Membership Issues in A Community Garden - Fee Payment

[Garrison Creek Park Community Garden Association]

Hi everyone.

We are having a small issue with a member that doesn't want to pay our nominal fee for a plot in our garden. He is doing it based on principal because he says "we are sucking money out of him". And that everyone should just be entitled to a garden plot without paying or contributing to the community. We collect money to replace tools/hoses, buy soil/compost but mostly we are saving up for the biggest cost of all which will be fully replacing plots as they break down. 

We have a very long waiting list and we have volunteer coordinators. No one makes any money. This person has been complaining about the garden fee since the very beginning basically saying that we can get everything for free from the city so that it should be free.(by the way, we don't get anything from the city and our tools are all old tools that members have donated after they got new ones for home).

I am asking if anyone has dealt with a member in their garden that wasn't contributing? Do Toronto Community Gardens have any rights in terms of laws/by-laws. We are on public land but I feel we are responsible for the space. 

He also has caused some issues with other members with harassment and fighting.

[Marc Green]

That’s very frustrating, and I understand how little genuine, practical “authority” you have as the coordinator. An agreement is only as good as the willingness of those who sign. Enforcement is very difficult.

I’m guessing you’ve already checked in with your colleagues at the Toronto Community Garden Network. For the City, I would go directly to Solomon Boyé, Supervisor of Community Gardens Program, contact info here: 

https://www.toronto.ca/explore-enjoy/parks-gardens-beaches/gardens-and-horticulture/urban-agriculture/community-gardens/

Apologies if this is remedial and/or redundant info.

Marc Green (he/him)

VP Operations
The Backyard Urban Farm Company
(416) 450-3899 (cell)

[Garrison Creek Park Community Association]

Yes. We have a document and everyone in the garden agrees to the rules by signing each year. He refuses to follow any instructions I, as a coordinator, send and taunts me in the garden. I checked the email logs and he has been a difficult member since at least 2012 always complaining about the fee. Which has ranged from $10-$20 for the season. The garden is locked when no one is inside and he has managed to either get someone to give him the combination or just hangs around until someone comes to garden. I cannot expect garden members to police the door or even get into any confrontations because most people are not in the garden to get into arguments.

Unless we have some kind of true back up from City by-laws, I feel we are out of luck. The crazy thing is, he is just so selfish. He has a beautiful garden space at home and yet thinks he also in entitled to a spot in our small community garden.

On Wed, Jun 5, 2024, 8:21 a.m. Marc Green <ma...@bufco.ca> wrote:

For community gardens that we manage, support, or create through community building, we require everyone sign a document that states all sorts of standards and understandings. If one is not willing to sign and adhere to the community garden agreement, then they are unfortunately not welcomed into the group. Without a common agreement, you have little ability to enforce rules.

You could possibly “open the books” so this person can see the money collected, what it’s been spent on so far, and how much is being put aside for infrastructure improvements, which will benefit him. Yet that sets a precedent that could be a time suck for you and other volunteer managers. 

You also have to consider that there may be other contributing factors for each individual - everything else from genuine food insecurity to poverty to mental health issues. So it can be a very slippery slope to navigate. 

In the end, we’ve always worked with a “majority rules” approach because there’s really no other way. 

I should think the City has resources for this sort of thing. I would start there (although TUG was your very best first step!)

Marc Green (he/him)

VP Operations
The Backyard Urban Farm Company
(416) 450-3899 (cell)

Visit us at http://www.bufco.ca
Follow us on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/BUFCO/
Follow us on Twitter: https://twitter.com/BUFCO
Sign up for our newsletter: http://eepurl.com/dsitrj

CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE:  This e-mail and any documents accompanying it contain information from Marc Green which is confidential and/or legally privileged.  The information is intended only for the use of the individual or entity named on the transmission. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution or the taking of any action in reliance on the contents of this email and attachments are strictly prohibited. If you have received this email in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from your computer and any other devices on which it may reside. 

Please consider the environment before printing this email. 

--
You received this message because you subscribed to the "Toronto Urban Growers" Google group.
 
To reply or post to this group, send email to toronto-ur...@googlegroups.com
 
Questions?
You can reach us at in...@torontourbangrowers.org
 
Mailing address
c/o Greenest City
220 Cowan Avenue
Toronto, Ontario
M6K 2N6
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Toronto Urban Growers" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to toronto-urban-gr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/toronto-urban-growers/6bba652c-c9a7-49ee-818c-b4d1e402b4abn%40googlegroups.com.

[Marc Green]

[Carolyn McCrory]

Hi all- 

I am a community gardener from nyc - somehow on this list, which I appreciate!

I just wanted to add that maybe a few members can speak with him about his problematic behavior? We have definitely experienced many different kinds of members over the years - perhaps if he appreciates the community in any way and having his garden plot he will change his ways a bit. This could be considered a warning?? Though it seems like it should be discussed at a meeting - what to do as a group if it feels like a member is really causing problems for others (perhaps a bylaw could be created). 

We used to have our board of directors mediate problems between members for example. It can be very challenging!

Our garden also has a policy where membership can be revoked if a member breaks a rule- most likely first discussing it and then perhaps receiving a warning - it may be three strikes and on the third infraction the membership is revoked. (Depending on what occurs of course.)

Do you have bylaws and contracts?? Here they are generally created by individual gardens with the input of all members. Contracts are signed by all members, who understand their membership can be revoked. (I think actually revoking a gardener’s membership happens very rarely, however.) 

Re not wanting to pay the yearly membership fee- many gardens here do have a hardship clause- perhaps you could allow his unwillingness to pay to fall under something like that. It seems like an anomaly for sure- most people are so appreciative for their plots that they do pay what is generally a very small fee.

I hope that helps! Good luck!!!

Carolyn 

On Jun 5, 2024, at 10:33 AM, 'Marc Green' via Toronto Urban Growers <toronto-ur...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

For community gardens that we manage, support, or create through community building, we require everyone sign a document that states all sorts of standards and understandings. If one is not willing to sign and adhere to the community garden agreement, then they are unfortunately not welcomed into the group. Without a common agreement, you have little ability to enforce rules.

--
You received this message because you subscribed to the "Toronto Urban Growers" Google group.
 
To reply or post to this group, send email to toronto-ur...@googlegroups.com
 
Questions?
You can reach us at in...@torontourbangrowers.org
 
Mailing address
c/o Greenest City
220 Cowan Avenue
Toronto, Ontario
M6K 2N6
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Toronto Urban Growers" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to toronto-urban-gr...@googlegroups.com.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/toronto-urban-growers/517CB777-6473-49C2-9E51-B903BCCD94D7%40bufco.ca.

<Email sig new logo reduced.pdf>

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/toronto-urban-growers/517CB777-6473-49C2-9E51-B903BCCD94D7%40bufco.ca.

[Marc Green]

I do not suggest encouraging individuals to speak to this person. It’s already contentious, and one-on-one interactions could easily escalate. 

How big is the garden, as in how many members? I’m thinking it would be appropriate for a “mandatory” attendance meeting. Do not single out this person, but rather use the time to re-iterate the rules and regulations, that it’s a majority rules organization, and that cooperation is required. People don’t have to agree with the rules and regs, but they to have to adhere. Just like speeding laws, I like to go fast, but there are consequences. 

If there is something in the guidelines that says what the consequences for uncooperative members are, then review those as well. Ask for feedback and objections. Likely this person will speak up, which will give all the other members opportunity to voice their opinions, and help this guy get the message that he can not act with the kind of independence he’s trying to act with. Everyone is equal, everyone has to meet the same basic standards. It’s the way it is, it’s the way everyone but a select few (one?) are clearly willing to accept. Unless there are real and genuine financial hardships, then there are no exceptions.

Consequences for non-adherence are hopefully laid out in your handbook, but if not, basic consequences could be tabled and voted upon. This guy should get the message when he sees the support for community and cooperation from everyone else.

That’s all I got. 

[Rhonda Teitel-Payne]

Hi everyone,

Yes, it's a shame when individuals take a lot of time and energy away from the more fun work of gardening together! I hope others will weigh in with suggestions. 

There aren't any city bylaws that regulate this kind of behaviour, but the City of Toronto does have an anti-harassment policy that applies to staff and anyone who uses city services (including parks). Most non-profit organizations have similar policies, it's the norm to expect people to treat each other with basic courtesy and respect. 

So how do you get people to do that?

Be clear on what the problem is. If someone is complaining about the garden, that is an annoyance and a drain on limited volunteer resources, but that isn't generally covered by policies. If a person is persistently attacking members of the garden or if they are aggressive or threatening (even once), that may fall under anti-harassment policies. The City of Toronto's policy has examples of what may or may not be harassment.

Strength in numbers. Talk to other garden members and get a sense of what they think. Even if others don't want to confront the person, it is helpful if everyone knows the situation.  Hopefully they all agree that the behaviour is unacceptable and can reinforce a common message (such as harassment is not welcome, people who don't follow the guidelines can't participate in the garden, fees are needed to cover expenses). 

Mediation. Is there a respected person from outside the garden who may be able to speak with the person involved?

Document. Whenever possible, note down details about incidents - location, date, time, who was present and a short description of what happened. If you ever have to take action on the person, this shows a pattern of behaviour and boosts your credibility. 

Consistency. If you don't respond to this behaviour, it will be harder to promote good behaviour in the future. You'll hear "you let Mr. X get away with not paying and harassing people, so why should I have to follow the rules?"

For general advice on conflict resolution, there is a 3-part webinar at https://torontourbangrowers.org/conflict-resolution  and you can find some tips in the manuals on starting a community garden https://torontourbangrowers.org/starting-community-garden.

BTW, the Toronto Community Garden Network doesn't exist anymore, it was folded into TUG. FoodShare also has a Google group for community gardens, you can contact Orlando to get signed up orl...@foodshare.net. If you're on Facebook, there is a Toronto Community Gardens group

For general advice on conflict resolution, there is a 3-part webinar at https://youtu.be/lujq-9Q5Gvg

Rhonda Teitel-Payne (she/her)

Co-coordinator

Toronto Urban Growers

@TOurbangrowers

TUG would like to acknowledge that the land on which we work is the historical territory of the Wendat, Anishinaabe, Haudenosaunee, Chippewa and, most recently, the Mississaugas of the Credit River nations. We encourage anyone who lives and works in Tkaronto (Toronto) to think about our responsibilities to this land and water, and to the peoples who have cared for this place for thousands of years. 

TUG resources for reconcili-action

---- On Wed, 05 Jun 2024 11:34:15 -0400 'Carolyn McCrory' via Toronto Urban Growers <toronto-ur...@googlegroups.com> wrote ---

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/toronto-urban-growers/AA48E3D5-2939-4FE7-961E-36B99E9E980C%40yahoo.com.

[Rhonda Teitel-Payne]

Thanks for weighing in, Shah.

I agree that the TUG list can't resolve each conflict that comes up, however we can share our experiences, advice and resources as we do on other topics. I think it's still better than feeling we are completely on our own!

A tip of the hat to all TUGgers who response to questions and share our resources with your communities . 

Rhonda

Rhonda Teitel-Payne (she/her)

Co-coordinator

Toronto Urban Growers@TOurbangrowers

TUG would like to acknowledge that the land on which we work is the historical territory of the Wendat, Anishinaabe, Haudenosaunee, Chippewa and, most recently, the Mississaugas of the Credit River nations. We encourage anyone who lives and works in Tkaronto (Toronto) to think about our responsibilities to this land and water, and to the peoples who have cared for this place for thousands of years. 

TUG resources for reconcili-action

---- On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 12:30:55 -0400 mohiuddin shah golam <mohi...@hotmail.com> wrote ---

Thanks Rhonda for mentioning community gardens regulations, bylaws and rules. There are lots of  multicultural community gardens in the City with multi problems and conflicts. Every community garden has board of directors, management committee, coordinator and supervisor to resolve internal issues.

I think, it is not a great idea to entertain and  handle all  those problems and conflicts by TUG forum.

With thanks

Shah

GetOutlook for iOS

---

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/toronto-urban-growers/18fedbb12ee.e8b8ebf9463991.8459946160664378704%40torontourbangrowers.org.

[Marc Green]

Just want to reiterate that encouraging people to talk to this individual isn’t a good idea IMO. People can make that choice on their own without encouragement from Administrators. If anything goes awry, Admin could be on the hook for liability - “they told me to talk to him!” At most, I would say “you’re welcome to talk to him, but that would be your choice - I’m not suggesting you do.” 

[mohiuddin shah golam]

Thanks Rhonda for mentioning community gardens regulations, bylaws and rules. There are lots of  multicultural community gardens in the City with multi problems and conflicts. Every community garden has board of directors, management committee, coordinator and supervisor to resolve internal issues.

I think, it is not a great idea to entertain and  handle all  those problems and conflicts by TUG forum.

With thanks

Shah

Get Outlook for iOS

---

From: toronto-ur...@googlegroups.com <toronto-ur...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of Rhonda Teitel-Payne <rho...@torontourbangrowers.org>
Sent: Thursday, June 6, 2024 9:26:51 AM
To: carolyn_mccrory <carolyn...@yahoo.com>
Cc: 'Carolyn McCrory' via Toronto Urban Growers <toronto-ur...@googlegroups.com>; marc <ma...@bufco.ca>; Garrison Creek Park Community Association <garrison....@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Toronto Urban Growers] Membership Issues in A Community Garden - Fee Payment

 

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/toronto-urban-growers/18fedbb12ee.e8b8ebf9463991.8459946160664378704%40torontourbangrowers.org.