Travelling to Spain first time
aliso...@sbcglobal.net
late spring or early fall. We'd like to go for 10-12 days and visit 3
or 4 places. He insists on Barcelona for at least 3 days. I'd like to
go to Seville, Ronda, and maybe Nerja or Granada. We like to
incorporate a little ocean time when we travel since we don't live near
one. Have decided on Southern Spain but if anyone insists that
northern spain is the way to go we could be persuaded.
We are young, active, like to walk, long day hikes are nice, and we
like good wine and good regional food (we'll try anything). We might
even take a dancing lesson or two.
Any suggestions for an itinerary, good places to stay? I'd love some
help.
Alison
brian glynn
Do you Yahoo!?
Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail.
Chav
I recomend Barcelona and others routes in andalucia, the Basque country
is a good option, all northen spain is really nice.
For itineries and city guides you can see spanishpromotions.com,
tourism and travel emagazine with lot of current news, reports, images
and videos about all spain and good places to stay.
We usually read it.
Good luck
Alison Hyde
Roger Warwick
Don't worry about speaking Catalan - while it is the main language in
Catalonia, all inhabitants also speak Castillian Spanish and will do
so to tourists, etc.
You haven't mentioned what time of year you're going to be in Spain.
This could be important for the beach time you said you wanted. The
water in the south of Spain tends to be a few degrees cooler than the
Mediterranean east coast of Spain. It's fine in summer, but if you're
coming in Spring or Autumn I would recommend the much warmer waters of
the Alicante or Murcia coasts.
By the way, Valencia will be holding the America's Cup next year - the
sailing competition.
Roger.
Alison Hyde
Alison,
Don't worry about speaking Catalan - while it is the main language in
Catalonia, all inhabitants also speak Castillian Spanish and will do
so to tourists, etc.
You haven't mentioned what time of year you're going to be in Spain.
This could be important for the beach time you said you wanted. The
water in the south of Spain tends to be a few degrees cooler than the
Mediterranean east coast of Spain. It's fine in summer, but if you're
coming in Spring or Autumn I would recommend the much warmer waters of
the Alicante or Murcia coasts.
By the way, Valencia will be holding the America's Cup next year - the
sailing competition.
Roger.
On 25/09/06, Alison Hyde wrote:
> Brian,
>
> Thanks for the advice, I was considering Valencia as well- hear they are
> hosting the world cup next year. I speak a little Spanish but I am a little
> worried about the Catalan. Unfortunately, my husband is not much on
> classical music and I'm sure he would be quite bored with Rodrigo's city.
>
> Thanks for the info on the Peniscola, I had not heard of it. looks
> interesting.
>
>
> Alison
>
Roger Warwick
no problem there.
If you've decided on also visiting Seville, Ronda and Granada then
there won't be much time for stopping elsewhere like Valencia, unless
you make it a day-trip from your Barcelona base.
Will you be flying from Barcelona to Seville or Granada? That would be
my choice, because otherwise you'll be wasting the best part of a day
just on that journey.
Roger.
lang...@verizon.net
My husband, 21 year old son and I went to Spain for the first time last May. You are in for quite a treat. We went to Madrid, Cordoba, Seville, Costa del Sol and Barcelona.
For Seville, let me make a few recommendations. First, the hotel where we stayed was just beautiful -- small, quaint and friendly. A little on the expensive side but we thought well worth it. You really knew you were in Seville! Here is the info if you would like to check it out. Convento de la Gloria www.hotelconventolagloria.com Phone: 954 293 670
Second, we took a tour with Conception Delgado. Only had time for one but would definitely have done all that she offered if we were able. She is wonderful and I highly recommend her very small group tour. There were only 7 of us. We got great information and found places that we probably would not have seen. Seville Walking Tours" in...@sevillawalkingtours.com.
And finally there is no where else to see flamenco! Try the show at Casa de la Memoria de Al-Andalus. It is located right in the historic district of Barrio de Santa Cruz. telephone 954-560-670. You should make reservations as soon as you get to Spain or to Seville because the fill up early AND you should get there early to get good seats. It is a small intimate flamenco show. There, of course, is also flamenco all over in the evenings, just stop in any place you hear singing and laughter.
In Granada I would highly recommend taking a private tour of the Alhambra. We would have spent hours just wandering around and although this is quite breathtaking, you would not really get the history of the place and understand the development of this wonder. We hired a private guide recommended in the Rick Steves guide book. I can not remember his name off hand but he was amazing. He is a native of Granada and you could tell he loved his city. Not only was he knowledgeable, he shared stories, again, that we would not have gotten if we had gone on our own. To us, traveling such a long distance, we truly wanted to learn the history of these major sites. Unfortunately my books are packed away (we are getting ready for a move) but if you go to the library and get the book I could confirm his name for you.
We did not stay in Granada but it does have perhaps the most famous parador in all of Spain. When we were there we were not able to get reservations. That was going to be our one big splurge. You might want to check it out.
BARCELONA -- oh, what a wonderful city! What art!! I can not recommend the hotel we stayed in here. It was dreadful! But, I can recommend the museums. They are unbelievable. We also did the Picasso walking tour through the TI office. A surprisingly great tour at a very reasonable price!! Just ask at your hotel where the nearest TI office is located and they can direct you where to get the tours. Many are offered and I understand all are quite good. They also give you a pass to the museum which means you do not have to wait in line. A big bonus on some days.
Although I have recommended tours, and we loved them, we also did most of our exploring on our own. Spain is a very friendly country and the people will help. The best memories are of the "little" things found along the way and the funny experiences that happen when least expected.
I can't wait to go back to Spain. Have a wonderful time. If I can help with anything else I will be happy to do so. I got wonderful help from this group when I went so will try to offer some assistance back to others. Terri
=====================
From: Alison Hyde <aliso...@sbcglobal.net>
Date: 2006/09/25 Mon AM 07:31:57 CDT
To: trave...@googlegroups.com
Subject: [travelspain] Re: Travelling to Spain first time
Brian, Thanks for the advice, I was considering Valencia as well- hear they are hosting the world cup next year. I speak a little Spanish but I am a little worried about the Catalan. Unfortunately, my husband is not much on classical music and I'm sure he would be quite bored with Rodrigo's city. Thanks for the info on the Peniscola, I had not heard of it. looks interesting. Alison
brian glynn <brian...@yahoo.com> wrote: Alison, I would skip Marbella, much too much like a bad version of Miami. Barcelona is very different from the rest of Spain. It is more like a small version of NYC or Chicago with better architecture. Don't go around Easter. Barcelona is swamped by drunk college kids from all overr the place.</DIV> <DIV>Valencia is smaller and has a nicer fell to me. Xativa, just north of Valencia is a fairly small village, but lovely. There is a lovely castle that overlooks the town and the whole region. You can have lunch and a glass of wine at the castle. I find it very charming and not touristy.</DIV> <DIV>Aranjuez, going north towards Madrid is a lovely little city. Get a copy of the Concerto de Aranjuez and it will inspire you to visit this location.</DIV> <DIV>There are some beautiful beaches between Valencia and Barcelona that aren't too touristy. Peniscola de la Plana is on a peninsula, is quite spectacular as peninsular casles go and there used to be a wonderful beach there. If you don't speak spanish I suggest you buy one of the new interactive cd rom programs and learn as much as possible. It will make the trip much more exciting. Good luck, Brian
aliso...@sbcglobal.net wrote:
My husband and I are planning a trip to Spain next year. It will be
late spring or early fall. We'd like to go for 10-12 days and visit 3<BR>or 4 places. He insists on Barcelona for at least 3 days. I'd like to
go to Seville, Ronda, and maybe Nerja or Granada. We like to
incorporate a little ocean time when we travel since we don't live near<BR>one. Have decided on Southern Spain but if anyone insists that<BR>northern spain is the way to go we could be persuaded.<BR><BR>We are young, active, like to walk, long day hikes are nice, and we<BR>like good wine and good regional food (we'll try anything). We might
even take a dancing lesson or two.
Any suggestions for an itinerary, good places to stay? I'd love some
help.
Alison
lang...@verizon.net
Gail Suber
I second Terri's recommendation about seeing flamenco at Casa de la Memoria
de Al-Andalus in Sevila. My guide recommended it and I was very happy with
the show. She's right, it's intimate and amazing. Barcelona is an amazing
place. I spent six days there and could have spent weeks there; it was my
favorite city. I spent an afternoon at the Joan Miro museum (I can't
remember the exact name in Spanish) and could have spent more time there, if
I'd had the time. You'll never get to see all of the art there, so just do
what you can. And of course, you can't miss Gaudi. If you have time, I'd
also recommend a day trip to Girona and/or Figueres, where the Dali Museum
is.
Gail in Santa Monica
George Marinkovich
I would recommend flamenco at Los Gallos in Sevilla.
____________ _________ _________ _________ ________
El Tablao Flamenco Los Gallos
Address: Plaza de Santa Cruz, 11
Tel.: 95 421 69 81
Website: http://www.tablaolosgallos.com/ (en Espanol)
"This tablao has a professional cast and is the nearest you'll get to the real thing. There are two shows, the first from 9-11pm and the second from 11.30-1.30am. They charge 21€ including one drink. [The showtimes and price have changed -- see below for accurate info]"
-- http://www.spanish- fiestas.com/ seville/flamenco .htm
"Los Gallos is an intimate club in the heart of the Barrio de Santa Cruz. Performances are good and reasonably pure."
-- http://www.liveitup .com/travel/ Go-Seville_ Western_Andalusi a_Spain/section- nightlife/ list.dest
It's recommended to go for tapas first in Santa Cruz then go to the show. I've been to this performance once in 2000 and again last month and enjoyed it immensely both times.
___________________________________
IF YOU WANT TO MAKE A RESERVATION YOU SHOULD DO THIS:
1. Decide which day and time you want. There are two
performances each evening: the first from 20:00 to 22:00,
and the second from 20:30 to 01:30.
2. Go to the Los Gallos website:
http://www.tablaolosgallos.com/
The website is Spanish-language only.
3. Press "Entrar" (Enter). On the next page, click
"Reservas" (Reservations).
4. In the "Introduzca los datos de su reserva" (Enter
the information for your reservation) box enter the
following:
Nombre (Name): your full name
E-Mail o tlfno (E-Mail or telephone number): your
e-mail address
Fecha de la reserva (Date of the reservation): enter
one of the following --
el dia 8 de septiembre 2006 (for example)
No de personas (number of people): 1
?Show de las 20:00 o de las 22:30? (Which show, 20:00
or 22:30?"):
enter "20:00" (for the 8pm show)
or "22:30" (for the 10:30 show)
Datos adicionaires (Additional information): put at least
one blank space here or it will complain
Press "Enviar" (send) to complete the reservation, or
"Borrar" (cancel) to cancel.
______________________________________
In about a day (or two) you will receive a confirmation email.
If the reservation is accepted it will look like the
following (with obvious differences for date and
time):
============
Le confirmo la reserva para el dia 9 de septiembre
2006 para 1 persona a las 20.00 horas
Tienes que estar unos 30 min antes
Gracias
Tablao Flamenco Los Gallos S.L.
Plaza de Santa Cruz, 11
41004 - Sevilla
Horarios
1. Show 20.00 - 22.00.
2. Show 22.30 - 00.30.
27€ Por persona con una consumicion
minima incluida.
Para mas información
Tel. +34 954 21 69 81
Fax. +34 954 21 34 36
mail. in...@tablaolosgallos.com
============
roughly translated into English:
============
This confirms your reservation for September 9, 2006
for one person for the 20:00 show.
You need to arrive about 30 minutes before the show.
Thank you.
Tablao Flamenco Los Gallos S.L.
Plaza de Santa Cruz, 11
41004 - Sevilla
Schedule
1. Show 20.00 - 22.00.
2. Show 22.30 - 00.30.
27€ per person (which includes one drink).
For more information
Tel. +34 954 21 69 81
Fax. +34 954 21 34 36
mail. in...@tablaolosgallos.com
===========
The above was a confirmation email, I suspect the "I'm
sorry we can't make your reservation" email would look
differently. Print out your confirmation email and
bring with you to Los Gallos at the appropriate date
and time at least 30 (45 is probably better) minutes
before the performance and pay for your ticket at the
door, and then wait in line to get decent seats.
______________________________
From Rick Steves' Spain 2006:
"Los Gallos gives nightly two-hour shows at 20:00 and
22:30 (EUR 27 ticket includes a drink, manager Nuria
promises goosebumps and a EUR 2 per person discount to
those who reserve directly with the Los Gallos and
show this book in 2006 -- maximum 2 per book; arrive
30 min early for better seats without obstructed
views, Plaza de la Santa Cruz 11, tel. 954-216-492)."
_______________________________
From: http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowUserReviews-
g187443-d539316-r3982356-
Tablao_Los_Gallos-Seville_Andalusia.html
"Traveler rating: 5 of 5 stars
Seville: Tablao Los Gallos: "Mesmerising"
Oct 1, 2005: A TripAdvisor Member, Cardifff, Wales
I visited Los Gallos on my birthday, and it was one of
the best birthdays ever! This show is hard to explain,
but it's the real deal and not some tourist-driven con
of a show. These are genuine performers who put their
heart and soul into it.
There are two showings every day - 8.30pm-10.30pm, and
10.30pm-12.30am [THESE TIMES ARE INCORRECT]. I
attended the later showing. It's worth getting there
at least 30 minutes before it starts and getting in
line at the door, so as to ensure you get the best
seats in the house. One drink of your choice is
included in the entry price - make sure you book ahead
too, otherwise you will be disappointed. Get your
hotel to book you in in advance!
This is a must-see for all those interested in tasting
the real culture and passion of Spain!
=======
Traveler rating: 5 of 5 stars
Seville: Tablao Los Gallos: "the real deal"
Jul 16, 2003: A TripAdvisor Member, Athens, New York
In 1981 and 1982, while working at a nearby Navy Base,
on advice from my Spanish friends, I visited los
Gallos in Seville and saw the remarkably talented
dancers, singers and musicians perform authentic
flamenco. As an American traveling abroad, I wanted to
see the real thing-- real spanish culture: Unlike the
other schlock offered to tourists, this is the real
deal. Halfway through the show, an ardent admirer of
the artists performing the show was recognized by the
performers, and they begged Senor Placido Domingo to
come up and sing a few songs, which he did. The place
is awesome...small, maybe 50 people in attendance. It
was one of the most remarkable shows I've ever seen,
bar none--Broadway, the Met, none compare. This place
is worth a trip to Spain. In fact, if you go to Spain
but not to los Gallos, you wasted your time.
========
Traveler rating: 5 of 5 stars
Seville: Tablao Los Gallos: "Worth the money"
Jun 13, 2003: lori...@msn.com, Philadelphia
What will seem a little funny to Americans - small
venue, sort of touristy/cheesy stage decoration....BUT
the musicians, singers and dancers were all super.
Some of the other shows are larger and flashier, if
this is your expectation, you may want to choose
another show.This is traditional Flamenco - no spandex
pants and frilly shirts [not that there's anything
wrong with spandex pants and frilly shirts!] and the
big broadway ending! Although not certain what exactly
they are singing about, it would appear to my novice
eyes that Flamenco is about pain, suffering, loss, and
maybe even emancipation? I get this only from how I
interpreted the movement and expression of the dancers
- it's very much like opera. For this reason, I found
the show to be mesmerizing and worth the 30 Euro price
tag. If you are a guitarist - you will want to watch
closely the skill that is displayed at Los
Gallos.Purchase tickets in advance (your hotel will do
this) and arrive at least 45 minutes early for the
show to get in line for the better seats. It can be
complicated to find the building - take a cheap cab
ride there and walk home.If you are lucky, you may see
Jairo perform - (luckier yet, you may meet him?).
Quite easy on the eyes for the ladies and talented to
boot! For the men, of course the senorita's are quite
attractive as well - in particular the dancer who uses
the shawl in her performance.Enjoy the show!"
____________________________________
Videos of a typical performance (warning, very poor
quality video/audio, sorry):
Go to the http://www.tablaolosgallos.com/ website and
pick "Multimedia" and then "Video" and then click on
each of the four picutres that appear on the page and
you will see a very poor quality video with horribly
annoying audio. Please try to look past that. The
actual performance has none of those defects, in fact,
I don't even think any microphones are used during the
performance -- the space is small enough that they are
not needed.
____________________________
I've also heard good things about the flamenco at Casa de la Memoria and their venue is indeed impressive, but my first choice for flamenco in Sevilla is Los Gallos.
________________________________
If you're really adventurous (in the sense that you may or may not actually see flamenco performed), you might consider:
El Tamboril
Pl. Santa Cruz, Santa Cruz, Seville, Spain
"El Tamboril is a late-night bar in the heart of the Barrio de Santa Cruz noted for its great glass case in which the Virgin of Rocío sits in splendor. At 11 each night, locals pack in to sing the Salve Rociera, an emotive prayer to her. Afterwards everything from flamenco to salsa continues until the early hours." --
http://www.liveitup .com/travel/ Go-Seville_ Western_Andalusi a_Spain/section- nightlife/ list.dest
"Flamenco is everywhere and nowhere. You'll hear it all the time, reverberating round the alleys and squares, as you get in cab, as you walk past an open window. You can go to one of the shows by major name artists at a theatre and the standard will be very high and very serious. But to catch spontaneous live flamenco is a combination of chance and nous.
... A little bar called El Tamboril on the plaza Santa Cruz is not a bad call, but always late, always when you are just about to leave. Then somebody will pick up a guitar and start to strum, the ululating wail of melancholic voices, so like the muezzin calling the faithful to dance, will pour forth and somebody will answer with sexy, passionate steps. If you're lucky." -- http://travel. guardian. co.uk/cities/ story/0,, 1739135,00. html
____________ _________ _________ _________ ________
More alternatives: http://www.spanish- fiestas.com/ seville/flamenco .htm
By all means, see flamenco while you're in Sevilla.
Enjoy,
George in Maryland
Gail Suber <paral...@hotmail.com> wrote:
Do you Yahoo!?
Get on board. You're invited to try the new Yahoo! Mail.
George Marinkovich
There's no shortage of things to do in Barcelona, but a great half day trip out of Barcelona is Montserrat, a monastery perched on a mountain about 45 minutes out of town by train. Depending on where you're staying you can metro to the train station at Placa D'Espana. Purchase a ticket there that includes roundtrip train travel to Montserrat and transportation from the train station to the monastery by cable car. Once at monastery you can see the basilica, hear the world's oldest boy's choir perform, and see and touch the statue of the black Madonna (Montserrat is the most famous pilgrimage site in Catalunya and one of the top three in Spain). Then you can hop on a funicular railway (additional cost) that will take you to the very top of the mountain, where you will have (depending on the weather) spectacular views of the surrounding countryside -- possibly even to the Mediterranean Sea. A forty-five minute walk along a wide path with amazing views will take you back down to the monastery. You can have lunch at a cafeteria near the monastery and there is usually a small farmer's market where they sell local produce (cheese, honey, etc.). If you want to stay longer there are numerous walking paths near the monastery that are in excellent shape and offer very beautiful views from the mountain. It's a very nice half day (or 3/4 day) trip. I was there in 2000 and I led a group of twelve friends there last month. We arrived at the monastery during an incredibly intense rainstorm, but by the time we got to the top of the mountain the rainstorm passed and our views from the top were inspiring.
Enjoy,
George in Maryland
Alison Hyde <aliso...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
All-new Yahoo! Mail - Fire up a more powerful email and get things done faster.
alexis johannessen
I guess there are plenty of places and things to see in Spain but there never is enough time. One of the cities you must see ( I think) is Sevilla, its beautiful and full of the Spanish way of life. Also it is not that far way from Ronda and only approx one hour to the south Atlantic coast of Spain. I guess to really see Sevilla you need at least 2 days. There are a few other places in the area that would be interesting and you could fit them on your way to Ronda. Cadiz is a small but wonderful city and you have the ocean. All around the province of Cadiz you have some of the best beaches of Spain, I might even say Europe. The best part of all is that during the spring and autumn they are empty!!! On your way to Ronda you might want to add towns like Grazalema, Arcos de la Frontera, Vejer de la Frontera even Jerez de la Frontera. You will find great Spanish food and Wine and real Spanish traditions. It might be interesting to visit one of these towns while they are having their "Feria".
Alexis
From: George Marinkovich <skat...@yahoo.com>
To: trave...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Monday, September 25, 2006 11:21:54 PM
Subject: [travelspain] Re: Travelling to Spain first time
Alison Hyde
George Marinkovich <skat...@yahoo.com> wrote:
Alison Hyde
aliso...@sbcglobal.net
go that route, then pick up a car in Seville. We do this on most of
our trips and sometimes it can be quite interesting. I don't want to
spend time in airports unless we have to. My husband is wierd, he
loves driving around in foreign lands and it does give freedom to
change plans on a whim. Our way back from Seville we will stop here
and there, keeping a couple of nights open with not pre-booked hotels.
You're right, we probably won't make it to Valencia but you never know.
I am confused by this site. Am I to respond on the google site or
through email? I can't figure it out.
Alison
Roger Warwick
> through email? I can't figure it out.
Hi Alison,
In fact you can do both. If you reply via your normal email program,
your message will appear on the Google Groups webpage for all to see
(http://groups.google.com/group/travelspain), and also in the email
Inbox of all those members whose settings on Google indicate that
wish.
This allows members to consult and search previous messages on the
webpage, and also post from there if they wish. But it's not
obligatory - you can just keep sending and receiving directly from
your email program if that's what best suits your needs.
It's the best of both worlds! ;-)
Roger.
Pete Clark
Alison Hyde <aliso...@sbcglobal.net> writes
> Alexis,
>
> Thanks for the advice, I do really want to see Ronda on our way out
> of Sevilla, and kind of travel from town to town from there to the
> coast. We did this in Italy on our way back to Rome from Liguria,
> travelling through Tuscany and lots of stops along the way, by far
> the best food/wine we had. I really would like to replicate that
> experience in Spain, getting some Spanish culture. Sometimes the
> places least likely to attract tourists are the most interesting.
I don't think that you can describe Ronda as least likely to attract
tourists!
--
Pete Clark
Sunny Andalucia
http://www.hotcosta.com/comm_1.htm
Alison Hyde
Hi Alison,
My husband, 21 year old son and I went to Spain for the first time last May. You are in for quite a treat. We went to Madrid, Cordoba, Seville, Costa del Sol and Barcelona.
For Seville, let me make a few recommendations. First, the hotel where we stayed was just beautiful -- small, quaint and friendly. A little on the expensive side but we thought well worth it. You really knew you were in Seville! Here is the info if you would like to check it out. Convento de la Gloria www.hotelconventolagloria.com Phone: 954 293 670
Second, we took a tour with Conception Delgado. Only had time for one but would definitely have done all that she offered if we were able. She is wonderful and I highly recommend her very small group tour. There were only 7 of us. We got great information and found places that we probably would not have seen. Seville Walking Tours" in...@sevillawalkingtours.com.
And finally there is no where else to see flamenco! Try the show at Casa de la Memoria de Al-Andalus. It is located right in the historic district of Barrio de Santa Cruz. telephone 954-560-670. You should make reservations as soon as you get to Spain or to Seville because the fill up early AND you should get there early to get good seats. It is a small intimate flamenco show. There, of course, is also flamenco all over in the evenings, just stop in any place you hear singing and laughter.
In Granada I would highly recommend taking a private tour of the Alhambra. We would have spent hours just wandering around and although this is quite breathtaking, you would not really get the history of the place and understand the development of this wonder. We hired a private guide recommended in the Rick Steves guide book. I can not remember his name off hand but he was amazing. He is a native of Granada and you could tell he loved his city. Not only was he knowledgeable, he shared stories, again, that we would not have gotten if we had gone on our own. To us, traveling such a long distance, we truly wanted to learn the history of these major sites. Unfortunately my books are packed away (we are getting ready for a move) but if you go to the library and get the book I could confirm his name for you.
We did not stay in Granada but it does have perhaps the most famous parador in all of Spain. When we were there we were not able to get reservations. That was going to be our one big splurge. You might want to check it out.
BARCELONA -- oh, what a wonderful city! What art!! I can not recommend the hotel we stayed in here. It was dreadful! But, I can recommend the museums. They are unbelievable. We also did the Picasso walking tour through the TI office. A surprisingly great tour at a very reasonable price!! Just ask at your hotel where the nearest TI office is located and they can direct you where to get the tours. Many are offered and I understand all are quite good. They also give you a pass to the museum which means you do not have to wait in line. A big bonus on some days.
Although I have recommended tours, and we loved them, we also did most of our exploring on our own. Spain is a very friendly country and the people will help. The best memories are of the "little" things found along the way and the funny experiences that happen when least expected.
I can't wait to go back to Spain. Have a wonderful time. If I can help with anything else I will be happy to do so. I got wonderful help from this group when I went so will try to offer some assistance back to others. Terri
=====================
From: Alison Hyde
Date: 2006/09/25 Mon AM 07:31:57 CDT
To: trave...@googlegroups.com
Subject: [travelspain] Re: Travelling to Spain first time
Brian, Thanks for the advice, I was considering Valencia as well- hear they are hosting the world cup next year. I speak a little Spanish but I am a little worried about the Catalan. Unfortunately, my husband is not much on classical music and I'm sure he would be quite bored with Rodrigo's city. Thanks for the info on the Peniscola, I had not heard of it. looks interesting. Alison
brian glynn wrote: Alison, I would skip Marbella, much too much like a bad version of Miami. Barcelona is very different from the rest of Spain. It is more like a small version of NYC or Chicago with better architecture. Don't go around Easter. Barcelona is swamped by drunk college kids from all overr the place.
Valencia is smaller and has a nicer fell to me. Xativa, just north of Valencia is a fairly small village, but lovely. There is a lovely castle that overlooks the town and the whole region. You can have lunch and a glass of wine at the castle. I find it very charming and not touristy.
Aranjuez, going north towards Madrid is a lovely little city. Get a copy of the Concerto de Aranjuez and it will inspire you to visit this location.
There are some beautiful beaches between Valencia and Barcelona that aren't too touristy. Peniscola de la Plana is on a peninsula, is quite spectacular as peninsular casles go and there used to be a wonderful beach there. If you don't speak spanish I suggest you buy one of the new interactive cd rom programs and learn as much as possible. It will make the trip much more exciting. Good luck, Brian
aliso...@sbcglobal.net wrote:
My husband and I are planning a trip to Spain next year. It will be
late spring or early fall. We'd like to go for 10-12 days and visit 3
or 4 places. He insists on Barcelona for at least 3 days. I'd like to
go to Seville, Ronda, and maybe Nerja or Granada. We like to
incorporate a little ocean time when we travel since we don't live near
one. Have decided on Southern Spain but if anyone insists that
northern spain is the way to go we could be persuaded.
We are young, active, like to walk, long day hikes are nice, and we
Alison Hyde
In message <2006092614094...@web81702.mail.mud.yahoo.com>,
Alison Hyde writes
brian glynn
Alison Hyde <aliso...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Get your email and more, right on the new Yahoo.com
lang...@verizon.net
You might also consider going to Cordoba. It is a short AVE trian ride from Seville. We spent two days there and loved it. Another small city with wonders to explore. The trains, by the way, are great. We went from train from Madrid to Cordoba and then from Cordoba to SEville. From there we rented a car and drove to the Costa del Sol. Worth the drive to see the small towns along the way. BUT a word of caution. We had to pick up our car on a Saturday in Seville although we were not leaving Seville until Sunday. We were given directions to a parking lot since our hotel was in the old town and driving is quite tricky. We got lost and drove around and around and ended up stuck in one of the streets that was too small to accomodate our very small car. It is a funny story to tell now but at the time we weren't laughing. Glad we took out the $10.00 extra insurance because when we got out we saw that the sides of the car were dented from the buildings. But, that in part is what traveling is all about. Terri
=====================
From: Alison Hyde <aliso...@sbcglobal.net>
Date: 2006/09/26 Tue AM 09:47:10 CDT
To: trave...@googlegroups.com
Subject: [travelspain] Re: Travelling to Spain first time
Thank you for the Seville advice and hotel info. I think if we do any tours it will be there...my husband is not much on tours but we have done this before and then he is glad we did later. Travelling w/him is like pulling teeth. I would have liked to go to Madrid vs. Barcelona but it is the one city he insists on seeing. I don't know what he is expecting. He doesn't really care for art museums but then he's never been to the Louvre or anything big. He does like Picasso and great architecture. I lived in Spain for a year when I was but 3 years old. I don't remember much but I kept with me and dreamt about for the longest time through my childhood was brightly colored mosaic tile. I am interested to see if anything I see awakens an old memory. I think the Picasso walking tour will be on our list. Thanks, Alison
lang...@verizon.net wrote:
Hi Alison,
My husband, 21 year old son and I went to Spain for the first time last May. You are in for quite a treat. We went to Madrid, Cordoba, Seville, Costa del Sol and Barcelona.
For Seville, let me make a few recommendations. First, the hotel where we stayed was just beautiful -- small, quaint and friendly. A little on the expensive side but we thought well worth it. You really knew you were in Seville! Here is the info if you would like to check it out. Convento de la Gloria www.hotelconventolagloria.com Phone: 954 293 670
Second, we took a tour with Conception Delgado. Only had time for one but would definitely have done all that she offered if we were able. She is wonderful and I highly recommend her very small group tour. There were only 7 of us. We got great information and found places that we probably would not have seen. Seville Walking Tours" in...@sevillawalkingtours.com.
And finally there is no where else to see flamenco! Try the show at Casa de la Memoria de Al-Andalus. It is located right in the historic district of Barrio de Santa Cruz. telephone 954-560-670. You should make reservations as soon as you get to Spain or to Seville because the fill up early AND you should get there early to get good seats. It is a small intimate flamenco show. There, of course, is also flamenco all over in the evenings, just stop in any place you hear singing and laughter.
In Granada I would highly recommend taking a private tour of the Alhambra. We would have spent hours just wandering around and although this is quite breathtaking, you would not really get the history of the place and understand the development of this wonder. We hired a private guide recommended in the Rick Steves guide book. I can not remember his name off hand but he was amazing. He is a native of Granada and you could tell he loved his city. Not only was he knowledgeable, he shared stories, again, that we would not have gotten if we had gone on our own. To us, traveling such a long distance, we truly wanted to learn the history of these major sites. Unfortunately my books are packed away (we are getting ready for a move) but if you go to the library and get the book I could confirm his name for you.
We did not stay in Granada but it does have perhaps the most famous parador in all of Spain. When we were there we were not able to get reservations. That was going to be our one big splurge. You might want to check it out.
BARCELONA -- oh, what a wonderful city! What art!! I can not recommend the hotel we stayed in here. It was dreadful! But, I can recommend the museums. They are unbelievable. We also did the Picasso walking tour through the TI office. A surprisingly great tour at a very reasonable price!! Just ask at your hotel where the nearest TI office is located and they can direct you where to get the tours. Many are offered and I understand all are quite good. They also give you a pass to the museum which means you do not have to wait in line. A big bonus on some days.
Although I have recommended tours, and we loved them, we also did most of our exploring on our own. Spain is a very friendly country and the people will help. The best memories are of the "little" things found along the way and the funny experiences that happen when least expected.
I can't wait to go back to Spain. Have a wonderful time. If I can help with anything else I will be happy to do so. I got wonderful help from this group when I went so will try to offer some assistance back to others. Terri
=====================
From: Alison Hyde <ALISO...@SBCGLOBAL.NET>
Date: 2006/09/25 Mon AM 07:31:57 CDT
To: trave...@googlegroups.com
Subject: [travelspain] Re: Travelling to Spain first time
Brian, Thanks for the advice, I was considering Valencia as well- hear they are hosting the world cup next year. I speak a little Spanish but I am a little worried about the Catalan. Unfortunately, my husband is not much on classical music and I'm sure he would be quite bored with Rodrigo's city. Thanks for the info on the Peniscola, I had not heard of it. looks interesting. Alison
brian glynn <BRIAN...@YAHOO.COM>wrote: Alison, I would skip Marbella, much too much like a bad version of Miami. Barcelona is very different from the rest of Spain. It is more like a small version of NYC or Chicago with better architecture. Don't go around Easter. Barcelona is swamped by drunk college kids from all overr the place. Valencia is smaller and has a nicer fell to me. Xativa, just north of Valencia is a fairly small village, but lovely. There is a lovely castle that overlooks the town and the whole region. You can have lunch and a glass of wine at the castle. I find it very charming and not touristy. Aranjuez, going north towards Madrid is a lovely little city. Get a copy of the Concerto de Aranjuez and it will inspire you to visit this location. There are some beautiful beaches between Valencia and Barcelona that aren't too touristy. Peniscola de la Plana is on a peninsula, is quite spectacular as peninsular casles go and there used to be a wonderful beach there. If you don't speak spanish I suggest you buy one of the new interactive cd rom programs and learn as much as possible. It will make the trip much more exciting. Good luck, Brian
aliso...@sbcglobal.net wrote:
My husband and I are planning a trip to Spain next year. It will be
late spring or early fall. We'd like to go for 10-12 days and visit 3<BR>or 4 places. He insists on Barcelona for at least 3 days. I'd like to
go to Seville, Ronda, and maybe Nerja or Granada. We like to
incorporate a little ocean time when we travel since we don't live near<BR>one. Have decided on Southern Spain but if anyone insists that<BR>northern spain is the way to go we could be persuaded.<BR><BR>We are young, active, like to walk, long day hikes are nice, and we<BR>like good wine and good regional food (we'll try anything). We might
George Marinkovich
Glad to hear you'll be in Sevilla, it's one of my favorite cities in Spain. Don't know where you're coming from but the high-speed AVE train from Madrid to Sevilla is wonderful and only takes two and a half hours. There's a lot to see in Sevilla. I just got back from a trip to Spain with a group of 70 inline skaters and one of the highlights was definitely Sevilla.
I've included my email to my group about Sevilla. We stayed at the Hotel Fernando III (Calle San Jose, 21, Sevilla, 41004, p: (34) 954 217307 f: (34) 954 220246, which is a nice hotel (with a rooftop pool -- wonderful because it was very hot in September) in a great location (the heart of Barrio Santa Cruz). Please ignore any references to skating or our hotel in the email (it was just easier to leave them in).
In my opinion, you don't want to leave Sevilla without doing these things:
* visit the Alcazar and its gardens
* visit the Cathedral and climb the Giralda for a great view of the city
* see Flamenco (either at a tablao like Los Gallos or Casa de Memoria, or at a Flamenco bar like El Tamboril)
* take part in the evening paseo walking through the incredible Barrio Santa Cruz and areas nearby
If you're not opposed to bullfighting, Sevilla is also a wonderful place to see a bullfight at the La Maestranza bullring (one of the oldest and most famous in all of Spain). If you don't want to see a bullfight (most Sundays at 7pm), you can still go to visit the bullring and see the museum (details below).
There are Roman ruins (a very large amphitheater seating perhaps 40,000) just outside Sevilla, called Italica. It's just a half hour bus ride away. I've a separate email about Italica if your interested.
Finally, there's the Andalusian Minibus Tour that takes a group of up to 8 people on a tour of the pueblos blancos villages in the mountains southeast of Sevilla (not quite to Ronda). This tour deserves it's own email, so one will follow shortly.
A lot of the info that follows was copied from Rick Steves' Spain 2006 tour guide which I also recommend (check your library, I was surprised to find my library had about 20 current guide books for Spain).
Enjoy,
George
George Marinkovich <skat...@yahoo.com> wrote: Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 15:08:45 -0700 (PDT)
From: George Marinkovich <skat...@yahoo.com>
Subject: Sights in Sevilla
To: euroro...@yahoogroups.com
Sights in Sevilla
____________________________________
Between skates, some sights in Sevilla that you might be interested in:
____________________________________
Seville Cathedral & La Giralda
"We'll build a cathedral so huge that anyone who sees it will take us for madmen."
NOTE: Shorts and T-Shirts are not allowed in the cathedral. So remember to dress appropriately before you set out so you're not turned away. The Cathedral is just a few minutes walk away from the hotel.
The world's largest Gothic church, with Columbus' tomb, treasury, and climbable tower (La Giralda):
Hours: Mon-Sat 9:30 - 15:30, FREE on Sun 14:30 - 18:00 (last entry one hour before closing)
EUR 7 cost, FREE on Sun.
Includes Giralda Tower Climb, 330 feet up a spiraling ramp to a grand city view. (It is skateable in theory, but if you do so please remember to bring along plenty of Euros for your bail bond and remember to tell people you're with that Canadian tour group.)
Consider Concepcion Delgado's Cathedral tour:
Rick Steves thinks she's a joy to listen to.
Fri at 13:00 (we may not be in Sevilla in time to do this)
Tours last 75 minutes, cost EUR 6, entrance fee is EUR 7 extra
meet at the statue in Plaza del Triunfo
www.sevillawalkingtours.com
____________________________________
Real Alcazar
Palace built by the Moors in the 10th century.
Hours: Tue-Sat 9:30 - 19:00, Sun 9:30 - 17:00
Cost: EUR 5
Crowded in the morning, come as late as possible.
Consider Concepcion Delgado's Alcazar tour:
Sat at 13:00
Tours last 75 minutes, cost EUR 6, entrance fee is EUR 5 extra
meet at the statue in Plaza del Triunfo
www.sevillawalkingtours.com
____________________________________
Plaza de Torros de la Maestranza
"The Cathedral of Bullfighting."
The bullfight tickets are purchased here so I will probably do this tour sometime on Friday (as early as practical) when I pick up the tickets..
20 minute guided tour in English through the bullring's strangely quiet and empty arena, its museum, the first-aid room where injured fighters are rushed, and the chapel where the matador prays before the fight.
EUR 4, 3/hour,
Best to go on a non-fight day (non-Sun) in order to see the chapel and horse room.
Bullfight Museum, guided tour of the bullring and its museum. Hours: Daily 9:30 - 19:00, fight days 9:30 - 15:00.
____________________________________
Casa de Pilatos
Although not based on the house of Pontius Pilate in Jerusalem, this 15th-century gem is the most sumptuous of Seville's urban mansions. A delightful blend of Mudejar (Christian-Islamic), Gothic and Renaissance styles, punctuated with classical statuary.
Open 9am - 7pm daily, guided tours every half hour
Plaza Pilatos 1
ground level only (includes patio and gardens) EUR 5, with upper level EUR 8,
The upper level is seen by guided tour only. The ground floor (including patios and gardens) is self-guided.
A seven minute walk northeast of the Cathedral on the northern edge of Barrio Santa Cruz.
____________________________________
Museo de Bellas Artes
Andalucia's top collection of paintings, including Murillo and Zurbaran.
Featuring Sevilla's passion for religious art: Zurbaran, Murillo, some El Greco, Goya, and Velazquez.
15 minute walk from the cathedral, Plaza Museo 9.
English language floor plan available.
Hours: Wed-Sat 9:00 - 20:30 (maybe just 20:00), Sun 9:00 - 14:30
Admission EUR 1.50.
____________________________________
Museo Palacio de la Condesa de Lebrija
"This aristocratic mansion takes you back into the 18th century like no other place in town."
A fascinating 18th-century aristocratic mansion near Plaza Nueva
Hours: Mon-Fri 10:30 - 13:30 & 17:00 - 20:00, closed Sun.
EUR 4 for ground floor unescorted, EUR 7 also includes 20 minutes upstairs
2 departures/hr Mon-Fri 10:30 - 13:30 & 17:00 - 20:00
Calle Cuna 8
____________________________________
Evening Paseo
Start out in the shopping district (between 18:00 and 20:00) at Plaza Nueva, walk along length of Calle Tetuan, then onto Calle Sierpes, and so on...
Locals strolling in the cool of the evening through Barrio Santa Cruz, the Calles Sierpes and Tetuan, and along the Guadalquivir River (either side between San Telmo and Isabel II bridges). Also Plaza Nueva and Plaza de Espana. Can be enjoyed well past midnight.
____________________________________
Templo Romano
A few blocks southeast of Plaza del Salvador on Calle Marmoles stand the ruins of a Roman temple. Its columns rise 15m from below street level and offer a glimpse of the literal depth of Sevilla's history.
_____________________________________
Plaza de Espana and Parque de Maria Luisa
Built for the 1929 World's Fair.
Classic haunt of thieves and con artists, but very pretty.
Check out the nearby Maria Luisa Park.
____________________________________
Fabrica Real de Tabacos
Bizet's Carmen worked here rolling cigars on her thighs, now it's a university (the more things change...). In the 18th century it was 2nd largest building in Spain. Mon-Fri 8:00 - 21:00, Sat 9:00 - 13:00, closed Sun
Near Plaza de Espana
____________________________________
Basilica de la Macarena
Church and Museum with the much-venerated Weeping Virgin statue and two significant floats from Seville's Holy Week celebrations.
Hours: Daily 9:30 - 14:00 & 17:00 - 20:00
Church is free, museum is EUR 3
This is a bit of a hike away from the Barrio Santa Cruz quarter where we're staying, but it's on the same side of the Guadalquivir River.
____________________________________
Museo Arqueologico
This Renaissance-style pavilion created for the 1929 Exposition houses Andalucia's principal archaeological museum.
In the Parque Maria Luisa
Open 9am - 8pm Wed-Sat, 9am - 2pm Sun
EUR 1.5 admission
____________________________________
Torre del Oro & Torre de Plata
Sevilla's riverside Golden Tower was the starting and ending point for all shipping to the New World. It houses a (dreary) little naval museum, but has a nice view from the balconies upstairs.
EUR 1, Tue-Fri 10:00 - 14:00, Sat-Sun 11:00 - 14:00
____________________________________
Barrio de Triana
This quarter across the Guadalquivir from where we're staying was once home to Seville's gypsies and produced many flamenco artists and bullfighters.
____________________________________
If you are planning to do a bunch of these museums (especially several in one day) you might want to investigate a Sevilla Card which covers addmission to many of the museums and can be purchased from a TI (Tourismo), it can be a real money-saver (EURO 30/1 day, 40/2 days, 50/3 days, www.sevillacard.es.
Enjoy,
George
aliso...@sbcglobal.net wrote:
Alison Hyde
tourists!
--
Pete Clark
In message <2006092614094...@web81702.mail.mud.yahoo.com>,
Alison Hyde writes
George Marinkovich
Here's the Andalusian Minibus Tour I was talking about. Fourteen of our group (7 each on 2 separate days) took this tour and it was unanimously a big hit. The villages (and castles) were absolutely breathtakingly beautiful. And I am so glad I wasn't driving! Most Americans are simply not used to driving on the kinds of narrow steep winding roads that you have to traverse to get to the pueblos blancos villages. I've been driving for 25 years and I would have been hard pressed to go everywhere that Paul (our tour guide) did without scraping the heck out of the vehicle I was driving. Even if by some miracle I didn't actually damage the vehicle there is no way that I could have driven as quickly as Paul did. We were gone all day as it was, if I had been driving we would have hopefully returned very late at night or we would not have seen nearly as much as we did with Paul.
Enjoy,
George
__________________________________________
Hi All,
It turns out that we CAN do the Andalusian Minibus Tour after all.
Although Paul McGrath, proprietor of this tour, wasn't planning on working Sunday (September 10, 2006) he will offer the tour on that date if we can get a group together. My understanding is that he has room for 8 people in his minivan. This is an excursion along the route of the "Pueblos Blancos" (white houses), a "journey through the mountains into the heart of rural Spain," a chance to get out of the big city, get off "the beaten track" and explore the lesser known parts of Andalusia.
____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ ____
Andalusian Minibus Tour:
"Aussie Paul McGrath, who's lived in Sevilla for eight years, takes small groups on all-day tours in his nine-seat minivan. You'll head to the villages south of Sevilla, which are difficult to get to without a car. Paul doesn't really provide tours, just an efficient, economic way to explore the great whitewashed towns along the "Route of the Pueblos Blancos." You'll leave in the morning and visit Zahara, Grazalema, and Setenil de las Bodegas; the tour also includes a stop at the Moorish castle Aguzaderas and a swimming-stop option in the summer (EUR 43; Mon, Wed, Fri, and alternate Sun; from Torre de Oro at 9:30, returns about 19:30, tel. 657-889-875 to reserve, http://www.theother spain.galeon. com/)." -- Rick Steves
-- more http://www.theother spain.galeon. com/
Paul said: "If you come along I promise you will be pleasantly surprised as I've added a couple of stops on the trip that aren't on the website."
According to the above website this is the itinerary for the tour:
Castillo de las Aguzaderas
"The castle was in a remarkably good state of preservation, the centuries have not caused too much damage to its condition. Approaching it gate we expected to see somebody taking money for the visit, but the gate was open and entry was free. I´m certain that this castle does not have too many visitors and charging for entrance would not be cost effective." -- more http://members. virtualtourist. com/m/2b80b/ 41b1c/
Great pictures of the Aguzaderas Castle:
http://spanishcastl es.castillosnet. org/SE-CAS- 004A1.shtml
Zahara de la Sierra
"The white village of Zahara de la Sierra is one of the most stunning images in the Province of Cadiz. As you drive on the A382 road, which links Arcos de la Frontera with Antequera, or the A376 from Seville to Ronda you see a castle built high on a rocky mountain peak and scattered below it are the whitewashed houses of Zahara de la Sierra, which lead down to a man made lake at the foot.
...The reservoir, which is a relatively new edition to the area, has made it even more popular with visitors, who also have the option of water sports and swimming, which didn't exist 10 years ago." -- more http://www.andaluci a.com/province/ cadiz/zaharadela sierra/home. htm
Paul says: "The Summer in Andalucia can be very HOT so in the warmer months the trip itinerary maybe changed slightly so as to permit bathing in the lake pictured above (at Zahara de la Sierra), during the hottest part of the day."
"The water is from high mountain springs and therefore clean and a beautiful turquoise colour.
...El Embalse de Zahara is excellent for swimming and the water is warm to the point that you can splash around easily for an hour before feeling a mild chill. It is clean enough not to feel the need to shower down later on."
...The community of Zahara has made this into a mini resort at the foothills of the steep mountains. The cool, cool mountain spring water has been dammed providing for a wonderful afternoon's swimming (up to 4 metres deep with benches built on stilts in the water), eating, basking in the sun, reading, drinking...a great recreational space and frequented by whole families, individuals and lovers." -- more http://www.upbustle andout.co. uk/zahara/ sierra/sierra. htm
Grazalema
"Grazalema is a lively village whose population of 2,250 swells hugely with the influx of visitors to the park. Its steep, cobbled streets are immaculately kept and are lined by whitewashed houses with windows covered by wrought-iron rejas and plant pots spilling over with colourful flowers." -- more http://www.andaluci a.com/province/ cadiz/grazalema/ home.htm
Puerta de las Palomas
View from Puerto de las Palomas between Zahara and Grazelema:
http://www.schweich .com/imagehtml/ 8294_3232_ 0623_71sm. html
Setenil de las Bodegas
"Named after its once flourishing wineries - bodegas - Setenil is probably unique among the pueblos blancos, white villages, of Andalucia. Where most pueblos blancos were built on protective bluffs and pinnacles, this town grew out of a network of caves in the cliffs above the rio Trejo north-west of Ronda. Its blinding white houses seem to emerge from the rocks, and some have rock roofs and even olive groves on their roofs." -- more http://www.andaluci a.com/province/ cadiz/setenil/ home.htm
Pictures of Setenil de las Bodegas:
http://www.setenil. com/fotos. htm
Panoramic pictures of Setenil de las Bodegas:
http://www.cerespai n.com/setenil_ de_las_bodegas. html
Above link translated to English:
http://translate. google.com/ translate? hl=en&sl=es&u=http://www. cerespain. com/setenil_ de_las_bodegas. html&sa=X&oi=translate&resnum=4&ct=result&prev=/search% 3Fq%3Dsetenil% 2Bde%2Blas% 2Bbodegas% 26hl%3Den% 26lr%3D%26client %3Dfirefox- a%26rls%3Dorg. mozilla:en- US:official% 26sa%3DG
Olvera
"Just north of Ronda and surrounded by national park is a beautiful white village, typical of this area. Olvera has an estimated 9,000 inhabitants. The town is long and narrow, its centre being the Plaza de la Concordia. The most interesting part of the town is the west side, with the castle and the large church which overlooks the rooftops.
The Castle at Olvera can be seen from miles around and the trip to the top is well worth the effort. You can drive almost to the top of the village. " -- more http://www.idealspa in.com/Pages/ Places/olvira. htm
Cadiz Province - The white village of Olvera
http://www.andaluci a.com/province/ cadiz/olvera/ home.htm
Enjoy,
George Marinkovich
aliso...@sbcglobal.net wrote:
Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1¢/min.
George Marinkovich
A funny story about this place. The day I went with my friend we were asked by the gatekeeper at the admission gate to Italica where we were from. I assumed he was asking because he wanted to know if we were from an EU country because citizens of an EU country get a discount. When he learned we were from the US he wouldn't take our money. I thanked him and offered to pay anyway, but he resolutely refused to accept our money. I thanked him again and we went on to have a great time at the site. Despite media reports to the contrary not everyone in Europe has a dim view of Americans.
The next day about 30 skaters from our group skated out to the Italica site from Sevilla. They had to pay the admission when they visited the site. Generosity has it's limits, or maybe it was another ticket-taker on duty. They had a great time as well.
Here are the details:
__________________________________________
A 3 hour daytrip out of Sevilla to Roman ruins located in Italica. Featuring the ruins of a very large amphitheater, that holds either 20,000, 25,000, 30,000, or 40,000 depending on who you wish to believe.
"One of Spain's most impressive Roman ruins is found outside the sleepy town of Santiponce, about six miles northwest of Sevilla. Founded in 206 B.C. for wounded soldiers recuperating from the Second Punic War, Italica became a thriving town of great agricultural and military importance. It was the birthplace of Roman emperors Trajan and Hadrian. Today its best preserved ruin is its amphitheater -- one of the largest in the Roman Empire -- with a capacity for 30,000 spectators.
...To avoid the midday heat, plan your visit to arrive early or late and definitely bring water. (EUR 1.50, Tue-Sat 8:30 - 20:30), Sun 9:00 - 15:00, tel. 955-997-376).
You can get to Italica by bus (30-min trip, frequent departures from Sevilla's Plaza de Armas station)." -- Rick Steve's "Spain 2006"
"Take the Empressa Casal bus (tel. 954 41 06 58) toward Santiponce from the Pl. de Armas bus station, platform 34. Get off at the last stop (30 min.; M-Sa every 30min. 6:30am-midnight, Su every hr. 7:30am-midnight; EUR 1). Pay onboard. The entrance to the ruins is next to the gas station where the bus stops. When returning to Sevilla, wait at the bus sign in front of the entrance to Italica, the bus will turn around at the gas station.
...Archaeological excavations began in the 18th century and continue today, although the oldest neighborhoods in Italica are still buried under downtown Santiponce and may never be recovered.
[Highlights:]
Casa del Planetario (House of Planets) has intricate mosaic floors depicting the seven gods that represent planets [2000 years later we're still arguing about which planets are really planets: http://www.timesheraldonline.com/ci_4236503];
Casa de Neptuno and Casa de Hylas, also have unique floors.
Reconstructed patios and a bakery depict life as it was during the city's decline.
The amazingly well-preserved amphitheater, among Spain's largest, at one time seated 25,000. It was used to stage fights between gladiators and lions. Today visitors can wander the grounds and the curving hallways that circle the structure at the center of the site. Although there is plenty of grass and shade, the ruins themselves are in direct sunlight, so bring lots of water." -- Let's Go, Spain & Portugal 2005
Special note to Jeffrey W.: The Empresa Casal bus sleeps at night. It generally turns in around midnight. In any case, it's only 9km back to Sevilla.
"Santiponce is not well endowed with facilities, but the Ventarillo Canario restaurant almost opposite the Italica site entrance does good and economical platos combinados and is famous for its grilled steaks served on wooden slabs with papas arrugados -- small baked potatoes in mojo spicy sauce." -- The Rough Guide to Spain
"The traces of Italica's streets and the mosaic floors of some villas can be seen. However, little remains of the city's temples or of its baths as most of the stone and marble has been plundered over the centuries. Some well-preserved Roman baths and a theater can be seen in Santiponce, a village just outside the site." -- Eyewitness Travel Spain
"Ten thousand people once lived here, in 1,000 dwellings. About 25% of the site has been excavated, and work is still in progress. You'll find traces of city streets, cisterns, and the floor plans of several villas, some with mosaic floors, though all the best mosaics and statues have been removed to Seville's Museum of Archeology." -- Fodor's Spain 2005
"Italica has been heavily recycled over the centuries and parts of its buildings have been reused in Santiponce, Seville and elsewhere. You can see statuary and further mosaics from here in Seville's Palacio de la Condesa de Lebrija and Museo Arqueologico." -- Lonely Planet Andalucia
Check out the slideshow at: http://community.webshots.com/album/131506409xXVOlV
More pictures here: http://www.livius.org/a/spain/italica/italica.html
Enjoy,
George
aliso...@sbcglobal.net wrote:
Pete Clark
Alison Hyde <aliso...@sbcglobal.net> writes
> This I know, but is it not worth seeing?
We enjoyed the town. My daughter walked down into the gorge whilst we
waited in a bar at the top.
Part of the pleasure of a visit is getting there, either by train from
near Gibraltar, by road from Marbella, or in our case, by road from
Coin, which is the next village inland from ours.
In the town, all the roads were up, and in usual Spanish style, there
were no diversions sign posted. We stopped and asked, and the man said
that I was third person to ask him that day.
edw martinez
In Seville, sevvvvllllla- you will not want a car for the city itself. From here you might consider a rental when you leave Sevilla, for trips to Granada and on to the coast. I took the train to Granada. Arrives around midday. Spend two nights. Get your tickets to the Alhambra ahead of time- they schedulde entrances and that will determine your time slots while in Granada. Also take the night tour (that will be two trips inside) if it still being seasonally offered. Go on to the coast by car or train or bus. Homeward bound you could either fly from a coast town or take the train. If you have a rental car by now, then drive back to Madrid and make the stop in Toledo. I have been to Madrid many times, so my own schedule is sometimes to spend a night there going in, but usually always spend the night before departure- in my case, back to the US west coast. Time to unwind, have a good dinner and leisurely get out to the airport in the morning. Final advice... make sure you have a prior hotel reservation for Barcalona, the earlier the better. It is a popular meeting convention site and many hotels book up "completo" . The weather in Andulusia in Spring is great. The weather in the north coast and basque areas in Spring and Summer are day to day. Rain. It seems I have always been in Spain in March-April-May and once in San Sebastain-Pamplona in June-July. But, I think early fall (surely after August) would also be a great time to travel too. Good travels- and half the fun is planning the trip. Actually one other final tip. You can do a lot, almost all of it, on the web--- hotel accomodations- Renfre train schedules- flights etc. All of the areas/regions/cities have great tourist or governmental tourism websites links. edwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww
My husband and I are planning a trip to Spain next year. It will be
late spring or early fall. We'd like to go for 10-12 days and visit 3
or 4 places. He insists on Barcelona for at least 3 days. I'd like to
go to Seville, Ronda, and maybe Nerja or Granada. We like to
incorporate a little ocean time when we travel since we don't live near
one. Have decided on Southern Spain but if anyone insists that
northern spain is the way to go we could be persuaded.
We are young, active, like to walk, long day hikes are nice, and we
Alison Hyde
edw martinez <edw...@gmail.com> wrote:
Gail Suber
I second Ed's recommendation about going to Toledo and/or Segovia. Since your husband likes ruins, these are great places to see them, especially Segovia, where there are ruins dating, if I remember correctly, from Roman times.
Gail in Santa Monica
From: Alison Hyde <aliso...@sbcglobal.net>
Reply-To: trave...@googlegroups.com
To: trave...@googlegroups.com
Subject: [travelspain] Re: Travelling to Spain first time
Date: Wed, 27 Sep 2006 05:43:39 -0700 (PDT)
sue james
Alison Hyde
sue james
From: Alison HydeSent: Thursday, September 28, 2006 3:12 PMSubject: [travelspain] Re: Travelling to Spain first time
Alison Hyde
Ken Bielen
Frugal Traveler
Footloose in Spain’s Capital of Style, Barcelona
By MATT GROSS
HOSTEL, a fellow tourist once warned me, is Dutch for
“Bring your own towel!”
Actually, she used stronger language, and her
hostility was so raw that I began to squirm. Her
comment came to mind last May, when I began planning a
cheap weekend trip to Barcelona, Spain’s capital of
sophisticated style and consumption. Visions of design
hotels danced in my head, alongside images of the
fantastical science-lab cuisine and ultrafashionable
footwear that I imagined were every Barcelonan’s
birthright.
But a weekend at, say, Casa Camper, the boutique hotel
(215 euros a night, about $280 at $1.30 to the euro)
run by the shoemaker of the same name, would have
gutted my entire weekend budget of $500. And I had to
banish any thought of eating at El Bulli, where the
20-course tasting menu of black-olive waffles and rose
foam (165 euros) has earned its owner, Ferran Adrià, a
reputation as the world’s greatest chef (or at least
its most innovative).
Worse, every hotel I could afford was booked.
Desperate, I posted a plea for a “hip but cheap” place
on Superfuture.com, an online forum for style hounds.
The reply came back quickly: the 24-room Hostal Gat
Raval. I shuddered. A hostel? No, a design hostel.
Skeptical, but enchanted by the price (42 euros a
night) and location (right behind the Museu d’Art
Contemporani de Barcelona), I gave it a shot. I would
have to share a bathroom, but that bathroom might very
well have Philippe Starck fixtures — and I wouldn’t
even have to bring my own towel.
So one Friday last May, I found myself hauling my
suitcase down a narrow Barcelona street, into a dim
foyer and up two flights of stairs. An inauspicious
start, but Gat Raval turned out to be quite nice: the
lobby was bright (white and Kermit the Frog green),
and my room was cheery, with a sink, full-length
mirror and petite balcony facing the sunlit street.
After relaxing for 15 minutes, I left to explore the
Raval neighborhood, but not before examining the
hallway bathrooms — no Starck, but functional and
clean. It would do.
Raval had been described to me as the equivalent of
Manhattan’s East Village, a bohemian area where young
artists, musicians and designers congregated. And
indeed, the people I saw on the streets were all
trendily attractive, with vintage sneakers, designer
boots or flip-flops on their feet. Mesmerized, I spent
a good hour observing them on the plaza in front of
the museum, where they sunned themselves on the warm
slate while skateboarders kick-flipped around them.
All that people-watching made me hungry, so I popped
into Mamacafé, around the corner on Carrer Doctor Dou.
In a sleek dining room painted in sunset colors, I
devoured tart and garlicky gazpacho, a fried egg over
patatas bravas (the spicy Catalan home fries) and
lemon sorbet — all made with ingredients from La
Boqueria, the famous marketplace that dates back to
the 13th century. A glass of red wine, included in the
set menu, and an espresso brought the bill to 10.55
euros — far less than I’d expected for such a fresh,
filling meal.
I waddled back to the Museu d’Art Contemporani, where
6 euros opened the doors to both the permanent
collection (ho-hum Cy Twomblys and Philip Gustons) and
a special exhibition of pop music albums, from Patti
Smith’s “Horses” by Robert Mapplethorpe to Raymond
Pettibon’s covers for Black Flag. As I stood at a
listening station, I realized this was just what I’d
hoped to find — the coolest of pop culture treated as
high art.
With culture under my belt, I made my obligatory visit
to La Rambla, the parklike pedestrian thoroughfare
that leads to the harbor. This was once the epicenter
of Barcelona street life, a place for performers,
protestors and, in the 1970’s and 80’s, prostitutes
and drug addicts. But since the 1992 Summer Olympics,
the area has been cleaned up — or, to some, Disneyfied
à la Times Square. People in overly elaborate costumes
(witches and knights figured heavily that day)
strolled next to gawking tourists while boisterous
groups of perpetually tipsy bachelorettes who
routinely wing in from England on easyJet and Ryanair
snapped up sombreros from street vendors. Sombreros!
Luckily, I was soon rescued by George, an American
expatriate I’d met through a friend. We hurried over
to Irati, a narrow tapas bar far enough from the
Rambla to discourage most tourists. The bartender
poured us glasses of Txakoli (pronounced cha-ko-LEE),
a dry white wine from the Basque region, as we sampled
the toothpick-skewered tapas piled before us: bread
slathered with goat cheese, anchovy crostini and
olives (1.50 euros each).
I told George about my frugal mission. He laughed. I
was in the wrong place, he said — the Catalans drive a
hard bargain. “Look,” he added, as the bartender
counted our used toothpicks to compute the bill (14.10
euros), “you’ll never see that in Madrid.”
As night fell, George led me through El Barri Gòtic, a
knotty old neighborhood of brick alleys and squares
fronting medieval churches. Miró had lived here, as
had a teenage Picasso, whose second-floor window
remains. No sooner was I completely lost than George
announced he had to leave; his wife expected him home
for dinner. I stumbled my way to a main road and
caught a taxi to meet Alex, another friend of a
friend.
Our plan was to feed off of El Bulli’s glamour by
eating at Inopia, a much-cheaper tapas bar run by Mr.
Adrià’s brother, Albert. But Alex, a Catalan-speaking
local, wanted to make sure I also saw Barcelona’s
darker side.
He lured me into L’Ovella Negra, a cavernous bar full
of foreign students, all immeasurably drunk on
1.20-euro draft beers (or, as www.ovellanegra.com puts
it, “beeeeeeeeer”). Alex explained that, back in his
university days, this had been his primary haunt. We
stayed for a couple of rounds, quietly mourning our
passing youth, when a blotto Irish girl mistook us for
Frenchmen and introduced us to her friends as Pierre
and François. It was our cue to leave.
Too bad it hadn’t come sooner. By the time we arrived
at Inopia, at the civilized hour of 11:30 p.m., the
kitchen was inexplicably and disturbingly closed. We
went across the street to the utterly empty Rossell
and ate uninspiring cheese-and-mushroom fondue (16
euros each). I was back at the Gat by 1 a.m. and
drifted off, pondering the meaning of inopia:
clueless.
Less than four hours later, my alarm clock screamed. I
had a mission: to watch La Boqueria wake up. Anyone
can browse the market’s jam-packed stalls in the day,
but I wanted to go behind the scenes to get a
vendor’s-eye view of the action. When I arrived at 5,
butchers were slicing whole pigs into pork chops,
fishmongers were arraying glistening sheets of crushed
ice and greengrocers were erecting rainbow ziggurats
of apples, oranges, tomatoes, cherries, peppers and
pears. Best of all, I was the only tourist.
La Boqueria is also a great place to grab a cheap
breakfast. After taking a million photos, I ordered a
cortado (a small strong coffee with a small amount of
milk) and croissant (2 euros) at Pinotxo, one of the
handful of tapas bars. By 6, serious shoppers were
starting to crowd in, and I was already exhausted.
So I returned to the hostel for a nap; I’d need more
sleep and a shower if I wanted to keep up with
late-night Barcelona. But I’d forgotten that unwritten
rule of hostels: last one into the shower is a rotten
egg. The drain was clogged, and the stall was so tiny
that I burned my forearm on a hot water pipe. I
emerged feeling dirtier than I did going in.
Still, I was glad for the rest. The weather was
perfect and the hostel desk clerk insisted I visit
Parc Güell, up in the hills overlooking the city. The
park was designed by Antoni Gaudí, whose avant-garde
architecture is evident everywhere, from the
animal-themed fountains to the cracked-tile benches
undulating around the Plaça del Teatre Grec.
The park also contains Gaudí’s house, now a museum of
his designs (admission is 4 euros). But the greatest
work of Barcelona’s most famous architect lies down
the hill at La Sagrada Familia, the über-ambitious
church he spent 43 years building — without ever
finishing. (Other architects have carried on the work,
now projected to be completed in 2022.) Admission was
8 euros, but by showing my Gaudí museum ticket, I got
in for 5. I gaped at the bifurcating columns, which
imitate the natural structure of tree trunks, and
marveled at the postmodern grid of the surrounding
scaffolding. The contrast made my heart soar, but not
in the way that Gaudí, a devout and conservative
Catholic, probably intended.
For a moment, I considered climbing the stairs to get
a view from the spires, but after walking around all
day, my feet hurt. It was time to replace my beat-up
Merrells. A 5-euro taxi ride brought me to El Born,
the SoHo to Raval’s East Village, full of chichi
boutiques and trendy restaurants. None, however,
carried the shoes I wanted, at least nothing under 150
euros.
By now, the sun was setting, and I wondered where the
day had gone. Sure, I’d spent so little, but I had
seen so little, too — I wished I could buy an extra
half day with my remaining wad. So I splurged on a cab
and headed back to Inopia.
I arrived to find George, his wife, Lucie, and their
friend David standing at Inopia’s sidewalk counter.
Inside, the fluorescent-lighted space looked more like
an industrial kitchen than the restaurant of a
semifamous chef. But that’s Inopia’s point:
straightforward tapas, without foams, airs or
mummified mackerels. Over glasses of Sierra Cantabria
and bottles of Moritz pilsner, we nibbled
textbook-perfect patatas bravas, a plate of olives
that spanned the flavor spectrum from bitter to sweet
to spicy, and a torta cañarejal — a block of cheese so
liquid and rich you could drink it like buttermilk.
But better than this food, better even than the price
(somehow, my share came only to 25 euros), was the
clubby atmosphere. Throughout the night, friends of
George and Lucie would swing by and gossip in English,
Spanish or Catalan, and I began to appreciate
Barcelona’s true attraction. It isn’t necessarily the
museums or restaurants, but its cosmopolitan people,
vibrant street life and Paris-meets-Miami architecture
that makes the city exciting. The sophistication I’d
been seeking wasn’t something I needed to spend a lot
of money to find.
I awoke the next morning to twin unpleasantries: once
again, I was not the first to the shower, but worse,
it was Sunday and all the stores were closed — no
chance to drop my extra euros on a pair of awesome
kicks. Instead, I ate lunch at Origen 99.9%, a
minichain of bistros devoted to traditional Catalan
recipes like baby octopus in chocolate sauce and
Monserrat tomatoes stuffed with cheese and anchovies.
Lunch was delicious and, at 15.57 euros, affordable.
But despite my epiphany the previous night, I couldn’t
get past my failure to find new shoes.
Disappointed, I shuffled down to the beach, possibly
Barcelona’s most picturesque feature. Right there, at
the edge of Barceloneta, a dense urban neighborhood,
was a golden field of sand whose beauty was matched
only by that of the young people sprawled across it. I
dropped my bag and towel near a trio of topless women
(I couldn’t help it, there were so many), kicked off
my worn-out shoes and walked into the Mediterranean,
my pockets full and my feet bare.
TOTAL 341.10 euros, including taxis; two 1.20-euro
subway rides; the books “Gaudí’s Barcelona” and Robert
Hughes’s definitive “Barcelona”; and a 70-euro pair of
super-cool Castañer espadrilles, which, alas, I bought
in Italy — not at the company’s shop in Barcelona.
VISITOR INFORMATION
WHERE TO STAY
Hostal Gat Raval, Joaquin Costa 44; (34-93) 481-6670;
www.gataccommodation.com. If the Web site lists no
vacancies, try www.bootsnall.com, a booking resource
for backpackers.
Hostal Gat Xino, Hospital 155; (34-93) 324-8833;
www.gataccommodation.com.
WHERE TO EAT AND DRINK
Inopia Classic Bar, Tamarit 104; (34-93) 424-5231;
www.barinopia.com.
Irati, Cardenal Casanyes 17; (34-93) 302-3084.
Mamacafé, Doctor Dou 10; (34-93) 301-2940.
Origen 99.9%, four locations; www.origen99.com.
Rossell, Tamarit 109; (34-93) 424-1505.
La Cova Fumada, Baluard 56; (34-93) 221-4061. Hidden
in the wafer-thin buildings of Barceloneta, La Cova
Fumada is a slice of old-school Catalonia with a
kitchen that produces workingmen’s classics like
butifarra sausage, bombas (potato and meat croquettes)
and cod in myriad forms.
WHERE TO SHOP
Castañer, Mestre Nicolau 23; (34-93) 414-2428;
www.castaner.com.
La Boqueria, Plaça de la Boqueria; (34-93) 318-2584;
www.boqueria.info. Closed Sundays.
Nubius, Espaseria 7; (34-93) 319-1006; and Avinyó 21;
(34-93) 304-2420; www.nubius.es. The shop embroiders
T-shirts and button-downs with images like a
skyscraper wrapped in alien tentacles.
Ras, Doctor Dou 10; (34-93) 412-7199; www.rasbcn.com.
It features design books and magazines and has a
gallery for the work of art-minded architects.
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