Tryton website upgrade
Telesight
The Tryton system becomes more and more mature and more extended.
To offer the future user/organization the right information about all the possibilities of the system and to get the promotion of Tryton going, we cannot leave our main promotional tool (the website) versions behind!
Tryton is worth it ...
This does mean, we build on what we have now in the Tryton website and extend and reshuffle what is needed.
To collect requirements and set out a strategy I have started a document:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1rqVZkpLo9JY0Gg8TnyMrv8KFIwNSImzcpQX1_iJNbFI/edit?hl=nl
Let me know what you think about it.
Anthony
Luis Falcon
2011/10/11 Telesight <afjsc...@gmail.com>:
> As mentioned by others in this forum, it seems the time to start thinking
> about "upgrading" the Tryton website.
> The Tryton system becomes more and more mature and more extended.
> To offer the future user/organization the right information about all the
> possibilities of the system and to get the promotion of Tryton going, we
> cannot leave our main promotional tool (the website) versions behind!
>
> Tryton is worth it ...
+1
> This does mean, we build on what we have now in the Tryton website and
> extend and reshuffle what is needed.
>
> To collect requirements and set out a strategy I have started a document:
> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1rqVZkpLo9JY0Gg8TnyMrv8KFIwNSImzcpQX1_iJNbFI/edit?hl=nl
>
Thank you for your work !
> Let me know what you think about it.
>
We'll be working on it.
> Anthony
>
> --
> try...@googlegroups.com mailing list
>
--
Luis Falcón
GNU Health
health.gnu.org
Tejas
- Bolg,
- Forum,
- Multilingual.
- Country Via tracking modules,
- Many of widget integration.
- Easy to create role based users.
- Photo gallery modules,
- Easy to Build Searching and views,
- Navigation and Navigation Menus
- Best SEO Parts
- Events Integrations.
- Admin Menu Integration.
- Easy To integrate Editors
- Easy To integrate E-mail to Post.
- Easy to manage subscription
- Great Security.
- Multiple-Site
- Evaluation/Rating.
- E-commerce.
- Mobile.
- URL-Aliasing. Very Easy Support Multi-lang...to...
Telesight
That is indeed a great CMS. Joomla is also nice, but it lacks a good access rights system.
Anthony
Tejas
Thanks,
Dr. Axel Braun
> That is indeed a great CMS. Joomla is also nice, but it lacks a good access
> rights system.
Joomla has picked up in 1.6 regarding the access rights, but drupal is *the*
nice solution for 'community' sites. If you want ultimate flexibility...take a
look at typo3 (maybe with YAML and if20)
Cheers/Ax
Tejas
Bertrand Chenal
Telesight <afjsc...@gmail.com> a écrit :
Both are overkill IMO. We are currently using sphinx[1] for the
documentation and are happy with it.
--
Bertrand Chenal
B2CK SPRL
Rue de Rotterdam, 4
4000 Liège
Belgium
Email: bertran...@b2ck.com
Website: http://www.b2ck.com/
Telesight
Drupal is relative easy to build with and to manage the site with.
Typo3 is the Rolls Royce under the CMS.
I have worked with both.
Typo3 is not so easy to learn though ...
But let us first concentrate on some content items of the website!
Anthony
Tejas
Telesight
It is not about documentation but about the Tryton website.
But for documentation Sphinx seems interesting, I am interested in it.
If you can place the Sphinx documentation in a website build with a CMS that would be nice.
Anthony
Cédric Krier
> Le Wed, 12 Oct 2011 05:39:18 -0700 (PDT),
> Telesight <afjsc...@gmail.com> a écrit :
>
> > @Maruti
> >
> > That is indeed a great CMS. Joomla is also nice, but it lacks a good
> > access rights system.
> >
> >
> > Anthony
> >
>
> Both are overkill IMO. We are currently using sphinx[1] for the
> documentation and are happy with it.
And also we want static pages.
All this was already discuss (don't find the thread) and the decision was to
use Sphinx with sphinx-contrib [1] and use the same tools as for the
documentation for translations.
[1] https://bitbucket.org/birkenfeld/sphinx-contrib
--
Cédric Krier
B2CK SPRL
Rue de Rotterdam, 4
4000 Liège
Belgium
Tel: +32 472 54 46 59
Email/Jabber: cedric...@b2ck.com
Website: http://www.b2ck.com/
himanshu patel
Tejas
Cédric Krier
> @Anthony
>
> Good we can do that.
>
> I can setup testing server for the same if needed.
>
> Regards
> Himanshu
>
> On Wed, Oct 12, 2011 at 6:51 PM, Telesight <afjsc...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > @BCH
> >
> > It is not about documentation but about the Tryton website.
> >
> > But for documentation Sphinx seems interesting, I am interested in it.
> > If you can place the Sphinx documentation in a website build with a CMS
> > that would be nice.
Please read: https://groups.google.com/d/msg/tryton/-IA9TLq5qag/pv5okIVkr38J
--
Cédric Krier
B2CK SPRL
Rue de Rotterdam, 4
4000 Liège
Belgium
Telesight
Is Sphinx used for the Tryton website? It is a documentation system, as far as I have read.
Static pages? What do you mean with that? In my mind, a website is about dynamic pages and with a CMS you can easily add things without ruining your website layout.
Anthony
Cédric Krier
> Yes, Right documentation is the best impression of good product.
>
> But first we start our presentation to world with tryton website.
>
> Also Most Important to care is the usability , So who will up the site and
> setup it, Please care for end-user's usability.
>
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Oct 12, 2011 at 6:54 PM, himanshu patel <anshp...@gmail.com>wrote:
>
> > @Anthony
> >
> > Good we can do that.
> >
> > I can setup testing server for the same if needed.
> >
> > Regards
> > Himanshu
> >
> > On Wed, Oct 12, 2011 at 6:51 PM, Telesight <afjsc...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> @BCH
> >>
> >> It is not about documentation but about the Tryton website.
> >>
> >> But for documentation Sphinx seems interesting, I am interested in it.
> >> If you can place the Sphinx documentation in a website build with a CMS
> >> that would be nice.
Please read: https://groups.google.com/d/msg/tryton/-IA9TLq5qag/pv5okIVkr38J
--
Cédric Krier
B2CK SPRL
Rue de Rotterdam, 4
4000 Liège
Belgium
Brian Dunnette
> But for documentation Sphinx seems interesting, I am interested in it.
> If you can place the Sphinx documentation in a website build with a
> CMS that would be nice.
>
Sphinx - right now, the (incomplete) files are available in Git (though
we can move this to Mercurial, if that's what people prefer):
https://gitorious.org/tryton-docs/tryton-admin-manual
There's also a service (ReadTheDocs) that builds readable versions of
the documentation, which are viewable here:
http://tryton-administration-manual.readthedocs.org/
As always, contributions are welcome...
-Brian D.
Cédric Krier
> Is Sphinx used for the Tryton website?
No, it is txt2tags as you can see in [1]
> It is a documentation system, as far
> as I have read.
It was it first goal but now it can be used for all kind of usages because at
the end a website is just about serving html pages.
> Static pages? What do you mean with that?
Pages are stored staticly on the webserver.
> In my mind, a website is about
> dynamic pages
No dynamic page is for application.
I don't see why we should have the pages changed every times someone request it.
> and with a CMS you can easily add things without ruining your
> website layout.
CMS is the worst thing ever for a website.
What we want is:
- edit locally with text editor (vim :-)
- test locally (based on Python is prefered)
- versioned (with mercurial)
- low ressource consumption (static pages)
- easy to maintain (text source based)
- easy to translate (using po file)
I don't know any CMS doing this.
[1] http://hg.tryton.org/www.tryton.org/
Jan Grasnick | grasbauer ug
> On 12/10/11 15:00 +0200, Bertrand Chenal wrote:
>> Le Wed, 12 Oct 2011 05:39:18 -0700 (PDT),
>> Telesight<afjsc...@gmail.com> a écrit :
>>
>>> @Maruti
>>>
>>> That is indeed a great CMS. Joomla is also nice, but it lacks a good
>>> access rights system.
>>>
>>>
>>> Anthony
>>>
>> Both are overkill IMO. We are currently using sphinx[1] for the
>> documentation and are happy with it.
> And also we want static pages.
>
> All this was already discuss (don't find the thread) and the decision was to
> use Sphinx with sphinx-contrib [1] and use the same tools as for the
> documentation for translations.
>
With this you can have a connector to include the documentation in the
context of a cms (a django example:
http://pypi.python.org/pypi/django-sphinxdoc/1.0)
BTW: we like to work more practical - so we are working if time permits
on http://cms.grasbauer.com/cms/tryton/. Following the discussion here,
we can update this dummy for a practical workshop at the unconference ....
Jan
I
Nicolas Évrard
That's exactly the kind of setup that I find clever and useful for
the project documentation. I *really* hope this project will take off.
For me the website should just define what is tryton, what are the
goals of tryton and how do we achieve that. No marketing bullshit,
just the needed information for newcomers (from the wide scope : IT
directors want success stories, devs want startup guides) and
community informations (mailing list, IRC channel, howtos, doc, ...).
--
Nicolas Évrard
B2CK SPRL
rue de Rotterdam, 4
4000 Liège
Belgium
Tel: +32 472 54 46 59
E-mail/Jabber: nicolas...@b2ck.com
Website: http://www.b2ck.com/
Nicolas Évrard
>BTW: we like to work more practical - so we are working if time
>permits on http://cms.grasbauer.com/cms/tryton/.
How do you fetch the mailing list latest discussion ?
BTW the rounded corner looks squared when the mouse is over them.
A part from that I like the layout (green might be a better secondary
color but YMMV)
>Following the discussion here, we can update this dummy for a
>practical workshop at the unconference ....
It might be a good idea.
--
Nicolas Évrard
B2CK SPRL
rue de Rotterdam, 4
4000 Liège
Belgium
Tel: +32 472 54 46 59
Telesight
You have made a very nice setup. Looks very interesting.
Thanks for the effort!
Anthony
Cédric Krier
> For me the website should just define what is tryton, what are the
> goals of tryton and how do we achieve that. No marketing bullshit,
> just the needed information for newcomers (from the wide scope : IT
> directors want success stories, devs want startup guides) and
> community informations (mailing list, IRC channel, howtos, doc, ...).
+1 (with a great look)
--
Cédric Krier
B2CK SPRL
Rue de Rotterdam, 4
4000 Liège
Belgium
Tel: +32 472 54 46 59
Rob Martin
That's exactly the kind of setup that I find clever and useful for
There's also a service (ReadTheDocs) that builds readable versions of
the documentation, which are viewable here:
http://tryton-administration-manual.readthedocs.org/
the project documentation. I *really* hope this project will take off.
Cédric Krier
> BTW: we like to work more practical - so we are working if time
> permits on http://cms.grasbauer.com/cms/tryton/. Following the
> discussion here, we can update this dummy for a practical workshop
> at the unconference ....
For me, it looks good. If you can provide a template for the Sphinx engine, it
will be a really good starting point. After that we just need to fill the
content.
Telesight
Thanks for your work. It looks good and if we can use it on the Tryton website and in the Tryton system than this is a great way to do.
Anthony
By the way; this thread is about the Tryton website not the Tryton documentation.
Jan Grasnick | grasbauer ug
> * Jan Grasnick | grasbauer ug [2011-10-12 16:03 +0200]:
>> BTW: we like to work more practical - so we are working if time
>> permits on http://cms.grasbauer.com/cms/tryton/.
>
> How do you fetch the mailing list latest discussion ?
http://groups.google.com/group/tryton/feed/atom_v1_0_topics.xml
> BTW the rounded corner looks squared when the mouse is over them.
some ideas, not a final design...
> A part from that I like the layout (green might be a better secondary
> color but YMMV)
>
Jan
Telesight
With a website you have to define your target group.
If you choose as target group "business owners" (small to medium) than they will be interested in what Tryton can offer them. What will be supported if they choose Tryton?
What processess can they support with Tryton and how to start with using it. What are the costs in money and time etcetera.
If you talk about a target group that exists of developers in a Project than you have to offer other information, in my opinion.
Anthony
zodman
Jan Grasnick | grasbauer ug
For me, it looks good. If you can provide a template for the Sphinx engine, it will be a really good starting point. After that we just need to fill the content.
[1] http://zpt.sourceforge.net/
Nicolas Évrard
As I said, I think we target both:
- business owners that have heard about Tryton and that would like
some informations about the solidity of the project
- developers that need howtos, coding guidelines, documentation,
etc.
- and even maybe people implementing Tryton for their company that
want an in-depth explanation of how they can use Tryton for their
business (but I doubt those people will do everything by
themselves: sooner or later they will probably need some custom
development).
Our website should provide information for those three profiles.
Cédric Krier
The targets are both.
And any way any discussion without real examples are pointless.
So for those who want to be part of the re-design of the website submit work
like:
- template for sphinx (the really first step)
- menu structure:
- text content
etc.
--
Cédric Krier
B2CK SPRL
Rue de Rotterdam, 4
4000 Liège
Belgium
Tel: +32 472 54 46 59
Brian Dunnette
> I just want to say: KISS.
complexity if you don't need its elaborate systems of access control and
user-management...
-Brian D.
Brian Dunnette
> Why do you want access control and user management?
control systems that are used (e.g. Mercurial) provide most of the
access control that's needed already; Drupal would just add more
complexity and confusion, and violate the KISS principle.
In other words, I'm agreeing with you, Cédric. :)
-Brian D.
Telesight
He does not want that!
But that is what Drupal brings with it, when you use it.
Drupal is nice for news sites, where a lot of people are working at. Not our purpose ...
Jan Grasnick | grasbauer ug
years. And I didn't talk about a CMS - only about the templating engine.
ZPT offers the great opportunity to use a concept of "Masterpage" and
filling slots in different ways. A other concept is to define macros,
that are reusable in many places. Don't know if jinja has the same
facilities - will check this in the next days.
Syed Shahrukh Hussain
wrote:
> On 12/10/11 09:55 -0500, Brian Dunnette wrote:
>>
>> > I just want to say: KISS.
>> +1 for simplicity - for instance, Drupal is nice, but certainly can add
>> complexity if you don't need its elaborate systems of access control and
>> user-management...
>
> Why do you want access control and user management?
>
True KISS, and its not feasible to have a system which updates it self
after every 2 years and is not mostly backward compatible.
We here not to learn or promote drupal.
Any system which is build on tryton database model would be gr8. :)
--
Shahrukh Hussain
Telesight
If you have different target groups for the website, than it is a good thing to separate the information by different menu entrances, different colors, or different tabs.
As long as you not mix up technical information with business oriented information ...
Anthony
Tobias Paepke
what is the scope of tryton?
The discussions in the past leads to say tryton is a framework. Not a
complete business solution. For example GNU Health has its own website.
Has this changed?
Tobias
Telesight
That is a good question!
The scope is also important for the content of the website.
Anthony
Telesight
@Cedric
That is just what it makes it more difficult to describe on a website.
Business people want a solution, not a framework in general.
Cédric Krier
> Op woensdag 12 oktober 2011 17:46:45 UTC+2 schreef Cédric Krier het
> volgende:
> > This doesn't mean that we get only one kind of audience and also that you
> > can
> > not use it out-of-the-box.
> Business people want a solution, not a framework in general.
This is because business people doesn't know what to look at. Because
framework means modularity, extensibility etc. and this is really key features
for a business application.
PS: could you clean the email before answering and no need to put @name it is
already set by you email (…schreef Cédric Krier…)
Telesight
This is because business people doesn't know what to look at. Because
framework means modularity, extensibility etc. and this is really key features
for a business application.
So, on the website we need to dedicate a part where we take the business owner by the hand and tell him (read "her") about all the delicious things he can find in the use of Tryton.
Anthony
Jan Grasnick | grasbauer ug
Just a thought: How about giving developers and business experts a place for discussing issues occuring in the implemetation process of tryton?
With such a forum the content of the website grows on its own and people has a warm place during the tiring process of implementation. I know that this can bloat the job of a website representing a technical framework, but it will connect experts to developers to tryton.
Cédric Krier
> Just a thought: How about giving developers and business experts a
> place for discussing issues occuring in the implemetation process of
> tryton?
> With such a forum the content of the website grows on its own and
> I know that this can bloat the job of a website representing a
> technical framework, but it will connect experts to developers to
> tryton.
And where do you think you are talking?
This is the place where people talk :-)
Nicolas Évrard
>>
>> This is because business people doesn't know what to look at. Because
>> framework means modularity, extensibility etc. and this is really
>> key features
>> for a business application.
>>
>>Exactly, business people do not understand what you technically
>>have created, so you have to help them with the right information.
>>Do realise, the business man or woman decide if they introduce
>>Tryton in their organization, not the technical developers.
>>So, on the website we need to dedicate a part where we take the
>>business owner by the hand and tell him (read "her") about all the
>>delicious things he can find in the use of Tryton.
>Good point. So there is the need for a section "use cases/success
>stories" with references. I agree, that there should not be to much
>marketing buzz. But I think, that could be a good help for
>non-technical people involved in the decision-makingprocess.
I think we all agree on this point.
We're waiting for success stories to be sent by people …
>Just a thought: How about giving developers and business experts a
>place for discussing issues occuring in the implemetation process of
>tryton?
I think you are on such a place ;)
Would you prefer another mailing list ? I don't think it would be as
populated as this one, maybe in the future a ML with a more specific
topic might be opened.
--
Nicolas Évrard
B2CK SPRL
rue de Rotterdam, 4
4000 Liège
Belgium
Tel: +32 472 54 46 59
Jan Grasnick | grasbauer ug
And where do you think you are talking? This is the place where people talk :-)
I think you are on such a place ;)
Luis Falcon
> Am 12.10.2011 15:22, schrieb Cédric Krier:
>>
>> On 12/10/11 15:00 +0200, Bertrand Chenal wrote:
>>>
>>> Le Wed, 12 Oct 2011 05:39:18 -0700 (PDT),
>>> Telesight<afjsc...@gmail.com> a écrit :
>>>
>>>> @Maruti
>>>>
>>>> That is indeed a great CMS. Joomla is also nice, but it lacks a good
>>>> access rights system.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Anthony
>>>>
> Why we should use a PHP-CMS? There are good solutions written in Python.
>>>
>>> Both are overkill IMO. We are currently using sphinx[1] for the
>>> documentation and are happy with it.
>>
>> And also we want static pages.
>>
>> All this was already discuss (don't find the thread) and the decision was
>> to
>> use Sphinx with sphinx-contrib [1] and use the same tools as for the
>> documentation for translations.
>>
> With Sphinx you can also Export to other formats - json for example. With
> this you can have a connector to include the documentation in the context of
> a cms (a django example: http://pypi.python.org/pypi/django-sphinxdoc/1.0)
>
> BTW: we like to work more practical - so we are working if time permits on
> http://cms.grasbauer.com/cms/tryton/. Following the discussion here, we can
> update this dummy for a practical workshop at the unconference ....
>
Great ! It looks nice. Thank you Jan .
Hey, developers even have a XXX corner. Only Tryton gives you that ! LOL :-)
http://cms.grasbauer.com/cms/tryton/development/xxx-corner
Seriously, I'm glad to see the community working on such important
factor as the Tryton portal.
Best
> Jan
> I
>
> --
> try...@googlegroups.com mailing list
>
--
Luis Falcón
GNU Health
health.gnu.org
Telesight
I have collected the statements and requirements that pop-up in this website discussion.
You all will find your statement (edited for the purpose ) in the website requirements document.
I hope this document will help in the decision how to give form to the Tryton website.
I have updated the document with your discussion points:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1rqVZkpLo9JY0Gg8TnyMrv8KFIwNSImzcpQX1_iJNbFI/edit?hl=nl
Anthony
himanshu patel
On Thu, 13 Oct 2011 12:53:17 +0500, Telesight <afjsc...@gmail.com> wrote:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1rqVZkpLo9JY0Gg8TnyMrv8KFIwNSImzcpQX1_iJNbFI/edit?hl=nl
Cool
--
Shahrukh Hussain
--
try...@googlegroups.com mailing list
Cédric Krier
> Guys
>
> Here we go...
>
> we will Design several layout for Tryton website. Need community to approve
> layout for the website.
Only layout based on sphinx will be useful.
PS: Please read
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/tryton/-IA9TLq5qag/pv5okIVkr38J
--
Cédric Krier
B2CK SPRL
Rue de Rotterdam, 4
4000 Liège
Belgium
Tel: +32 472 54 46 59
himanshu patel
Telesight
GuysHere we go...we will Design several layout for Tryton website. Need community to approve layout for the website.RegardsHimanshu
See page 6 requirement 7.
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1rqVZkpLo9JY0Gg8TnyMrv8KFIwNSImzcpQX1_iJNbFI/edit?hl=nl
Telesight
I will put it into the document so everybody can judge the options ...
Anthony
Cédric Krier
> Can we start from wireframes,rough layout of pages in jpeg (top 4
> main pages at most).
I think it is pointless because we only want a sphinx template.
So working with other tools will not allow to see if it will work with the
sphinx templating.
Finnaly, we will only choose between only Sphinx template proposals.
Luis Falcon
>
> Can we start from wireframes,rough layout of pages in jpeg (top 4 main pages
> at most).
+1
I believe is good to have an idea of the look & feel. Then we just
need to port this idea to sphinx.
>
> Prior to proceeding with sphix templates..
>
> which i think will be the last step after an html draft is final.
>
>
> --
> Shahrukh Hussain
>
> --
> try...@googlegroups.com mailing list
>
--
Luis Falcon
> On 13/10/11 17:22 +0500, Syed Shahrukh Hussain wrote:
>> Can we start from wireframes,rough layout of pages in jpeg (top 4
>> main pages at most).
>
> I think it is pointless because we only want a sphinx template.
> So working with other tools will not allow to see if it will work with the
> sphinx templating.
>
implementation ?
So, a designer / artist can do a draft and send the idea. Is easier
for them to do so, and then the guys that will work with sphinx will
implement that idea.
> Finnaly, we will only choose between only Sphinx template proposals.
>
> --
> Cédric Krier
>
> B2CK SPRL
> Rue de Rotterdam, 4
> 4000 Liège
> Belgium
> Tel: +32 472 54 46 59
> Email/Jabber: cedric...@b2ck.com
> Website: http://www.b2ck.com/
>
--
Syed Shahrukh Hussain
wrote:
> On 13/10/11 17:22 +0500, Syed Shahrukh Hussain wrote:
>> Can we start from wireframes,rough layout of pages in jpeg (top 4
>> main pages at most).
>
> I think it is pointless because we only want a sphinx template.
> So working with other tools will not allow to see if it will work with
> the
> sphinx templating.
>
> Finnaly, we will only choose between only Sphinx template proposals.
>
@cedric
How come its pointless, making a jpeg is not learning another tool.
You can make it in ms paint as well, its an illustration of how the layout
would look like.
Your asking everyone to learn sphinx, its not goin to work.
once we agree how it may look, one of us can volunteer to convert into
sphinx template.
--
Shahrukh Hussain
Udo Spallek
> On 13/10/11 17:22 +0500, Syed Shahrukh Hussain wrote:
> > Can we start from wireframes,rough layout of pages in jpeg (top 4
> > main pages at most).
> I think it is pointless because we only want a sphinx template.
> So working with other tools will not allow to see if it will work
> with the sphinx templating.
> Finnaly, we will only choose between only Sphinx template proposals.
Maybe this[1] helps to catch the goal from the technical side.
Cheers Udo
[1]
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/1576340/using-sphinx-to-write-personal-websites-and-blogs
--
_____________________________
virtual things
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81375 München
Tel: +49 (89) 710 481 55
Fax: +49 (89) 710 481 56
Cédric Krier
> 2011/10/13 Cédric Krier <cedric...@b2ck.com>:
> > On 13/10/11 17:22 +0500, Syed Shahrukh Hussain wrote:
> >> Can we start from wireframes,rough layout of pages in jpeg (top 4
> >> main pages at most).
> >
> > I think it is pointless because we only want a sphinx template.
> > So working with other tools will not allow to see if it will work with the
> > sphinx templating.
> >
> But could we have a basic picture of the looks prior to the Sphinx
> implementation ?
>
> So, a designer / artist can do a draft and send the idea. Is easier
> for them to do so, and then the guys that will work with sphinx will
> implement that idea.
Forme, 30 people can not talk about the design together.
The only way to get things done, is to have some proposal and we choice in
this lots.
So anyone who want to make a proposal, do it on your side and present a final
result.
I could setup a deadline if it can help?
Cédric Krier
> once we agree how it may look, one of us can volunteer to convert
> into sphinx template.
Sphinx has some limitation so it is not possible to implement every things in
it.
More over, I think the solution must be close to sphinx template engine to get
it simple, clear and easy to maintain.
Jan Grasnick | grasbauer ug
> So anyone who want to make a proposal, do it on your side and present
> a final result. I could setup a deadline if it can help?
Tejas
Tejas
himanshu patel
Nicolas Évrard
>First step is to get Layout only as JPEG.
>Layout design will be compatible to Sphinx Template and obviously user
>friendly.
I must say I don't care how the people create the sphinx template as
long as they arrive to a template that suits our needs.
If they want to hack right now on sphinx: good.
If they want to create a sketch, discuss it and then create the
template: that's nice too.
What we need is templates so that people can choice amongst all of
them.
--
Nicolas Évrard
B2CK SPRL
rue de Rotterdam, 4
4000 Liège
Belgium
Tel: +32 472 54 46 59
Cédric Krier
> We are going to build Tryton protal/website not an documentation system
> thats clear.
>
> That why to taking about Sphinx[documentation generator.]
First, you are doing top-posting which already reduce the value of your arguments.
(see https://groups.google.com/d/msg/tryton/-IA9TLq5qag/pv5okIVkr38J)
Sphinx can do more than just documentation. We already analyzed and it matches
all our requirements (see previous emails).
> Drupal is great CMS for protal and website launching. Even have great
> features which are most of all we have require.
We don't want a CMS.
> We have to build a tryton website where we can use
> widgets,
I don't know what you mean.
> blogs ,
We don't need a blog
> community feeds,
I don't know what it is.
> news,
Can be done with sphinx-plugin.
> forums,
We already have it (you are talking on it :-)
> email,
I guess you mean mailing list and it is merged in the google groups.
> subscription,
I don't know what you mean.
> by language translation.
I have not see any good translation tools in Drupla nor any CMS.
We want po files to translate.
> And File downloading features which all are ready with drupal-
We already have "File downloading" with lighttpd (see
http://downloads.tryton.org/) and also on PyPI.
> Its based on
> what is not important for us. But It hold lots of features thats we require
> most...
>
> [We dont have to spend much time for web site development but have to use
> ready cms which holds ultimate feature which we require....]
There is no web site development needed. We just need a template and after
that fill it with content.
Jan Grasnick | grasbauer ug
> Sphinx can do more than just documentation. We already analyzed and it
> matches all our requirements (see previous emails).
Implementing a lot of extensions will convert sphinx to a CMS - so this
is not the point. Better to say: sphinx is in focus, because the
documentation is the heart of the website and the easiest way to
maintain it is sphinx, am I right?
In a formerly post you wrote, that you want edit the page with vim,
everything in flat files etc. But this will build a barrier for the
future: You wanna write a lot of modules, documented with rst and
exportable as documention to the website. But there could be a less
technical group involved in the tryton community: the project managers
of implementations. They should have also the possibility to contribute
here knowledges to the website - without opening a comandline and
learning markup languages. And finally you don't want to be annoyed with
a lot of questions about how to contribute content to the website.
> I have not see any good translation tools in Drupla nor any CMS. We
> want po files to translate.
This looks strange for me. Changing a single word in the english version
will result in the need to change other languages as well. And for non
technical user is a hassle to translate things like
msgstr ""
" {{li}}{{a class=\"documentation\" "
"href=\"/de/documentation.html\"}}Dokumentation{{/a}}{{/li}}".
So it's hard to acquirer volunteers who translate content on the
website. This should be more simple - without knowing how to implement
an other solution. In our CMS we have choosen this way: a text without a
marker is general (or untranslated), if there is a translation fitting
the browser language the system choose this (like content negotiation).
But this ist technical stuff again ;)
The conclusion of what I wanna say:
The discussion about the content and the target of the website is
fruitful, because we get a more general picture of the expectations of
all the community. The discussion about the technical implementation
should start later. So Anthony's approach to write a document together
is a good step and each other input should be welcome as well.
Cédric Krier
> Am 13.10.2011 16:07, schrieb Cédric Krier:
> >Sphinx can do more than just documentation. We already analyzed
> >and it matches all our requirements (see previous emails).
> >We don't want a CMS.
>
> Implementing a lot of extensions will convert sphinx to a CMS - so
> this is not the point. Better to say: sphinx is in focus, because
> the documentation is the heart of the website and the easiest way to
> maintain it is sphinx, am I right?
Absolutly not.
Sphinx will build a static website and it is a very important feature for us.
A CMS is a bullshit to maintain.
We did not choose sphinx because of the documentation but because it is the
best tool we find that match our requirements.
> In a formerly post you wrote, that you want edit the page with vim,
> everything in flat files etc. But this will build a barrier for the
> future: You wanna write a lot of modules, documented with rst and
> exportable as documention to the website.
Yes rst is a great format because *anybody* can use it.
> But there could be a less
> technical group involved in the tryton community: the project
> managers of implementations. They should have also the possibility
> to contribute here knowledges to the website - without opening a
> comandline and learning markup languages.
If someone want to write a document for the website and he can not do it in
RST, I prefer that he doesn't do it because he will lose the time of
everybody.
> And finally you don't want
> to be annoyed with a lot of questions about how to contribute
> content to the website.
Don't care. It will be pretty simple to explain:
- fetch the source here
- submit a patch like explain in HowtoContribute.
> >I have not see any good translation tools in Drupla nor any CMS.
> >We want po files to translate.
> This looks strange for me. Changing a single word in the english
> version will result in the need to change other languages as well.
> And for non technical user is a hassle to translate things like
>
> msgstr ""
> " {{li}}{{a class=\"documentation\" "
> "href=\"/de/documentation.html\"}}Dokumentation{{/a}}{{/li}}".
That's why we want to switch from rst2tag to Sphinx.
Sphinx is in rst and it will give such po file:
http://hg.tryton.org/tryton/file/tip/doc/usage.pot
> So it's hard to acquirer volunteers who translate content on the
> website. This should be more simple - without knowing how to
> implement an other solution. In our CMS we have choosen this way: a
> text without a marker is general (or untranslated), if there is a
> translation fitting the browser language the system choose this
> (like content negotiation). But this ist technical stuff again ;)
The po way is pretty comment and it works.
I don't understand your explaination.
Jan Grasnick | grasbauer ug
>> So it's hard to acquirer volunteers who translate content on the
>> website. This should be more simple - without knowing how to
>> implement an other solution. In our CMS we have choosen this way: a
>> text without a marker is general (or untranslated), if there is a
>> translation fitting the browser language the system choose this
>> (like content negotiation). But this ist technical stuff again ;)
> The po way is pretty comment and it works.
> I don't understand your explaination.
>
http://httpd.apache.org/docs/2.0/content-negotiation.html
We chosed a way like this in our CMS (implemented a bit different) and
are using the po only for common sentences in the backend and some
frequently used widgets.
We have chosen this way, because its more easy for a translator if he
has the whole context in mind and right before his eyes. This only as a
explanation for what I meant.
Leogabriel
I leave here a proposal for the update of the website of tryton.
http://www.tryton.com.ar/index.png
http://www.tryton.com.ar/pagina.png
thanks
Leonardo G. D.
thymbr@
Converging Ideas for Emerging Realities
www.thymbra.com
Bertrand Chenal
Leogabriel <leonard...@gmail.com> a écrit :
> Hello
> I leave here a proposal for the update of the website of tryton.
>
> http://www.tryton.com.ar/index.png
> http://www.tryton.com.ar/pagina.png
It looks nice. I was just thinking that orange is a good secondary
color.
--
Bertrand Chenal
B2CK SPRL
Rue de Rotterdam, 4
4000 Liège
Belgium
Email: bertran...@b2ck.com
Website: http://www.b2ck.com/
Cédric Krier
> Le Thu, 13 Oct 2011 13:51:41 -0700 (PDT),
> Leogabriel <leonard...@gmail.com> a écrit :
>
> > Hello
> > I leave here a proposal for the update of the website of tryton.
> >
> > http://www.tryton.com.ar/index.png
> > http://www.tryton.com.ar/pagina.png
>
> It looks nice. I was just thinking that orange is a good secondary
> color.
I think it is a bad idea to introduce a new color in the palet of Tryton.
Our image only starts to be known that we should not change it.
--
Cédric Krier
B2CK SPRL
Rue de Rotterdam, 4
4000 Liège
Belgium
Luis Falcon
> Hello
> I leave here a proposal for the update of the website of tryton.
>
> http://www.tryton.com.ar/index.png
> http://www.tryton.com.ar/pagina.png
>
> thanks
>
>
> Leonardo G. D.
> thymbr@
> Converging Ideas for Emerging Realities
> www.thymbra.com
>
> --
> try...@googlegroups.com mailing list
Telesight
Hello
I leave here a proposal for the update of the website of tryton.
http://www.tryton.com.ar/index.png
http://www.tryton.com.ar/pagina.png
thanks
Leonardo G. D.
Leonardo,
Thank you for your work. With real examples we can discuss the matter much better!
Is it possible to make one with 3 columns (2 text columns left)? That way we get an example of the column layout differences.
As colors: We now have black (which is no color but the absence of light) and white (which is a mix of all colors ;-)
We need to keep the concept, if a supporting colors destroys the concept? I do not know for now.
Anthony
Tejas
Antonio Beamud Montero
> 2011/10/13 Leogabriel<leonard...@gmail.com>:
>> Hello
>> I leave here a proposal for the update of the website of tryton.
>>
>> http://www.tryton.com.ar/index.png
>> http://www.tryton.com.ar/pagina.png
>>
> +1 ;-)
+1
Bertrand Chenal
Cédric Krier <cedric...@b2ck.com> a écrit :
>
> I think it is a bad idea to introduce a new color in the palet of
There is already orange on the current website, so we are not
introducing anything.
> Tryton. Our image only starts to be known that we should not change
> it.
>
It's your point of view. :)
--
Bertrand Chenal
B2CK SPRL
Rue de Rotterdam, 4
4000 Liège
Belgium
Cédric Krier
> Le Thu, 13 Oct 2011 23:49:22 +0200,
> Cédric Krier <cedric...@b2ck.com> a écrit :
> >
> > I think it is a bad idea to introduce a new color in the palet of
>
> There is already orange on the current website, so we are not
> introducing anything.
I'm not against new colors but only when it is used for a specific reason.
Here, the new colors is added for everywhere so it becomes part of the image
of Tryton (and this new color is not in the logo nor in the software etc.).
> > Tryton. Our image only starts to be known that we should not change
> > it.
> >
>
> It's your point of view. :)
So what is your point of view about the knownledge of Tryton's image?
--
Cédric Krier
B2CK SPRL
Rue de Rotterdam, 4
4000 Liège
Belgium
Telesight
I'm not against new colors but only when it is used for a specific reason.
Here, the new colors is added for everywhere so it becomes part of the image
of Tryton (and this new color is not in the logo nor in the software etc.).
You are completely correct Cedric, a new color must serve something: highlight things, stress things or simply give the "image" a special impression. That is why I asked the questions in
the paragraph "Tryton website design goal" point 2 en 3: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1rqVZkpLo9JY0Gg8TnyMrv8KFIwNSImzcpQX1_iJNbFI/edit?hl=nl
That means that you have to carry that supporting color to others parts of your project too. This does not mean you have to do this immediately, but you can do it over time if you wish ...
Anthony
Bertrand Chenal
Cédric Krier <cedric...@b2ck.com> a écrit :
> > > Tryton. Our image only starts to be known that we should not
> > > change it.
> > >
> >
> > It's your point of view. :)
>
> So what is your point of view about the knownledge of Tryton's image?
I have no point of view about what people know about Tryton, but a
point of view about the evolution of the image of Tryton.
Most if not all companies/products have changed (or will change) their
image. First, this brings some freshness (and shows to people that there
is some activity) and sometimes the change is made to fix issues with
old design (nobody is perfect).
Simple example: the gradient at the bottom of the logo. IMO it looks
already old-fashioned (gradient are so '09 ...) and moreover it can
not be printed reliably (on T-shirts for example), so it's not
consistent.
Still in my opinion, one of the important principle that we follow since
day one in Tryton is that we try hard to develop code that is designed
to stay, but at the same time we are not afraid of change if we see it
as an improvement. So, I think we should have the same approach with
the image of Tryton.
--
Bertrand Chenal
B2CK SPRL
Rue de Rotterdam, 4
4000 Liège
Belgium
Cédric Krier
> Le Fri, 14 Oct 2011 11:48:46 +0200,
> Cédric Krier <cedric...@b2ck.com> a écrit :
>
> > > > Tryton. Our image only starts to be known that we should not
> > > > change it.
> > > >
> > >
> > > It's your point of view. :)
> >
> > So what is your point of view about the knownledge of Tryton's image?
>
> I have no point of view about what people know about Tryton, but a
> point of view about the evolution of the image of Tryton.
>
> Most if not all companies/products have changed (or will change) their
> image.
There is two factors that generates those changes:
- Trying to make forget bad image
- An new direction for the company/product
I think we are in any of both cases.
> First, this brings some freshness (and shows to people that there
> is some activity)
If it is the only way for a project to show it is living than it is in really
bad shape. This will be the worst cases (first point of the two factors).
> and sometimes the change is made to fix issues with
> old design (nobody is perfect).
You can fix design issue but keep the same spirit.
> Simple example: the gradient at the bottom of the logo. IMO it looks
> already old-fashioned (gradient are so '09 ...)
So for you the website must change every 2 years.
I really prefer to spend times to improve the software than having such boring
discussion on the website design.
> and moreover it can
> not be printed reliably (on T-shirts for example), so it's not
> consistent.
There is no issue to have declination of the same logo depeding of the
support. And removing this gradient is not really a change of the image of
Tryton but just a fix. (Completly different than adding a new color).
> Still in my opinion, one of the important principle that we follow since
> day one in Tryton is that we try hard to develop code that is designed
> to stay,
The same for the image.
> but at the same time we are not afraid of change if we see it
> as an improvement. So, I think we should have the same approach with
> the image of Tryton.
Except that the code is visible only to the developpers.
Moreover when such changes happen, we change all the code to work with the new
design because we can master the code. But talking about external image, it is
completly different, we don't master it. We already have some issues with some
guys using old/wrong logo, wrong name (Tryton ERP) etc.
Changing the image of the project must be done with great caution.
I don't want that the Tryton project has the image (like some others follow my
eyes) to change everything on each releases.
Having a stable image is also a good message sent outside that we are stable
and reliable (like the release policy, bugfix backport…)
--
Cédric Krier
B2CK SPRL
Rue de Rotterdam, 4
4000 Liège
Belgium
Luis Falcon
2011/10/14 Cédric Krier <cedric...@b2ck.com>:
I don't think is boring. It's quite productive. A project is much more
than just coding. It's about a multi-disciplinary team that offer
their talents.
So, programmers are good at coding, but might not be good at web
design. That's why I asked Leonardo to give us a hand in this.
Artists / designers are good at making a website looking good. They
know how to combine colors and layouts to make it look great. Then we
can just map the idea to the sphinx platform or whatever you want.
People expressed a positive reaction to Leonardo's sketch. I think we
can and should have several more, so we can discuss which look and
feel is the best. If not, we should go with this one. I believe we are
keeping the spirit of Tryton with this page, and definitely will
improve the looks.
--
Korbinian Preisler
> >
> > So for you the website must change every 2 years.
> > I really prefer to spend times to improve the software than having such boring
> > discussion on the website design.
>
> I don't think is boring. It's quite productive. A project is much more
> than just coding. It's about a multi-disciplinary team that offer
> their talents.
+1
>
> Artists / designers are good at making a website looking good. They
> know how to combine colors and layouts to make it look great. Then we
> can just map the idea to the sphinx platform or whatever you want.
+1
>
> People expressed a positive reaction to Leonardo's sketch. I think we
> can and should have several more, so we can discuss which look and
> feel is the best. If not, we should go with this one. I believe we are
> keeping the spirit of Tryton with this page, and definitely will
> improve the looks.
+1
--
Korbinian Preisler
____________________________________
virtual things
Preisler & Spallek GbR
Munich - Aix-la-Chapelle
Windeckstr. 77
81375 Munich - Germany
Cédric Krier
> CMS is the worst thing ever for a website.
> What we want is:
>
> - edit locally with text editor (vim :-)
> - test locally (based on Python is prefered)
> - versioned (with mercurial)
> - low ressource consumption (static pages)
> - easy to maintain (text source based)
> - easy to translate (using po file)
I forget to say:
- small page size (current 1926 bytes)
- clean HTML
- accessible in text mode
- browsable without js
- W3C compliant
- under CC-by-sa-3
Bertrand Chenal
Cédric Krier <cedric...@b2ck.com> a écrit :
> There is two factors that generates those changes:
>
> - Trying to make forget bad image
> - An new direction for the company/product
>
> I think we are in any of both cases.
I think this is a simplistic, black-and-white (hehe) vision of the
subject.
> > First, this brings some freshness (and shows to people that there
> > is some activity)
>
> If it is the only way for a project to show it is living
No, it is not. The image of Tryton must reflect his nature, and the
project is evolving, and so does the image.
> than it is
> in really bad shape. This will be the worst cases (first point of the
> two factors).
>
> > and sometimes the change is made to fix issues with
> > old design (nobody is perfect).
>
> You can fix design issue but keep the same spirit.
Nobody want to change the logo with a pink unicorn. We are talking
about a subtle gradient and a secondary color. Moreover, I think that
the Leonardo proposal follows the current spirit (maybe too much on some
points).
> > Simple example: the gradient at the bottom of the logo. IMO it looks
> > already old-fashioned (gradient are so '09 ...)
>
> So for you the website must change every 2 years.
No it's just an early mistake that can be fixed easily. And I would like
to keep the result for a long time.
> I really prefer to spend times to improve the software than having
> such boring discussion on the website design.
I find talking about design and image rather exciting. It's your
right to find it boring, but it shouldn't be an excuse to reject any new
idea on the subject.
> > but at the same time we are not afraid of change if we see it
> > as an improvement. So, I think we should have the same approach with
> > the image of Tryton.
>
> Except that the code is visible only to the developpers.
What about the new search widget? It is quite a radical change.
> Moreover when such changes happen, we change all the code to work
> with the new design because we can master the code. But talking about
> external image, it is completly different, we don't master it. We
> already have some issues with some guys using old/wrong logo, wrong
> name (Tryton ERP) etc. Changing the image of the project must be done
> with great caution.
1) Yes, this is why it's important to talk about it.
2) We shouldn't avoid of doing stuffs because they are difficult.
> I don't want that the Tryton project has the
> image (like some others follow my eyes) to change everything on each
> releases. Having a stable image is also a good message sent outside
> that we are stable and reliable (like the release policy, bugfix
> backport…)
Come on, we are talking about little modifications, nobody will think
that Tryton is unreliable or that we try to hide a bad image because of
them.
--
Bertrand Chenal
B2CK SPRL
Rue de Rotterdam, 4
4000 Liège
Belgium
Cédric Krier
> Le Fri, 14 Oct 2011 12:51:33 +0200,
> Cédric Krier <cedric...@b2ck.com> a écrit :
> > > is some activity)
> >
> > If it is the only way for a project to show it is living
>
> No, it is not. The image of Tryton must reflect his nature, and the
> project is evolving, and so does the image.
For me the project did not change since the begining. I mean the goals, the
organisation, the process are still the same.
> > I really prefer to spend times to improve the software than having
> > such boring discussion on the website design.
>
> I find talking about design and image rather exciting. It's your
> right to find it boring, but it shouldn't be an excuse to reject any new
> idea on the subject.
I don't reject new ideas. As I already said I'm not against fixing Tryton's
image as soon as it is just a fix. So removing the gradient seems logical as
we have too much support on which it doesn't work.
But I'm against big change in the Tryton's image without good reason.
>
> > > but at the same time we are not afraid of change if we see it
> > > as an improvement. So, I think we should have the same approach with
> > > the image of Tryton.
> >
> > Except that the code is visible only to the developpers.
>
> What about the new search widget? It is quite a radical change.
No, it doesn't change the way the search works.
The proof is that we generate still the same domain.
> > Moreover when such changes happen, we change all the code to work
> > with the new design because we can master the code. But talking about
> > external image, it is completly different, we don't master it. We
> > already have some issues with some guys using old/wrong logo, wrong
> > name (Tryton ERP) etc. Changing the image of the project must be done
> > with great caution.
>
> 1) Yes, this is why it's important to talk about it.
Of course, so why do you want to change the Tryton's visual image to include a
new color?
> 2) We shouldn't avoid of doing stuffs because they are difficult.
Especially, I fight because it is too easy to change. It is more difficult to
have a clear vision for the long term and it is what I want to have for
Tryton.
> > I don't want that the Tryton project has the
> > image (like some others follow my eyes) to change everything on each
> > releases. Having a stable image is also a good message sent outside
> > that we are stable and reliable (like the release policy, bugfix
> > backport…)
>
> Come on, we are talking about little modifications, nobody will think
> that Tryton is unreliable or that we try to hide a bad image because of
> them.
I think you are underestimate the impact of adding a new color to the visual
image of Tryton.
Perhaps I'm not clear enought about my concern on a new color.
I'm not against having other colors in the Tryton website, we already got
somes. For example the news box for RSS feeds but it is different of the one
of "Tryton Store". This is right because they have different semantic/purpose.
But the current proposal adds a new color all over the website (if I
understand it well), so such design makes this color full part of the visual
image of Tryton.
--
Cédric Krier
B2CK SPRL
Rue de Rotterdam, 4
4000 Liège
Belgium
lists.j...@symetrie.com
Le 13 oct. 2011 à 22:51, Leogabriel a écrit :
> http://www.tryton.com.ar/index.png
> http://www.tryton.com.ar/pagina.png
One point about languages links: though double letter codes are not pretty, country flags are colored but quite unprecise.
Why indeed have a british flag to symbolize english speaking people (United States, Canada, India, New Zealand, etc.) or the french flag for french speaking people (what about Belgic, Luxembourg, Swiss, Quebec...)?
Isn't it better to have the whole language word in its language? i.e. : english, français, Deutsch, italiano, Հայերէն... Could be placed in tabs or in a list.
Jean-Christophe Michel
--
Symétrie
livres et partitions, édition multimédia
30 rue Jean-Baptiste Say
69001 LYON (FRANCE)
tél +33 (0)478 29 52 14
fax +33 (0)478 30 01 11
web www.symetrie.com
Cédric Krier
> Hi,
>
>
> Le 13 oct. 2011 à 22:51, Leogabriel a écrit :
> > http://www.tryton.com.ar/index.png
> > http://www.tryton.com.ar/pagina.png
>
> One point about languages links: though double letter codes are not pretty, country flags are colored but quite unprecise.
> Why indeed have a british flag to symbolize english speaking people (United States, Canada, India, New Zealand, etc.) or the french flag for french speaking people (what about Belgic, Luxembourg, Swiss, Quebec...)?
> Isn't it better to have the whole language word in its language? i.e. : english, français, Deutsch, italiano, Հայերէն... Could be placed in tabs or in a list.
I think we should apply the same rule as in the database creation from the
client "The langue name in its own language".
Telesight
Especially, I fight because it is too easy to change. It is more difficult to
have a clear vision for the long term and it is what I want to have for
Tryton.
I think you are underestimate the impact of adding a new color to the visual
image of Tryton.
Perhaps I'm not clear enought about my concern on a new color.
I'm not against having other colors in the Tryton website, we already got
somes. For example the news box for RSS feeds but it is different of the one
of "Tryton Store". This is right because they have different semantic/purpose.
But the current proposal adds a new color all over the website (if I
understand it well), so such design makes this color full part of the visual
image of Tryton.
I also do like standardization and a long term vision but that does not mean that you can change things step by step and carefully watch pitfalls.
But as a community we have to mention these risks and write them down so we can step by step take action, with these risks in our minds.
That is why I collect the ideas and requirements in a document, so I can reread them in a summarized form ( to read the whole thread again, that is what I find boring ... ;-)
Anthony
Telesight
I forget to say:
- small page size (current 1926 bytes)
- clean HTML
- accessible in text mode
- browsable without js
- W3C compliant
- under CC-by-sa-3
I have added them. What do you mean with the license CC-by-sa-3? For what; the tool or the website?
Anthony
Telesight
I leave here a proposal for the update of the website of tryton.
http://www.tryton.com.ar/index.png
http://www.tryton.com.ar/pagina.png
thanks
Leonardo G. D.
I have added them to the requirements document so we can compare and write remarks about the templates:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1rqVZkpLo9JY0Gg8TnyMrv8KFIwNSImzcpQX1_iJNbFI/edit?hl=nl
Anthony