Queen storage

[Paula Breen]

When I was visiting Norm Lott he showed me that he would cage virgin queens and put them above a shim above a queen excluder above the top box of a very strong colony where they would be cared for by nurse bees. I'm wondering if anybody has any experience with this, or if you have any other hacks for storing MATED queens in cages. How long have you stored queens in cages, and have you ever played with putting them way up high on  a strong hive for the nurse bees to take care of them until you're ready to put them in other hives? 

[Paula Breen]

Answered my own question. Anyone near San Leandro got a banking frame? FWIW, Norm did not use one, just had the cages loosely up top in the shim space. 

[Mimi]

Mated Queens in cages could be stored in mating nucs with lots of nurse bees.  I’ve kept 3 mated Queens alive for about 2 weeks in mating 5 frame nuc.   The bees wouldn’t start making Queen cells until ~2-3 days after last Queen is removed but they will continue to manage brood.  

Sent from my iPhone

On Feb 9, 2026, at 1:40 PM, Paula Breen <paulae...@gmail.com> wrote:



When I was visiting Norm Lott he showed me that he would cage virgin queens and put them above a shim above a queen excluder above the top box of a very strong colony where they would be cared for by nurse bees. I'm wondering if anybody has any experience with this, or if you have any other hacks for storing MATED queens in cages. How long have you stored queens in cages, and have you ever played with putting them way up high on  a strong hive for the nurse bees to take care of them until you're ready to put them in other hives? 

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[Paula Breen]

Hi Mimi, yeah I know. I'm working on a shortcut where I don't have to make nucs. I think my plan will work as I've seen it work successfully with Mr Lott. 

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[Mimi Edwards]

I think Norm’s method uses same theory as Demaree split.  Original hive Queen should not move up above honey band but Queen excluders make certain she can’t harm virgins.  With mated Queens it’s more tricky because loyal workers might want to kill unwanted mated Queen. If you do that experiment let us know the outcome.

Mimi 

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[Robin Chatham]

Jamison n I were trained by Norm. The Queen cages were on top of an inner cover with surrounding shim of strong queenless hive with lotsa nurse bees. Its quite the task to create that. 

The queens can be virgin or mated.

Wayne Scott told me he forgot to release a queen from a cage with a cork plug and noticed it 30 days later. She was well cared for and once released proved to be prolific.

Robin Chatham

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[Paula Breen]

Thanks Robin.

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[Catherine Edwards]

I made a nuc once for banking but a while ago. Can't recall if it should be queenless. What do you know about it?

Catherine Edwards

(510)421-7206

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[Mimi]

A strong Queenless hive is equivalent to a large mating nuc, so guess there’s no shortcut around that.  Good luck with Queen banking let us know what you ended up doing.  Mimi 

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On Feb 9, 2026, at 3:45 PM, Paula Breen <paulae...@gmail.com> wrote:



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[Catherine Edwards]

Thanks

Catherine Edwards

(510)421-7206

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[Robin Chatham]

If the hive already has a queen,  they won't take care of the ones in the cages.

Robin Chatham

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[Paula Breen]

Looks like there are ways to do it with a queen right colony.  Thanks to Bob for this:

https://cms.jcloudpro.com/storage/clients/countryblossoms_pro/file_1749435729806_22172.pdf

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[Catherine Edwards]

I'll make a queenless nuc tomorrow between the raindrops, keep it above a queeright hive until Wednesday when it will go on its own stand, ready to receive queen cages on Thursday.

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Catherine Edwards

(510)421-7206

[Robin Chatham]

Well that's fascinating.  Please post a followup of how it works out for you. 

Robin Chatham

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[Sung Han Lee]

Yes. I have been using shim on top of inner cover and place queen cage facing center hole. Of course gotta cover outer cover. Also each cage has 3 to 4 nurse bees with the queen. These are mostly mated queens. Don't keep virgin queens too long, few days are maximum. They need to get mated sooner than later.

Mated queens can stay weeks. But usually they get placed or sold in a week or so.

Sung Lee The Bee Charmer 

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[Robin Chatham]

Sung, is the hive already queen right and you put mated queens in cages in top? Or is hive queenless?

Robin Chatham

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[Gerald Przybylski]

I read that if newly mated queens are banked as soon as they start laying, their ovaries don't have a chance to fully develop
like they would if allowed to lay for several weeks after they initially start. 

I think it may have been at a michael bush queen workshop many years ago, he said you can set up a queen bank
with many caged mated queens, and one mother queen laying eggs.  It will be happy, and the queens will be cared for.
You can remove queens without trouble. 
However, you can't add in another queen to the queen-bank without the colony getting very upset. (I presume the colony will want to attack the unfamiliar queen)

Virgin queens need to mate within about 20 days after emerging, or they will only ever be drone-layers.  (Verified/discovered by Huber 200 years ago)
They don't emit the pheromones that mated queens do, so I imagine they're easier to bank. 

that's my 2¢ on the topic

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[Paula Breen]

The OSU attachment posted previously in this thread sites data that show "long-term banking does not affect performance of colonies headed by banked queens", and also that long-term banking does not affect queen reproductive quality. And this is in reference to queens that have actually been overwintered in banked colonies. I think if you were doing it short-term just to get through a couple of storms the queens should be right as rain.

P

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[Robin Chatham]

1 curiosity: if I add caged queens to a queen right colony aren't all of those queens unfamiliar?

2nd curiosity: in cold weather will enough bees surround the caged queens to keep them warm?

Robin Chatham

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[Paula Breen]

This document addresses those questions in detail. It was very helpful. https://cms.jcloudpro.com/storage/clients/countryblossoms_pro/file_1749435729806_22172.pdf

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[Paula Breen]

@Sung Lee  was your hive queenless or queen right when you banked those queens? Thanks! 

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