Highlighting, cursor, backspace and delete comments

[Mark Shainblum]

Hi guys,

I've been using Trelby for a few weeks now, and though I generally find it very intuitive and easy to use, I've got to say that I'm constantly butting my head up against the way you've implemented the cursor and related functions like highlighting and deleting text.

1) I know the "highlighting the last character" square cursor is still standard in some apps and non-Windows OS's. In fact, I remember having cursors like this on my old 8-bit Atari 130XE. But, now, after almost 20 years of using Windows, I'm accustomed to the standard line cursor and I get befuddled. I'm never sure where the insert point is, and I'm constantly deleting the wrong character or inserting characters in the wrong place.

2) I have the same problem with the way Trelby highlights blocks of text. For one, the highlight effect is just too light and subtle, under certain lighting conditions I can't see it at all. Secondly, it keeps befuddling my learned instincts. I instinctively expect to be able to highlight a block of text and then type destructively right over it, but I keep being called up short when Trelby won't do that. (I also expect to be able to click multiple times on a word to highlight it, though that's not such a big deal.)

I'm not criticizing your implementation nor the philosophy behind it, there's a lot of merit to the way you've done it. There's also a lot of merit to the Dvorak keyboard, but I don't use it because I just can't get used to it.

Just a thought!

Best,

Mark

Mark Shainblum
Writing|Editing|Creativity
Montreal, Quebec, Canada

www.northguard.com/mbs
www.shainblum.com

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[Anil Gulecha]

On Tue, Mar 20, 2012 at 7:35 PM, Mark Shainblum <shai...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi guys,
>
> I've been using Trelby for a few weeks now, and though I generally find it
> very intuitive and easy to use, I've got to say that I'm constantly butting
> my head up against the way you've implemented the cursor and related
> functions like highlighting and deleting text.
>
> 1) I know the "highlighting the last character" square cursor is still
> standard in some apps and non-Windows OS's.

Yes, Trelby currently lacks this. Filed
https://github.com/oskusalerma/trelby/issues/136

A thinner cursor option would be trivial to add. A blinking cursor
would need the addition of a timer, and some optimizations to screen
update code. Would adding just a thin cursor make things easier for
you.. or is blinking cursor a requirement?

> 2) I have the same problem with the way Trelby highlights blocks of text.
> For one, the highlight effect is just too light and subtle, under certain
> lighting conditions I can't see it at all.

This is easy to fix. Under File> Settings >Change >Colors, change to
selection color to something darker.

If the default isn't good on some monitors, we may need to change the
default also too something darker.

> Secondly, it keeps befuddling my
> learned instincts. I instinctively expect to be able to highlight a block of
> text and then type destructively right over it, but I keep being called up
> short when Trelby won't do that. (I also expect to be able to click multiple
> times on a word to highlight it, though that's not such a big deal.)
>

Filed https://github.com/oskusalerma/trelby/issues/137

> I'm not criticizing your implementation nor the philosophy behind it,
> there's a lot of merit to the way you've done it. There's also a lot of
> merit to the Dvorak keyboard, but I don't use it because I just can't get
> used to it.
>

Yup, thanks. Usability suggestions are very welcome. Many of my recent
fixes have been to change Trelby's default UI behavior to be similar
to any other text editor.

~Anil

[Anil Gulecha]

This was simple enough to implement:
Patch : https://github.com/oskusalerma/trelby/pull/138/files

Osku: Why exactly do we have separate keyboard selection behaviour
(using arrow keys to extend selection).. is it because that's how it
was implemented? I would like to change that as well (to
shift+arrowkeys) just like with any other editor.

~Anil

[Mark Shainblum]

Hey Anil,

Thanks for this!

A non-blinking thin cursor that appears after the character would be okay, I think. Adding the blinking would be a good long-term goal, but just having a standard insertion point would go a long way towards resolving my problem. That said, perhaps the cursor might need to be a little bolder than the standard Windows cursor to make up for the lack of blinking. Is that possible?

I'm assuming that you can't easily implement an "I-beam" mouse pointer either, right? I didn't even realize I was missing it until I stopped and concentrated on the Gmail interface as I type this message.

I will change the highlight colours, thanks! I will say that I'm using Trelby on two totally different computers (an emachines laptop and a Dell desktop) and on both monitors the highlighting is just too light. I think you probably want to make the default colour at least one shade darker.

Thanks!

Mark

[Mark Shainblum]

Ha! I didn't even realize that you could use the arrow keys to extend the selection.

[Anil Gulecha]

Hi,

Thin cursor patch also in the queue.

Screenshot of new cursor:
https://github.com/oskusalerma/trelby/issues/136#issuecomment-4598683

~Anil

[Osku Salerma]

Hi,

I don't really understand what your question is I'm afraid. "separate keyboard selection behavior": separate from what? And when you say you would like to implement shift+arrowkeys for selection, I don't know what you mean either, since we already support that.

On Tue, Mar 20, 2012 at 14:38, Anil Gulecha <anil....@gmail.com> wrote:

Osku: Why exactly do we have separate keyboard selection behaviour
(using arrow keys to extend selection).. is it because that's how it
was implemented? I would like to change that as well (to
shift+arrowkeys) just like with any other editor.

~Anil

--
Osku Salerma

[Osku Salerma]

We'll change the default selection color to be a bit darker.

--
Osku Salerma

[Anil Gulecha]

On Wed, Mar 21, 2012 at 4:53 AM, Osku Salerma <osku.s...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I don't really understand what your question is I'm afraid. "separate
> keyboard selection behavior": separate from what? And when you say you would
> like to implement shift+arrowkeys for selection, I don't know what you mean
> either, since we already support that.
>

Err.. I meant different selection behavior. From the replies on the
bug, I gather it was because this is also the behavior on emacs? (I
haven't used it, being a steadfast vim user).

On the latter, I was being thickheaded. Of course we already support
that, and I use it all the time.

~Anil

[Zenoian]

Hi, I am new to Trelby,  I just want to say, albeit five years after these comments made about the cursor, I have the same problem.  My eyes, see the thin line fine. The block is confusing, and  in terms of 'time' and  unnecessary mistakes,  Going back to fix, and seeking an accurate entry point. is an unnecessary drain on creative thought.

One small thing, the email address for this group is not one I use a lot. How co I change it?

I noticed you play the blues..  me also.:)

Best to all,

Z