinctive
regional ciders and perries will disappear. Furthermore, it could mean the
complete extinction of many rare traditional varieties of fruit, with a
consequent loss to the gene pool.
This won't bother the big producers, who use imported Chinese apple
concentrate, lots of sugar, and Alcohol Reducing Agent (water to you and me!)
There is also a possible threat to hopyards, with all that would mean to
brewers of quality British beer.
>In any other country it wouldn't be a story.
I suggest that an ill-advised and ignorant decision by a Government that would
result in the destruction of something unique to that country would be news
almost anywhere in the civilised world.
Oz
>There is much more in this matter than sentiment. If the growers of cider
>apples and perry pears are forced to cut down their orchards to balance their
>books, then the craft cider makers will lose their supplies and distinctive
>regional ciders and perries will disappear.
That has nothing to do with the payment, which is decoupled.
It has all to do with how much cidermakers are prepared to pay for the
ciderapples.
>Furthermore, it could mean the
>complete extinction of many rare traditional varieties of fruit, with a
>consequent loss to the gene pool.
See above.
>This won't bother the big producers, who use imported Chinese apple
>concentrate, lots of sugar, and Alcohol Reducing Agent (water to you and me!)
Very probable.
>There is also a possible threat to hopyards, with all that would mean to
>brewers of quality British beer.
Indeed, but nothing to do with the payments, which are decoupled.
>I suggest that an ill-advised and ignorant decision by a Government that would
>result in the destruction of something unique to that country would be news
>almost anywhere in the civilised world.
.sig reinstated:
Roy Bailey - Proprietor
The Lambourn Valley Cider Company
(Real cider from the Royal County)
<www.lambournvalleycider.co.uk>
Do you have your own orchards, or do you buy apples in?
David G. Bell
<d10YleHZ...@farmeroz.port995.com>
o...@farmeroz.port995.com "Oz" wrote:
> That has nothing to do with the payment, which is decoupled.
Oz, it looks to be all to do with how the transition is handled, and how
"orchard" is defined. There was also a mention of "dual use" on some of
the land -- livestock grazing in orchards.
The argument seems to be that certain kinds of tree in a field, even
potentially a single tree, turn it into an "orchard". And lose any
value in calculating the single farm payment, even if under the current
system it qualified as grazing land to support (indirectly?) claims for
livestock subsidy.
It looks to me like another instance of DEFRA penalising good farming
practices -- look at how what they planned interacted with using vining
peas (or other unsupported crops) in a rotation.
--
David G. Bell -- SF Fan, Filker, and Punslinger.
"History shows that the Singularity started when Sir Tim Berners-Lee
was bitten by a radioactive spider."
Charles Francis
<o...@farmeroz.port995.com> writes
>
>
>.sig reinstated:
> Roy Bailey - Proprietor
> The Lambourn Valley Cider Company
> (Real cider from the Royal County)
> <www.lambournvalleycider.co.uk>
>
>Do you have your own orchards, or do you buy apples in?
>
cider vinegar?
Regards
--
Charles Francis
Oz
>On Monday, in article
> <d10YleHZ...@farmeroz.port995.com>
> o...@farmeroz.port995.com "Oz" wrote:
>
>> That has nothing to do with the payment, which is decoupled.
>
>Oz, it looks to be all to do with how the transition is handled, and how
>"orchard" is defined. There was also a mention of "dual use" on some of
>the land -- livestock grazing in orchards.
OK, so now you are looking ten years into the future....
>It looks to me like another instance of DEFRA penalising good farming
>practices -- look at how what they planned interacted with using vining
>peas (or other unsupported crops) in a rotation.
Defra have cocked up anyway by not just having the historic payment.
I imagine the rest of the ec are utterly delighted ....
Jane Gillett
Jim Webster <J...@zerogeespam.oo.net> wrote:
> "Oz" <o...@farmeroz.port995.com> wrote in message
> news:yMMDrUG7...@farmeroz.port995.com...
> > Jane Gillett <j.gi...@stertfarm.co.uk> writes
> > >Probably true but the sentimental attitude helps to give us an
> environment
> > >pleasant to live in in several aspects and I shall be sorry to see all
> the
> > >orchards lost. Particularly as it seems to be generated entirely by yet
> > >another apparently random government decision, one probably taken by
> people
> > >who have little practical experience of what they are talking about
> without
> > >adequate thought for the consequences.
> > >
> > >I suppose I should ask, for the sake of completeness, is there a
> practical
> > >reason - other than saving money?
> >
> > I am baffled. Whether they do or don;t get the money will have no effect
> > on whether they keep the orchards or not.
I meant the government saving money.
> >
> > The cash is decoupled.
> either way, if an orchard can only be saved for £300 a hectare then to be
> perfectly honest, it is on its uppers anyway.
It would be worth the government spending money saving it for its
environmental value. Similar to hedgerows only it's environmental for
people rather than for wildlife. It can't surely amount to very much money
- we can't have that many traditional orchards.
Jane
> Jim Webster
> >
> > --
> > Oz
> > This post is worth absolutely nothing and is probably fallacious.
> >
> > DEMON address no longer in use.
> > BTOPENWORLD address about to cease.
> > >>Use o...@farmeroz.port995.com (whitelist check on first post)<<
--
Oz
>>jim
>> either way, if an orchard can only be saved for £300 a hectare then to be
>> perfectly honest, it is on its uppers anyway.
>
>It would be worth the government spending money saving it for its
>environmental value. Similar to hedgerows only it's environmental for
>people rather than for wildlife. It can't surely amount to very much money
>- we can't have that many traditional orchards.
Payments for production are banned. You could have a special fund for
preserving old orchards, how you would police and fund it I have no
idea.
Jim Webster
> Jane Gillett <j.gi...@stertfarm.co.uk> writes
>
> >>jim
> >> either way, if an orchard can only be saved for £300 a hectare then to
be
> >> perfectly honest, it is on its uppers anyway.
> >
> >It would be worth the government spending money saving it for its
> >environmental value. Similar to hedgerows only it's environmental for
> >people rather than for wildlife. It can't surely amount to very much
money
> >- we can't have that many traditional orchards.
>
> Payments for production are banned. You could have a special fund for
> preserving old orchards, how you would police and fund it I have no
> idea.
>
It would probably have to be done under Environmental Stewardship, in which
case it would be relatively easy. Initial inspection to check it is worth
preserving and then an agreed annual payment plus management plan
Jim Webster
Roy Bailey
>
affected by the Government proposals. All my fruit is surplus to the growers'
requirements and is therefore free, but has to be collected from a fairly wide
area.
--
Oz
so the decoupled payments are a distraction and nothing to do with the
grubbing of old orchard varieties. They are, though, preservable by
other more direct routes.
--
Oz
This post is worth absolutely nothing and is probably fallacious.
BTOPENWORLD address about to cease. DEMON address no longer in use.
>>Use o...@farmeroz.port995.com (whitelist check on first posting)<<
Oz
>In article <d10YleHZ...@farmeroz.port995.com>, Oz <o...@farmeroz.port995.com>
>writes
>>
>>Do you have your own orchards, or do you buy apples in?
>>
>I have a new orchard which is not yet bearing fruit and which would not be
>affected by the Government proposals. All my fruit is surplus to the growers'
>requirements and is therefore free, but has to be collected from a fairly wide
>area.
So you are well aware that the decoupled payments have nothing to do
with the preservation or not of old orchards.
--
Oz
This post is worth absolutely nothing and is probably fallacious.
BTOPENWORLD address about to cease. DEMON address no longer in use.
>>Use o...@farmeroz.port995.com (whitelist check on first posting)<<
Jim Webster
> >> preserving old orchards, how you would police and fund it I have no
> >> idea.
> >>
> >
> >It would probably have to be done under Environmental Stewardship, in
which
> >case it would be relatively easy. Initial inspection to check it is worth
> >preserving and then an agreed annual payment plus management plan
>
> so the decoupled payments are a distraction and nothing to do with the
> grubbing of old orchard varieties. They are, though, preservable by
> other more direct routes.
As I mentioned elsewhere I was at a talk given by Allan Buckwell on the
subject last night.
Effectively woodland and orchards area excluded from the SFP. There is a
discussion as to what represents an orchard, a woodland and a grass park
with a few nice trees in it and they might set a figure of so many trees per
hectare.
The problem is, just how big are these orchards.
The reason for this is that by 2012, the payment is only going to be Ł150 to
Ł170 a hectare anyway
Defra's website is playing silly beggars when I tried to get the statistics
for orchards, but if you take an average sized cider apple orchard, and then
look at the weight of crop off it, it should be easy to work out how much
per tonne of crop Ł170 per hectare equates to
Jim Webster
Roy Bailey
writes
>Roy Bailey <ne...@westberks.demon.co.uk> writes
>>In article <d10YleHZ...@farmeroz.port995.com>, Oz
><o...@farmeroz.port995.com>
>>writes
>>>
>>>Do you have your own orchards, or do you buy apples in?
>>>
>>I have a new orchard which is not yet bearing fruit and which would not be
>>affected by the Government proposals. All my fruit is surplus to the growers'
>>requirements and is therefore free, but has to be collected from a fairly wide
>>area.
>
>So you are well aware that the decoupled payments have nothing to do
>with the preservation or not of old orchards.
>
price of everything and the value of nothing.
Oz
>In article <3ecivMF8...@farmeroz.port995.com>, Oz <o...@farmeroz.port995.com>
>writes
>>So you are well aware that the decoupled payments have nothing to do
>>with the preservation or not of old orchards.
>>
>No, I'm not.
Well, perhaps you should learn about the decoupled payments so you can
properly discuss the issues.
>I am aware, however, that you are one of those people who knows the
>price of everything and the value of nothing.
Ahh, so now gratuitous insults take the place of a coherent argument.
Sounds like you don't even want to know the facts,
or search for a solution.
David G. Bell
<r2y0rrAu...@westberks.demon.co.uk>
ne...@westberks.demon.co.uk "Roy Bailey" wrote:
> In article <3ecivMF8...@farmeroz.port995.com>, Oz <o...@farmeroz.port995.com>
> writes
> >Roy Bailey <ne...@westberks.demon.co.uk> writes
> >>In article <d10YleHZ...@farmeroz.port995.com>, Oz
> ><o...@farmeroz.port995.com>
> >>writes
> >>>
> >>>Do you have your own orchards, or do you buy apples in?
> >>>
> >>I have a new orchard which is not yet bearing fruit and which would not be
> >>affected by the Government proposals. All my fruit is surplus to the growers'
> >>requirements and is therefore free, but has to be collected from a fairly wide
> >>area.
> >
> >So you are well aware that the decoupled payments have nothing to do
> >with the preservation or not of old orchards.
> >
> No, I'm not. I am aware, however, that you are one of those people who knows the
> price of everything and the value of nothing.
I don't think Oz is a supermarket buyer...
Nor is he Lincolnshire post and rail.