Presenting: RichLinks - external links presented as objects

[Mat]

The TWaddler, inspired by a request, proudly presents...

RichLinks


<:-)


P.S - If you like TiddlyWiki, TELL your friends.

[Thomas Elmiger]

Hi Mat

Thank you for this really great functionality!

The tweet did not show up for me when I tried yesterday, but it does now. Everything else seemed to work immediately. Great demos!

Have you thought about making a richlink-plugin?

Have a great Sunday,
Thomas

[Mat]

Thanks Thomas!

The tweet did not show up for me when I tried yesterday, but it does now.

Interestingly that is how it behaved for me too. But that also happened when I tried the TW Twitter plugin itself, i.e without RichLink. I believe a page reload made the tweet appear.

 

Everything else seemed to work immediately. Great demos!

I'm curious, does the soundcloud link play the song without issues? It doesn't for me in Chrome but it works in FF. I corresponded with Birthe who also reported irregularities for different OS's (i.e not browsers). But again, this is unlikely to have anything to do with RichLink which is just a "shell".

Have you thought about making a richlink-plugin?

Yeah... but I'm not sure what to put into it. The main macro yes, but much other stuff is made for customization and none of the templates are required.  And it needs Tobias' split plugin which opens a generally interesting question on how to present a plugin that requires another (I posted this issue apropos this).

Thanks for you feedback Thomas!

<:-)

[Mat]

BTW, anyone who thinks TW should feature something like this as a standard,
please add a like to this github request.

<:-)

[@TiddlyTweeter]

Ciao Mat

Indeed there are issues with Soundcloud in Chrome. I don't understand what the issue is but users regularly report it.

My 2 cents,
Josiah

Mat wrote...

[@TiddlyTweeter]

Great Utility. Both works and also highlights how good/easy TW can be. These are the kinds of mature utilities we need.

Four suggestions ...

1 - Release it as a proper plugin.

2 - Don't bother with options on the various "sites or file types". Just wrap them ALL in a plugin (the overhead is small) and give note you can delete what you don't need and make new ones.

3 - Give one example of using relative paths (is that doable?) such that you could author locally and then upload & still  have it work.

4 - Mention you can use the "Stamp" tool to insert a boilerplate for it in the editor.

Best wishes
Josiah

[Mat]

@Josiah,

I updated the Soundcloud demo to mention their users have reported problems. Thanks for info.
info to mention

1 - Release it as a proper plugin.

2 - Don't bother with options on the various "sites or file types". Just wrap them ALL in a plugin (the overhead is small) and give note you can delete what you don't need and make new ones.

That's the problem though; you can't delete what you don't want from a plugin. And even if I add only, say, the main macro and the dictionary into a plugin, there's still the need for the Split plugin.
 

3 - Give one example of using relative paths (is that doable?) such that you could author locally and then upload & still  have it work.

Please describe a bit more what you mean.
 

4 - Mention you can use the "Stamp" tool to insert a boilerplate for it in the editor.

Good point. Might look into that.  If anyone makes such a stamp, I'd be happy to include it.


<:-)

[@TiddlyTweeter]

Mat ...

That's the problem though; you can't delete what you don't want from a plugin

Oops, sorry. I never knew!

Josiah

Josiah:

[HC Haase]

This is awesome.. would be cool to have this as standard.

[PMario]

On Sunday, May 14, 2017 at 12:46:39 PM UTC+2, Mat wrote:

BTW, anyone who thinks TW should feature something like this as a standard,
please add a like to this github request.

Not really a fan of this being default. ... eg: If you load content from 3rd parties like ths, you ping them and provide a whole load of information about your current status and activity. eg: IP address used, which gives a good approximation of your current location. Content, that you are interested in, at the current moment ... and so on.

This is a nice plugin, and it should stay that way! Everyone, who wants to use it, should be able to do so. ... AND ... everyone, who doesn't want to expose private information, should be free to do so as well.

just my 2cents
mario

[Mat]

On Monday, May 15, 2017 at 12:39:28 PM UTC+2, PMario wrote:

On Sunday, May 14, 2017 at 12:46:39 PM UTC+2, Mat wrote:

BTW, anyone who thinks TW should feature something like this as a standard,
please add a like to this github request.

Not really a fan of this being default. ... eg: If you load content from 3rd parties like ths, you ping them

Let's not throw out the baby with the bath water. The core wouldn't necessarily have to provide any "pinging" templates at all. It could feature the equivalent of the richlink main macro and the (customizable) dictionary, without templates... but, it could (should!) IMO provide at least templates for local files. Many people want to show e.g pdf documents and it would be super simple for people to make e.g nice image albums or audio or video libraries for local files.

...AND if the user does want the pinging commercial services, then he can rather easily make those too.


<:-)

[PMario]

Hi Mat,

There are several ways to achieve similar results, but if the core dictates one approach we need to stick with it. In my opinion stuff like this is perfectly fine as a plugin.

If the core renders external links, they should behave like browser links. They should open new tabs. .. I personally don't want to open a PDF inside a tiddler. I want it to be a link to a new tab.

Plugins also have the advantage, that the development can be completely independent from the core. So the update / feature request cycle can be much faster.

So my proposal is to improve the plugin discovery mechanism, instead of including every possible extension into the core.

-m

[@TiddlyTweeter]

Cari

I have no idea on the underlying tech issues.

I do feel we are selling TW short by NOT having ways that users can find brilliant plugins like Mat's without having to read f***g google groups 24/7.

So, overall, I feel PMario's "improve the plugin discovery mechanism" is likely the rightest direction if we want anyone but Constant Readers to have a clue what is available.

Best wishes
Josiah

[Mat]

PMario wrote:

There are several ways to achieve similar results, but if the core dictates one approach we need to stick with it. In my opinion stuff like this is perfectly fine as a plugin.

From a marketing perspective, this is almost a given. IMO this is one of those things that people expect in modern comparable systems.

It is even so fundamental that much of it is part of HTML5. Integrating it into TW would only bring the functionality closer to the user for easy application. To use Josiahs term here above, "we're selling TW short" by not featuring this in the standard distro.

If the core renders external links, they should behave like browser links. They should open new tabs. .. I personally don't want to open a PDF inside a tiddler. I want it to be a link to a new tab.

Ok, but again, which templates to include is another matter. If no template is identified for a link... then it's just a normal link.

Actually, I'm reminded of the setting for tiddler titles - "show as text VS. show as link".  External links could be "show embedded (where template exists)  VS. show as plain link".

So: No forced pinging and no forced display - which seem to be your main objections (and I agree with them!)  Rather, only the "infrastructure", i.e the equivalents of the richlink main macro and the dictionary, to simplify custom templates.


<:-)

[@TiddlyTweeter]

Ciao Mat

I did a test as follows that confirms the plugin supports relative paths, at least for the ".jpg" file type. I haven't tried the other types yet but assume they will too.

The code...

<<richlink "img/masterdon_havisham_ch8.jpg" "Havisham">>

... works identically for a local TW and for the same TW put online. I hope this clarifies what I meant. It also answered my own question :-).

Best wishes
Josiah

Mat wrote ...

Josiah suggested ...

[Mark S.]

Hi Mat,

Very nice!

Am I missing something -- is there a way to use this with PDF?

Thanks!
Mark

[@TiddlyTweeter]

Ciao Mark S.

It works fine with PDF.

The issue may be PDF does not always work fine with it.

That is not a RichLinks issue per se. Its most likely a browser settings issue. PDFs can be more complicated than other file types.

As a start I suggest checking the browser settings to ensure that its using its own "preview" / "viewer" and not a third-party app for PDF.

Best wishes
Josiah

[@TiddlyTweeter]

Ciao Mat

On the issues for PDF display ... is there a way that the RichLinks can elegantly degrade into a normal link IF an embeddable viewer is not available?

I'm not sure how much of a regular occurrence PDF display failure in-page is now. But it does happen because the handling of the PDF file type in browsers, at least in the past, was quite complex and often involved invoking 3rd party apps. 

Just comments
Josiah

[Mark S.]

You're right. I must have done something wrong with my first test.

Text also works, which is good because text doesn't work with _canonical_uri on my system.

Thanks,
Mark

[Mat]

Josiah,

"relative paths" - OK, I think you're referring to what I would call "local files".

Thanks for your test! I hadn't investigated this but, yes, it does work - it is a matter of using a link/path with a supported filetype ending (e.g ....jpg). Any difference in behaviour from external links should not be because of RichLinks. Anyway, thanks. I should update the docs to make this clear.


<:-)

[Mat]

Mark S,

Am I missing something -- is there a way to use this with PDF?

I felt compelled to split out the demo for PDF because some browsers insist on triggering download for PDFs. But, yeah, it does work, and eventual "problems" is likely not because of RichLink.

<:-)

[Mat]

Josiah,

... is there a way that the RichLinks can elegantly degrade into a normal link IF an embeddable viewer is not available?

That's a good idea - for all templates! If the rich embedding fails, the link should show! Currently, nothing is shown which is bad. I'll see what I can do.

Thanks!

<:-)

[@TiddlyTweeter]

Ciao Mat

I think of "local files" as just those on my PC. But I think of "relative links" for use both locally AND online. The point being to create something that works whatever the context.

J, x

[@TiddlyTweeter]

Ciao Mat

I been looking at the ".txt" file type.

I been looking around to see if there is a simple way to wrap long lines in "objects" of that type so you can properly read them. I haven't found any. Maybe its a fundamental limitation? Because its not a part of TW file you can't enforce any styling on it? I'm not clear if JavaScript might be able to do that or not?

Best wishes
Josiah

[Mat]

@TiddlyTweeter wrote:

I been looking at the ".txt" file type.

I been looking around to see if there is a simple way to wrap long lines in "objects" of that type so you can properly read them. I haven't found any. Maybe its a fundamental limitation?

Not sure what you mean. Does the text not wrap properly for you in the object? I.e can you not put anything...

<object data="$link$" type="text/plain" style="width:HERE; height:$height$; " scrolling:yes>
<a href="$link$" target="_blank">$link$</a> (missing or not supported)
</object>

Because its not a part of TW file you can't enforce any styling on it? I'm not clear if JavaScript might be able to do that or not?

 
I believe <object> has the same limitations as iframes, i.e that you can style the object/iframe but not the content because the content is on someone elses domain. BUT there are tricks that could enable it, involving JavaScript, where you e.g scrape the content and reproduce it locally. This would, as far as I can tell, be particularly suitable for plain texts.

<:-)

[@TiddlyTweeter]

Ciao Mat

To clarify, what I am seeing in Firefox on PC is this from your demo ...


Without wrapping of paragraphs to the "object window" width its not really readable.

Best wishes
Josiah.

[@TiddlyTweeter]

Ciao Mat

I just tried the same in Chrome on PC & it comes wrapped and with correct paragraph breaks.... like this bit ...


Best wishes
Josiah

[Mat]

Josiah

.txt files wrapping - You're right. It seems it wraps well in Chrome but not in Firefox. I googled around but find no solution :-/

Again, of course, this is not because of RichLink, and likely not TW.  Frustrating with all these browser differences.

<:-)

[@TiddlyTweeter]

The whole fantasy of "Web standards" makes me apoplectic. Standards, my ass. Ending up having to deal with someone else's problem basically put me completely off getting into net stuff beyond the superficial level.

I take my hat off to people who can handle the mess it really is.

*Rant off*

Josiah

[@TiddlyTweeter]

Ciao Mat

At the practical level its perhaps worth in the documentation noting that the .txt works WELL in Chrome though poorly in Firefox. Its worth it for the Chrome IMO, even though I don't use it much, as it is the majority browser.

Best wìshes

Josiah

On Friday, 19 May 2017 18:57:13 UTC+2, Mat wrote:

[Stephen Wilson]

I'm probably just being slow...but how does the syntax for the iframes one look?

Thought I could update the template to this:

<iframe src="link" width="100%" height="413" style="border:0px;" allowtransparency="true"></iframe>
<span style="display:block; padding-top:2px; color:#818181; font-size:13px;">
<a href="Direct Link to embeded page" style=" color:#818181; font-size:13px;" target="_blank">Title</a>, by <a href="Direct Link to home page" style=" color:#818181; font-size:13px;" target="_blank">Homepage name</a></span>

<br> 

which looks like:

http://stephenteacher.tiddlyspot.com/#KaTeX%20Functions

[Mat]

@Stephen, I'm guessing you're referring to that the content of your iframe, i.e the embedded page, does not "adjust" to the size of the iframe, yes? I'm afraid that is up to the embedded page as far as I know. I believe you can "clip" the embedded page, using the deprecated but (I think) functional CSS clip attribute,  but it's a bit messy.

On my screen, if I hide the sidebar at least the horizontal scroll is avoided. Matter of screen size.

<:-)

[Ste Wilson]

No.. Much simpler question :)

<<richlink "link here">> all works fine.
<<richlink iframe "link here">> or
<<richlink "iframe link here">>

Or any other combination of " and >> I have tried don't get me an iframe :)

[Petruschka]

Tremendous plugin! Thank you very much!

A hint: Please tag your templates and maybe the plugin itself. Anyone can import your all together much more easily by just dragging the correct tag pill to their respective TW. <3

Best wishes

[Mat]

Petruschka wrote:

Tremendous plugin! Thank you very much!

A hint: Please tag your templates and maybe the plugin itself. Anyone can import your all together much more easily by just dragging the correct tag pill to their respective TW. <3

Thanks Petruschka, yes, I made RichLinks before the tagpill DnD feature was available. I should update it but there's just so many other things that are more important ;-)

<:-) 

[TonyM]

Mat,

I really like what richlinks does, but I have not managed to get it working in my own wiki, even in a empty.html. Installing from your demo site is a "little Complex" and I am no doubt doing something wrong, however I am trying to repackage it for an easier install. One reason is I would like to add the package to my plugin repository so it comes up in my searches.

Can I help you package it for better distribution?

Regards

Tony

[Petruschka]

I see. :) And this is a one time bulk action with TiddlyCommander. ;) Would be great if you would TonyM help you. Great project!

[Peter Buyze]

Mat, I agree with TonyM and Petruschka that it would be great if you would update this.

--

Securely sent with Tutanota. Get your own encrypted, ad-free mailbox:

https://tutanota.com

1 May 2020, 22:27 by wegs....@gmail.com:

--

You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "TiddlyWiki" group.

To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to tiddlywiki+...@googlegroups.com.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tiddlywiki/3d2c7038-e61b-4682-a122-a2ff92102794%40googlegroups.com.