New battery concept is promising - if it can be scaled up for electric cars

[Jerry Schneider]

http://tinyurl.com/ygsqwdo

[Charl du Toit]

"For now, the battery is not rechargeable,"
Could be a problem with bigger traction batteries - be interested to hear
what the end-of-life issues are.

Kind Regards
Charl du Toit
CamdeK Consulting
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

----- Original Message -----

From: "Jerry Schneider" <j...@peak.org>
To: <transport-...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2009 6:24 AM
Subject: [t-i] New battery concept is promising - if it can be scaled up for
electric cars


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[Brad Templeton]

I hate articles about this which are so scared to use "numbers" with
the public that they leave out the most important facts.

How many watt-hours? How heavy? What maximum current?

Saying "6000 hours" is meaningless. The battery in my watch lasts
6,000 hours, much longer really -- but at microamps.

[Michael Weidler]

End of ife isn't going to be the problem - it turns to sand. The problem will be getting the (I'm assuming) pure silicon to produce the charged battery in the first place. I am assuming pure silicon since the article didn't mention anything about silicon compounds - just silicon. --- On Thu, 11/19/09, Charl du Toit <c.du...@xtra.co.nz> wrote:

From: Charl du Toit <c.du...@xtra.co.nz> Subject: Re: [t-i] New battery concept is promising - if it can be scaled up for electric cars To: transport-...@googlegroups.com Date: Thursday, November 19, 2009, 2:59 PM

"For now, the battery is not rechargeable," Could be a problem with bigger traction batteries - be interested to hear what the end-of-life issues are. Kind Regards Charl du Toit CamdeK Consulting >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jerry Schneider" <j...@peak.org> To: <transport-...@googlegroups.com> Sent: Friday, November 20, 2009 6:24 AM Subject: [t-i] New battery concept is promising - if it can be scaled up for electric cars > http://tinyurl.com/ygsqwdo > > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "transport-innovators" group. > To post to this group, send email to > transport-...@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to

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[Jack Slade]

I think we have to know a lot more about silicon oxide before we even understand the concept. Purity solves itself.....only silicon can become silicon oxide.   I think it is natural that they should make a small battery first. Size  should not be a problem either, as nearly everything is built as a scale model before the final product is built.   The process presents a concept that I have not thought of before. This is like filling a battery with a product (silicon oxide) that seems to have an excess of electrons.  Therefore, the real energy being used is whatever energy it took to produce that amount of oxide.   Is it necessary to find a way to turn the depleted sand back into silicon oxide as a re-charging method, or can they pour out the sand and pour in another charge of silicon oxide?  I am sure that they will think of this.   I agree that we need to know how many amps at what voltage, and for what time period, to calculate usable energy (Kwh). Harmful side effects from production and costs are the other factors that may determine success or failure. It sounds promising.   Jack Slade --- On Sat, 11/21/09, Michael Weidler <pstr...@yahoo.com> wrote:

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[Michael Weidler]

Jack, I suggest you bone up on basic chemistry. First off it's silicon DIoxide. Second there are myriad silicon compounds. Silicon chemistry is almost as varied as carbon chemistry. In fact, it has been speculated that silicon based life is possible. --- On Sat, 11/21/09, Jack Slade <skytr...@rogers.com> wrote:

[Jack Slade]

Michael, that's why I said we need to know more about it. The fact remains that only silicon can produce a silicon compound, no matter what name you call it.

[Jack Slade]

Michael, here is a copy/paste from the article on batteries>>>the oxygen inside passes through a membrane to interact with oxidized silicon. This stable, inert, light and non-toxic material is high in energy and reverts to sand after the fuel is depleted.<<<   Does it not say "oxidized silicon"? I never heard the term"Dloxide".  What is it?

[Michael Weidler]

Silicon oxide would be SiO, which is a radical with a positive charge.  Silicon Dioxide (SiO2)  (aka. sand) is a stable uncharged molecule. A quick google indicates that the term Silicon Oxide and Silicon Dioxide seem to be used interchangably. Perhaps SiO can not be maintained as a free radical?   This is not to say that it is impossible to create an ionic suspension of SiO,although I haven't seen anything indicating that it is possible. It's been too long since my chemistry classes for me to recall the list of common radicals; however, i suspect that the reporter got it wrong - again.

[Jack Slade]

I understand that when you wrote "silicon Dloxide" you meant "silicon Dioxide".  My initial message meant that our limited chemistry might not be good enough this battery, at least until we have a lot more info. By "positive charge" I presume you mean that silicon oxide would be "electron hungry". Well, any material that kas too many electrons, or too few, is good battery material.   If I remember correctly, the article said " an oxide of silicon", and that it converts to sand when the battery is depleted. Is there also SO3, SO4, etc? Let me know if you can figure it out.   Jack Slade

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[rober...@aol.com]

Speaking of batteries, and it may have been covered before, but has anyone any info on EEstore?

rp