Fwd: [ohm2013 bestuur] how to run camp commerce (vendors/stalls)?
Martin Dittus
I contacted HAR, CCC, and ToorCamp to ask how they run camp commerce. Koen of HAR/OHM was the first to reply, see below.
See also:
http://wiki.emfcamp.org/wiki/Commerce
m.
Begin forwarded message:
> From: Koen Martens
> Subject: Re: [ohm2013 bestuur] EMFCamp 2012 (UK): how to run camp commerce (vendors/stalls)?
> Date: 14 March 2012 09:46:46 GMT
> To: Martin Dittus <mar...@dekstop.de>
> Cc: in...@ohm2013.org
>
> Hey Martin,
>
> On Sun, Mar 11, 2012 at 05:09:15PM +0000, Martin Dittus wrote:
>> I'm contacting you because I'm looking for information that I couldn't find on the HAR wiki, and I've not yet found direct contacts for the right individuals in the org team.
>>
>> I'm with the London Hackspace, and part of an effort to organise a UK hacker camp which will likely happen later this summer:
>> http://www.emfcamp.org/
>>
>> After a few weeks of initial research we're just about to sign a contract with a potential venue. We're now starting to discuss infrastructure and coordination details, and one aspect in particular made us curious about precedents: the question of how to manage commerce at the camp. We expect that a lot of independent hardware hackers will want to sell their kits, and we know that we will appreciate the presence of a few food vendors.
>>
>> Who can I speak to for details about how this was handled at HAR, or what your plans are for OHM? Any assistance is greatly appreciated.
>
> You can ask me, as i've been doing finance for har2009 :)
>
>> In particular we are currently discussing the following:
>> * Where do we draw the line between makers selling their own kits (very much encouraged) and businesses who need to pay for the privilege?
>
> At har, we don't draw the line. I know it is different at cccamp where vendors need to pay 5 to 10% of their
> turn-over to the event, but at har we don't do that. We are not in it to make money, so it wouldn't make
> sense at all. Plus, the few 'vendors' that are there to sell stuff are people we know quite well such
> as Mitch Altman / Jimmie P. Rodgers or Wim from hackable devices. In most cases, they did rent a tent
> through us, which we made available at a minimal margin just to make the numbers round.
>
> As for food/drinks: we did not ask money from these vendors. We ran the bar ourselves, but food was
> provided by entrepeneurs whom we invited. They collected har coins for their goods, which they could
> exchange 1-on-1 for real money with us. We did not keep a percentage. Sometimes, the venue demands
> a percentage of any food or drinks being sold, but this was not the case at har2009. Usually this is
> because the venue already has contracts with a specific company for catering, and they need to be
> 'bought of' so to speak. The catering companies also ran their shops for their own risk, we did
> not give guarantees about sales or whatever.
>
>> * Centralised vs self-organising commerce -- should vendors need to register?
>
> As for catering, we picked them ourselves. The other vendors were already quite involved in our
> network and thus organically blended into the whole.
>
>> * Would we charge per tent, per stall, fixed sum, revenue share?
>
> At ccc it's a revenue share afaik, at har we just had them pay the rent for their tents at cost-price,
> nothing more.
>
>> * Do we need separate kinds of agreements with food stalls? (Caused by statutory requirements, waste disposal concerns, etc.)
>
> Apart from hygeniec concerns (in nl there needs to be at least one person available/responsible
> for each food/drinks operation with the proper certificate, which is basically a binder of
> regulations to learn and an exam to take) there wasn't anything special about those stalls. They
> just ran their business. Of course, if they make food or serve drinks you will probably provide
> them with power and water. We toyed with the idea of having them pay for that, but in the end
> it was marginal in the total amount spent on utilities and we didn't bother.
>
> If there's any questions, let me know!
>
> Btw, is there a date yet? I'd very much like to come :)
>
> - gmc
Martin Dittus
Btw today on IRC mcflyhh provided answers regarding the CCC side of things, I updated the wiki page accordingly.
m.
-------
Hi Martin,
On Wed, Mar 14, 2012 at 12:07:59PM +0000, Martin Dittus wrote:
> One question did just come up: what's the advantage of using private currencies? (HAR coins.)
One is security: you prevent having large sums of money all over the terrain and having to transport
that around to collect, provide change, etc..
The other is that it is easier to take 4 50 euro bills and put them in your pocket, than it is
to walk off with 200 euros worth of coins. Also less attractive because it is worthless outside
of the event.
A final reason might be that you have a reasonably accurate tally of what gets sold by whom,
which makes for good statistics for later events (ratio of money spent on cheap snacks versus
biological dinners etc..)
- gmc