Description component / bundle

[Daniel Leech]

Hi,

I am sure that not many of you are aware of the Resource stacks
"Description" functionality.

It provides a way for third party units to add "descriptors" to a Puli /
CMF Resource - descriptors may be edition links, creation links (for
children), the title which should be used, thumbnails, summary
descriptions, etc.

This allows all resources to be represented and handled in a genric
fashion (f.e. in a browser).

I have just realised however that it would be equally beneficial to
describe standard objects - i.e. ODM Documents, ORM Entities ..
whatever without depending on having access to the resource which
represents them.

So I propose to make yet another CMF component dedicated to object
description.

https://github.com/symfony-cmf/resource/issues/36

This seems good to me as it already feels awkward in the Resource
component.

Sounds good?

Cheers,

Dan

[gmx Privat]

Hi dan,

I don't know if there coralation to your descriptors. But for for adding resource state change descriptions i would like to see something like defined in the ALPS standard.

[Daniel Leech]

You could use the information in an API, but it is not coupled with APIs
(or resources), something like:

$description = $descriptionFactory->describe($someObject);

$description->getDescriptor(EditLinkDescriptor::class); // path/to/edit/123
$description->getDescriptor(TitleDescriptor::class); // "My Article"
$description->getDescriptor(ClassFqnDescriptor::class); // AppBundle\Enitiy\Foobar
$description->getDescriptor(ImageSrcDescriptor::class); ///thumbnails/foobar.jpg
$description->getDescriptor(ChildCreateLinks::class); // some iterator...

On Sun, Aug 28, 2016 at 08:08:11PM +0200, gmx Privat wrote:
> Hi dan,
>
> I don't know if there coralation to your descriptors. But for for adding resource state change descriptions i would like to see something like defined in the ALPS standard.
>

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[Daniel Leech]

I am going to do this tomorrow unless there is no reply to this thread.

[Wouter de Jong]

I'm sorry for my slow response :) (and david is on summercamp)

We need to be very carefull with creating new packages. We've recently

abandoned some very usefull packages (e.g. the MediaBundle), because

we don't have the man-power to maintain them.

By introducing even more packages, we both give a wrong message (why

deprecating MediaBundle and introducing Description?) and we get more

maintainance work.

Please note that we've added quite some components in the past months

which are all created and maintained by you (RoutingAuto, ContentType,

Resource). Please be aware of the time it takes to maintain all these packages

and their bundles.

Imo, our number one goal is to provide easy to use bundles for the Symfony

framework. I don't think we should create components that may be used by

other CMSes (I don't think it'll happen often, as CMSes are often quite coupled

to their own packages).

I propose:

If we know this package will be used standalone and have good use-cases,

we can think about splitting it.

Otherwise, let's keep it in the Resource component and create a Description

component when we find an actual use-case.

2016-09-03 17:32 GMT+02:00 Daniel Leech <dan...@dantleech.com>:

I am going to do this tomorrow unless there is no reply to this thread.

On Sun, Aug 28, 2016 at 09:25:34PM +0100, Daniel Leech wrote:
> You could use the information in an API, but it is not coupled with APIs
> (or resources), something like:
>
>     $description = $descriptionFactory->describe($someObject);
>
>     $description->getDescriptor(EditLinkDescriptor::class); // path/to/edit/123
>     $description->getDescriptor(TitleDescriptor::class); // "My Article"
>     $description->getDescriptor(ClassFqnDescriptor::class); // AppBundle\Enitiy\Foobar
>     $description->getDescriptor(ImageSrcDescriptor::class); ///thumbnails/foobar.jpg
>     $description->getDescriptor(ChildCreateLinks::class); // some iterator...
>
> On Sun, Aug 28, 2016 at 08:08:11PM +0200, gmx Privat wrote:
> > Hi dan,
> >
> > I don't know if there coralation to your descriptors. But for for adding resource state change descriptions i would like to see something like defined in the ALPS standard.
> >
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[Daniel Leech]

On Sat, Sep 03, 2016 at 05:42:34PM +0200, Wouter de Jong wrote:
> I'm sorry for my slow response :) (and david is on summercamp)
> We need to be very carefull with creating new packages. We've recently
> abandoned some very usefull packages (e.g. the MediaBundle), because
> we don't have the man-power to maintain them.

I don't think the MediaBundle was that useful tbh.

> By introducing even more packages, we both give a wrong message (why
> deprecating MediaBundle and introducing Description?) and we get more
> maintainance work.
> Please note that we've added quite some components in the past months
> which are all created and maintained by you (RoutingAuto, ContentType,
> Resource). Please be aware of the time it takes to maintain all these
> packages
> and their bundles.

I want to create decoupled CMS components, I want to build a viable CMS
using these decoupled components. I thought this was the goal of the
Symfony CMF.

> Imo, our number one goal is to provide easy to use bundles for the Symfony
> framework. I don't think we should create components that may be used by
> other CMSes (I don't think it'll happen often, as CMSes are often quite
> coupled
> to their own packages).
> I propose:
> If we know this package will be used standalone and have good use-cases,
> we can think about splitting it.
> Otherwise, let's keep it in the Resource component and create a
> Description

I need this component outside of the Resource stack and there is no
reason that it should be coupled to Resources. It is very CMS-centric.

> component when we find an actual use-case.

To be honest I wonder if I shouldn't create another organization. Which
provides decoupled CMS components which integrate with Symfony.

The fact is I have put aside alot of time over the coming months to
develop all these things and I am not sure we have a common agenda here.

I would love to discuss this in an IRC meeting or over Skype or
whatever, and if people like what I am doing then great. Otherwise I can
move both ContentType and Description to another organization with no
hard feelings.

Cheers,

Dan

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[Wouter de Jong]

Yeah, I think you want to create a CMS, whereas imo, the CMF is mostly about

providing bundles to make your site more easily editable.

If we plan to provide a framework for CMSes, I'm happy to throw my idea of CMF

away (tbh, I would love to create a CMS).

I like your proposal to organize a CMF meeting about this on IRC soon (this might

also repower us, as the CMF project activity is close to zero).

Shall we create a doodle for the meeting?

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[gmx Privat]

Am 03.09.2016 um 20:13 schrieb Wouter de Jong <jong.de...@gmail.com>:

Yeah, I think you want to create a CMS, whereas imo, the CMF is mostly about

providing bundles to make your site more easily editable.

If we plan to provide a framework for CMSes, I'm happy to throw my idea of CMF

What is the difference? Building components to make parts of a symfony project editable, can end in a set of features of a CMS. It is all about man power to build that. So WouterJ is right, currently we only have the Power to maintain a smal set of components. So we have to make that Part really really good. And we have to present (Talks, Articles, Documentation) that really good. That is the only way to get more contributors in my opinion.  Then we can move on. 

I have so many ideas in my head (lots of frontend stuff,...API) but my time ...

away (tbh, I would love to create a CMS).

I like your proposal to organize a CMF meeting about this on IRC soon (this might

also repower us, as the CMF project activity is close to zero).

Good point. 

Shall we create a doodle for the meeting?

Yes.

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[Daniel Leech]

Done: http://doodle.com/poll/abq6rxm65emiqkmc

On Sat, Sep 03, 2016 at 08:13:44PM +0200, Wouter de Jong wrote:
> Yeah, I think you want to create a CMS, whereas imo, the CMF is mostly
> about
> providing bundles to make your site more easily editable.
> If we plan to provide a framework for CMSes, I'm happy to throw my idea of
> CMF
> away (tbh, I would love to create a CMS).
> I like your proposal to organize a CMF meeting about this on IRC soon
> (this might
> also repower us, as the CMF project activity is close to zero).
> Shall we create a doodle for the meeting?

> <[1][2]dan...@dantleech.com>:

> [2][3]symfony-cmf-de...@googlegroups.com.
> >      > > For more options, visit
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[Daniel Leech]

Here you go: http://doodle.com/poll/abq6rxm65emiqkmc

On Sat, Sep 03, 2016 at 08:13:44PM +0200, Wouter de Jong wrote:
> Yeah, I think you want to create a CMS, whereas imo, the CMF is mostly
> about
> providing bundles to make your site more easily editable.
> If we plan to provide a framework for CMSes, I'm happy to throw my idea of
> CMF
> away (tbh, I would love to create a CMS).
> I like your proposal to organize a CMF meeting about this on IRC soon
> (this might
> also repower us, as the CMF project activity is close to zero).
> Shall we create a doodle for the meeting?

> <[1][2]dan...@dantleech.com>:

> [2][3]symfony-cmf-de...@googlegroups.com.
> >      > > For more options, visit
> [3][4]https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

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[GMX - Maximilian Berghoff]

Dan, can you add some more information into the description. So we can
share it a little on twitter and so on?
I would really wish to do that on a kind of a hangout, cause on a chat
you can't really follow discussions, you can't do some kind of a
moderation (or i didn't see that).

Max

[Daniel Leech]

Tbh, I am not sure what we are discussing yet otherwise I would have
done. I will update it in the coming days and put it on Twitter.

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[David Buchmann]

> Yeah, I think you want to create a CMS, whereas imo, the CMF is mostly about
> providing bundles to make your site more easily editable.

in my understanding, the aim of the cmf was always twofold and included
providing building blocks to create custom (or other) cms.

> I like your proposal to organize a CMF meeting about this on IRC soon
> (this might
> also repower us, as the CMF project activity is close to zero).

as you probably noticed, i have become less active, both in the
mailinglist and in the repositories. but i still care about the cmf. i'd
be happy to join such a meeting and see that we can (re)align ourselves.
i filled out the doodle, but most of the dates actually are already
past... i am usually more flexible during the day than in evenings.

imo we can also try to continue the discussion here by emails.

cheers,david

ps: regarding media bundle, i think both dan and wouter are right in
some way. media management is an important functionality for a cms, so
it would be relevant. but the bundle we had never became very relevant
because it was complicated and not 100% ready to use and documentation
is lacking too.

[Daniel Leech]

On Mon, Sep 12, 2016 at 10:28:19AM +0200, David Buchmann wrote:
> > Yeah, I think you want to create a CMS, whereas imo, the CMF is mostly about
> > providing bundles to make your site more easily editable.
>
> in my understanding, the aim of the cmf was always twofold and included
> providing building blocks to create custom (or other) cms.
>
> > I like your proposal to organize a CMF meeting about this on IRC soon
> > (this might
> > also repower us, as the CMF project activity is close to zero).
>
> as you probably noticed, i have become less active, both in the
> mailinglist and in the repositories. but i still care about the cmf. i'd
> be happy to join such a meeting and see that we can (re)align ourselves.
> i filled out the doodle, but most of the dates actually are already
> past... i am usually more flexible during the day than in evenings.
>
> imo we can also try to continue the discussion here by emails.

I think discussing here is fine for the moment. I have been working on some
things privately and I will, in the coming week, post what I have done
which will may provide a good basis for discussion.

>
> cheers,david
>
> ps: regarding media bundle, i think both dan and wouter are right in
> some way. media management is an important functionality for a cms, so
> it would be relevant. but the bundle we had never became very relevant
> because it was complicated and not 100% ready to use and documentation
> is lacking too.


>

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