question

[Ira Cohen]

So I'm considering upgrading from my 2018 MS to a new MS/MX.  Aside from the fact that it's new, what would I be gaining or losing?

Is it quieter (I have pronounced road noise)? charges more quickly? better range?  Does it still have sensors or is it just relying on cameras?

BTW, I am happy with my current car but it is out of warranty so there's that

Ira

[Charlie Chan]

Hey Ira!

How are you? Hope all is well with you!

The the S long range AWD has range of 405 miles, 0 to 60 in 3.1 sec , 149 mph top speed.

SuperCharging is 250 kw, I don't remember the 

2018 S supercharging spec.

You get a center screen that is motorized and it can be set to pan towards you, center or toward the passenger. You still have the instrument cluster screen in front of the steering wheel.

Round steering wheel is standard now yolk is extra. No stalks for signal or whispers, but I got used to it pretty quick (we got a new X this May).

Rear passenger now have a small iPad mini size screen at the back of center console, so they can adjust the vent, heated seats, music, YouTube..

New S is more efficient, has a heat pump for HVAC.

It also uses a lithium ion 12 volt battery, so no more changing out that lead acid 12 volt every 3 to 4 yrs.

Charlie

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[Charlie Chan]

The new s and x are quiet, they have double panned glasses..

No ultrasonic sensors, it's all camera based now. They will be releasing the vision based 3d reconstructed environment for parking.

It should be coming through over the air update in about a week or two.

On Tue, Dec 19, 2023, 8:27 AM Ira Cohen <ilc...@gmail.com> wrote:

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[Ira Cohen]

Hi Charlie  - Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to you and yours!!!

Wow.  OK, you convinced me (S or X?)  Now I have to convince my wife.........

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[Ira Cohen]

Charlie - did you trade in your other car with them?

On Tue, Dec 19, 2023 at 2:20 PM Charlie Chan <cchan...@gmail.com> wrote:

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[Charlie Chan]

Hey Ira,

Sorry for the late reply.

Tough call, for comfort and more upright seating position, higher view, the X is great. Also X still qualify for $7500 fed tax credit. Goes 350 miles. 5, 6 or 7 seat (only the 6 seater has the mono post motorized seats but doesn't fold flat. The 5 and 7 seater folds flat if that is important to you)

If you want range, then S is better, 405 mi. 

Drives like a sports sedan, you know the rest 😁

I will be trading in my old 2013 model s 60kwh for a Model Y, because I can transfer unlimited superchargering from the old S to a new Y, S or X if you take delivery before Dec 31.

The old 2016 model x 90D is going to my brother in law.

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[Ira Cohen]

Thanks. So trading it in to Tesla,  not  selling it.

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[Ira Cohen]

Well, just tried to buy one.  They didn't have one in the color configuration we wanted (white outside and in) and wouldn't transfer charging because delivery of a new one would be in Jan/Feb.  Nothing, nada, in inventory.

Will see what happens next year

[Jon Landis]

If you would consider a lightly used white & black car, these guys will ship, take your trade & are very good with Tesla. Some of them worked for Tesla in the past.

https://www.currentautomotive.com/inventory/used-2022-tesla-model-s-base-awd-4d-hatchback-5yjsa1e5xnf470450/

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[Ira Cohen]

Thanks for the info 

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[Charlie Chan]

Sorry to hear that Ira, end of the year is always crazy ... 

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[PETER FLEMMING]

Happy holidays 

Sounds like the old gang!

As you know, I started out with the S (had a couple through the years) bought a Y at the reduced rate last January and switched to the X when Elon knocked 20k off list!  Traded in the Y for the X and got a good number from Tesla!! Absolutely love the five seater X, the ride, tech, practicality and overall appearance!!!  The ultimate 

vehicle for me!!

Sent from my iPhone

On Dec 23, 2023, at 4:09 PM, Jon Landis <jon.l...@gmail.com> wrote:



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[Jon Landis]

All of the above. I would drive a new one and see what you think, but there are meaningful differences in all the areas you mentioned. Not sure when the self driving hardware change occurred, but in practice, the system ability should be similar. 

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[Jon Landis]

Sure. I also swapped the Yoke for the round wheel with mobile service and they did it in my driveway in under 30 minutes.

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[Badalamenti Vito Anthony]

Hi Ira,

I finally sold my 2014 MS 60, with 227,000 miles on it. While I still used it as my daily driver, and loved it (and its sun roof!), the offer to transfer my forever free SC to a new car was a great motivator. So, back in November, I picked up a new MX Plaid! It is simply amazing- much better than my prior 2018 MX P100D.

I believe you would be gaining a much quieter ride, more interior room, new features (the Yoke wheel, no stalks), and much improved FSD, using only cameras. And, new color choices. I got the very cool Ultra Red. I get about 300 mile range. And of course, the warranty is a huge benefit.

Just my two cents, while I wait patiently, for the Cybertrucks to arrive.

[Ira Cohen]

Thanks Vito. I'm waiting for mine to arrive!

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[Badalamenti Vito Anthony]

Your X or CT?

Congrats!

[Ira Cohen]

MS - supposedly by the 15th

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[Tom Bischoff]

Does anyone have FSD with 12.3?

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[Dan]

Unlikely yet 

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[bill p]

I haven't seen any in teslafi going to NJ yet but did see Virginia and a few Texas ones so I guess it's starting to slowly release to the rest of us.

bill

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[Daniel Dodson]

Anxious to get it. Want to wait to buy until v12 is available. Family is already terrified at the notion of FSD.  Everything I've seen shows v12 being much smoother.

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[bill p]

Drove home last night from a wedding with my daughter and son-in-law in the back (this is V11 still).  They are both kind of scaredy cats.  About 1/2 home (maybe 15 miles out) I put on FSD and they never noticed. 

BTW just took a look and there are several more eastern V12 but nothing close.  No NJ, DE, PA, NY.  I did notice that all that teslafi has at this point are AP3

bill

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[Michael Thwaite]

Yep, just downloaded tonight!

[Tom Bischoff]

Annnnnndddddd......what are your thoughts on 12.3?

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[Michael Thwaite]

Ah, yeah, erm, well... it's still pointless.

There's been a lot said about how amazing 12.3 is: "It's like there's a human driving the car!" "Is the rollout slow because they're driven by Tesla employees remotely?", etc.

There's no doubt that it's an amazing technological feat, I mean, it's the LLM of car driving but... it's still a bit crap.

I can say that it's evolution, even revolution over 11.4.7 which was, just, well, broken and, I could be positive about how much it shows the path to true self driving but, right now, it's not self driving, no It's anxiously letting the car lurch around whilst hoping that it doesn't clip the curb or bounce through the NJ potholes. If you actually enjoy letting a first time driver have a go with your car whilst you anxiously hold the steering wheel, then yeah it's for you. if not, it's still just a gimmick, I mean, amazing tech but, there's no real world application yet.

I hope it's better on the highway than the previous version but, I don't think it's going to be, I believe it's the same highway stack so, randomly changing lanes and turning off the highway... but I've not tried it yet.

In more detail, it drives at 37 in a 40 area, it drives at 50 in 25 area, it accelerates like it's on fire, it brakes late, it can't hold a steady speed, it doesn't understand pot holes, it does slow down for some road obstacles, it did indicate left then slowly passed a parked mail van, it failed to stop at the destination but it did handle a busy four-way junction very well, it could get you home if you were incapacitated!

As my son observed "If you have to stay alert and hold the steering wheel anyway, what's the point?"

MPT

[Mark Nevar]

I got it Monday overnight. Used it Tuesday and it still can't make the left turn off of Rt 202 onto Holland Brook Road where there is a dedicated left turn lane and no traffic signal. It tries to go to the intersection and make the turn from the highway's fast lane. It worked flawlessly in V10, then broke in v11. 

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[bill p]

I see you're near me.  Do you go over studdiford much?  I think every version from 10.2 on has veered on to the shoulder going from branchburg to hillsborough and making the right.  Does that happen to you?

bill

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[Mark Nevar]

I don't have that problem on Studdiford and I go over it a lot (not yet with 12.3). BTW, tried the turn onto Holland Brook Rd 2 more times. 1st time was flawless and the second time it danced between the fast and exit lanes a few times before doing it correctly. I also took it to Red Bank on Saturday night and it made it with just one intervention. It's definitely much improved over v11. Can't wait for more updates.

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[bill p]

I've only gone over once (flooded on Sunday morn) but it used to veer to the right on to the shoulder as it approached the stop (going in to Hillsborough).  Yesterday it did not so maybe finally fixed. 

My biggest complaint so far is the speed thing.  It does drift down on streets. I drove to Reading->Hershey and back on Sunday and was pleased with the drive.   The speed on the interstates worked as always. 

One lesser complaint is it is coming up to lights & stops faster again.  I can see it's using the physical brakes every time instead to slowing and being able to just use regen.

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[Daniel Dodson]

Hoping to get the FSD trial this week.  

Wife and are already refusing to ride with on.  Seems pretty close minded.

Dan Dodson

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[Wick Smith]

I also had to disengage after just a couple of minutes. It was far too slow and I was holding up traffic. On my way to breakfast the speed limit is 35 mph but FSD was holding at 32 and could not be bumped any higher. I normally go 40 to 45 on that strip of road, as does everyone else.

-wick

On Mar 26, 2024, at 6:43 AM, Mark Nevar <ma...@nevars.com> wrote:



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[bill p]

It has done some interesting things which I've never seen before.

There was a small pickup trying to make a left in to a parking lot.  My car stopped kind of close and other cars behind me were going around to right by going on the shoulder as you would normally see.  When the pickup move forward a bit, my car then did the same thing.  Never saw it go around like that before.  Unfortunately it also did not go back left to get back in the travel lane but proceeded down the shoulder until I disengaged. 

While I'm not using it locally much (highways are still good) because of the speed issue, it does seem to take turns better.  I haven't had any of the wheel jerk so far.  Lane centering seems better (others have reported differently).  The phantom braking might be a bit worse although maybe that is tied to the speed issue.

Parking is not any better but it looks like the parking improvements are HW4 so far at least.  As has been the case for my ownership the car simply almost never 'sees' a parking space.

bill

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[Michael Thwaite]

I finally got out onto the highway; I think it's the same stack as 11.x and equally broken - random lane changes, suddenly turning off the highway, yielding to traffic joining the highway, etc.

Once back into normal surface streets I had to intervene more than before - harsh acceleration followed by max region then some more acceleration, etc.  After a bit more late braking and more speed hunting and with speed aware cruise control no longer available (I used that a lot; let it handle speed & I'll avoid the potholes) I had to switch it off for good.

The cruise control on my Roadster still works but after ten years of development, Tesla seems to have gone backwards.

<footnote> Just FYI, I've been a long standing supporter of Tesla, right from the pre-Roadster days and I've spent some time supporting them against the odds but, with the current state of affairs with FSD and, having driven non-tesla cars that do the core of FSD much, much better, I'm feeling a little let down so, take my rants with that in mind.</footnote>

[bill p]

yes the lane changing is still there even with minimize lane changes which I set almost every time by clicking the right scroll button left and then the button to set min lane chg so that's a little easier than its first appearance.

And yes to the acceleration / braking.  You'd think that if Tesla is really about saving the environment (for us as the earth would get along just fine without us) they'd default to a mild acceleration (using less juice) and normal braking that didn't use the physical brakes (recapturig more juice).

bill





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[Michael Thwaite]

Yes indeed... we need to send them to chauffeur school!

[Tom Bischoff]

"Whole Mars Catalog" posts videos on youtube driving around San Francisco on FSD and the car performs much better than is described in this thread. Is he somehow editing these videos to make the FSD look better than it really is? Or is there more data from the SF area in the neural networks database? 

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[Tom Bischoff]

Our Model Y with EAP and HW4 got the FSD trial this morning. We just got back after a drive on FSD and I am nauseas. The speed control is terrible. Coming up on a traffic light the car didn't know if should be in the left or right lane and danced back and forth before almost clipping the car in front of us. On twisty Berkshire Valley Road it swung way wide on several turns. And it going 35 mph straight for a concrete wall at and underpass. I think it would have hit it had I not intervened.

I don't know how Tesla would think that a free trial of FSD would entice anyone to pay for it. 

And we bought the EAP so we would have the smart summon to pull the car in and out of our tight garage. And we still don't have it. Let me guess, it will be available "soon".

Very disappointed.