Kodak Date Codes

[Millard Winnin]

Ibought two 400-ft. tins of B&W neg 16mm Eastman last summer, which was going to be used for an experimental short a few weeks later. As many film projects go, it is only now that we're finally getting around to shoot this stock. I just pulled the cans out of the fridge to look them over, and was surprised to find that there is no expiration date stamped anywhere. How does one go about determining when the stuff expires? Is there a number I can call with the emulsion batch number at Kodak? John? I am certain ?he stuff is still usable, but if it is near expired I want to know so that I can introduce an antifoggant during development or overexpose a third of a stop more.

Motion Picture film stock does not have an expiry date on it. If you process a short length, Kodak stock will have a date code on it which will tell you when it was manufactured. You can find information on date codes on the Kodak website.Neither a date code or an expiry date is of much help to you. You need to determine the fog level of the film and its speed. These will depend on the storage history of the film. You need to process a short length of unexposed film and also do an exposure test using the normal development time and temperature. You can then make any adjustments for the film. If the fog level is too high than it is preferable not to use the film although you can try an anti foggant.

In the days when features were regularly shot on B/W film every batch of film would be sent to a lab before shooting to have gamma tests made so that the lab knew how to process the film to get the correct gamma and to get the exact speed.

Thanks for the info Brian. It was purchased new about one year ago and has been refrigerated ever since. How exactly do you shoot a test with B&W? I've shot them with color film only. Is there a specific chart I should shoot for such a test?

I wouldn't worry at all about B/W film that's been in the freezer, or even fridge, for only a year, if it was fresh when you got it. The fog level goes up a bit, but I'd be happy using B/W for stills after a few years.

A normal Greyscale chart as used for colour film would be fine. You need to make sure that you get a range of density from white to black and that you can see all the steps of the wedge. I would have thought that if the film had been refridgerated then it should be in excellent condition. It might be sufficient just to shoot a short length of picture and include a fleshtone in it and make sure the density of the face is not too light or too dark.

Professional motion picture film is not labeled with an expiration date, as storage conditions determine how fast the characteristics change. The emulsion batch and roll number provide the information needed for Kodak to track the history of a particular film roll.

I recently purchased a very nice Cine-Kodak Special 16mm camera on eBay (the original model with the flat, non-divergent turret). The serial number is 4736. Does anyone have an idea when it was manufactured? I'm thinking late 30's or early 40's. Thanks.

No, just the numbers 4736. I think it was made before the CAMEROSITY code was used. The literature that came with the camera is dated from the late 30s to the early 40s, which may be a clue. It has the original mask set, the care instructions have the date code 6-38. The 100 foot magazine that came with it is stamped 100-6161. I can't be sure it was the original one that came with the camera, though. I know the same magazines were used with the Cine-Special II.

Here are some photos that may be helpful. The turret plate is different from others I've seen, which are usually either missing or have exposure tables printed on them. This one is solid black. The 15mm lens finder glass is cracked, otherwise the camera is in excellent condition, with only minor wear. I'm surprised Kodak hasn't provided a reference for this.

Thanks, Simon. That's good to know. I'm very impressed with it, and after oiling it I looking forward to using it, mainly for time-lapse and other single-frame work. It's a very heavy, seemingly well made camera with many of the features of the Bolex H16 cameras for a much lower price. By the way, reading your previous positive comments on these cameras is one of the reasons I purchased it. I have been considering getting one for a long time.

The flaw with my previous comment is it only allows for one camera to be produced per month-highly unlikely! So it was probably manufactured in 1936 or 1937, if the first number represents the production year.

There is no such connection. The number is just a straight sequential serial number. No production year, no codes. Just a number. The number of your camera would place it somewhere around 1940, if production was fairly consistent from year to year. There were about 9000 CS-I cameras made between 1933 and 1948.

Kodak very likely does not have a reference for this, but I've been collecting serial numbers on these for years. Part of my reply to Simon below should have been addressed to you. Proportionally, yours would fall sometime around 1940, so maybe give or take a year.

I think I may have the likely answer. I checked the serial number of the 25mm Anastigmat lens that likely was sold with the camera, as they generally came with this standard lens. The serial number is EY00458. Refer to the excerpt below from bnphoto.org/bnphoto/LFN/KodakID_htm:

That is a good way to date these, provided you are fairly certain the lens is the original one with the camera. Yours also fits in sequence so probably is, but I would be cautious in general trying to date these that way because lenses were often switched, upgraded, added by later owners, or simply replaced, so it's one of those things that warrants care and is most credible when all the numbers are in the proper range.

I agree with you, Michael, that is would be wise to consider the lens date circumstantial evidence. I wouldn't say with certainty it dates from 1940, but it is probably very close to that date (circa 1940). It will probably be impossible to state with certainty the exact year of manufacture, since Kodak didn't appear to keep detailed records of their early models like Paillard-Bolex. One of the reasons I bought it, besides its collector's value, is that I can do basic lubrication on it myself and it's still a viable camera for the single-frame work I intend to do with it. Eastman Kodak very thoughtfully provided lubrication ports throughout the camera. Plus I have read on this forum that it's not terribly difficult to disassemble for a thorough cleaning and greasing. I will wait on that until I get a copy of the military service manual. I have the parts list but that's all it is: a parts list. Right now it runs nice and smooth for an 80+ year-old camera, and I'm good with that. Thanks, Michael.

IMPORTANT NOTE: Some of these dates do not correspond to the dates on the Kodak website: I copied this information in 1969 from hand written notes and I do not have any corroboration of these dates. Also these would be the dates of introduction in the UK.

Agfa did not put date codes on their film. From the early 20's until 1924 the edge print 'Agfa' was printed in 'BOLD' typeface with the top of the A flattened. From 1924 on the type face was thinner and the A had a sharp top. See the samples below. Click thumbnail to enlarge.

Lens coatings were not introduced until the late 1930s and this lens certainly seems older than that. Is the bloom the result of some natural oxidation or did someone like the lens so much they had it coated in later life? Or does it just happen to have been made in the two or three year gap between Kodak introducing their first coatings and bringing in their alphabetical lens date-codes?

It is clearly a four-element lens: the back group unscrews easily and quite obviously comprises more than one lens. It is also obvious at that point that there are a couple of lenses in front of the aperture diaphragm.

The first site is a PDF straight from Polaroid explaining the codes found on the back of their instant photos. This includes both peel-apart (pack-film) and integral film. This fifty-five page document (dated 1998) does a thorough job of explaining the various codes found on the backs of Polaroid pictures. I never gave much thought to these codes and assumed they only meant something to Polaroid.

Again, using the information from the above referenced websites I can determine that this film was manufactured in July (07) 1978 (8). In the background of the Polaroid is my certificate of having played Soccer during my freshman year of high school, 1979. Again, my Dad used his film sparingly, which probably explains why we have so few family Polaroids.

I am a nostalgic person by nature and enjoy looking at old photographs as much as I enjoy taking new photographs. Each picture tells a unique story and it tells one that will last for as long as the photograph itself lasts. Now, get out there and make memories. SHOOT MORE INSTANT FILM!

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