Good Songs for "Borrowed" Tunes (Was Re: saradA AlOcanalu)
lylayer
--- In racch...@yahoogroups.com, "Uday Bhaskar" <uday_n@s...>
wrote:
>
> > Writing poetry naturally could be difficult. But writing a
> seemingly natural poetry (songs here) for dubbing movies is doubly
> tough.
> I am particularly selecting songs that retained the tune, but
totally
> changed the meaning and context, unlike songs like "పయనించే ఓ
> చిలుకా".
continuing this song..
పుల్లా పుడకా ముక్కున కరచీ గూడును కట్టితివోయీ..
ఎందకు ఎండి నీ బిగిరెక్కలు వానకు తడిసినవొయీ..
ఎన్నడో తిరిగి ఇటు నీరాకా ఎవరో తెలిసినవారూ...
Who is the great guy who wrote this song Uday? What a guy! What a guy!
A few posts back you said... 'Abhi tho kuch kahaa nahi, abhi to kuch
suna nahi ...'
So true. So very true.
' abhi abhi tho aye ho, bahar ban ke aye ho...
abhi na javo chod kar, e dil abhi bhara nahi '
Thanks for all the beautiful things said so far, my friend.
lyla.
Courtesy: http://www.kanneganti.com/
Uday Bhaskar
> >
> There is a website for plagiarised songs. Though there are
> not (m)any telugu songs in that, it is educative to know
> that all the famous MDs are in the hall of "f(sh)ame".
>
One of my all time favorite English albums is Pete Sieger and Arlo
Guthrie Live. In that, Pete makes a statement that I thought was very
interesting. Actually he attributes this statement to his father, who
apparently once said that "plagiarism is basic to all cultures".
Regards,
Uday
Courtesy: http://www.kanneganti.com/
Anandaswarup Gadde
--- In racch...@yahoogroups.com, "Srinivas Ganti" <gantisri@h...> wrote:
> > --- Anandaswarup Gadde <gaddeswarup@y...> wrote:
> >
> > > I have in mind "kondagali tirigindi" (and a
> > > Hindi tune "Mere dil ki nagariya" from Madhosh,1951).
> > > Does anybody know where these tunes are coming from?
>
> I haven't heard Madhosh song in a long time. Will listen to it
> carefully again but I don't think "kondagaali tiringindi" has a one to
> one resemblance with "mere dil kii nagariyaa".
Sorry; I did not mean that there is any resemblance between the two. Both
seemed different from other songs that I heard before. The Telugu song has
some eerie charm and nice lyrics. The Hindi song (which I do not understand)
has some lines which sound like rap music that came much later. I tried it on
my children, but they say that all Indian film music sounds the same to them.
Swarup
Courtesy: http://www.kanneganti.com/
Anandaswarup Gadde
--- In racch...@yahoogroups.com, Raj P <rajpalla@y...> wrote:
>
> I remember reading article about arudra, long time back. According to the
author of the article, the tune was borrowed from a native telugu folk song,
with x-rated words. I am not sure about the authenticity of the article though.
Thanks; I was hoping that this was Pendyala's inspiration. But it is good to
know that such wonderful tune came from the folk tradition.This adds weight
to what Maddipati Krishna Rao has been saying for a while: that we should try
preserve not only folk songs but also folk tunes.
Swarup
Courtesy: http://www.kanneganti.com/
J. K. Mohana Rao
--- Anandaswarup Gadde <gaddeswarup@y...> wrote:
> I have in mind "kondagali tirigindi" (and a
> Hindi tune "Mere dil ki nagariya" from Madhosh,1951).
> Does anybody know where these tunes are coming from?
>
The music for madhosh was by madanmOhan. The best
person to answer your question is perhaps SrI
gaMTi (of Indianscreen website) gAru. He is a
memeber of RB, I believe. - m
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Srinivas Ganti
--- In racch...@yahoogroups.com, "J. K. Mohana Rao" <jkmrao@y...>
wrote:
>
>
> --- Anandaswarup Gadde <gaddeswarup@y...> wrote:
>
> > I have in mind "kondagali tirigindi" (and a
> > Hindi tune "Mere dil ki nagariya" from Madhosh,1951).
> > Does anybody know where these tunes are coming from?
> >
> The music for madhosh was by madanmOhan. The best
> person to answer your question is perhaps SrI
> gaMTi (of Indianscreen website) gAru. He is a
> memeber of RB, I believe. - m
I am in no way related to Indian Screen. That credit belongs to
Srinivasa Rao Sanagavarapu. Actually having too many Srinivas's around
is one reason why ppl. started calling be by last name :)
I haven't heard Madhosh song in a long time. Will listen to it
carefully again but I don't think "kondagaali tiringindi" has a one to
one resemblance with "mere dil kii nagariyaa".
Ganti.
Courtesy: http://www.kanneganti.com/
Uday Bhaskar
> start used western and northern tunes. The famous tune for "Ohoho
> pavurama" sung by Bhanumati was set after B.N.Reddi heard a tune in
an
> English movie and wanted a similar tune. This may be an instance of
> "innovations occuring through the interference of different
cultures". Perhaps
> Paruchuri sreenivas will be able to tell us more about this after
February.
According to Idlebrain.com, this song from స్వర్గసీమ is based on
the original Rita Hayworth number from the movie "Blood and Sand" on
which this movie is based. Details can be seen at
http://www.idlebrain.com/nosta/swargaseema.html
Again, the lyrics for this song were written by బాలాంత్రపు
రజనీకాంత రావు, a well known poet in his own right.
Uday Bhaskar
>
> > I am particularly selecting songs that retained the tune, but
> totally
> > changed the meaning and context, unlike songs like "పయనించే ఓ
> > చిలుకా".
>
> continuing this song..
>
> పుల్లా పుడకా ముక్కున కరచీ గూడును కట్టితివోయీ..
> ఎందకు ఎండి నీ బిగిరెక్కలు వానకు తడిసినవొయీ..
> ఎన్నడో తిరిగి ఇటు నీరాకా ఎవరో తెలిసినవారూ...
>
> Who is the great guy who wrote this song Uday? What a guy! What a
guy!
>
The song is from కులదైవం, and I think the lyricist was
సముద్రాల, but I am not sure.
Again, the lyric you have quoted illustrates why writing songs to a
foreign tune can be such a difficult task, and this is certainly one
instance where the poet did a great job. Looking at all the అచ్చ
తెలుగు words in this song, who would ever have guessed that this is
based on a Hindi song?
Anandaswarup Gadde
--- In racch...@yahoogroups.com, "J. K. Mohana Rao" <jkmrao@y...>
wrote:
Though there are
> not (m)any telugu songs in that, it is educative to know
> that all the famous MDs are in the hall of "f(sh)ame".
It is no shame as long as they acknowledge; probably the tradition of
acknowledgement was absent for a while. May be we should consider these
as tributes of some great MD's to other great MD's. Sometimes, these
borrowings seem as good and as intersting as the originals.
Swarup
Courtesy: http://www.kanneganti.com/
Hemantha Kumar
As recently as a couple or three years ago one song "kilele kilele aavo aavo kilele" by OSIBISA was knocked down into Telugu. The song is something like"maavele maavele paruvaalu maavele"
The song "Halo Halo O ammayi" from Iddaru Mitrulu is almost a copy of an English song titled "Mustafa" where the opening tune matches with words "Mustafa ya Mustafa". Maybe Sreenivas Paruchuri garu can lend a helping hand here.
While talking of Iddaru Mitrulu, Interestingly, we can note that as many as 5 songs with the the opening words being doubled like
"Halo Halo O ammayi"
"Khushi Khushi ga Navvutu"
"Oho Oho ninne korega"
"Ee Musi Musi Navvula"
"Navvali Navvali nee Navvulu"
Even the song "O Rama Nee Nama mentho" sounds like a double though really not. Is it because the movie is on IDDARU Mitrulu.
Sreenivas Paruchuri garu, any light on this "schemingly" coincidence or otherwise?
While talking of Mitrulu has anyone got the nice song "ennALLO vEcina udayaM I nADE yeduravutuMTE" from "manci mitrulu" (I think)? or is it "prANa mitrulu"?
Best wishes
Hemantha Kumar
The all time super-hit number "mehbooba mehbooba" of Sholay is an almost 100% lift from "Demis Rousseau"s (hope got the spelling of the name right) "Say you Love me Love me Love me"
Uday Bhaskar <uday_n@s...> wrote:
<snip>
By the way, I remember a number of Hindi songs that copied English songs and western classical tunes, but I can only recollect one Telugu song with an English tune (Uriah Heap's "Lady in Black" copied for a "comedy" song picturised on Rajababu, that goes something like "నువ్వే నాకు ప్రాణం అందుకే కోరి వచ్చా). I am sure there must
have been plenty of them, especially in the 50s and 60s, the golden era for plagiarism.
Regards,
Uday
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Uday Bhaskar
--- In racch...@yahoogroups.com, NaChaKi <nachakigroups@y...>
wrote:
>
> >>While talking of Iddaru Mitrulu, Interestingly, we can note that
as
> many as 5 songs with the the opening words being doubled
>
> Good observation, and good linking to "iddaru" mitrulu. I did notice
> such doubling with a few other movies of recent times (last 2-3
years).
Reminds me of something that Veturi mentioned when he came to the
TANA Regional Conference at Dallas some years back. It seems when he
was writing the lyrics for అడవి రాముడు, he ended up writing almost
all the songs to the same beat, and K.V. Mahadevan was getting a
little frustrated that all the tunes ended up being similar, and so
he (Mahadevan, that is) came up with a suggestion for the inevitable
మారువేషం song for NTR. Original lyric written by Veturi
was "చూడరా చూడరా, సులేమాన్ మియా!". Apparently KVM told
him "ముమ్డు ఇంకో రెండు చూడరా లు పడేయండి, మిగతాది నేను
చూసుకుంటాను", and so the song became "చూడర చూడర చూడర చూడర
సులేమాన్ మియా!" :-).
Raj P
Anandaswarup Gadde <gaddeswarup@y...> wrote:
"I have in mind "kondagali tirigindi"..."
I remember reading article about arudra, long time back. According to the author of the article, the tune was borrowed from a native telugu folk song,with x-rated words. I am not sure about the authenticity of the article though.
- Saleem
--- In racch...@yahoogroups.com, "Uday Bhaskar" <uday_n@s...>
wrote:
>Actually he attributes this statement to his father, who
> apparently once said that "plagiarism is basic to all cultures".
Eventhough many of the MDs are well versed in various forms of music, some
tunes seem to come out of the blue. I have in mind "kondagali tirigindi" (and a
Hindi tune "Mere dil ki nagariya" from Madhosh,1951). Does anybody know
where these tunes are coming from?
Courtesy: http://www.kanneganti.com/
NaChaKi
>>While talking of Iddaru Mitrulu, Interestingly, we can note that as
many as 5 songs with the the opening words being doubled
Good observation, and good linking to "iddaru" mitrulu. I did notice
such doubling with a few other movies of recent times (last 2-3 years).
One movie that comes to mind immediately is చంటి (a very recent
release, not the Venkatesh-starrer). The lead lines of all the songs in
the movie are:
1. కోణంగి కోణంగి
2. ఒంట్లో నెత్తురు
3. చెమ్మ చెక్క
4. రుక్కు రుక్కు
5. గుప్పిడి గుప్పిడి
6. మస్తానీ మస్తానీ
Only two songs do not double, and one of them is again a
near-double(చెమ్మ చెక్క).
NaChaKi.
P.S: BTW, the song ఎన్నాళ్ళో వేచిన ఉదయం is from మంచి మిత్రులు.
The song from ప్రాణమిత్రులు is స్నేహాని కన్న మిన్న లోకాన
లేదురా... కడ దాక నీడ లాగా నిను వీడిపోదురా, if I remember correctly.
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Anandaswarup Gadde
--- In racch...@yahoogroups.com, "Uday Bhaskar" <uday_n@s...>
wrote:
>Actually he attributes this statement to his father, who
> apparently once said that "plagiarism is basic to all cultures".
Eventhough many of the MDs are well versed in various forms of music, some
tunes seem to come out of the blue. I have in mind "kondagali tirigindi" (and a
Hindi tune "Mere dil ki nagariya" from Madhosh,1951). Does anybody know
where these tunes are coming from?
Swarup
Courtesy: http://www.kanneganti.com/
Uday Bhaskar
> Hmmm, correct me if I am wrong, but isn't the Telugu song
(పయనించే
> ఓ చిలుకా...) precedent to the Hindi one? That's what I thought
all
> these years anyway.
>
> NaChaKi.
> PS: Whether I'm right or wrong, that's a compliment to the lyricist
in
> the second language, as someone confused it to be the first.
>
>
You may be right. If my memory serves me right, "చల్ ఉడ్ జా రే
పంఛీ" was from the movie Bhabhie, which I think was a remake of a
Telugu movie.
Again, as you say, whichever way, one of the lyricists (or probably
both) did an excellent job.
Anandaswarup Gadde
--- In racch...@yahoogroups.com, "Uday Bhaskar" <uday_n@s...>
wrote:
Yet, some lyricists did
> wonders with tunes that music directors plagiarised from other
> languages.
I think that this happens a lot. Some of the tunes set by Tagore for Gitanjali
songs were supposed to be borrowed from Scottish and Japanese folk tunes (
I do not have any written conformation for this but this what Kalyan Mukherhes
who is a mathematicaian as well as a musician told me). Saluri Rajeswara
Rao spent an year with Saigal, Puncaj Mullick and others and right from the
start used western and northern tunes. The famous tune for "Ohoho
pavurama" sung by Bhanumati was set after B.N.Reddi heard a tune in an
English movie and wanted a similar tune. This may be an instance of
"innovations occuring through the interference of different cultures". Perhaps
Paruchuri sreenivas will be able to tell us more about this after February.
What is surprising to me is the explosion of talent for a few decades before
and after independence ( in the context of film songs) and the eventual
decline. Unfortunately, this may have some roots in Andhra culture and we
may have to discuss in terms of castes. I find that most of the writers and
progressive elements in the early days were Brahmins ( I remember ANR
telling us that he was the only Kamma boy in the film industry for eight years
and it was the Brahmins who discovered and encouraged him). It was the
probably the only commnity in which a large number of people were educated
and some of them started rebelling against orthodoxy. This together with
British rule, exposure to Marxism and such ideologies from around the world
and opportunities provoded by printing and the new medium of movies might
have been some of the reasons behind this explosion. After independence,
there have been new power structures, the theme of independence which
united the people was gone, new commercialism and corruption (reflected in
songs like 'nandamaya') and there were still good songs from people who
remembered the old days. After that I do not know. May be some of the
younger people can enlighten us.
Swarup
Courtesy: http://www.kanneganti.com/
NaChaKi
>>Looking at all the అచ్చ తెలుగు words in this song, who would ever
have guessed that this is based on a Hindi song?
Hmmm, correct me if I am wrong, but isn't the Telugu song (పయనించే
ఓ చిలుకా...) precedent to the Hindi one? That's what I thought all
these years anyway.
NaChaKi.
PS: Whether I'm right or wrong, that's a compliment to the lyricist in
the second language, as someone confused it to be the first.
Uday Bhaskar
>
> Writing poetry naturally could be difficult. But writing a
seemingly natural poetry (songs here) for dubbing movies is doubly
tough. One thing, the message should be properly conveyed. The words
While not in the same class as songs for dubbed movies, songs written
to "borrowed" (read copied or stolen) tunes is also a challenge, as
it is often difficult to maintain the rhythm and rhyme pattern and
still retain some semblance of meaning. Yet, some lyricists did
wonders with tunes that music directors plagiarised from other
languages. Some examples I can think of -
1. "ఈ రోజు, మంచి రోజు, ప్రేమ సుమం వికసించిన రోజు" to the tune
of "యే రాతైన్, నయీ పురానీ"
2. "నీ మది చల్లగా, స్వామీ నిదురపో" to the tune of "ఖిల్తే హైన్
గుల్ యహాన్"
3. "దేఖ్నే మైన్ భోలా హై, దిల్కా సలోనా" to the tune of "ఏరువాకా
సాగారోరన్నో చిన్నన్నా" (this goes to shows that plagiarism works both
ways :-))
I am particularly selecting songs that retained the tune, but totally
changed the meaning and context, unlike songs like "పయనించే ఓ
చిలుకా".
By the way, I remember a number of Hindi songs that copied English
songs and western classical tunes, but I can only recollect one
Telugu song with an English tune (Uriah Heap's "Lady in Black" copied
for a "comedy" song picturised on Rajababu, that goes something
like "నువ్వే నాకు ప్రాణం అందుకే కోరి వచ్చా). I am sure there must
have been plenty of them, especially in the 50s and 60s, the golden
era for plagiarism.
Regards,
Uday
Courtesy: http://www.kanneganti.com/
J. K. Mohana Rao
--- Hemantha Kumar <andhraputhra@y...> wrote:
>
> The song "Halo Halo O ammayi" from Iddaru Mitrulu is almost a copy of an
> English song titled "Mustafa" where the opening tune matches with words
> "Mustafa ya Mustafa". Maybe Sreenivas Paruchuri garu can lend a helping hand
> here.
>
There is a website for plagiarised songs. Though there are
not (m)any telugu songs in that, it is educative to know
that all the famous MDs are in the hall of "f(sh)ame".
Please visit
http://www.iespana.es/i2fs/
and also for an article in rediff on the same issue, see
http://www.rediff.com/search/2003/jun/11music.htm
Sri gaMTi gAru and paracUri gAru may know more about this.
Regards! - J K Mohana Rao
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