Floating flare
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MacQuigg
Jul 18, 2010, 8:58:32 PM7/18/10
to blowout
I uploaded an initial sketch of Dr Ellen's idea for a floating flare.
Lot's of details need to be worked out. Suggestions are welcome.
I haven't thought about the underwater pipes and valves, but that
seems pretty straightforward.
Lot's of details need to be worked out. Suggestions are welcome.
I haven't thought about the underwater pipes and valves, but that
seems pretty straightforward.
docellen
Jul 19, 2010, 11:41:11 AM7/19/10
to blowout
Nice sketch, Dave. Now, how do we get BP to look at this?
How about we make a prototype, and light it about 3 miles offshore
near New Orleans. Don't tell anyone I suggested this. I don't want
BP sending their black helicopters. :>)
How about we make a prototype, and light it about 3 miles offshore
near New Orleans. Don't tell anyone I suggested this. I don't want
BP sending their black helicopters. :>)
MacQuigg
Jul 19, 2010, 12:04:32 PM7/19/10
to blowout
Maybe we can get Kevin Costner to help. :>)
docellen
Jul 19, 2010, 12:15:03 PM7/19/10
to blowout
Not a bad idea, actually. Put some tall floating booms around the
base of that flare, and run a pipe to a nearby ship.
This might work even better with the burning barge idea. Instead of
trying to burn everything, which might require many barges, use just
one. Burn off the gas, and let the oil fill the barge about one foot
deep. Then collect the oil at the end opposite where the oil is
flowing in. A long perforated pipe, about 3 inches off the deck,
should be able to collect the oil without gas or tar.
Can you make a sketch?
base of that flare, and run a pipe to a nearby ship.
This might work even better with the burning barge idea. Instead of
trying to burn everything, which might require many barges, use just
one. Burn off the gas, and let the oil fill the barge about one foot
deep. Then collect the oil at the end opposite where the oil is
flowing in. A long perforated pipe, about 3 inches off the deck,
should be able to collect the oil without gas or tar.
Can you make a sketch?
karish
Jul 20, 2010, 7:28:32 AM7/20/10
to blowout
If the oil were burned cleanly this flare would release
248,000,000 BTU per hour. The flare itself would get
pretty warm.
When I was little someone gave me an alcohol torch. It
had a closed brass chamber with a tube coming out the
top that bent 90 degrees and ended in a small orifice.
An external flame heated up the tube just behind the
orifice and boiled the alcohol in the tube, which caused
a jet of alcohol, liquid and vapor, to spray out of the orifice
where it made a nice hot jet of flame.
I think this flare would get hot enough to flash the oil in it
to vapor. It would be tough to keep the pressure down to
100 PSI. High-pressure jets of vaporized oil would be
good for efficient burning. This assumes that the pressure
involved could be managed.
MacQuigg
Jul 21, 2010, 2:14:45 PM7/21/10
to blowout
I don't like the burning barge idea. With not much more effort, we
could make it a closed tank, oil and gas in the bottom, gas out the
top, and pure oil out the middle (essentially a gas separator). Then
the oil would be easy to deliver to ships, with an underwater
manifold, like we were discussing with the string of flares. The gas
out the top could go to flares with open holes instead of nozzles.
Let's have some more discussion, then I'll make a sketch.
could make it a closed tank, oil and gas in the bottom, gas out the
top, and pure oil out the middle (essentially a gas separator). Then
the oil would be easy to deliver to ships, with an underwater
manifold, like we were discussing with the string of flares. The gas
out the top could go to flares with open holes instead of nozzles.
Let's have some more discussion, then I'll make a sketch.
MacQuigg
Jul 21, 2010, 2:24:33 PM7/21/10
to blowout
On Jul 20, 4:28 am, karish <chuck.kar...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I think this flare would get hot enough to flash the oil in it
> to vapor. It would be tough to keep the pressure down to
> 100 PSI. High-pressure jets of vaporized oil would be
> good for efficient burning. This assumes that the pressure
> involved could be managed.
Good point about the vapor pressure I've added a relief valve at the
> I think this flare would get hot enough to flash the oil in it
> to vapor. It would be tough to keep the pressure down to
> 100 PSI. High-pressure jets of vaporized oil would be
> good for efficient burning. This assumes that the pressure
> involved could be managed.
top of the flare, basically a disk on a spring.
MacQuigg
Jul 23, 2010, 2:40:32 PM7/23/10
to blowout
See the file oil_gas_separator.png for something that could be
assembled in a day from common parts. Suggestions are welcome.
assembled in a day from common parts. Suggestions are welcome.
docellen
Jul 23, 2010, 11:32:51 PM7/23/10
to blowout
You might want some flexible hoses instead of rigid pipes for the
inlet and oil outlets. That tank is going to be tossed around with
the waves. We'll still need the pipes to carry the oil a safe
distance away from the flare, where it can be loaded onto a ship. The
pipes should be suspended independent of the tank, maybe 50 feet down.
Some steel cables between the tank and the pipes would keep the hoses
from getting jerked.
A float valve inside the tank could keep the oil level constant.
Some weights on the bottom might keep the tank from tipping over when
there is no oil in it.
inlet and oil outlets. That tank is going to be tossed around with
the waves. We'll still need the pipes to carry the oil a safe
distance away from the flare, where it can be loaded onto a ship. The
pipes should be suspended independent of the tank, maybe 50 feet down.
Some steel cables between the tank and the pipes would keep the hoses
from getting jerked.
A float valve inside the tank could keep the oil level constant.
Some weights on the bottom might keep the tank from tipping over when
there is no oil in it.
MacQuigg
Jul 24, 2010, 10:50:20 AM7/24/10
to blowout
How about we put a steel frame around the whole thing, with weights at
the bottom about 50 feet down. That should keep the tank vertical,
and minimize motion from wind and waves. Also, the frame could extend
upwards, if we want to get that flare higher above the water.
We could put the connections at the bottom of the frame where there is
easy access for divers. Some kind of flex joint might be better than
a flexible hose. We don't want the hoses getting tangled as the pipes
drift around in random ocean currents.
The design is getting more complex, but I think we are still within
your requirement that it be build-able in a few days from standard
parts.
the bottom about 50 feet down. That should keep the tank vertical,
and minimize motion from wind and waves. Also, the frame could extend
upwards, if we want to get that flare higher above the water.
We could put the connections at the bottom of the frame where there is
easy access for divers. Some kind of flex joint might be better than
a flexible hose. We don't want the hoses getting tangled as the pipes
drift around in random ocean currents.
The design is getting more complex, but I think we are still within
your requirement that it be build-able in a few days from standard
parts.
MacQuigg
Jul 25, 2010, 9:09:31 PM7/25/10
to blowout
I've modified the design and uploaded a new file,
oil_gas_separator_detail.png. SketchUp is really cool. I just
discovered the "Xray" mode, where you can see inside the tank. Notice
the float valve at the top of the inlet pipe. I'm assuming such a
valve is readily available, but if not, we can make it quickly with
some nested pipe sections, like a slide trombone.
If anyone would like to work directly with SketchUp, I've uploaded two
of the data files (extension .skp). The png snapshots are done with a
screen shot of the SketchUp window.
Please welcome Jack Erhart to our group. Jack is an expert in
SketchUp, and he has agreed to help us out with these sketches. It
will be good to have an expert on the team, in case we get a call from
the Admiral, and he wants something ready to build ASAP. :>)
oil_gas_separator_detail.png. SketchUp is really cool. I just
discovered the "Xray" mode, where you can see inside the tank. Notice
the float valve at the top of the inlet pipe. I'm assuming such a
valve is readily available, but if not, we can make it quickly with
some nested pipe sections, like a slide trombone.
If anyone would like to work directly with SketchUp, I've uploaded two
of the data files (extension .skp). The png snapshots are done with a
screen shot of the SketchUp window.
Please welcome Jack Erhart to our group. Jack is an expert in
SketchUp, and he has agreed to help us out with these sketches. It
will be good to have an expert on the team, in case we get a call from
the Admiral, and he wants something ready to build ASAP. :>)
Jack B. Erhart
Jul 25, 2010, 10:18:43 PM7/25/10
to stop_b...@googlegroups.com
|
Expert? No! Willing to help? Yes! I have a client who's bed and breakfast I'm working on right now, so when I can swing some time this next week, I'll take a better look at all you have provided.
Thanks for the nice mention.
Jack B. Erhart
Phone: 805.244.Jaxx (5299)
Skype ID: jaxcoffee
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