Exact values in graphs and geometry

[Microgees]

From os 3.0 release notes, it says coordinates of points can be exact values.  I have a clickpad cas and i have no idea how to find it. Say for eg f(x)=x^1/2, when x=0.5, it should display root 2 on 2. For my calculator, it displays 0.707.  What can i do to make it an exact value??

 

THX!

[Andy Kemp]

This is because you used 0.5 which is a decimal, so it thinks you want a decimal answer...  If you put 1/2 instead you will get what you expected.

On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 1:13 PM, Microgees <ross...@yahoo.com> wrote:

From os 3.0 release notes, it says coordinates of points can be exact values.  I have a clickpad cas and i have no idea how to find it. Say for eg f(x)=x^1/2, when x=0.5, it should display root 2 on 2. For my calculator, it displays 0.707.  What can i do to make it an exact value??

 

THX!

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[Microgees]

Thx for ur reply. But after puting 1/2, i still got 0.707, not root 2 on 2.  Any idea why??

[Andy Kemp]

Are you using a CAS version as the exact value feature isn't available on the Numeric?

On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 1:58 PM, Microgees <ross...@yahoo.com> wrote:

Thx for ur reply. But after puting 1/2, i still got 0.707, not root 2 on 2.  Any idea why??

--

[Andy Kemp]

Just wondering are you using 'trace' as that seems to still return approximate values.  Try putting a point on the curve and then changing the x-value to 1/2...

[Daniel Tran]

i too have that issue on my CAS.
it shows approx even when i trace with "exact" input

[Daniel Tran]

could you show me steps?

On Apr 8, 9:11 am, Andy Kemp <a...@kemp.co> wrote:
> Just wondering are you using 'trace' as that seems to still return
> approximate values.  Try putting a point on the curve and then changing the
> x-value to 1/2...
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 2:00 PM, Andy Kemp <a...@kemp.co> wrote:
> > Are you using a CAS version as the exact value feature isn't available on
> > the Numeric?
>

[Andy Kemp]

I think that is just a reflection of the way the trace function works, however I agree it would be nice if trace could also show exact values...  For now though just put a point on the curve and double click on the x co-ordinate and then type in the value you want...

Alternatively choice 'point-on' option, then select the curve, and press 'left bracket' ( and then type the x-value you want...

Cheers

Andy

On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 2:13 PM, Daniel Tran <tutr...@gmail.com> wrote:

i too have that issue on my CAS.
it shows approx even when i trace with "exact" input

[Wayne]

I have the same problem with the CAS Touchpad. The capability
described in Section 5.1 of the Release Notes does not work with any
configuration that I can find, including auto settings everywhere and
entering all the max, min, etc with exact values. If someone has this
working on CAS Touchpad, please explain. Thanks.
Wayne

> >http://lafacroft.com/archive/nspire.php- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

[Wayne]

Can you reproduce the graph of f2(x)=2*sin(x+pi/2) exactly as it
appears on page 11 of the Release notes, with the axes labeled as
shown? That is what I cannot get to work.
Wayne

On Apr 8, 1:33 pm, Andy Kemp <a...@kemp.co> wrote:
> I've just tested on my CAS touchpad running 3.0, and it worked as I
> described earlier...
>
> I created a Graphs Page
> Added the graph f1(x)=sqrt(x)
> Added a 'Point-on'
> Changed the x-coordinate to be 2
>
> The y-coordinate showed sqrt(2)

> > > >http://lafacroft.com/archive/nspire.php-Hide quoted text -

[Andy Kemp]

Yes worked fine for me - How are you changing the window settings?  I noticed it only gives the exact values if you do it by double clicking and changing the values on the screen (which is how I mostly do it anyway).  If you use the windows settings dialogue box it only uses decimal values for the scale...

[Wayne]

That is the magic step. I always use window settings to change limits
and scale. Changing the values on the screen works. Thanks.
Wayne

> > > > > >http://lafacroft.com/archive/nspire.php-Hidequoted text -

[Microgees]

If i need to draw a sine graph and find its x-intercepts, how can I
find the exact values in the Graph mode??

> > > > > >http://lafacroft.com/archive/nspire.php-Hidequoted text -

[Lana Golembeski]

Use 6 analyze graph. You are looking for zeroes so place the hand to the left of a zero and then to the right of the zero and the point will appear on the graph and say "zero",

Sent from my iPhone
Lana

[Lana Golembeski]

Sooty. It's not exact. Hmmm

Sent from my iPhone
Lana

On Apr 8, 2011, at 6:43 PM, Microgees <ross...@yahoo.com> wrote:

[Daniel Tran]

please read the previous posts

[Lana Golembeski]

i did too ..to the sin (x) graph...but the zero gave me 3.1415...not the exact value.

On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 12:33 PM, Andy Kemp <an...@kemp.co> wrote:

I've just tested on my CAS touchpad running 3.0, and it worked as I described earlier...

I created a Graphs Page

Added the graph f1(x)=sqrt(x)

Added a 'Point-on'

Changed the x-coordinate to be 2

The y-coordinate showed sqrt(2)

[Daniel Tran]

read this please

On Apr 8, 9:27 am, Andy Kemp <a...@kemp.co> wrote:

[Sean Bird]

Enjoy the attached screen capture. Notice how the end values are also exact. I double clicked on one of the end values and pressed TAB to jump to the next one to change it.

Right, trace doesn't give exact even if the number is typed in, but by putting a point on the graph you will get great results.

- Sean Bird
http://bird-godlydominion.blogspot.com/

[Ray Fox]

Sean,

 

I was able to get the end values and the pi/4 to show on the screen by following your instructions and changing it.

However, when I use the graph trace with trace step, it gives the info in decimals.

 

Is there a way to get the windows settings to determine what will show on the graph, and have it "count" by pi/4 or whatever?

 

Ray

--

[Andy Kemp]

For now it looks like the 'graph trace' feature doesn't support the new 'exact values'.  You can however get exact values by putting a point on the function, then entering the x-value you want which will give the exact value where possible...

I useful little tip to remember is if you want the value to be decimal instead put a decimal point at the end of the number, which will force it into decimal mode...

[Sean Bird]

Like Andy is saying, it will calculate exact values when possible, i.e. if an approximate value is calculated, it will not return an exact value.
Note: Trace and SLIDERS will result in approximate values.

More can be done with fractions by doing things like calculate approxRational( )

Since with the CAS you can do calculation with pi, the spreadsheet and scatterplot can be used to set up a pseudo-trace. See the attached.

- Sean Bird
http://bird-godlydominion.blogspot.com/

[Andy Kemp]

Nice idea!, with a little bit of work it should be easy enough to create a 'fake trace' which attempts to give exact answers by using approxRational and basing it on the step size chosen on the graph...  this should allow you to create something that would work for both trig and non-trig functions...

--

[Ray Fox]

I must not have the default set up correctly.

Everything is decimals, not fractions of pi.

Attached a screen shot from my pc.

Ray

--

[Sean Bird]

I would guess you are using a numeric Nspire. In fact I tested it out on the numeric Nspire because I wondered what it would look like. Yep, that's it.

[Ray Fox]

OOPS!

 

That was it. I have both on my laptop. The numeric opened the file automatically!!

 

Thanks,

 

Ray

--

[Ray Fox]

Sean,

 

I REALLY like what you did.

Can you walk me through the steps to create.

 

Thanks,

 

Ray

On Sat, Apr 9, 2011 at 6:12 AM, Sean Bird <covena...@gmail.com> wrote:

--

[Sean Bird]

Well, I really should be making progress on a few other projects, but here is a link to a video explanation of what I did.

It is a bit embarrassing ... not as perfect as I would like it ... I would do a few things differently if I were to record anything ever again, but perhaps it will be helpful.

Enjoy,
- Sean Bird

T³ - Teachers Teaching with Technology - Instructor

T³’s mission is “to provide quality professional development that enables the mathematics and science educator to be successful in the classroom through the appropriate use of technology."

blog: http://bird-godlydominion.blogspot.com/
website: http://covenantchristian.org/bird/Nspire.html
Covenant Christian High School
Indianapolis, IN

On Sat, Apr 9, 2011 at 8:22 PM, Ray Fox <kenr...@gmail.com> wrote:

Sean,

 

[Ray Fox]

I apologize for taking up your time.

Thanks for the video.

It is great, and so are you.

 

Ray

--

[Travis Bower]

Sean, great show.  Thanks.

For those who watched the Advanced Authoring webinar, he could have also added a split screen with dynamic Notes and f1 would update values much like his ordered pair did.

Nspire has 3 ways of doing everything--is that a maxim?

As for time, think how laborious it would be to both write out all those steps and to read and duplicate!!  With a quick 11 minute video, BAM!  Sweet.

I would encourage you experts out there to do more of these.  Don't be bashful.  We love it!  

I assume you used your smartboard recorder.  Is it a fast upload to Google docs/vids?  I am now trying a jing.swf of 18MB over dsl phone line and it is sssllloooowwwwww.

Thanks for giving of your time...a brief reply is ok!

[Sean Bird]

Right, I did you the Smart Recorder. With Jing you can pick which part of the screen you want to capture. It uploaded pretty quickly to the Google docs with our dsl phone line wirelessly.

Regarding the Interactive Notes pages, check out page 3.1 of the attached file. The trig function can be changed to cosine and it will automatically give the correct solution. Interactive Notes have been able to give exact answer (again for numeric you can get fractions, and with the Nspire CAS you can enjoy pi and sqrt) for about a year now. Many amazing things have happened when Notes became Interactive.
But we were wanting to see what's new on the Graphs page.

On Sun, Apr 10, 2011 Travis Bower <tbo...@dphs.org> wrote:

Sean, great show.  Thanks.

For those who watched the Advanced Authoring webinar, he could have also added a split screen with dynamic Notes and f1 would update values much like his ordered pair did.

Nspire has 3 ways of doing everything--is that a maxim?

As for time, think how laborious it would be to both write out all those steps and to read and duplicate!!  With a quick 11 minute video, BAM!  Sweet.

Right, that is why I went with the video.

I would encourage you experts out there to do more of these.  Don't be bashful.  We love it!  

I assume you used your smartboard recorder.  Is it a fast upload to Google docs/vids?  I am now trying a jing.swf of 18MB over dsl phone line and it is sssllloooowwwwww.

Thanks for giving of your time...a brief reply is ok!

On Sat, Apr 9, 2011 at 7:11 PM, Ray Fox <kenr...@gmail.com> wrote:

Thanks for the video.

It is great, and so are you.

 

Ray

On Sat, Apr 9, 2011 at 8:34 PM, Sean Bird <covena...@gmail.com> wrote:

Here is a link to a video explanation of what I did.

[Ray Fox]

I have found when recording with Smart Boards, sometimes it is better to change it to a FLV file (I use Camtasia) It handles larger files (10+ minutes) better.

 

Ray

[Nevil Hopley]

Travis recently said:

"> I would encourage you experts out there to do more of these [video
constructions].  Don't be bashful.  We love it!"

I would suggest you visit the follow page:
http://www.handheldgeometry.co.uk/siteindexnspire.htm

There are currently 16 construction videos hosted there (see the
Nspire files with the word 'Construct' next to them)

Their original creation was intended to help 'newbie' Nspirers know
how some of the more complex constructions are made.

Maybe these might give you a few insights into other design
techniques?

Many of the videos are 'silent', as the moving imagery is all that's
required to know how the construction is made.

Now that Nspire 3.0 is with us, I can see that a soundtrack will help
with future constructions are there are many more options available
that the author can talk about, whilst creating whatever file is on
camera.

Nevil

[Steve Arnold]

For those interested in learning how to create dynamic documents, another site is

http://compasstech.com.au/TNS_Authoring/

This is my authoring support site and anyone interested is most welcome to join the "online authoring classroom" there and work through some tutorials (with videos).

Steve

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With best wishes,
Steve
_________________
Dr Stephen Arnold
Educational Technology Consultant
Compass Learning Technologies

T3 Fellow, Teachers Teaching with Technology Australia

Office: +61-2-4232-2080
Mobile: +61-4-0175-3834
US contact: +1 (707) 927 0280

Web: http://compasstech.com.au
_________________   

[Steve Arnold]

For those interested in learning how to create dynamic documents, another site is

http://compasstech.com.au/TNS_Authoring/

This is my authoring support site and anyone interested is most welcome to join the "online authoring classroom" there and work through some tutorials (with videos).

Steve

----------------------------------

On 11 April 2011 04:12, Nevil Hopley <ne...@calculatorsoftware.co.uk> wrote:

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With best wishes,
Steve
_________________
Dr Stephen Arnold
Educational Technology Consultant
Compass Learning Technologies

T3 Fellow, Teachers Teaching with Technology Australia

Office: +61-2-4232-2080
Mobile: +61-4-0175-3834

Web: http://compasstech.com.au
_________________   

[Andy Kemp]

I've just tested on my CAS touchpad running 3.0, and it worked as I described earlier...

I created a Graphs Page

Added the graph f1(x)=sqrt(x)

Added a 'Point-on'

Changed the x-coordinate to be 2

The y-coordinate showed sqrt(2)

On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 6:29 PM, Wayne <wayn...@thepaces.org> wrote:

I have the same problem with the CAS Touchpad.  The capability
described in Section 5.1 of the Release Notes does not work with any
configuration that I can find, including auto settings everywhere and
entering all the max, min, etc with exact values.  If someone has this
working on CAS Touchpad, please explain.  Thanks.
Wayne

On Apr 8, 9:27 am, Andy Kemp <a...@kemp.co> wrote:
> I think that is just a reflection of the way the trace function works,
> however I agree it would be nice if trace could also show exact values...
>  For now though just put a point on the curve and double click on the x
> co-ordinate and then type in the value you want...
>
> Alternatively choice 'point-on' option, then select the curve, and press
> 'left bracket' ( and then type the x-value you want...
>
> Cheers
> Andy
>
>
>

> On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 2:13 PM, Daniel Tran <tutran...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > i too have that issue on my CAS.
> > it shows approx even when i trace with "exact" input
>

> > --
> > To post to this group, send email to tins...@googlegroups.com
> > To unsubscribe send email to tinspire+u...@googlegroups.com
> > For more options, visit this group at
> >http://groups.google.com.au/group/tinspire?hl=en-GB?hl=en-GB
> > The tns documents shared by group members are archived at

> >http://lafacroft.com/archive/nspire.php- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

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