Play DVD-V in foobar?

[Marcelo]

Guys,

I've been playing DVD-A in foobar for a while. I also have a load of
DVD-V that contain 96/24 tracks (like genesis, etc). Is there a plug-
in that would allow me to play DVD-V in foobar so I can get to play
the 96/24 audio tracks properly? (not interested in the video part of
it)

Right now, if I use any DVD player SW on my PC I get downsampled. I
can also extract the music stream using AC3, but is tedious.

Regards

[polmuaddib]

Good question. I asked myself that a while ago and still didn't find a
way to play 96/24 DVD Video in true resolution on PC.
I hope that someone knows better.
Sorry.
I guess there is a way to convert it to flac or something, but as you
said.... it is not the point.

[Marcelo]

Thanks.... I was wondering why the guys that wrote the dvd-a plugin
for foobar could not write a dvd-v plugin... let's see if someone else
figured a trick to make this work.

[Robert Russell]

KMplayer plus reclock (straight thru no downsampling) to SPDIF plays all
surround sound formats including DVD-A using the new Winamp DVD-A plugin

RARBAR

[polmuaddib]

I haven't tried that still, and it might work for 24/96 DTS, but can
it work for DVD-A?
Because I thought that you can't deliver MLP 5.1 in 24/96 through
SPDIF because of bandwith limitations.
Or am I wrong?
Also, is that the only way? Through SPDIF? Because I use analog
connection to my 5.1 reciever.
Either way it is not a solution for me right now.
Unless that KMplayer doesn't downsample, which would be perfect.
Also, what Reclock actually does? Does it keep the true resolution or
just upsamples the downsampled output of a SW player?
Thanks

On Sep 29, 6:37 am, Tab Cursor <tabcur...@gmail.com> wrote:
> RARBAR,
>
> Are you using the MLP/TrueHD Decoder? Here:
>
> http://www.winamp.com/plugins/details/221516
>
> And I think I found a site explaining how to use Winamp plugins in
> KMplayer. Here:
>
> http://www.kmplayer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4513
>
> But can you open files from the AUDIO_TS folder? Or are you converting
> to MLP files first?
>
> Thanks...
>
> On Sep 28, 9:17 pm, Tab Cursor <tabcur...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > RARBAR,
>
> > Could you please explain where you found the Winamp DVD-A plugin?
> > Also, how did you set up KMplayer to use it?
>
> > Thanks...

> > > Regards- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

[Robert Russell]

Yes - you have the link I used for the plugin.

I am not an expert on this. So, my explanation might not be technical enough
to satisfy most in this group. But, I will give it a try.

First, KMplayer has played all surround formats for a long time (at least
two years)So DTS and AC3 all play nicely. Even some experimental surround
MP3s played via a Winamp plugin. DVDs using dolby or DTS also played fine.

But only recently (2 months?) has KMplayer been able to play DVD-A. About
the the end of ShaPlayer development, Mommyman developed this DVD-A plugin
for Winamp. I think this is the first version. So I hope updates will make
it even stronger and more capable (I have not been able to play surround
sound individual song files with the ".mlp" extension. Anybody able to do
that yet?

I suspect both the Shaplayer and Mommyman Winamp plugin have the same DVD-A
decode code/theory in their roots. I downloaded the Mommyman DVD-A plugin,
copied the plugin into the KMplayer plugins folder. Then I mounted a DVD-A
iso using Daemon tools. With no extra adjustments KMPlayer played the DVD-A
flawlessly. It has always been a little strange but I start the DVD-A in
KMplayer by opening CD G: (Where G: is the virtual drive holding my DVD-A
image.) So I guess KMplayer can't tell the difference between a CD and DVD.
Also to my surprise it also did the video and allowed interaction with DVD
controls (just like playing a real DVD). Pretty neat Huh?! I tested my 60
DVD-A ISO collection that I knew played with Shaplayer and all worked! I
like the above method for playing DVD-A but the KMplayer (Winamp plugin)
also allows playing by opening an AUDIO_TS folder. Select open folder rather
than open CD

Next, I tackled the down sampling (Percieved sound quality) issue of
KMPlayer. I read all the posts on Shaplayer website and discovered how he
solved the problem using reclock with Shaplayer. I followed his directions
on how to add reclock to/with Shaplayer Wow ! what a difference! So then I
went to the KMPlayer forum and searched for any info on implementing Reclock
for KMPlayer. Lots of threads exist and most of them were in French. I left
the KMplayer forum and did a Google search for "KMPlayer and Reclock". I
found an entire webpage that provided directions on how to setup KMplayer to
use Reclock. My first attempt at playing a DVD-A using KMplayer with Reclock
was a success. Wow! What great sound quality!! So, I suspect Reclock does
beat the down sampling issue. But, I ask the wizards of this board, how do
you know for sure? Are there any analytical tests?

So, you are probably wondering why does Reclock work. First I think Reclock
was designed primarily to keep sound and video together (synchronized) when
playing any format video and audio. But the writers of this filter allow
audio input to pass thru its filter unaltered. So if you are going out of
your computer to SPDIF you sending exactly what comes in (no downsampling)
All works well as long as the amplifier/receiver you are connected to is
capable of decoding the frequencies and bits you are handing it via SPDIF
input.

My journey in surround is a fun one. I have learned a lot from this forum,
Shadson Shaplayer Group, and The KMplayer Group. Thanks to all of you!!!!!
KMplayer and Reclock are working so well that I want to use them as the
nucleous to build a Home Theater Personal Computer (HTPC) I am not a pioneer
in this. Google search for "HTPC and KMPlayer" and you will find a group in
England that is about 2 years ahead of me. There is even a tutorial on how
to integrate KMPlayer and Mediaportal (Free from the people who developed
Xbox Media Center). The people at KMplayer are also way ahead of me.
KMplayer supports Bluray. I am about a year away from purchasing my first
disk drive capable of reading and writing Bluray

I think Reclock is working with all formats including DVD-V (relates to one
of your early questions). Even though you are not interested in video, if it
is there, you will get it. But again anybody have any testing tools other
than our ears?

Last helpful pointer. Use the latest versions of Daemon tools, KMplayer,
AC3Filter, and Reclock. Surround files that would not play a year ago now
play flawlessly with less CPU utilization.

Hope this answers your questions.

RARBAR

-----Original Message-----
From: surrou...@googlegroups.com [mailto:surrou...@googlegroups.com]
On Behalf Of Tab Cursor
Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 11:37 PM
To: SurroundSound

Subject: [SurroundSound] Re: Play DVD-V in foobar?


RARBAR,

Are you using the MLP/TrueHD Decoder? Here:

http://www.winamp.com/plugins/details/221516

And I think I found a site explaining how to use Winamp plugins in
KMplayer. Here:

http://www.kmplayer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4513

But can you open files from the AUDIO_TS folder? Or are you converting
to MLP files first?

Thanks...

On Sep 28, 9:17 pm, Tab Cursor <tabcur...@gmail.com> wrote:
> RARBAR,
>
> Could you please explain where you found the Winamp DVD-A plugin?
> Also, how did you set up KMplayer to use it?
>
> Thanks...
>
> On Sep 28, 8:09 pm, "Robert Russell" <rar...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>
>
>

[Marcelo]

Guys,

Thank you all for the great contributions and passion to the issue. I
can't wait to get to the weekend and have some time where to try all
this suggestions.

One note though I forgot to mention: my setting is strictly stereo.
Right now with foobar I can play mostly anything (DTS, FLAC, FLAC+DTS,
DTS in WAV, DVD-A, etc) and I will downmix it to stereo, but will play
at full 96/24, even 192/24. The only thing I can't do is to take some
of the DVD-Video I have (like most of Genesis) that have 96/24 DTS
tracks on them and get to hear them at 96/24 instead of downsampled to
16/44.1

That is my main goal now. I do have a 5.1 setting on another part of
the house. I'd like to be able to do the same (play at 96/24) on that
system, but obviously not downsampled to stereo. Today I have a MAC
mini attached to that receiver, but I'm not getting 96/24 out of it.
Anyway, I will cross that bridge later. Now, I just want to get the
96/24 out of my DVD-V on my PC attached to my stereo system.

I want to thank all for your insights. This forum has been an
invaluable tool for me to learn, since I'm relatively new at high
resolution audio issues.

Regards...

[Marcelo]

Guys,

Now I recall last time I tried to make reclock work I found it
supported WASAPI and some time of Kernel Direct mode, but NOT asio. I
run Vista, so the kernel mode only works in XP and the digital audio
card I have does not support WASAPI, only ASIO. So basically I could
not make Reclock output at 96/24, then is what I decided to move to
foobar.

Do you guys know of Reclock does ASIO now, or if there is a "bridge"
between WASAPI and ASIO or Kernel Direct and ASIO that would solve
this issue?

Regards...

[Lokkerman]

On all the audio blogs WASAPI is not supposed to work very well and for the matter getting ASIO to work is a dog too, although not tried it on Reclock but guess normality does apply
We could actually do with a serious piece of work that makes all multi-media apps work directly to the DACs and not through lots of extraneous is it working/not working, plug-ins and patches and host OS, even though most people who have written them, had could clear, well thinking objectives in mind.
Anyone write software out there??
Cheers

[polmuaddib]

I tried setting up KMplayer, and it shows a lot of promise. It works
fine with Reclock, but it puts it on the end of the line. It's just as
I thought. In the end you can set it up easily to output 24/96 DTS,
but it is not real. It only upsamples the downsampled. It goes,
something like this: The player decodes the input with some filter. In
this case 24/96 DTS is decoded with AC3 Filter, but it decodes it only
16/48. I managed to swap it with ffdshow audio decoder, which uses
libdts or libavcodec or something, but the result of decoding is the
same 16/48. Then it goes to player's output which is 16/48, and then
Reclock upsamples it to whatever you want. So, you need to make sure
that the signal goes through every step unchanged and decoded
properly, but it is easier said...
On the other hand, I don't think that any of DTS filters doesn't
decode 24/96 DTS properly. Except PDVD9's which states that it
recognises it as 24/96 DTS. Of course, player's output downsamples it.
So, that got me thinking to use Cyberlink's filter to decode 24/96 DTS
properly in KMplayer and hopefully get it to go through unchanged.
Unfortunatly, I can't get it to work. I put in all settings that I
could find in KMplayer to use Cyberlink's filter, gave it merits, and
nothing.
And the last obstacle is, of course KMplayer's output. I know there is
a setting to use Reclock as an output renderer, but it always goes
last.
I am sorry if I didn't explain everything that I wanted perfectly, but
I hope you'll get it and help me figure this out.
Thank you all...

[Robert Russell]

One further thought - check the specs of the DAC on your stereo system. It
may be the culprit. It may not be capable of 96/24 and be doing the down
conversion.

Rarbar

[Robert Russell]

Beats me! I am running XP and had absolutely no problems. Check out the
latest version of reclock and let google translate some of the reclock posts
in French. Might give give you a clue

[Robert Russell]

Great Idea !  Also maybe someone could write a PC test app that we could route SPDIF output from anything (including a PC) and into a PC to  measure frequency and number of bits.  So we could confirm some of what we think is happening.  But perhaps someone has already done that.

 

RARBAR

---

[Robert Russell]

Thanks for giving me lots of new ideas to try. Also, how do you determine
(measure) where downsampling and upsampling occur? Is there some type of
software you use? Also I read a rumour that the original author, "Z" is
writing a new player (Google POTplayer). Perhaps he is modernizing it to do
what we all want in a HTPC. Wish we could find a way to feed him ideas or
contribute to some type of product specification.

[robert chewter]

i tried out the MLP plugin on winamp...plys ok..er in stereo..still havent got 5.1 output.

[Lokkerman]

got to be a setup problem as i use it all the time and have done for a year  or`so

sometimes audio card output drivers to have an affect, so check them too