Pakistan Trans Border Optical Fiber Links
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Muhammad Anees Ur Rahman
May 9, 2012, 2:41:31 AM5/9/12
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Dear fellows, I am currently working on a research paper on establishing trans-border optical fiber links between Pakistan and its neighboring countries. I need your help with data and pointers if you have any on the follwoing aspects which i think are relevant:
1) How trans-border optical fiber links can help boost the Pakistan Telecom industry
2) Socio-political challenges faced when laying trans-border optical fiber links including any regulatory hurdles and ways then can be overcome?
3) Benefits or problems for the telecom industry and overall economy for both countries being linked?
Your help in advance is greatly appreciated. Please also show if you support establishment of these links or oppose it?
Fouad Bajwa
May 9, 2012, 6:03:14 AM5/9/12
to telecom-gr...@googlegroups.com, Anne Lord, Rajnesh Singh
Hi Anees,
You bring on an interesting discussion, something that has been
relevant to another issue within optic fibre discussions and that is
dark fiber and whether it could help connect with neighboring
countries or improve Internet speeds etc. Its not only lacking in our
region, its also the same for neighboring union regions
http://www.mafhoum.com/press7/218T42.pdf but there have been attempts
to tackle this between regions in Europe:
http://www.porta-optica.org/publications/POS-D3.4_Cooperation_Agreement_and_Acceptable_Use_Policy.pdf.
Last year I was delivering ITU missions and had the opportunity to go
to Afghanistan and meet with the telecom related actors and bodies. I
had detailed discussions on the issue of dark fiber and why the two
nations had not yet walked that road because the closest Afghani
densely populated area to Pakistan is Kabul and there is a possibility
to use dark fibre networks if Pakistan based Internet Service
Providers were allowed to cross borders through some sort of economic
cooperation etc. This should be considered within the fact famework
that Pakistani companies like IBEX Islamabad etc are working with
Telecom Operators including MTN, Roshan etc in Kabul to provide IVR
solutions in various Farsi Dari, Pashto etc languages.
The discussion spurred out of the issue that In Pakistani urban areas
(and adjoining rural regions) citizens can easily enjoy 1MB/2MB
Broadband at US$16/17 per connection but in Kabul, the same speed is
available at US$100 for 1MB and US$200 for 2MB. I was training 4
organizations including MoICT, TRA, AT, KU and none of my trainees had
access to the Internet other than their offices or at the training
venue which was an ITU Academy. Yes, Afghan citizens hardly have
access to Internet at their homes.
The reason why we can't share dark fiber primarily is due to political
reasons. At the end of the day, the two nations really aren't that
friendly with each other and the recent events totally put each in the
negative zone with each other. IF the two countries agree today to
exchange dark fiber, Afghanistan's Internet penetration and widespread
adoption scene would dramatically improve within 1.5 years. I had a
detailed discussion with a local telco on the issue of sharing dark
fiber capacity and they said as long as the red flag was up by the
authorities, we could not even think of talking about such a
cooperation.
There is another issue which is of protecting critical internet
infrastructure from attacks that has never been explored by Pakistan
or its neighbors as a joint collaboration. You may want to read this
article though not a strong case but helps you get the idea that we
don't have such research or testing coming out anywhere in the region:
http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2010/03/how-amsterdam-was-wired-for-open-access-fiber.ars/4
There is another element of economic hypocrisy in terms of Internet
related business with our neighboring regions by our Telecom industry
and authorities as well. It might be termed as a strategic or
competitive advantage of a de-regularized market. For example, a
Middle Eastern operator in Pakistan sells LDI/Bandwidth to our
neighboring countries and our MoIT/PTA/Parliamentary ICT Committee
obviously allows all this because they have never intervened. If this
can happen then why not dark fiber sharing and more possibly the
creation of a regional Internet Exchange Point so that we can boost
our Internet traffic speeds.
I would also like to point you to the issue of IXP's in Pakistan. We
don't have a proper IXP other then our Internet traffic
DPI/surveillance point at PIE in Karachi. Our Telecom/ISP companies
should pool and build an IXP. One such idea was floated for Lahore's
Arfa STP PITB last year to exchange the traffic between PTCL and all
other providers at an IXP optic fibre loop that would have boosted
Internet traffic speeds for Lahore and then could be replicated across
other cities of Pakistan.
You should definitely go through this recent Internet Society Economic
Study on IXP's and its impact. The summary is presented here:
http://www.internetsociety.org/news/new-study-reveals-how-internet-exchange-points-ixps-spur-internet-growth-emerging-markets
and the report can be downloaded here:
http://www.internetsociety.org/sites/default/files/Assessment%20of%20the%20impact%20of%20Internet%20Exchange%20Points%20%E2%80%93%20empirical%20study%20of%20Kenya%20and%20Nigeria.pdf
Finally before we step into sharing dark fibre etc with neighboring
countries, our telcos and Internet Service Providers including
authorities should be ashamed of themselves for giving us meagre
speeds whereas we have the technical capacity to buy and extend
increased speeds. Recall the saying "The amount of data coming out of
an optical fibre is doubling every nine months", means that we will
evidently come to a point where sharing dark fibre or generally
building and interconnecting regional IXPs would become a necessity.
I hope this helps
Best....
Foo
> --
> Manage your subscription:
> http://groups.google.com/group/telecom-grid-pakistan
> Browse and populate the community wiki at: http://wiki.telecompk.net
--
Regards.
--------------------------
Fouad Bajwa
ICT4D and Internet Governance Advisor
My Blog: Internet's Governance: http://internetsgovernance.blogspot.com/
Follow my Tweets: http://twitter.com/fouadbajwa
You bring on an interesting discussion, something that has been
relevant to another issue within optic fibre discussions and that is
dark fiber and whether it could help connect with neighboring
countries or improve Internet speeds etc. Its not only lacking in our
region, its also the same for neighboring union regions
http://www.mafhoum.com/press7/218T42.pdf but there have been attempts
to tackle this between regions in Europe:
http://www.porta-optica.org/publications/POS-D3.4_Cooperation_Agreement_and_Acceptable_Use_Policy.pdf.
Last year I was delivering ITU missions and had the opportunity to go
to Afghanistan and meet with the telecom related actors and bodies. I
had detailed discussions on the issue of dark fiber and why the two
nations had not yet walked that road because the closest Afghani
densely populated area to Pakistan is Kabul and there is a possibility
to use dark fibre networks if Pakistan based Internet Service
Providers were allowed to cross borders through some sort of economic
cooperation etc. This should be considered within the fact famework
that Pakistani companies like IBEX Islamabad etc are working with
Telecom Operators including MTN, Roshan etc in Kabul to provide IVR
solutions in various Farsi Dari, Pashto etc languages.
The discussion spurred out of the issue that In Pakistani urban areas
(and adjoining rural regions) citizens can easily enjoy 1MB/2MB
Broadband at US$16/17 per connection but in Kabul, the same speed is
available at US$100 for 1MB and US$200 for 2MB. I was training 4
organizations including MoICT, TRA, AT, KU and none of my trainees had
access to the Internet other than their offices or at the training
venue which was an ITU Academy. Yes, Afghan citizens hardly have
access to Internet at their homes.
The reason why we can't share dark fiber primarily is due to political
reasons. At the end of the day, the two nations really aren't that
friendly with each other and the recent events totally put each in the
negative zone with each other. IF the two countries agree today to
exchange dark fiber, Afghanistan's Internet penetration and widespread
adoption scene would dramatically improve within 1.5 years. I had a
detailed discussion with a local telco on the issue of sharing dark
fiber capacity and they said as long as the red flag was up by the
authorities, we could not even think of talking about such a
cooperation.
There is another issue which is of protecting critical internet
infrastructure from attacks that has never been explored by Pakistan
or its neighbors as a joint collaboration. You may want to read this
article though not a strong case but helps you get the idea that we
don't have such research or testing coming out anywhere in the region:
http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2010/03/how-amsterdam-was-wired-for-open-access-fiber.ars/4
There is another element of economic hypocrisy in terms of Internet
related business with our neighboring regions by our Telecom industry
and authorities as well. It might be termed as a strategic or
competitive advantage of a de-regularized market. For example, a
Middle Eastern operator in Pakistan sells LDI/Bandwidth to our
neighboring countries and our MoIT/PTA/Parliamentary ICT Committee
obviously allows all this because they have never intervened. If this
can happen then why not dark fiber sharing and more possibly the
creation of a regional Internet Exchange Point so that we can boost
our Internet traffic speeds.
I would also like to point you to the issue of IXP's in Pakistan. We
don't have a proper IXP other then our Internet traffic
DPI/surveillance point at PIE in Karachi. Our Telecom/ISP companies
should pool and build an IXP. One such idea was floated for Lahore's
Arfa STP PITB last year to exchange the traffic between PTCL and all
other providers at an IXP optic fibre loop that would have boosted
Internet traffic speeds for Lahore and then could be replicated across
other cities of Pakistan.
You should definitely go through this recent Internet Society Economic
Study on IXP's and its impact. The summary is presented here:
http://www.internetsociety.org/news/new-study-reveals-how-internet-exchange-points-ixps-spur-internet-growth-emerging-markets
and the report can be downloaded here:
http://www.internetsociety.org/sites/default/files/Assessment%20of%20the%20impact%20of%20Internet%20Exchange%20Points%20%E2%80%93%20empirical%20study%20of%20Kenya%20and%20Nigeria.pdf
Finally before we step into sharing dark fibre etc with neighboring
countries, our telcos and Internet Service Providers including
authorities should be ashamed of themselves for giving us meagre
speeds whereas we have the technical capacity to buy and extend
increased speeds. Recall the saying "The amount of data coming out of
an optical fibre is doubling every nine months", means that we will
evidently come to a point where sharing dark fibre or generally
building and interconnecting regional IXPs would become a necessity.
I hope this helps
Best....
Foo
> Manage your subscription:
> http://groups.google.com/group/telecom-grid-pakistan
> Browse and populate the community wiki at: http://wiki.telecompk.net
--
Regards.
--------------------------
Fouad Bajwa
ICT4D and Internet Governance Advisor
My Blog: Internet's Governance: http://internetsgovernance.blogspot.com/
Follow my Tweets: http://twitter.com/fouadbajwa
Faisal Khan
May 9, 2012, 4:20:50 AM5/9/12
to telecom-gr...@googlegroups.com
Anees:
Such links are already established, Iran, Afghanistan and China (I am led to believe)
Such links are already established, Iran, Afghanistan and China (I am led to believe)
Sent from my BlackBerry®
From: Muhammad Anees Ur Rahman <ane...@gmail.com>
Sender: telecom-gr...@googlegroups.com
Date: Tue, 8 May 2012 23:41:31 -0700 (PDT)
ReplyTo: telecom-gr...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Pakistan Trans Border Optical Fiber Links
--
Fawad Niazi
May 9, 2012, 9:24:56 AM5/9/12
to telecom-gr...@googlegroups.com
I guess you may contact SAARC secretariat in Pakistan. It has an agenda to link all the members.
Ashar Iqbal
May 9, 2012, 8:05:28 AM5/9/12
to telecom-gr...@googlegroups.com, Anne Lord, Rajnesh Singh
Just to add to the benefit of Internet Exchanges for ISPs - right now you are paying for bandwidth. This would be bandwidth for free.
Is there any reason for not doing this?
Ashar
Is there any reason for not doing this?
Ashar
Saqib Ilyas
May 10, 2012, 2:46:36 AM5/10/12
to telecom-gr...@googlegroups.com
IMHO, there could be issues like premises and equipment rental/ownership. While the traffic could be exchanged for free, there might be concern about who makes the money, however little, out of the free service.Muhammad Saqib Ilyas
PhD Student, Computer Science and Engineering
Lahore University of Management Sciences
PhD Student, Computer Science and Engineering
Lahore University of Management Sciences
Rehan Allahwala
May 10, 2012, 7:09:05 AM5/10/12
to telecom-gr...@googlegroups.com
Salam anees bhai
Can you introduce yourself plz
Thanks
Rehan
--
Ashar Iqbal
May 11, 2012, 5:31:57 AM5/11/12
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Generally speaking everyone (ISPs, customers, websites) gains by participating in an IX, but if concerns like this stop participation then we all lose by getting to buy bandwidth.
Ashar
Ashar
IZ
May 11, 2012, 7:04:43 AM5/11/12
to telecom-gr...@googlegroups.com
Ashar,
Big to big ISP, yes, small to big, yes to former and not so much for lateral.
Which pretty much means that a big ISP will most probably charge a smaller one to peer.
On the topic, it's not that simple as in laying the fiber, it's more to do with ownership, legal and political reasons, which most of guys have already pointed out.
It's a good initiative anyways, shortest path is always in the interest of service providers as well as customers. Plus on the economic front, a big boom of data is being expected due to introduction of cloud services, the company I work for is going to provide $40 mil/annum network infrastructure in china for cloud based services of a well known online store. Sorry cant disclose either names here, but the point is, to be ready for the future, we need massive bandwidth, lots of data centers an shortest routes to nearest data-centers and interconnects in the region.
Thanks
Izh
Sent from my iPhone
Sent from my iPhone
Haris Shamsi
May 16, 2012, 1:19:01 AM5/16/12
to telecom-gr...@googlegroups.com
Cross Border links I believe is mostly political and as Izhar has
mentioned- related to ownership.Currently non-existence of consortium
having both side representation etc is also a contributor to it.
To my understanding, PTCL has laid a fiber till Afghanistan and few
other operators have laid the cable till wahga border (please correct
me if this has gone live with India)
IMHO, there are several model of IX running in Pakistan. ITI, TWA
itself could be called IXPs as they are routing the traffic within
Pakistan. Cable Net providers connected with each other and few ISPs
are also trying localize the traffic. You may not require an
"announced" IXP to localize the traffic, its more of a
commercial/authority issue when it comes to formation of IXP.
/HS
http://cloud.pk
You're either part of the solution or part of the problem - Eldridge Cleaver
mentioned- related to ownership.Currently non-existence of consortium
having both side representation etc is also a contributor to it.
To my understanding, PTCL has laid a fiber till Afghanistan and few
other operators have laid the cable till wahga border (please correct
me if this has gone live with India)
IMHO, there are several model of IX running in Pakistan. ITI, TWA
itself could be called IXPs as they are routing the traffic within
Pakistan. Cable Net providers connected with each other and few ISPs
are also trying localize the traffic. You may not require an
"announced" IXP to localize the traffic, its more of a
commercial/authority issue when it comes to formation of IXP.
/HS
You're either part of the solution or part of the problem - Eldridge Cleaver
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