Here's an example of a tree structure (treeview) implemented on TW

[Mark S.]

A few days ago Morris Gray pointed out the treeview plugin code for
jquery developed by the folks at http://www.dynamicdrive.com/ .

I've been hoping for some capability like this would come along, so
I've taken a first stab at implementing it:

http://treeview.tiddlyspot.com/

There are things that aren't quite perfect, and maybe some of the TW
wizards here can step in. I wasn't able to find the code that formats
tooltip titles on links, so I'm using a simplified expression. And
the menu doesn't refresh itself automatically. The way I implemented
it might be a bit kludgey, too, in some eyes.

But it shows that it can be done.

-- Mark

[Morris Gray]

On May 18, 3:38 pm, "Mark S." <throa...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> A few days ago Morris Gray pointed out the treeview plugin code for
> jquery developed by the folks at http://www.dynamicdrive.com/.

Ahh my little acorn,

You have done well. Each journey begins with the smallest of
steps.... if one doesn't get rooted along the way :-)

Here is some plant food for your little bonsai. Sprinkle this into
your PageTemplate and your tree will grow automatically with each
tiddler tier.

<div id='mainMenu' refresh='content' force='true' tiddler='MainMenu'></
div>

Keep up the good work, acorn.

Morris Gray
http://twhelp.tiddlyspot.com
A TiddlyWiki help file for beginners

[FND]

> I've taken a first stab at implementing it:
> http://treeview.tiddlyspot.com/

That's a really nice idea - thanks for looking into it, Mark.
Unfortunately though, it doesn't seem to work for me: All the macro
generates for me is a single-item list with a link to the root tag
(tested with Firefox 3 on Ubuntu, and also with Internet Explorer 8 and
Firefox 3 on Windows XP).

-- F.

[Heller]

Same here firefox and IE on Vista...

[Mark S.]

Maybe I should have loaded all the CSS stuff manually into the
StyleSheet. Is it possible you have a firewall or other configuration
that would prevent one site from accessing info from another? The
symptoms you describe sound like what happens if the CSS is
unavailable.

I'm running FF3 under XP.

Thanks,
Mark

[Morris Gray]

Hi Mark,

You've done an excellent job so far. It was only days ago when I
imagined what TWT-Notes would look like with a tree menu like the one
on DynamicDrive now I've seen it thanks to you.

You might be encouraged to see it too. It works in IE7 and Google
Chrome as well.

http://twt-notes-treeview-experimental.tiddlyspot.com/

The first useful working jQuery plugin for TiddlyWiki by MarkS.
Congratulations, keep going....

Morris Gray
http://twhelp.tiddlyspot.com
A TiddlyWiki help file for beginners

http://twt-notes.tiddlyspot.com
tabbed notes for the taking

[Mark S.]

Ok -- I'm cheating now.

IE 6 (and maybe the other IE's) don't seem to respond to the @import
in the stylesheet. So I physically put the <link> stylesheet inside
the TW file up at the header. Now it works fine with IE 6 on my XP
system.

This is probably not the best long term solution. Perhaps someone here
can explain the proper style syntax that will get this to work without
physically changing the structure of the file. However, a quick search
on the net suggests that IE sometimes has problems with the @import
thing.

Also, if its not working for you, you might check if any security
settings (browser or firewall) that would prevent page X on site A
from grabbing stuff from site B. The CSS needs to bring in images,
which is why the version on tiddlyspot can't just embed the CSS, since
I would need to be able to create a file directory for the images that
go with the CSS to do that.

Have fun,
Mark

[Mark S.]

Thanks Morris,

That looks good!

-- Mark

On May 18, 5:57 am, Morris Gray <msg...@symbex.net.au> wrote:
> Hi Mark,
>
> You've done an excellent job so far.  It was only days ago when I
> imagined what TWT-Notes would look like with a tree menu like the one
> on DynamicDrive now I've seen it thanks to you.
>
> You might be encouraged to see it too.  It works in IE7 and Google
> Chrome as well.
>
> http://twt-notes-treeview-experimental.tiddlyspot.com/
>
> The first useful working jQuery plugin for TiddlyWiki by MarkS.
> Congratulations, keep going....
>

> Morris Grayhttp://twhelp.tiddlyspot.com
> A TiddlyWiki help file for beginnershttp://twt-notes.tiddlyspot.com

[Morris Gray]

On May 19, 12:18 am, "Mark S." <throa...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> This is probably not the best long term solution. Perhaps someone here
> can explain the proper style syntax that will get this to work without
> physically changing the structure of the file. However, a quick search
> on the net suggests that IE sometimes has problems with the @import
> thing.

I put the css link in MarkupPreHead as:

<link rel="stylesheet" type="text/css" href="http://
www.dynamicdrive.com/dynamicindex1/treeview/jquery.treeview.css" />

Morris Gray

http://twhelp.tiddlyspot.com
A TiddlyWiki help file for beginners
http://twt-notes.tiddlyspot.com
tabbed notes for the taking

[Mike]

Marks example does not work for me, but Morris's does. . .
Looks great !!

Thx,

Mike
FF3.0.9 on XP64

On May 18, 9:59 am, Morris Gray <msg...@symbex.net.au> wrote:
> On May 19, 12:18 am, "Mark S." <throa...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > This is probably not the best long term solution. Perhaps someone here
> > can explain the proper style syntax that will get this to work without
> > physically changing the structure of the file. However, a quick search
> > on the net suggests that IE sometimes has problems with the @import
> > thing.
>
> I put the css link in MarkupPreHead as:
>
> <link rel="stylesheet" type="text/css" href="http://www.dynamicdrive.com/dynamicindex1/treeview/jquery.treeview.css" />
>

> Morris Grayhttp://twhelp.tiddlyspot.com
> A TiddlyWiki help file for beginnershttp://twt-notes.tiddlyspot.com

[Mark S.]

Hah! And now I have the same problem! On all remotely hosted TW's. But
everything is OK on locally hosted TW's.

If you go to Morris' site, and refresh a couple times, you may find it
stops working there as well.

Just a guess, but I suspect that the server at dynamicdrive stops
serving up the all-important images after it has been hit by a 3rd
party site more than 3 or 4 times. Think this may be a common
technique to prevent abuse. BUT, if you download the TW file, and open
from your own system, I think you'll find that it works. Possibly dc
doesn't care if local pages use their images.

Maybe later I'll try posting the images to my personal site, and see
if that makes a difference.

It would be nice if tiny little images like this could be posted to
tiddlyspot.

-- Mark

[Morris Gray]

On May 19, 2:47 am, "Mark S." <throa...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Just a guess, but I suspect that the server at dynamicdrive stops
> serving up the all-important images after it has been hit by a 3rd
> party site more than 3 or 4 times. Think this may be a common
> technique to prevent abuse. BUT, if you download the TW file, and open
> from your own system, I think you'll find that it works. Possibly dc
> doesn't care if local pages use their images.

I think I've worked a few bugs out. I don't see the refresh problem
however I did put the images on my own site because I felt
uncomfortable accessing DynamicDrive. It is now independent I think
except for the images. Perhaps Eric will tell us a way to access the
images via CSS using the Attach plugin.

I think I've 'almost' got everything working now. It needs tidying up
a lot but I've rushed some instructions.

Please give it a try and add a few things and see what needs fixing.

http://twt-notes-treeview-experimental.tiddlyspot.com/index.html

Morris

[Mark S.]

Hi Morris,

Looking good.

The way you installed the CSS, by putting the name of the tiddler, is
that standard TW, or is there a plugin that makes that possible?

Thanks,
Mark

[Eric Weir]

On May 18, 2009, at 5:02 PM, Morris Gray wrote:

> I think I've worked a few bugs out. I don't see the refresh problem
> however I did put the images on my own site because I felt
> uncomfortable accessing DynamicDrive. It is now independent I think
> except for the images. Perhaps Eric will tell us a way to access the
> images via CSS using the Attach plugin.
>
> I think I've 'almost' got everything working now. It needs tidying up
> a lot but I've rushed some instructions.
>
> Please give it a try and add a few things and see what needs fixing.
>
> http://twt-notes-treeview-experimental.tiddlyspot.com/index.html

Ah! At last -- a tree for TiddlyWiki that looks like, and looks like
it might work like, a tree!

I'll be watching this closely.

Thanks,
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Eric Weir
Decatur, GA USA
eew...@bellsouth.net

[Morris Gray]

On May 19, 7:36 am, "Mark S." <throa...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Hi Morris,
>
> Looking good.
>
> The way you installed the CSS, by putting the name of the tiddler, is
> that standard TW, or is there a plugin that makes that possible?

Oh I just named the CSS tiddler the name of the javascript because I
was lazy and copied and pasted, also I turned it off and on so many
times it stood out in the Timeline so I could find it easily... Its
just a tiddler name. What you might not have noticed is that it is
inserted near the bottom of my messy StyleSheet as a nested
stylesheet.

By the way you've done a wonderful job on the plugin for first time
around... or any time around for that matter :-)

I basically set up my site to save you time so you would have an
actual working situation to run it through the mill and get it to the
release stage that much quicker. There has been a lot of people
waiting a long time for something like this.

I've been changing it and uploading it constantly so get the latest
version. I'm going to give it a rest now.

http://twt-notes-treeview-experimental.tiddlyspot.com/index.html

A very tired Morris :-)

[dickon]

This looks great. Before I lose sleep and hair, is it likely to work
in a tiddlyweb environment yet, or would I be wiser to wait a little
while for you clever folk to sort it out further?

I am very interested in using it for my TiddlyManual project for
manualizing mental health interventions (see
http://imp.peermore.com/imp/recipes/imp/tiddlers.wiki )

Dickon.

[IainS]

Am I missing something - what does it look like at the end? It sounds
interesting but I am not sure what it looks like and not sure whether
I have the time to try it out.

Iain

[Mark S.]

Thanks for the encouragement, Morris.

I've just made an update. There is now a new macro (treeview2 off of
TreeviewPluginPlugin2) that will allow you to specify the other tree
styles and some basic settings such as animation, collapse state,
speed.

I hope you don't mind, but I've borrowed your stylesheet setup so
maybe people won't be so puzzled when they see the site and wonder
what its supposed to do. I've also put a referral to your site in the
opening text. Let me know if you want it worded differently or more
prominently ;-)

Thanks,
Mark

[Heller]

Great work... this is really neat

I found one glitch: when you display an expanded tree on opening a
tiddlywiki (as in your example) then instead of displaying a '-' at
the tree branch you display a '+' and from then on collapsing and
expanding the branches always give the opposite symbol. This does work
correctly on trees that are not initially expanded on opening the TW.

RobV

[Morris Gray]

To see it working you only have to click here:

http://twt-notes-treeview-experimental.tiddlyspot.com/

If and when you get time you can download it and experiment.
Instructions are provided to try it in your own TW but you will need
something like that in the above link to add items to the menu
easily. Or you can add the tags manually.

Hi Dickon,

I tried it in you site offline and it works perfectly whether it works
on TiddlyWeb you will have to try it.

Morris

[Alex Hough]

It looks fantastic.
May I suggest something for a future tweek: make it so that it works
without external files.

Maybe characters can be used for the line such as : _ | –

ALex


2009/5/20 Morris Gray <msg...@symbex.net.au>:

--
t: 0161 442 2202
m: 0781 372 50 17
skype: alexhough
delicious: alexhough

[Morris Gray]

On May 20, 1:53 pm, "Mark S." <throa...@yahoo.com> wrote:

Well done Mark. I have added Plugin2 to my site. It is working just
fine, have a look.

For a big menu like I'm using to see how it feels; opening the whole
thing is a bit over the top.

However I put it in the persist state and it remembers where it was
when you last had it open during any session but doesn't persist with
a reload.

The next problem is how to keep it partially open because I'd like a
chosen number of top levels to be open on startup. You might be
interested to know that my first three levels are three different
tiddlers and are where they are because of tags. However they
obviously inherit the open all command.

> I hope you don't mind, but I've borrowed your stylesheet setup.

Not at all but we do need to work something out for the images
though. I can't guarantee I can keep them on my site for everyone for
all time. You might try ImageShack.

Keep on truckin' :-)

Morris

[Mike Norman]

I tried the experimental treeview and it worked on my system (WinXP/
SP3, Firefox 3.0.10); however, when
I navigated away, the portion of the page where the Menu was did not
get re-drawn by FF - tried a couple
different sites, forced a refresh: nothing worked. Somehow, the Menu
'damage' doesn't get 'repaired'.

Anyone else see this?

Mike Norman

[Mark S.]

Hi Morris,

I've just updated plugin2 with a new, undocumented feature.
Undocumented, because we'll have to see if its worth it.

Now when you specify the settings, you can specify a "sesame" and an
"antisesame" tag. Like

'collapsed: false, antisesame: "closed" '

"sesame" (case matters) gives the name of the tag to indicate that a
tiddler should be OPEN by default. "antisesame" gives the name of the
tag to indicate that a tiddler should be CLOSED by default.

So far, I haven't found any use for "sesame" -- in fact, I'm not
entirely sure that it works -- it may be that it only works when you
have a rootless tree.

But for your purposes, the 'antisesame' does seem to work. So if you
say that you want a menu to be open (collapsed: false), but specify
'antisesame' as "closed", and then tag each of the tier two menu items
with "closed", then the tree will be open, but each of the branches
will be closed.

I allow you to specify your own tags, in case you're already using
"open" and "closed" for something, or in case you want to have
different menu trees with different defaults.

The extra code to do this may slow things down a bit ... not sure.
Seems fine on FF so far. Oh, code seems to work on IE 6 so far as
well ... if you want to put that on your front page.

Persistence problems ... well, one thing at a time ;-)

Thanks,
Mark

[Eric Weir]

On May 20, 2009, at 2:24 PM, Mark S. wrote:

> I've just updated plugin2 with a new, undocumented feature.
> Undocumented, because we'll have to see if its worth it.

Somewhere TreeView was described as being "like Windows Explorer." I
think I know the answer, but thought I would ask to make sure, and to
get the feature request out there:

Might it be possible to provide for rearranging items in the tree,
e.g., by dragging?

I wonder also about controlling tiddlers from the tree, e.g., close a
selected tiddler, all tiddlers at a node, or ranges of tiddlers and
nodes of tiddlers.

Probably asking a lot, but they say, "If you don't know ask."

Regards,

[Morris Gray]

Hi Mark,

I've been unsuccessful in making antisesame work on my site. I've
disabled your other versions, tried it on various little branches, I
copied and pasted your antisesame code (but not your tiddlers I admit)
I am a bit thick in the head right now though.

Perhaps you could try it on the latest version of my site since that's
what I tried it on. You got it all fresh in your mind so you might
find I was doing something wrong.

Oh I did notice the +s and -s do get mixed up when trees are open on
startup, I think that was always the case.

Morris

[Mark S.]

The code I'm seeing on your site says version 0.2. The current code
should say 0.21. Maybe you didn't upload after experimenting?

Just checking.

Thanks,
Mark

[Mark S.]

Hi Morris et al,

I've updated the version. Plugin should read .22.

I *think* I've gotten rid of the closed-for-open errors that were
reported. Except for the situation noted in the following.

The "antisesame" option should work better now, and does pretty much
what you expect. You invoke treeview with the "collapsed: false"
option, and it all opens except for those tiddler/folders that you
have marked with the antisesame tag (typically "closed").

The sesame option allows you to mark a tiddler as "open", but it may
not work quite the way you think. If the tree starts as collapsed,
then when you click to open the tree, branches that have been marked
as "open" will already be open -- but only for that level! Not all the
way down the sub-branch. If the tree starts as opened, then the same
behavior applies. The branch is open, but not all the way down AND ...
unfortunately, the crazy bug reappears. I've been trying everything I
can think of ... hopefully this isn't too much a problem at this
stage.

Thanks,
Mark

[Mark S.]

Hello Eric,

On May 20, 11:40 am, Eric Weir <eew...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> On May 20, 2009, at 2:24 PM, Mark S. wrote:
>
> Somewhere TreeView was described as being "like Windows Explorer." I  
> think I know the answer, but thought I would ask to make sure, and to  
> get the feature request out there:

I'm wondering if you're thinking of some other, possibly commercial
product. This treeview is a library of javascript code. Actually,
maybe I should refer to it as Treeview Menu.

> Might it be possible to provide for rearranging items in the tree,  
> e.g., by dragging?

This capability isn't in the native treeview menu code. We can hope
that they might add it some day. I can imagine some ways to emulate it
a bit ... but is a bit mind-numbing.

> I wonder also about controlling tiddlers from the tree, e.g., (1) close a  
> selected tiddler, (2) all tiddlers at a node, or (3) ranges of tiddlers and  
> nodes of tiddlers.

I think I can see a way, by adding "open" command links to the tree
items, to get to (1) and (2). Maybe someone else would know a way to
detect a range necessary for (3). I think it would definitely need to
be something more than one or two people needed ..

Thanks,
Mark

[Mark S.]

For anyone that's interested, I've traced the +s -s bug in this
limited situation to a library incompatibility. The treeview libraries
want their own version of jquery to play with. Fortunately, so far its
a pretty limited effect.

-- Mark

On May 21, 10:55 am, "Mark S." <throa...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> The sesame option ... If the tree starts as opened, then the same

[Eric Weir]

On May 21, 2009, at 5:34 PM, Mark S. wrote:

>> Might it be possible to provide for rearranging items in the tree,
>> e.g., by dragging?
>
> This capability isn't in the native treeview menu code. We can hope
> that they might add it some day. I can imagine some ways to emulate it
> a bit ... but is a bit mind-numbing.

Thanks, Mark. I expected it would not be easy, but thought I would put
it out there. I'll keep my hopes up.

>> I wonder also about controlling tiddlers from the tree, e.g., (1)
>> close a
>> selected tiddler, (2) all tiddlers at a node, or (3) ranges of
>> tiddlers and
>> nodes of tiddlers.
>
> I think I can see a way, by adding "open" command links to the tree
> items, to get to (1) and (2). Maybe someone else would know a way to
> detect a range necessary for (3). I think it would definitely need to
> be something more than one or two people needed ..

Not having used TreeView, yet, I can't say I would really need any of
these. I just noticed, playing with it a little in Morris'
experimental implementation, that after you've clicked on a number of
items in the tree, the tiddlers remain open after the tree has been
collapsed. But maybe that's precisely the way you want it to function:
use the tree as a way to navigate to the tiddlers you want to work with.

I appreciate your work on this. I'm absolutely incapable of being of
any help, but I'm following the development closely, and I can
certainly imagine myself adopting it and finding very helpful.

Not sure where I got the comparison with Windows Explorer. Perhaps I
imagined it.

Sincerely,

[Morris Gray]

On May 22, 4:55 am, "Mark S." <throa...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Hi Morris et al,
>
> I've updated the version. Plugin should read .22.

Hi mark,

I've brought everything up to date at:
http://twt-notes-treeview-experimental.tiddlyspot.com/index.html

The 0.22 plugin is looking very good. It's wonderful to keep certain
levels closed or open at will. It depends on the context within the
menu itself how one uses it and the versatility is great.

Using antisesame I gave it a pretty thorough test an didn't see an
anomalies. Well done.

As far as sesame is concerned I didn't try it since you said it still
had bugs.

As far as having both options, open-sesame and close-sesame, are
concerned if you had to choose one or the other which one would it
be? You can achieve what you want with either one.

Although I only tried close-sesame I found it intuitive to start with
the fully open tree and tag the branches I wanted kept closed. I not
sure how it would be the other way around. However I did start with
an existing menu. If you were building one from the ground up tagging
it as you go would be a different matter.

When you think you have found all the bugs in sesame you know about
let me know and I'll have a go at it.

Great work so far Mark...

Morris

[Morris Gray]

Update

It appears the the behaviour with antisesame is the same whether it is
started with collapsed:false or collapsed:true. I suppose you
shouldn't use antisesame in collapsed true but it may be an indication
of future problems or a clue to known existing bugs.

Morris

[Mark S.]

Hi Morris and anyone else following this topic!

I've just uploaded version 0.23.

This version supports persistence. That is, you can open a tree the
way you like it, close the file, and come back later and have it in
the same open state. You need to have the dynamic drive cookie library
installed, and set up your configuration for the macro appropriately.
The instructions are with the plugin2 tiddler.

Have fun,
Mark

[Morris Gray]

Hi Mark,

Wow it works like a charm, I admire your persistence :-)

However when accessed from TiddlySpot it creats an error in both IE&
and Chrome if you're accessing the cookie script from DynamicDrive.

I suggest that you put the jquery.cookie.js in TiddlyWiki as a
plugin. Someone thoughtfully made TiddlyWiki jQuery compliant :-)

Morris

[Mark S.]

Hi Morris,

Actually, I have the jquery.cookie.js code from DD already embedded in
the code at treeview.tiddlyspot.com ... so hopefully you're referring
to what happened when you updated the plugin2 on your tw site. I
suppose I should make this clearer in the documentation. Then again,
it may be just you and me using it ;-)

Yes, it appears that the server at DD won't serve up *anything* via a
third party web site. Oh well.

Thanks for the feedback!
Mark

[Morris Gray]

On May 23, 3:40 pm, "Mark S." <throa...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Hi Morris,
>
> Actually, I have the jquery.cookie.js code from DD already embedded in
> the code at treeview.tiddlyspot.com ... so hopefully you're referring
> to what happened when you updated the plugin2 on your tw site. I
> suppose I should make this clearer in the documentation. Then again,
> it may be just you and me using it ;-)

Yes I had the the problems with IE and Chrome after updating to your
version .23 and using the persist option. And no, I didn't know you
had the cookie script in your core.

It works perfectly as a TiddlyWiki plugin and for distribution it's
better for obvious reasons. Probably some of this stuff possibly can
be fitted into your plugin - I assume.

See below on how I installed your plugin :-)
http://twt-notes-treeview-experimental.tiddlyspot.com/index.html#1TreeviewSetup

You're doing really well and when you're done you'll find a lot of
people will want to use it.

Morris

[Eric Weir]

On May 23, 2009, at 4:18 AM, Morris Gray wrote:

> On May 23, 3:40 pm, "Mark S." <throa...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Actually, I have the jquery.cookie.js code from DD already embedded
>> in
>> the code at treeview.tiddlyspot.com ... so hopefully you're referring
>> to what happened when you updated the plugin2 on your tw site.
>

> It works perfectly as a TiddlyWiki plugin and for distribution it's
> better for obvious reasons. Probably some of this stuff possibly can
> be fitted into your plugin - I assume.
>
> See below on how I installed your plugin :-)
> http://twt-notes-treeview-experimental.tiddlyspot.com/index.html#1TreeviewSetup
>
> You're doing really well and when you're done you'll find a lot of
> people will want to use it.

Count me in. However, I have a question. Taking a look at
JqueryTreeViewCSS in your TWT-Notes installation, do I understand
correctly that you will need to be online to use this plugin when it
is ready?

Thanks,

[Mark S.]

The little icons that make up the tree have to be available either in
a local directory, or online somewhere. When I put TW on a stick, I
tend to take an entire directory at once anyways. That way I can carry
along information that would bloat the TW file -- like images and web
sites.

If there is a way to access images embedded with the AttachFilePlugin
in CSS, then maybe the tree could be completely contained in the TW.

The images are used as background urls in the CSS that gets applied to
the tree. So if some CSS expert knows how to translate background
images into text substitutes, maybe that could be another off-line
approach.

-- Mark

[wolfgang]

Hi Mark,

> The images are used as background urls in the CSS that gets applied to
> the tree. So if some CSS expert knows how to translate background
> images into text substitutes, maybe that could be another off-line
> approach.
>

Though not really an expert, but here an example of an embedded
background image in a stylesheet. The theme switch is accessible in
the options panel:

http://www.zrenard.com/tiddlywiki/tiddlywiki.html#Ectopolis1

I think it would be good to use stylesheet transclusion in this case.
So the embedding can also be circumvented by those who prefer it with
real icons.

regards..

[Eric Shulman]

> If there is a way to access images embedded with the AttachFilePlugin
> in CSS, then maybe the tree could be completely contained in the TW.

The good news is that AttachFilePluginFormatters -- the 'runtime'
rendering functions that handle 'attachment tiddlers' -- already
supports the use of attached images within the StyleSheet.

When a tiddler containing the [[TiddlerName]] syntax is *displayed*,
it usually just renders a link to another tiddler. However, if this
syntax occurs within your StyleSheet then, when the CSS in the
StyleSheet tiddler is *processed*, any instances of [[...]] will also
be used to *insert* the contents of the indicated tiddler directly
into the CSS *before* it is passed to the browser for further
handling.

This use of [[...]] has been enhanced by AttachFilePluginFormatters to
recognize tiddlers tagged with 'attachment' as a special case and,
rather than inserting the entire contents of the attachment tiddler,
it automatically retrieves a URL -- either data://, file://, or http://
-- based upon the attachment definition, and then inserts that URL
into the CSS before further processing.

Thus, using the CSS standard syntax for embedding a background image:
.someClass { background-image: url('...'); }
you can easily insert a URL from an attachment tiddler, like this:
.someClass { background-image: url('[[SomeTiddler]]'); }

enjoy,
-e
Eric Shulman
TiddlyTools / ELS Design Studios

[Mark S.]

Thanks Eric!

I've tried this on 2 or 3 images, and it seems to be working well.
Guess I'll be doing a bit of cutting and pasting this weekend.

Thanks!
Mark

[Mark S.]

Thanks to Eric, the treeview menu is now portable. The images are
embedded in the TW file. Calling this 0.24. Additional documentation
in the plugin write-up.

Thanks all!
Mark

On May 23, 11:22 am, "Mark S." <throa...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Thanks Eric!
>
> I've tried this on 2 or 3 images, and it seems to be working well.
> Guess I'll be doing a bit of cutting and pasting this weekend.
>
> Thanks!
> Mark
>
> On May 23, 10:19 am, Eric Shulman <elsdes...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > The good news is that AttachFilePluginFormatters -- the 'runtime'
> > rendering functions that handle 'attachment tiddlers' -- already
> > supports the use of attached images within the StyleSheet.
>

>...

[Eric Weir]

On May 23, 2009, at 4:32 PM, Mark S. wrote:

> . . . the treeview menu is now portable. The images are

> embedded in the TW file. Calling this 0.24. Additional documentation

> in the plugin write-up.,

Wow! That was quick. But that's the way things happen around here.

Looking forward to giving TreeView a try.

Thank *you*, Mark. And of course, as always, Eric, too.

Sincerely,

[Eric Weir]

Another question, that may already have been answered: will it be
possible exclude tiddlers from the tree, the way you can from the
sidebar with excludeLists?

Thanks in advance,

[wolfgang]

> > Might it be possible to provide for rearranging items in the tree,
> > e.g., by dragging?
>
> This capability isn't in the native treeview menu code. We can hope
> that they might add it some day. I can imagine some ways to emulate it
> a bit ... but is a bit mind-numbing.
>

It is mind-numbing, since it would have to retag all tiddlers, if you
dragged a top-level tiddler somewhere else all at once. A batch
process which is only possible now with intermediated steps with tools
as:

http://lewcid.org/tiddlywiki-bookmarklets/ RenameAllTagged
http://yann.perrin.googlepages.com/twkd.html#TemplatedTagTools
http://ido-xp.tiddlyspot.com/#MultiTagEditorPlugin
http://www.tiddlytools.com/#TiddlerTweaker

but maybe there's the possibility for integrating for example the
bookmarklet RenameAllTagged for this purpose somehow?

regards..

[wolfgang]

Hi Eric,

> Another question, that may already have been answered: will it be
> possible exclude tiddlers from the tree, the way you can from the
> sidebar with excludeLists?
>

Since Treeview is based on tags the excludeLists tag should also work
here. As long as it hasn't been tagged with a top level tag.

regards..

[Mark S.]

For this particular tree structure, I don't think you'd have to rename
all tags.

root
root.a
a.Jonas
a.Silas
Silas.Bod
root.b
b.Coraline
b.OtherMother

where the dot notation indicates:

tagname(parent branch).node(leaf).name

Then to move "Bod" to "OtherMother" would only require renaming the
"Silas" tag on "OtherMother" to "Coraline" :

root
root.a
a.Jonas
a.Silas
root.b
b.Coraline
b.OtherMother
OtherMother.Bod

Or to then move the entire "a" branch below "Coraline", just change
the "root" tag on "a" to "Coraline" :

root
root.b
b.Coraline
Coraline.a
a.Jonas
a.Silas
b.OtherMother
OtherMother.Bod

But I'm new at this, so may be missing some more complicated
situation.

Its the dragging and dropping that worries me, since its not in the
library and would probably require wading through the treeview code.
What could be feasible is to put a button or link on each branch for
cutting. Click on the button to cut, and then click on another branch
button to paste. The tags get renamed, and when its sorted out, the
branch or leaf has been moved.

Thanks,
Mark

[Morris Gray]

On May 25, 12:05 am, Eric Weir <eew...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> Another question, that may already have been answered: will it be
> possible exclude tiddlers from the tree, the way you can from the
> sidebar with excludeLists?

The way TWT-Notes-Exp is set up TheTop Level tiddler name is the tag
for all of it's children. And that's the same for the top level
tiddler of any branch. If you want childA removed just remove it's
tag. Or by using the name of childB as a tag for childA then you
can merge childA beneath childB.

By the same token you can merge one complete tree structure into any
branch of another structure by simply changing one tag. Likewise you
can break off a branch of any size from a structure by changing one
tag.

This is the original structure of TWT Notes. I have inserted whole
original TWT-Notes structures into Treeview without changing anything
except removing a piece of extraneous code from the contents of the
second level tiddler.

With TWT-Notes-Exp, because it automatically updates the tree, using
the TaggerPlugin you can sit and watch the structure reorder itself
as you change tags. You can remove a branch while the rest of the
tree pulls up the remaining structure and welds itself back together.
It's much more fun that dragging and dropping :-) It's action from a
distance.

You can built structures just as easily, by clicking on 'make
subtopic' in the toolbar you can add a tiddler or a branch at any
level simply with one click. Then reorder them with Tagger if need be.

Now people might start understanding TiddlyWiki better and it having
broader appeal with the non-linear chaos taking shape and gaining some
order. The days might be coming to an end of chasing tiddlers up and
down the screen and when you click on something seeing tiddlers scroll
by like a demented gaming machine in Las Vegas:-)

Well done Mark.

http://twt-notes-treeview-experimental.tiddlyspot.com/index.html

Morris

[Eric Weir]

On May 24, 2009, at 5:32 PM, Morris Gray wrote:

> On May 25, 12:05 am, Eric Weir <eew...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>> Another question, that may already have been answered: will it be
>> possible exclude tiddlers from the tree, the way you can from the
>> sidebar with excludeLists?
>
> The way TWT-Notes-Exp is set up TheTop Level tiddler name is the tag
> for all of it's children. And that's the same for the top level
> tiddler of any branch. If you want childA removed just remove it's
> tag. Or by using the name of childB as a tag for childA then you
> can merge childA beneath childB.
>
> By the same token you can merge one complete tree structure into any
> branch of another structure by simply changing one tag. Likewise you
> can break off a branch of any size from a structure by changing one
> tag.
>

> . . . .

>
> With TWT-Notes-Exp, because it automatically updates the tree, using
> the TaggerPlugin you can sit and watch the structure reorder itself
> as you change tags. You can remove a branch while the rest of the
> tree pulls up the remaining structure and welds itself back together.
> It's much more fun that dragging and dropping :-) It's action from a
> distance.

I was almost going to say this gives me everything I want, but there's
a situation I'm certain I'll want to do frequently that's not taken
care of: I can't reorder list of tiddlers at the same level in the
tree, say move one from lower down in the list to higher up on the
same level, e.g., where each tiddler contains a paragraph of a
document and I want the paragraphs to appear in an order other than
alphabetic.

I suppose that could be taken care of by composing topics to indicate
order in a list as well as the content of the tiddler, which I've been
doing anyway.

Still, while it doesn't give me quite give me everything I want, it
almost does. [I have an old DOS "outlining" program that I miss very
much, and I'm probably subconsciously hoping that TreeView will
eventually let me do all the things I used to do with it. Nothing ever
will. It was/is genuinely unique. [I put "outlining" in quotes because
calling it that doesn't begin to do it justice. It was more an idea
capturer, organizer, and reorganizing.] I've pleaded with the
developer to adapt it to run as a command driven application in Linux
and OS X. He's promised he will, but it keeps not appearing. Oh how I
miss it.]

>
> Now people might start understanding TiddlyWiki better and it having
> broader appeal with the non-linear chaos taking shape and gaining some

> order. . . .

My bet is they will.

> Well done Mark

Amen. Amen. Amen.

Thanks to both of you.

Sincerely,

[Eric Weir]

Thanks, wolfgang.

And while I'm at it, glad to see you back on TiddlyWiki GoogleGroup. I
wondered if you were OK.

Sincerely,

[pat]

I know cross-posting is a no-no, but I realize that I posted a comment
about treeview there:
http://groups.google.com/group/TiddlyWiki/browse_thread/thread/ae27dbd756c135fe
that properly belonged here, so I hope I'll be forgiven this time. And
this will bump up a topic that deserves to be at the top!

The trees currently expand horizontally, which is very suitable to the
intended use in the side bar. Could the code be tweaked to offer a
vertical top-down expansion too? This would be useful to display trees
with few but long branches, as opposed to trees with many but short
branches.

[wolfgang]

> Thanks, wolfgang.
>
> And while I'm at it, glad to see you back on TiddlyWiki GoogleGroup. I
> wondered if you were OK.
>
> Sincerely,
>

Thanks for caring, Eric. I did have to struggle with an age/stress
related disease (PAD), which consumed all my time.
Gladly, the situation now improved a bid again.

> intended use in the side bar. Could the code be tweaked to offer a
> vertical top-down expansion too?

For the case this isn't possible, you could also dynamically widen the
main menu area to fit even more sub-branches, requiring only some
slight changes to the default style. I set up an example here:
http://menuflex.tiddlyspot.com/

The original implementation for Overflowing styles by FND here:
http://cleanlayout.tiddlyspot.com/

regards..

[Mark S.]

I think what you want is a whole different animal -- the accordion
menu. Like:

http://www.dynamicdrive.com/dynamicindex17/ddaccordionmenu-bullet.htm

Maybe there's already an accordion menu for TW out there?

-- Mark

On Jun 2, 5:46 pm, pat <annopo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I know cross-posting is a no-no, but I realize that I posted a comment

> about treeview there:http://groups.google.com/group/TiddlyWiki/browse_thread/thread/ae27db...

[pat toche]

> Maybe there's already an accordion menu for TW out there?

There is this plugin:
AccordionMenuPlugin
AccordionMenuPluginDemo
http://tw.lewcid.org/

which I've tested and enjoyed.

[pat toche]

> I set up an example here:http://menuflex.tiddlyspot.com/

very elegant, thanks for the pointer -- I noticed more than a few
nifty features I like!

wishing you the better and the best Wolfgang,

Pat

[Mark S.]

Thanks for pointing that out!

Now, if it was only tag based ... I suppose it would be possible to
create a macro that would generate the unordered list, and then
*maybe* the accordion macro right after it would then turn it into an
accordion menu. However, I can't tell from the demo if the menu
understands nested lists -- which you would need for a family tree or
similar project.

-- Mark

On Jun 3, 6:28 am, pat toche <annopo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Maybe there's already an accordion menu for TW out there?
>
> There is this plugin:
> AccordionMenuPlugin

> AccordionMenuPluginDemohttp://tw.lewcid.org/

[pat toche]

>I can't tell from the demo if the menu understands nested lists

I don't think it understands nested lists, I made several attempts but
it would only display one level of the accordion.

Relatedly, I think, there is something called hypergraph discussed
here:
http://groups.google.com/group/TiddlyWiki/browse_thread/thread/1f0849e4ed778541/e7b375436b608a64?lnk=gst&q=hypergraph#e7b375436b608a64

and the example still available here:
http://dl.getdropbox.com/u/241006/TiddlyTagmapGraph.html

I have no idea how to use it though!

[wolfgang]

> Relatedly, I think, there is something called hypergraph discussed

> here:http://groups.google.com/group/TiddlyWiki/browse_thread/thread/1f0849...

>
> and the example still available here:http://dl.getdropbox.com/u/241006/TiddlyTagmapGraph.html
>
> I have no idea how to use it though!

The original hypergraph with instructions to install is here:

http://project.dahukanna.net/tiddlywiki/twextensions.htm

Beside its beauty - it also depends on external files and to make
custom mindmaps (as in above example) an xml file has to be edited in
an external editor.

> wishing you the better and the best Wolfgang,
>
> Pat

Thanks :-)

[Tobias Beer]

On 18 Mai, 07:38, "Mark S." <throa...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> A few days ago Morris Gray pointed out thetreeviewplugin code for
> jquery developed by the folks athttp://www.dynamicdrive.com/.
>
> I've been hoping for some capability like this would come along, so
> I've taken a first stab at implementing it:
>
> http://treeview.tiddlyspot.com/
>
> There are things that aren't quite perfect, and maybe some of the TW
> wizards here can step in. I wasn't able to find the code that formats
> tooltip titles on links, so I'm using a simplified expression. And
> the menu doesn't refresh itself automatically. The way I implemented
> it might be a bit kludgey, too, in some eyes.
>
> But it shows that it can be done.
>
> -- Mark

This is interesting indeed, though a bit of a hassle for predominantly
single file users. As an alternative, I find that the sitemap-view of
mptw's tagglyTagging offers quite a powerful (and fast) tree
too ...without collapsing images or any external files.

On 18 Mai, 09:05, Morris Gray <msg...@symbex.net.au> wrote:
> Ahh my little acorn,
>
> You have done well. Each journey begins with the smallest of
> steps.... if one doesn't get rooted along the way :-)
>
> Here is some plant food for your little bonsai. Sprinkle this into
> your PageTemplate and your tree will grow automatically with each
> tiddler tier.
>
> <div id='mainMenu' refresh='content' force='true' tiddler='MainMenu'></
> div>
>
> Keep up the good work, acorn.
>
> Morris Grayhttp://twhelp.tiddlyspot.com
> A TiddlyWiki help file for beginners
>
> On May 18, 3:38 pm, "Mark S." <throa...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > A few days ago Morris Gray pointed out thetreeviewplugin code for
> > jquery developed by the folks athttp://www.dynamicdrive.com/.
>
> > I've been hoping for some capability like this would come along, so
> > I've taken a first stab at implementing it:
>
> > http://treeview.tiddlyspot.com/
>
> > There are things that aren't quite perfect, and maybe some of the TW
> > wizards here can step in. I wasn't able to find the code that formats
> > tooltip titles on links, so I'm using a simplified expression. And
> > the menu doesn't refresh itself automatically. The way I implemented
> > it might be a bit kludgey, too, in some eyes.
>
> > But it shows that it can be done.
>
> > -- Mark
>
Also, saving changes to a tiddler seems to be quite time consuming on
http://twt-treeview.tiddlyspot.com ...I guess that is due to
refreshing the mainmenu after every change. So, if you're fine with
having it updated only when refreshed, I recommend to not make any
changes to the main menu section in the page template. Though this
would, of course, result in a more "static" version of "el arbol" ;o)

Tobias.

[Morris Gray]

On Jun 24, 1:17 am, Tobias Beer <beertob...@googlemail.com> wrote:

> This is interesting indeed, though a bit of a hassle for predominantly
> single file users. As an alternative, I find that the sitemap-view of
> mptw's tagglyTagging offers quite a powerful (and fast) tree
> too ...without collapsing images or any external files.

TagglyTagging is powerful but for users not familiar TiddlyWiki it can
provide far too much information that distracts from the application a
particular TiddlyWiki might be designed for. However it is a
wonderful TiddlyWiki builder's and TiddlyWiki power user's tool.

TagglyTagging requires good spacial recognition and some understanding
not only of a TiddlyWiki's structure but an understanding of
TagglyTagging itself. For those unfamiliar with these things it can
become a maze to get lost in.

By the way TWT-Treeview is a single file and does not rely on any
external files or images for working in Firefox, Chrome and Opera. For
those who can put up with the glacial speed of IE then they can put up
with external images that are conveniently supplied because IE doesn't
recognize embedded images.

> Also, saving changes to a tiddler seems to be quite time consuming on http://twt-treeview.tiddlyspot.com...I guess that is due to

> refreshing the mainmenu after every change. So, if you're fine with
> having it updated only when refreshed, I recommend to not make any
> changes to the main menu section in the page template. Though this
> would, of course, result in a more "static" version of "el arbol" ;o)

All TiddlyWikis refresh the MainMenu when it's changed and seldom has
anyone noticed them as quite time consuming. In TWT-Treeview it is
forced to refresh because it can be silently changed by adding items
to it through Treeview. Also if auto save is enabled it saves after
every edit which can be changed.

It is self defeating to try to build a tree structure without seeing
immediate results. To have to put work into adding topics or branches
to the menu and then save and reload to see them is silly. The results
are instantaneous with the PageTemplate the way it was designed. I
would strongly disagree that changing it speeds anything up.

Thanks for your evaluation it's good to get feedback.

Morris Gray
http://twt-treeview-executive.tiddlyspot.com/
The ultimate TiddlyWiki

> Also, saving changes to a tiddler seems to be quite time consuming onhttp://twt-treeview.tiddlyspot.com...I guess that is due to

[Eric Weir]

On Jun 23, 2009, at 10:39 PM, Morris Gray wrote:

> Morris Gray
> http://twt-treeview-executive.tiddlyspot.com/
> The ultimate TiddlyWiki

Missed the announcement of this, Morris. Not sure I will use all the
features, some are not quite to my taste, but many are very
attractive. Tabbed menus is especially neat for Treeview.

Regards,
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[wolfgang]

> > Morris Gray
> >http://twt-treeview-executive.tiddlyspot.com/
> > The ultimate TiddlyWiki
>
> Missed the announcement of this, Morris.
>

A very beautiful TW indeed, thanks for setting it up and making it so
easy to use :-)

regards..

[Tobias Beer]

On Jun 24, 4:39 am, Morris Gray <msg...@symbex.net.au> wrote:
> TagglyTagging is powerful but for users not familiar TiddlyWiki it can
> provide far too much information that distracts from the application a
> particular TiddlyWiki might be designed for.  However it is a
> wonderful TiddlyWiki builder's and TiddlyWiki power user's tool.

Maybe for some it's a power users tool, for me it only took a few
moments of consideration and the understanding that it is incredibly
powerful in listing tiddler relations that go far beyond the "tagging"
box... and all this without any further special setup or wikisyntax,
but only a good understanding of how to make powerful use of tags.

> TagglyTagging requires good spacial recognition and some understanding
> not only of a TiddlyWiki's structure but an understanding of
> TagglyTagging itself. For those unfamiliar with these things it can
> become a maze to get lost in.

I can surely can imagine that.

> By the way TWT-Treeview is a single file and does not rely on any
> external files or images for working in Firefox, Chrome and Opera. For
> those who can put up with the glacial speed of IE then they can put up
> with external images that are conveniently supplied because IE doesn't
> recognize embedded images.

I seemed to have seen references to external js files in the
"original" treeview wiki and thus put it into the "not so much a
single-file-wiki category. Good indeed, that I find myself corrected!

> It is self defeating to try to build a tree structure without seeing
> immediate results.  To have to put work into adding topics or branches
> to the menu and then save and reload to see them is silly. The results
> are instantaneous with the PageTemplate the way it was designed.  I
> would strongly disagree that changing it speeds anything up.

As fo me it speeds things up by magnitudes... and as for when to use
"global" refresh, instead of immediate update would be when you use
your tiddlywiki more as a public wiki (site) available to others, such
that there is no need to always work with "live content".

> Thanks for your evaluation it's good to get feedback.

I surely never intent to sound overly critical, though unfortunately I
tend to focus on the what-I-don't-like's of a given concept /
implementation ;o) So, I hope plenty of folks will find TWT-Treeview
as useful as you do!

[wolfgang]

> By the way TWT-Treeview is a single file and does not rely on any
> external files or images for working in Firefox, Chrome and Opera. For
> those who can put up with the glacial speed of IE then they can put up
> with external images that are conveniently supplied because IE doesn't
> recognize embedded images.
>

If one does it without the AttachFile package but embeds data:uri's
directly, or via transclusion, in the stylesheet - also IE does
display the tiny Icons of treeview - and no need for AttachFile
package and additional external pics in the first place:

http://menuflex.tiddlyspot.com/#Ico%20JqueryTreeviewCSS

For reasons explained by Paul in this thread:

http://groups.google.com/group/TiddlyWikiDev/browse_thread/thread/1b346e3f6e0eaf3f#

Regards..

[wolfgang]

> By the way TWT-Treeview is a single file and does not rely on any
> external files or images for working in Firefox, Chrome and Opera. For
> those who can put up with the glacial speed of IE then they can put up
> with external images that are conveniently supplied because IE doesn't
> recognize embedded images.
>

[Morris Gray]

On Jul 3, 6:00 pm, wolfgang <wolfgangl...@gmail.com> wrote:

> If one does it without the AttachFile package but embeds data:uri's
> directly, or via transclusion, in the stylesheet - also IE does
> display the tiny Icons of treeview - and no need for AttachFile
> package and additional external pics in the first place:
>
> http://menuflex.tiddlyspot.com/#Ico%20JqueryTreeviewCSS

Thanks for this wolfgang I'm giving it a try. In the next few hours
I'll put up a version of TWT-Blackicity using this method for images.
It is also is demonstrating a tag based accordion menu.

By the way treeview-red-line.gif has a typo in it in you Ico sections
tiddler it has treeview-redline.gif (with the hyphen missing)

Thanks for the embedded data:uri tip and converting so many images to
it.

Morris

> http://groups.google.com/group/TiddlyWikiDev/browse_thread/thread/1b3...
>
> Regards..