The Amazing Racists
Kevin M.
see it as a cut above others in the genre. I watched the show because
it sent the contestants to Kazakhstan, a place near and dear to my
heart.
I was not amused.
http://www.tvornottv.net/2008/11/18/the-amazing-racists/
--
Kevin M. (RPCV)
Joe Coughlin
And yet if the show focused on every country's modern telecommunications infrastructure, we'd just end up with a season long ad for Cisco routers and Intel chips.
I dig that you wanted to see the Kazakhstan that you know and loved. But the show needs to demonstrate what makes the countries unique, not the same. What I learned about Kazakhstan was that it was a very clean, very modern city that has very strong milk. Oh, and those birds were awesome.
In the end, the only people portrayed in a poor light were the racers who refused to blend in and join the society. When Dan and Andrew ("Dandrew") got frustrated because they couldn't find the Mongol Warrior clue, they didn't blame themselves or their poor people skils, they blamed the people. Which just made Dandrew look like the Sheep Butts that Nick and Starr had to eat.
--
+++++++++++++++
Joe Coughlin
Happy Accidents
http://inturnaround.vox.com
Darren Glass
It is also worth pointing out that they do exactly the same types of things wherever they go -- including episodes that are set in the US. Unless, that is, you think that everyone in Wasington DC is a spy, all Chicagoans eat is deep dish pizza, and all residents of Wyoming dress as 19th century cowboys.
Its never a good use of time to try to convinice someone that a show they dislike is actually good, and from prior discussions I know it is particularly fruitless with you. So I can accept it if you dont see the things that many of us love about The Amazing Race and you would prefer to watch Travel Channel documentaries. But I think that your cries of racism are unfair.
- dg
David Lynch
> On Tue, Nov 18, 2008 at 1:46 AM, Kevin M. <drunkba...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Yes, I know, there are many of you who adore this reality series and
>> see it as a cut above others in the genre. I watched the show because
>> it sent the contestants to Kazakhstan, a place near and dear to my
>> heart.
>>
>> I was not amused.
>>
>> http://www.tvornottv.net/2008/11/18/the-amazing-racists/
>>
>> --
>> Kevin M. (RPCV)
>
> And yet if the show focused on every country's modern telecommunications
> infrastructure, we'd just end up with a season long ad for Cisco routers and
> Intel chips.
I'm going to go down a similar route and point out that "modern
shopping districts" are pretty much the same everywhere in the world,
and on top of that "go to the meat counter at a supermarket, where the
butcher will hand you your next clue" isn't all that interesting for
viewers. Also, going to an open-air market where meat is sold wasn't
presented as the only option available or even the most-used option,
and it's not exactly gone from the first world -- I can have the same
experience every Saturday morning at the farmer's market without
having to leave the good old US of A.
I'm pretty sure that there were more people laughing at the cow suits
on the street in modern dress than appeared in traditional dress at
the "Kazakh warriors" clue.
> I dig that you wanted to see the Kazakhstan that you know and loved. But the
> show needs to demonstrate what makes the countries unique, not the same.
> What I learned about Kazakhstan was that it was a very clean, very modern
> city that has very strong milk. Oh, and those birds were awesome.
About the worst that I would say is that the percentage of the
population that speaks English is lower than in the other countries
that have been visited during the race.
The show is "The Amazing Race," not "The Amazing Cultural
Documentary." (I specifically avoid mentioning the "travel show"
genre, because they too will focus on the "different" things instead
of the modernness of their telecommunications and shopping districts.)
TAR plays up the anachronistic as tradition and history, but it's no
worse than anywhere else in the world (even the US) is treated.
In this and past seasons, we've had:
* Matching a drawing of a Maori's facial tattoos to the face of the
Maori they were painted on. The Maori were doing a Haka (or some
variation of one) during the entire challenge.
* Searching a bicycle parking garage in Amsterdam for two matching
bicycles, then going to a canal where the racers had to jump across a
canal using a pole.
* Eating deep-dish pizza in Chicago.
* Looking for a clue engraved on a stone tablet at Angkor Wat.
* Numerous challenges involving tuk-tuks in India.
* Leading donkeys down a path in Ireland.
* Plowing a field with an ox somewhere in southeast Asia. (It was
several years ago, but still provides one of the best single
exclamations ever uttered in frustration on TAR or any other reality
show I'm aware of, in the form of "My ox is broken!")
* Stilt-walking in Lithuania.
And the list goes on...
--
David J. Lynch
djl...@gmail.com
Kevin M.
If the show went to America's deep south, to a replica of a small
plantation, and contestants had to grab their next clue from a bunch
of African-American slaves picking cotton, would you all point to that
as a brief taste of American culture? Would you say that, though not
truly representative of the country as a whole, it was more
entertaining than watching contestants walk up to a well-dressed black
man or woman and to take their next clue from them? Or a less extreme
example, if the show tried to use some modern day back woods town like
Bakersfield, CA as a microcosm of America, would you be alright with
that town representing America on the series? Because the parts of
Almaty they chose to show did not represent the city I know Almaty to
be, much less the country Kazakhstan is.
Almaty has a rich history and a vibrant present. Hell, the airport
alone has improved leaps and bounds from when I was there five years
ago. What did they focus on? The Mongols. The Kazakhstani people were
raped, slaughtered, and conquered by the Mongols (among about a dozen
other peoples). What appear to be foothills on the outskirts of
Almaty, at the foot of the Tien-Shan mountains, are actually countless
graves... sacred ground. That was the aspect of Kazakhstan's culture
they chose to spotlight.
I agree that the show should be entertaining, but, at a higher level,
Americans should strive to be better than the ones on that show, and
American viewers should strive to be better represented. I agree with
Darren that trying to change my mind about this show would be next to
impossible. I find most reality TV to be deplorable wastes of prime
time real estate, and this show seems to be as bad as the worst I've
seen. As I said at the outset, I don't know if this installment of
"The Amazing Race" is indicative of the series as a whole, but
people's replies would seem to indicate that it is. If so, there is a
lot of shame that should be felt by a lot of people.
--
Kevin M. (RPCV)
David Lynch
their own land is not just something we Americans impose on foreigners
-- just look at any "old west" stereotype or even the history course I
had just five years ago at a major state university, which was taught
like there was nobody of any importance living west of the
Appalachians or south of Virginia until white people and/or African
slaves came during the 19th century.
I would expect that, if a version of TAR, particularly a foreign one,
ever swept through my part of Texas, I would hope for better, but I
would expect every bad stereotype of cowboys, crude oil, The Alamo,
and (depending on how much they focus on Austin and not just Texas)
pot-smoking, Barton Springs-swimming slackers to appear -- not because
it's what *should* be focused on, but because it's *television*. I
wouldn't set a bar for factual accuracy on a show with a primary
purpose of being entertaining (as opposed to informative) high enough
for me to limbo under, even if the show is non-fiction, and I'm kind
of surprised that someone who worked in the industry would set it as
high as you appear to have.
Kevin M.
> I wouldn't set a bar for factual accuracy on a show with a primary
> purpose of being entertaining (as opposed to informative) high enough
> for me to limbo under, even if the show is non-fiction, and I'm kind
> of surprised that someone who worked in the industry would set it as
> high as you appear to have.
The argument can be made that my days working in the industry were
numbered BECAUSE I set the bar high. As for not demanding factual
accuracy on shows (even shows whose ultimate purpose is to entertain)
set in the real world... I don't even know where to begin to respond
to that statement. I mean, why do reality shows exist if not to
attempt to capture reality (in a hopefully entertaining way)?
I used to really enjoy "The Real World," back when all they did was
cast seven strangers to live in a house and live their lives. Though
the editing created specific biases, the concept was a unique
experiment combining people from all facets of American life. Once
"The Real World" started giving the seven strangers specific jobs and
challenges, I lost interest, because, by and large, it resulted in
seven strangers running around a city like idiots, offending the
locals and making fools of themselves for cash and prizes. I thought
the first season of Big Brother was decent, before producers started
inciting conflict and outright hatred between the contestants. I find
people in general to be entertaining, with their own personal
histories and stories to tell. The trumped up antics found on shows
like "Survivor" hold no interest to me at all.
My argument against ridiculously premised reality shows is the same
argument I have against recreational drug use. I find reality, and the
people I encounter in real life, to be much more interesting and
entertaining than the typical lunkheaded reality show contestant. I
see people giving a damn about who gets evicted from the "Big Brother"
house, when they don't give a damn when their own next door neighbor
gets evicted. I see people cry when a D-list celebrity gets voted off
of "Dancing with the Stars," but those same people refuse to watch the
news because it is too depressing. I don't understand that.
Maybe I set the bar too high. Forgive me, but maybe it is others who
set the bar way too low.
--
Kevin M. (RPCV)
Darren Glass
If the show went to America's deep south, to a replica of a small
plantation, and contestants had to grab their next clue from a bunch
of African-American slaves picking cotton, would you all point to that
as a brief taste of American culture? Would you say that, though not
truly representative of the country as a whole, it was more
entertaining than watching contestants walk up to a well-dressed black
man or woman and to take their next clue from them? Or a less extreme
example, if the show tried to use some modern day back woods town like
Bakersfield, CA as a microcosm of America, would you be alright with
that town representing America on the series?
In another message you write about how you dont understand people who care about reality TV and dont care about the news and the real world around them. I totally share your sentiment. The difference between us is that I dont blame the reality shows for the fact that some of their viewers dont also watch the news. It is quite possible to watch -- and even to care passionately -- about things that are pure entertainment while still also caring about the world. It seems to me that most people on this list -- including you -- are prime examples of that. So I'm not really sure why you are trying to get all 'holier than thou' about this right now.
dg
Kevin M.
> So I'm not really sure why you
> are trying to get all 'holier than thou' about this right now.
If I am, it is because there is a substantial lobby for reality TV,
from fans to penny-pinching network executives, but very few who lobby
for the citizens of a nation I called home for more than a year.
Unless Lance Armstrong joining Team Astana puts Kazakhstan on the map,
very few Americans will ever see or visit the place. I am one of maybe
5,000 Americans who can even speak a few words of the native Kazakh
language.
Part of the mandate for those of us who serve as Peace Corps
Volunteers is that we inform Americans about the countries we visited
and try to correct any incorrect stereotypes. We actually swear an
oath pledging to do that. When I see the country misrepresented, as I
did, I do my best to correct it. It is, essentially, what I was paid a
meager stipend to do.
In a world where countries ending in -stan are assumed to be filled
with Muslim extremists and terrorists, Kazakhstan stands out in its
attempts to modernize and make itself friendly to western nations. In
the city where I lived, the only thing bigger than the central mosque
was the central church. It is still the launch point for all Russian
spacecraft. It is a country that, as long as the government is bribed
enough, sells oil to the US.
So, continue to praise reality TV. If you enjoy it, or if it provides
you an entertaining release after a hard day of work, fantastic. But I
will keep doing what I'm doing because it is not in my nature to allow
an entire nation of 14 million people to be made into a punchline for
the sake of entertainment. If that makes me holier than thou, then so
be it.
--
Kevin M. (RPCV)
Jay Lewis
And while they didnt go to Bakersfield, they did make stops at
> places like Huntsville Alabama, Heber City Utah and York PA, none of
> which I would consider microcosms of America (with all due respect to
> anyone living in one of those locales).
They also spent the night in a trailer park in Laurel (Petal?) Mississippi.
I get where Kevin is coming from though. I don't exactly agree either,
but I understand.
--
QWIZX.com - A little bit of everything
Maybe
> Yes, I know, there are many of you who adore this reality series and
> see it as a cut above others in the genre. I watched the show because
> it sent the contestants to Kazakhstan, a place near and dear to my
> heart.
>
> I was not amused.
>
Apparently, you missed the show from South Africa where they went to
the prison cell where Nelson Mandella spent 20 something years. All
the racers paused for a moment to reflect on the enormity of the
situation before taking their clue and running off.
In Africa, they also went to the area where they gathered the
residents together to ship to the United States to make them slaves.
The racers stopped and paused there before continuing on with the
race.
You also missed the show where the racers went to Auschwitz and paused
to pray and cry before taking their clue and running off.
Apparently, you missed the hated Family Edition of TAR where the
racers had to reinact a Civil War battle before getting a clue or row
a boat with a George Washington look alike standing in the boat
guiding them. They all reflected on what it all meant and were glad
their George Washington didn't fall in the water.
And, I know you probably don't download TAR Asia but there was a scene
last season where the racers went to the "Land of 1,000 Buddhas" and
one team who were Buddhists stopped before each Buddha they
encountered and prayed out of respect. I thought they would never get
out of that park and would lose that leg!
So I find it offensive that you would say such a thing about Amazing
Race when you apparently don't know what you are talking about.
Maybe...don't declare show you don't normally watch racist based on
one episode.
Kevin M.
> I don't think you should declare a show racist based on one episode.
The show I watched was racist. From what people have said on and off
this list, the episode I saw was typical of the format and tone of the
series. If true, the series is racist.
> Apparently, you missed the show from South Africa where they went to
> the prison cell where Nelson Mandella spent 20 something years. All
> the racers paused for a moment to reflect on the enormity of the
> situation before taking their clue and running off.
What I saw was racist. I'm thrilled to hear that not all of the
episodes included gross depictions of different nationalities at their
lowest points, or immature attitudes towards people of different
ethnicities. What I saw was a racist show. I was told, essentially,
that since it was for entertainment purposes as opposed to
informational purposes, that it was alright to not be factually
accurate. I disagree. Strongly. If that seriously offends you...
tough.
--
Kevin M. (RPCV)
Darren Glass
On Tue, Nov 18, 2008 at 10:53 AM, Darren Glass <dgl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> So I'm not really sure why you
> are trying to get all 'holier than thou' about this right now.
Part of the mandate for those of us who serve as Peace Corps
Volunteers is that we inform Americans about the countries we visited
and try to correct any incorrect stereotypes. We actually swear an
oath pledging to do that. When I see the country misrepresented, as I
did, I do my best to correct it. It is, essentially, what I was paid a
meager stipend to do.
I totally get this, and understand where you are coming from. I just think that if you had your "Teacher" hat on instead of your "I hate reality tv" hat on, you would recognize that TAR is a gameshow rather than an educational program and that it would actually be a great source of 'teachable moments'. From other topics, I know you have used tv and current events in really interesting ways iin the classroom, and I thnk this shouldnt be different -- in particular, I for one would have appreciated a post in which you explained more about what you thought was portrayed correctly and what was off and why showing Mongols may be un-PC etc, but your post instead seemed to attack TAR and ts fans, and more generally all tv under a huge genre of 'reality'.
In other words, flies, honey, vinegar.
d
dsi...@yahoo.com
> > I don't think you should declare a show racist based on one episode.
>
> The show I watched was racist. From what people have said on and off
> this list, the episode I saw was typical of the format and tone of the
> series. If true, the series is racist.
is Earl." All Americans aren't redneck morons, and I don't think even
the simplest viewer came away from TAR with the impression that
Kazakhstan is full of colorful simple furriners who exist solely for
our amusement and mockery.
I knew nothing about the country before going in (sorry, but it's
true!) and came out with a bit of appreciation for its culture and
traditions. It's a shame that CBS couldn't have devoted an hour to
their documentary "Almaty: 21st Century City on the Go!," but I guess
that's just the nature of a television network that's trying to
attract viewers.
--Dave Sikula
PeterL
On Nov 18, 8:14 am, "Kevin M." <drunkbastar...@gmail.com> wrote:
> To all who have commented so far.
>
> If the show went to America's deep south, to a replica of a small
> plantation, and contestants had to grab their next clue from a bunch
> of African-American slaves picking cotton, would you all point to that
> as a brief taste of American culture? Would you say that, though not
> truly representative of the country as a whole, it was more
> entertaining than watching contestants walk up to a well-dressed black
> man or woman and to take their next clue from them?
Kazakhstan?
> Or a less extreme
> example, if the show tried to use some modern day back woods town like
> Bakersfield, CA as a microcosm of America,
Bakersfield, and those people think you are a racist to call their
city back woods.
> would you be alright with
> that town representing America on the series?
somehow is representative of any country they visited. Another poster
has given a selection of tasks previous TAR shows had contestants do
in various countries. I certainly don't think it is in any way
representative of those countries. For example, bungi jumping is a
favorite task. It's been performed in at least three or four
countries from what I can remember. Are we to think that residents of
Macau, for example, regularly bungi jump from the Macau Tower? Anyone
who thinks that is delusional.
> Because the parts of
> Almaty they chose to show did not represent the city I know Almaty to
> be, much less the country Kazakhstan is.
>
> Almaty has a rich history and a vibrant present. Hell, the airport
> alone has improved leaps and bounds from when I was there five years
> ago. What did they focus on? The Mongols. The Kazakhstani people were
> raped, slaughtered, and conquered by the Mongols (among about a dozen
> other peoples). What appear to be foothills on the outskirts of
> Almaty, at the foot of the Tien-Shan mountains, are actually countless
> graves... sacred ground. That was the aspect of Kazakhstan's culture
> they chose to spotlight.
>
trade mission.
This was chosen with the approval of local tourism officials, no
doubt.
> I agree that the show should be entertaining, but, at a higher level,
Housewives, for example, are they representative of all housewives in
America? I don't think so. Why don't they show regular housewives
who cook and sew and teach their children homeworks and join the PTA?
CSI, is Las Vegas full of murders? Show the good side of Vegas, such
as their great airport. OK bad example. How about Law and Order? Do
people in NYC do nothing but rape and get raped? How about showing
all the friendly residents of NYC helping tourists?
> Americans should strive to be better than the ones on that show, and
> American viewers should strive to be better represented. I agree with
> Darren that trying to change my mind about this show would be next to
> impossible. I find most reality TV to be deplorable wastes of prime
> time real estate, and this show seems to be as bad as the worst I've
> seen. As I said at the outset, I don't know if this installment of
> "The Amazing Race" is indicative of the series as a whole, but
> people's replies would seem to indicate that it is. If so, there is a
> lot of shame that should be felt by a lot of people.
>
> --
> Kevin M. (RPCV)
PeterL
are objecting to, it's not racism.
Second, since you are not familiar with this series, it's not a
travelogue. The show works very closely with local tourism officials
to bring the racers to each country. So if you want to blame anyone,
also blame local tourism officials.
And most importantly, the show has one hour to show a bunch of racers
doing various tasks to race to the finish. They do the same cursory
look at so called "customs" of each country they go to. Sometimes
they do good things, such as visiting the "door of no return" in
Africa where slaves were sent on slave ships. Other times they
disrespect country customs and even religious practices. They are
equal opportunity offenders, if you take the view that each country
should be shown in the best light.
But if you take the view that the show's attraction is the
relationships amongst racers, then it is what it is.
Kevin M.
> First of all, Kazakhstanians are not a race. So whatever it is you
> are objecting to, it's not racism.
There is no such thing as a "Kazakhstanian," but the Kazakh people are
a very real, very specific race, as are the Uighers, Uzbeks, and the
half dozen other ethnicities who comprise the bulk of Kazakhstan's
population. If Mongolians make up even .5% of the population, I'd be
shocked (the CIA World Factbook doesn't even list them). The time the
Mongols spent in Kazakhstan was spent killing and plundering.
> Second, since you are not familiar with this series, it's not a
> travelogue. The show works very closely with local tourism officials
> to bring the racers to each country. So if you want to blame anyone,
> also blame local tourism officials.
I don't expect it to be a documentary series, but I also don't expect
them to outright lie about what the country is like. Darren suggested
the show was a teachable moment. It was. Many of my students watch the
show, and I spent the morning undoing the damage that had been done.
One of my students, a girl from China, said they did the same thing
when they were in her country a while ago. Someone on the list asked
me to point out the lies in the hour that I saw. It will take less
time to point out the truths:
- There is a place called Almaty, Kazakhstan
- It has an airport
- Some people drink milk
> Other times they
> disrespect country customs and even religious practices. They are
> equal opportunity offenders
Which is just one of many reasons why the show is trash. Equal
opportunity sleaze is still sleaze.
Seriously, Dave and others whose opinions I respect claim no instances
of racism in the episode. I grant that I may be oversensitive when it
comes to the Kazakh, and I even grant that the highly dysfunctional
Kazakh tourist board aided in the stupidity (their online videos to
promote tourism frustrate those of us who have been there, and
supposedly inspired the character of Borat). I could describe in vivid
detail the ceremonial meal involving the sheep's head, but it would
bore you. Suffice it to say, each piece of meat consumed is
accompanied by words of praise and thanks (and, occasionally, sips of
vodka), and there are no belly dancers (if only). Nobody throws a tin
plate of mystery meat on the table and tells you to dig in.
People buy milk in the Ramstore (the Turkish run grocery store similar
to a Target) or "magazines" (the equivalent of convenience stores),
because Almaty is a modern city and not a stereotypical third world
locale. It has casinos, a massive opera house, and a circus. The
aforementioned falconry is not a place where costumed men parade
around like fools. It is an awe inspiring place where the massive
birds are trained to do everything from deliver messages to kill. The
chickens were the result of George Bush throwing good money after bad;
as a result, the nation has more chickens than they could possibly
consume, and no viable means of exporting them. So they sit there,
hoping to be groped by reality show contestants in search of golden
eggs.
Believe me, I could be critical of Kazakhstan, and even poke fun at
some of the nation's genuine quirks. But the nation is attempting to
build itself up into something more than a former Soviet republic.
Corrupt as the Kazakh government is, the leadership has taken steps
make the country more than the collection of nomads it once was. The
capital city of Astana didn't even exist a decade ago, and now they
are talking about putting a massive dome over it so people can walk
around in shorts and t-shirts in the middle of a -40 degree winter.
So while I wasn't expecting "Almaty: 21st Century City on the Go!," I
was hoping for some sense, however small, of who the people actually
were. For those of you who don't know, no part of that show reflected
the people of Kazakhstan. They are not a bunch of descendants of
Mongol savages who sit on the floor eating sheep's ass while belly
dancers gyrate around them (again, if only).
--
Kevin M. (RPCV)
Thomas Allen Heald, Esquire
> So while I wasn't expecting "Almaty: 21st Century City on the Go!," I
> was hoping for some sense, however small, of who the people actually
> were. For those of you who don't know, no part of that show reflected
> the people of Kazakhstan. They are not a bunch of descendants of
> Mongol savages who sit on the floor eating sheep's ass while belly
> dancers gyrate around them (again, if only).
Would "The Amazing Race" even have scheduled Kazakhstan as a leg had it
not been for Sacha Baron Cohen's Borat Sagdiyev?
Darren Glass
them to outright lie about what the country is like. Darren suggested
I don't expect it to be a documentary series, but I also don't expect
the show was a teachable moment. It was. Many of my students watch the
show, and I spent the morning undoing the damage that had been done.
Did you use the same tone of anger and vitriol that you used in your post or this thread? If so, I am surprised that you still have a job -- certainly I couldnt get away with talking to my students that way. If not, then I think you missed my point.
One of my students, a girl from China, said they did the same thing
when they were in her country a while ago. Someone on the list asked
me to point out the lies in the hour that I saw. It will take less
time to point out the truths:
- There is a place called Almaty, Kazakhstan
- It has an airport
- Some people drink milk
Are you saying that CBS fabricated the market they did show us? Did they design the chicken factory from scratch? Did they build that mountain? Was it an animatronic bird? Are you really sure that carts selling milk simply dont exist? I get that they didn't show us YOUR Almaty or even the Almaty that is the most typical part of the city, but I have a hard time believing that those locales were "lies".
Honestly, Kevin, your ranting sounds to me exactly like people who rant anytime a gay character on a show turns out to be a murderer or a minority character has less than 100% pure motives. And my response to you is the same as to them: I empathize with your frustration that maybe the biggest picture isnt being shown and I understand your worries that some people might walk away with wrong impressons, but expecting that full portrait from a show like this one is just silly.
People buy milk in the Ramstore (the Turkish run grocery store similar
to a Target) or "magazines" (the equivalent of convenience stores),
because Almaty is a modern city and not a stereotypical third world
locale.
If you think they portrayed it as a third world locale, you are just betraying how little you have seen of the show and your sensitivity to this issue. As someone else has pointed out, Almaty came across looking far cleaner and more modern than many cities they go to on the race.
For those of you who don't know, no part of that show reflected
the people of Kazakhstan. They are not a bunch of descendants of
Mongol savages who sit on the floor eating sheep's ass while belly
dancers gyrate around them (again, if only).
And whhile there are probably some people who would walk away from the show with that impression, I honestly think the number is small and probably filled with people who you would dismiss for other reasons. I think most viewers of the show understand this fact, and its not because we're all racists.
- dg
Kevin M.
> Did you use the same tone of anger and vitriol that you used in your post or
> this thread? If so, I am surprised that you still have a job -- certainly I
> couldnt get away with talking to my students that way. If not, then I think
> you missed my point.
Hell yes. My students know of my contempt for shows like this, and
they know of my experience in the Peace Corps. I teach middle school.
If you attempt to be anything less than genuine with middle schoolers,
you get positively eaten alive.
> Are you saying that CBS fabricated the market they did show us?
I am stating that few in Almaty would use such a market.
> Did they design the chicken factory from scratch?
Kazakhstan wants to sell their surplus chickens, and used the series
to shamelessly promote something that has little or nothing to do with
the people of Almaty.
> Did they build that mountain?
The foothills are graves
> Was it an animatronic bird?
No, but the men holding them were costumed fakes
> Are you really sure that carts selling milk simply
> dont exist?
The stands on the streets generally sell smokes, cell phone minutes,
and newspapers featuring naked women holding machine guns on their
covers. I spent three months in Almaty, and never saw anyone selling
glasses of milk on the street (bottled fermented goat's milk, on the
other hand).
> Honestly, Kevin, your ranting sounds to me exactly like people who rant
> anytime a gay character on a show turns out to be a murderer or a minority
> character has less than 100% pure motives.
I suppose I am a founding member of KAAD!* That works on so many levels.
Actually, I found it amusing when Gary Oldman and his band of Kazakh
rebels hijacked Air Force One and took President Harrison Ford
hostage. It amused me immensely. And when the last season of "The West
Wing" featured a war in Kazakhstan, I laughed so hard that fermented
goat's milk shot out my nose (it was the one highlight of that entire
hideous season).
Perhaps, just perhaps, there is a whopping big difference between
fictitious TV shows and reality TV. For example, and this is just one
crazy example, I expect fictitious TV shows to include stuff that has
been made up, whereas I expect reality TV shows to include stuff that
reflects reality.
I would love to continue this, but I have to shower and shave earlier
than usual. Tom reminded me on our website that Shannen Doherty is
back on "90210" this week. After watching "The Amazing Race," it will
be a nice change of pace to view a show with good taste and a high
moral compass.
--
Kevin M. (*Kazakhstani Alliance Against Defamation)
PeterL
On Nov 18, 5:18 pm, "Kevin M." <drunkbastar...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > First of all, Kazakhstanians are not a race. So whatever it is you
> > are objecting to, it's not racism.
>
> There is no such thing as a "Kazakhstanian," but the Kazakh people are
> a very real, very specific race, as are the Uighers, Uzbeks, and the
> half dozen other ethnicities who comprise the bulk of Kazakhstan's
> population.
Please get your terminology straight.
Kevin M.
> Just one point, they may be an ethnic group, but they are not a race.
> Please get your terminology straight.
Ethnicity: the fact or state of belonging to a social group that has a
common national or cultural tradition
Race: a group of people sharing the same culture, history, language,
etc.; an ethnic group
Why the semantic side-argument? Are you implying it is somehow
better/worse/different to be ethnically prejudiced as opposed to
racist? Being a member of the Kazakh race and having Kazakh ethnicity
mean the same thing.
--
Kevin M. (RPCV)
Thomas Allen Heald, Esquire
> common national or cultural tradition
>
> Race: a group of people sharing the same culture, history, language,
> etc.; an ethnic group
>
> Why the semantic side-argument? Are you implying it is somehow
> better/worse/different to be ethnically prejudiced as opposed to
> racist? Being a member of the Kazakh race and having Kazakh ethnicity
> mean the same thing.
Hey now ... lets not be anti-semantic!
Kevin M.
Thanks Tom. I needed the laugh.
--
Kevin M. (RPCV)
Ed Dravecky
> If the show went to America's deep south, to a replica of a small
> plantation, and contestants had to grab their next clue from a bunch
> of African-American slaves picking cotton, would you all point to that
> as a brief taste of American culture?
No slaves were met on their foray into Alabama but while they spent
one night at the US Space and Rocket Center, their daylight hours were
spent climbing a giant rusty office chair and racing go-carts around a
NASCAR track. Then it was off to Mississippi to explore a mobile home
dealership! What a fine, in-depth look at the culture of the New
South.
Cop shows would be boring if most episodes were about paperwork,
routine calls, and dull training seminars. Medical dramas about most
of the doctors I've encountered would be cancelled by the second
commercial break.* I've been to New Zealand and know what people
don't travel from place to place by Zorb. I live in Dallas and not
everything we do involves a frantic cab ride through traffic from the
airport to a deserted park.
I just accept that a show like "The Amazing Race" is only going to
give me a trivial highlights of the differences between that place and
culture and my own.
*My eye doctor's murder by his wife and her identical twin sister was
made into a USA Network movie but he was the exception to the rule,
not a refutation of it.
--
Ed Dravecky III
http://www.fencon.org/
Martin Phipps
countries in the world: there was even a local version of The Amazing
Race in Brazil and The Amazing Race Asia just completed its third
season. The producers for The Amazing Race go to the countries in
question and scout for suitable locations: as Loren said, modern
infrastructure is not what they are looking for. They are looking for
something interesting to show on TV. And as Rick pointed out, the
local people are more than happy to help them out: The Amazing Race is
shown, as I said, all over the world and its ratings beat any travel
show on Discovery or any documentary on National geographic. The same
day that The Amazing Race Asia showed contestants visiting Oman, there
was a full page ad in the Taipei Times advertising holidays in Oman.
You said that dressing up Kazakhs like Mongol warriors was "akin to
dressing up a black man as a spear-chucking cannibal" but that's not
quite true: the Mongols invaded the area in the 13rd century AD and,
according to Wikipedia, it wasn't until the 15th century that "a
distinct Kazakh identity began to emerge among the Turkic tribes, a
process which was consolidated by the mid-16th century with the
appearance of a distinctive Kazakh language, culture, and economy" so
it seems that Kazakhs have a dual Turkic / Mongol heritage. Perhaps
they just wanted to display both. Similarly, both The Amazing Race
Asia and The Amazing Race (proper) have shown "Maori warriors" dressed
in traditional costumes and, seeing as how The Amazing Race Asia did
it first (so I've been told) and that was locally produced, it's hard
to cry racism when Americans then go ahead and do the exact same
thing.
Martin
Martin Phipps
> On Nov 18, 2:15 pm, "Kevin M." <drunkbastar...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Tue, Nov 18, 2008 at 2:01 PM, Maybe <Maybeso...@aol.com> wrote:
> > > I don't think you should declare a show racist based on one episode.
>
> > The show I watched was racist. From what people have said on and off
> > this list, the episode I saw was typical of the format and tone of the
> > series. If true, the series is racist.
>
> Oh, honestly, Kevin, it was about as racist as an episode of "My Name
> is Earl." All Americans aren't redneck morons, and I don't think even
> the simplest viewer came away from TAR with the impression that
> Kazakhstan is full of colorful simple furriners who exist solely for
> our amusement and mockery.
the Philippines and they didn't visit Makati or any of the malls, they
were sent to a farm to blow a field using a carabao. That seems like
a reasonanble comparison to me. And TARA was not only broadcast in
the Philippines but even had Filipino contestants. It might be harder
to cry "racism" when the contestants are selected from the very
countries they visit... and yet the result is the same: there tends to
be a focus on the rural and not on the urban, on the historic rather
than the modern, on the unique rather than the mundane.
Martin
Keith Privett
| As though on cue, to combat Phil's voiceover prologue at the starting line of the next leg contextualized as it discussed Almaty "Founded in ancient times, it was destroyed in the 13th century by Mongols [clip of horse back re-enactors trotting in the hills], only to re-emerge six centuries later as a political capital [capitol building]. Today it is a major industrial center [high rise construction site], with more than one million residents. In the middle of this resilient city, Old Square; this historic plaza was the eighth pit stop in a race around the world." Here's travel guide author Ed Hasbrouck's more balanced view http://hasbrouck.org/blog/archives/001575.html . In a sentence: The racers were alienated because russian is the second language, gouged by taxis because they were presumed to be in the oil industry, and by the way, anyone know a good place in the states for their mutton stew? --- On Fri, 11/21/08, Martin Phipps <martin...@yahoo.com> wrote: |