What speaker brands are you using?

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Joseph Krempetz

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Apr 30, 2024, 7:12:31 PMApr 30
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Hi Folks,

With EAWs JF series on its way out, I’m wondering what you are using in to replace older EAW speakers? Specifically, I’m looking to replace a lot of UB12s, JF60s, JFX100s, and JFX88s. Any recommendations are much appreciated! This venue can’t quite afford to bump up to Meyer or d&b, but wanted something that could match the quality of those older EAW boxes.


Thanks for your time,
Joe Krempetz

Seablade -

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Apr 30, 2024, 9:36:04 PMApr 30
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Check out Danley speakers.

    Thomas

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rbing...@juno.com

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May 1, 2024, 9:30:46 PMMay 1
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Some of the newer stuff made by EAW are pretty nice speakers. I would just reach out to them to find out which models are being produced long term. Although it was interesting to note that Jeremy Forsythe (the son of the founder and the real life JF that the speaker line was named after) has left EAW and moved over to K Array. No idea if that actually means anything or not.

I would also look at Fulcrum Acoustics, founded by former EAW designer Dave Gunness. They make some cardiod speakers (they don't use electronics to form the cardiod pattern) that are really impressive pieces when I've head them in demos. And their more traditional point source cabinets sound nice as well, those I've actually used in shows.

Some of the Nexo stuff is a little cheaper than Meyer and d&b I think. But not by a lot. EAW and Fulcrum are probably the ones I would go to for point source that isn't in the price category of a Meyer or d&b.

Richard B Ingraham

Palmer Jankens

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May 3, 2024, 7:08:12 PMMay 3
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Hello,

I understand your pain! I think I bought the final 4 remaining spare drivers for the original JF80 (not the JF80z) back in 2016 or 2017. They're becoming difficult to keep alive.

I was able to attend Infocomm last year and spent a lot of time in the loudspeaker demo rooms. Before sharing my opinions I want to emphasize that they are only my opinions and therefore may not be what others agree with. Making loudspeaker brand suggestions to a group of sound people isn't fun! Having said that... here are the brands that stuck out in one way or another.

Alcons - https://www.alconsaudio.com - These have been adopted by a few broadway folks as fills and after hearing them I see why. They have a lot of models and sounded great at all product sizes/levels.

1 SOUND - https://www.1-sound.com - These break away from the norm in a good way (to me). Again, there are a lot of size options and I loved the sound. They have a M+S fill speaker that keeps the stereo image across your fill zones which is a unique and cool idea.

Adamson - https://www.adamson.ai - Lots of options, was mid-pack in how they sounded. A more recognized brand which can help with rider/client acceptance.

Martin - https://martin-audio.com - Another more recognizable brand but I don't know what was going on in their demo room because they sounded bad in comparison to the other brands. I think the person that tuned the speakers may have had severe high-frequency hearing loss because they were thin, sizzling, and fatiguing when I heard them.

RCF - https://www.rcf.it/en - I have enjoyed RCS cabinets the two times I've mixed on them in large-format. I can't speak for their smaller products but I thought they should be a more popular brand after doing a few shows on them and really liking their sound. Also I think they make the drivers for several other loudspeaker brands but don't quote me on that.

Renkus-Heinz - https://www.renkus-heinz.com - I have had several bad personal experiences with this brand, especially when it comes time for service/repair. There is a large R-H install where I work and all of them (in regular use) needed service within 5 years; several have needed a second service. Our issues have all been PSU related.

Nexo - https://www.nexo-sa.com - A Yamaha brand so there should be support for a while. Another brand I think should be more popular because they're nice cabinets with a lot of sizes and rigging hardware to choose from. If you're a Yamaha house they integrate well in the ProVisionare system design software ecosystem too. 

Danley - https://www.danleysoundlabs.com - The mythical Danley brand. I don't have any experience with these but, you know, "You could've done it with a single Danley."

The other "smaller" brands doing demos at Infocomm but I was not able to hear were:
-CODA Audio - https://codaaudio.com
-Void Acoustics - https://voidacoustics.com

Most of the above brands offer a product close to the EAW cabinets you're replacing and are worth a quick browse.

For the sake of saying it, d&b, L'Acoustics, and Meyer are all as popular as they are for a reason. After doing demos at my previous job we ended up selecting d&b 5S https://www.dbaudio.com/global/en/products/series/xs-series/5s/ for our under balcony and front fill cabinets because they were notably nicer than the other options, even to management (that's how we got the money approved... we had them listen and choose). But woof are they expensive. Switching from passive EAW to powered Meyer/anything is probably way out of scope and I would say not worth the payoff with currently available passive options.

Hope this helps a bit. I'm killing time between rehearsal and performance so this was a nice refresher on brands for me too.

Palmer


Nat Koren

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May 6, 2024, 4:47:12 PMMay 6
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Hey Palmer,
Wow, thanks for the comprehensive overview of a few brands.  Your perspective pretty much lines up with my opinion of the companies on this list.

I did an orchestral pops concert recently that used a db Technologies rig.  I was very pleasantly surprised by its musicality, linearity, name-your-own-superlative-ity.  Often confused with d&b (Germany), it’s db Technologies (Italy).  They make a fill speaker that’s smaller than the JF80, more the size of a UPSlim, and sounded very nice on the apron.  Vertical is 100 degrees, kind of wide.

I’ve been a longtime Meyer fanboy, but these are some serious competition.

-

Nat Koren
Head Sound Engineer
France-Merrick Performing Arts Center
 yHippodrome Theatre
 x M&T Bank Exchange Theater
12 North Eutaw Street
Baltimore, MD




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Joseph Krempetz

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May 6, 2024, 4:47:12 PMMay 6
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Amazing, thanks for all the info Palmer, and everyone else who responded! 



On May 3, 2024, at 7:08 PM, Palmer Jankens <pjan...@gmail.com> wrote:

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jer...@jjlee.com

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May 10, 2024, 1:50:47 AMMay 10
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My “I can’t afford Meyer/ d&b/ L’Acoustics” go to is absolutely Fulcrum. Great speakers, coverage patterns, prices. 

1-Sound cannons are great, but not cheap. Their subs are interesting and unique in form factor. 

K-Array are amazing- but you’ll need a sub for anything other than a full speaker from them. Their small speakers are fantastic for what they are- but they’re still small. 

IMO- Void is all about mega yachts needing something cool looking. Danley is all about having a subwoofer big enough to call an apartment. QSC are decent, but they don’t sound like a family at all. JBL A series are under appreciated, but their run of the mill speakers are… run of the mill. 

And don’t forget the amps. Almost all good speakers either require a same-brand amp, or something like Powersoft with DSP. Otherwise, you will not be well pleased. 

Paul Kraus

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May 15, 2024, 11:13:59 AMMay 15
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I am curious about the comment highlighted below...

> On May 7, 2024, at 22:07, jer...@jjlee.com wrote:

> And don’t forget the amps. Almost all good speakers either require a same-brand amp, or something like Powersoft with DSP. Otherwise, you will not be well pleased.

I started doing sound in the late 1970’s / early 1980’s when powered speakers did not really exist and DSP was a dream. Better speakers were designed to be flat (or to have a specific characteristic response).

I know that powered speakers (I have JBL LSR-2325P on my desk and EV ZLX-12P and Mackie SRM-450) have electronic crossovers that compliment the driver/cabinet acoustic characteristics as well as filters that compensate for flaws in the acoustic systems. I also have passive EV SX-300 and ZX-1 which sound very good with no processing.

I also know that certain passive speakers *require* the use of an external processor (or processor / amplifier), I am looking at you Bose 801.

Have all passive speaker designs given up producing good acoustic response without processing?

NOTES:

The LSR-2325P uses analog filters which makes it easy to repair.

The SRM-450 (version 1) is all analog.

The ZXL-12P is a DSP.

—
PK

Nick Kourtides

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May 15, 2024, 2:46:40 PMMay 15
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I think modern design practices around conventionally amplified speakers have to grapple with how much passive, high-level filtering and phase correction is it reasonable to do at the speaker/crossover network in the box? 

Good passive designs of the past, like EAW smaller KF and JF series, and others, relied on complex and expensive filtering components AND also significantly larger amplifiers for equivalent headroom. I would regularly drive JFs and KFs, and especially the MK installation series, with bridged amps at 1500-2000W per driver. 


Nick Kourtides
Sound Design
(he/him)


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jer...@jjlee.com

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May 15, 2024, 5:05:34 PMMay 15
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I think it’s a whole different thing than the “good old days”. 

Back then, any speaker tuning was done by ear (no real analysis tools) and with an analog crossover. Speakers weren’t designed to work together and sum well. People used 1/3 octave graphics on everything. 

We now have real tools. The speakers can be designed to be hyper efficient. Phase and frequency response can be taken care of in DSP as well as transient response and damping factor. Voltage limiters protect the speakers. 

Some companies try to be purist today (KV2) but suffer from lack of DSP. They can’t really align their drivers to create a coherent wavefront the way you can with FIR filters. 

The basics remain. You need a good driver in a good cabinet with good materials. 
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