My answer to Vanessa's assignment, part 2
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David
Feb 6, 2009, 11:02:12 PM2/6/09
to TipsTricks2009
Write peer review guidelines, writing group instructions and peer
editing checklist for a class you teach.
I ASK MY SS TO READ THEIR OWN WORK AS IF IT WERE SOMEONE ELSE'S, TO
GET DISTANCE. #1: CLARITY! IS IT EASY TO UNDERSTAND THE ARGUMENT?
IF SO, THEY'RE 75% THERE. THE OTHER 25% IS GRAMMAR, SPELLING AND SO,
WHICH I FIND MORE IMPORTANT THAN SOME TEACHERS BECAUSE LOUSY GRAMMAR
AND SPELLING MAKE ME FEEL LIKE THE STUDENT IS DUMB, EVEN WHEN HE/SHE
IS NOT. IS IT JUST ME?
Vanessa
Feb 7, 2009, 9:34:06 AM2/7/09
to TipsTricks2009
"Does it make sense?" is #1 priority. And you can also apply business
writing benchmark: "Can I bill from it?" or technical writing, "Can I
build from it?"
That's also why grammar and mechanic are the LAST items to go over.
Correcting grammar and mechanics is NOT revision. It is proof-reading.
True revision is major surgery not band aids and cosmetics. Getting
them to see their errors and recognize their own error patterns is an
important step. Unfortunately neither is a beginner level skill.
Over the years, I've notice that most writers - all the way up the
writing food chain - are not automatically able to read their own work
as though written by someone else. Just asking them is not always
enough. Reading with an editor's eye is skill they have to learn.
Actually reading the writing of others as in writing and peer review
groups helps them learn how.
writing benchmark: "Can I bill from it?" or technical writing, "Can I
build from it?"
That's also why grammar and mechanic are the LAST items to go over.
Correcting grammar and mechanics is NOT revision. It is proof-reading.
True revision is major surgery not band aids and cosmetics. Getting
them to see their errors and recognize their own error patterns is an
important step. Unfortunately neither is a beginner level skill.
Over the years, I've notice that most writers - all the way up the
writing food chain - are not automatically able to read their own work
as though written by someone else. Just asking them is not always
enough. Reading with an editor's eye is skill they have to learn.
Actually reading the writing of others as in writing and peer review
groups helps them learn how.
David
Feb 7, 2009, 11:33:54 AM2/7/09
to TipsTricks2009
MY COMMENTS (IN CAPITALS) ON YOUR COMMENTS (IN LOWERCASE)
And you can also apply business
> writing benchmark: "Can I bill from it?" or technical writing, "Can I
> build from it?"
LOVE IT.
>
> True revision is major surgery not band aids and cosmetics.
I GUESS THAT'S WHY IT'S HARD FOR TEACHERS TO DO -- IT'S NOT ALWAYS
OBVIOUS WHAT NEEDS TO BE REVISED, AND EXPLAINING TO THE STUDENT IS
ALSO HARD.
> Actually reading the writing of others as in writing and peer review
> groups helps them learn how [to look at their *own* writing as if it were someone else's, for editing purposes].
THAT'S BRILLIANT AND SO TRUE. THANK YOU VANESSA.
>
And you can also apply business
> writing benchmark: "Can I bill from it?" or technical writing, "Can I
> build from it?"
>
> True revision is major surgery not band aids and cosmetics.
OBVIOUS WHAT NEEDS TO BE REVISED, AND EXPLAINING TO THE STUDENT IS
ALSO HARD.
> Actually reading the writing of others as in writing and peer review
THAT'S BRILLIANT AND SO TRUE. THANK YOU VANESSA.
>
Vilvi
Feb 7, 2009, 1:35:55 PM2/7/09
to TipsTricks2009
Hmmm... Therein lies a problem for my group. Frequently (almost
always) a student writes something and I can't figure out what they're
saying at all. I ask her/him to read it and often discover that they
only wrote down every other word they thought. It makes perfect sense
to the student... but no one else. Suggesetions?
Vilvi
always) a student writes something and I can't figure out what they're
saying at all. I ask her/him to read it and often discover that they
only wrote down every other word they thought. It makes perfect sense
to the student... but no one else. Suggesetions?
Vilvi
Vanessa
Feb 7, 2009, 2:45:27 PM2/7/09
to TipsTricks2009
Hmmm.... I remember that kind of writing teaching Spanish 1. Having
them talk about what they are going to write first can help - like pre-
writing out loud. They become more aware too reading each other's
(hard to decode) writing. I think they expect teacher to decode
meaning of just about anything. Flattering I suppose but just not
true. And they can help each other figure out what something means.
Later on, I would take their sentence for practice rewriting
sentences. When they would complain about sentences not making sense,
I'd say - now you know how I feel. Sometimes I could even see the
light go on...
It's hard to come with authentic tasks at that level too. Writing
postcards is one. Or writing sentence or so to caption a picture
(selected for proximity to available vocabulary).
One they write one sentence that makes sense, they can write two and
then another. Not right away - and I use the expression, "make sense,"
loosely.
Or clone cloze/gap fill exercises from reading.
Vanessa
them talk about what they are going to write first can help - like pre-
writing out loud. They become more aware too reading each other's
(hard to decode) writing. I think they expect teacher to decode
meaning of just about anything. Flattering I suppose but just not
true. And they can help each other figure out what something means.
Later on, I would take their sentence for practice rewriting
sentences. When they would complain about sentences not making sense,
I'd say - now you know how I feel. Sometimes I could even see the
light go on...
It's hard to come with authentic tasks at that level too. Writing
postcards is one. Or writing sentence or so to caption a picture
(selected for proximity to available vocabulary).
One they write one sentence that makes sense, they can write two and
then another. Not right away - and I use the expression, "make sense,"
loosely.
Or clone cloze/gap fill exercises from reading.
Vanessa
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