[Next Project] The City of God by Augustine of Hippo (trans. Marcus Dods)

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Devin O'Bannon

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Oct 12, 2025, 3:02:25 PMOct 12
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Hello all,

For my next project, I feel like doing something longer, so I'd like to do The City of God by Augustine of Hippo. (Rather than "Augustine" or "St. Augustine," I'll go with what the placeholder already has.) Also, to make the references easier to understand, I'll be expanding the abbreviated references in the footnotes.



Thanks,

Devin

Kara Reddy

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Oct 12, 2025, 3:44:34 PMOct 12
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godspeed homie

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Alex Cabal

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Oct 12, 2025, 7:22:56 PMOct 12
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OK, But I don't think your scans of vol 2 match. They're published by
John Grant and have a different translator. Vol 1 is published by T & T
Clark and apparently has at least 3 translators.

If John Healy translated a different edition, we want to see which
translation is better. Are there any other translations?

There is typically some scholarly consensus on which translation is
better, or at least which ones are bad, for works this old.


On 10/12/25 2:02 PM, Devin O'Bannon wrote:
> Hello all,
>
> For my next project, I feel like doing something longer, so I'd like to
> do /The City of God /by Augustine of Hippo. (Rather than "Augustine" or
> "St. Augustine," I'll go with what the placeholder <https://
> standardebooks.org/ebooks/augustine-of-hippo/the-city-of-god> already
> has.) Also, to make the references easier to understand, I'll be
> expanding the abbreviated references in the footnotes.
>
> Transcription (vol. 1): https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/45304 <https://
> www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/45304>
> Transcription (vol. 2): https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/45305 <https://
> www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/45305>
>
> Page scans (vol. 1): https://archive.org/details/
> cityofgodtransla01auguuoft/page/n3/mode/2up <https://archive.org/
> details/cityofgodtransla01auguuoft/page/n3/mode/2up>
> Page scans (vol. 2): https://archive.org/details/
> cityofgodtransla02auguuoft/page/n5/mode/2up <https://archive.org/
> details/cityofgodtransla02auguuoft/page/n5/mode/2up>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Devin
>
> --
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Devin O'Bannon

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Oct 12, 2025, 10:28:46 PMOct 12
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Yikes, I pasted the wrong link! (I had to switch from one scan to another for volume 2 and accidentally clicked the wrong link.) The correct scans for volume two are in the link below.

And yes, you're correct, I misspoke. Marcus Dods was the principal translator, but not the only one. 

As far as translations go, there's only two in English that are in the public domain: John Healey (which was done in the 1600s) and the Marcus Dods et al. translation (done in the 1800s). As far as reviews of those translations, I've found this one, which says that he thought Healey's was more accurate on the whole, but that Dods was satisfactory and much easier to read for modern-day readers than Healey's. However, Marcus Dods, in the first volume of the translation I've linked to above, called John Healey's "unaccountably bad." I haven't been able to find any other reviews to "break the tie," as it were. But it seems that the Marcus Dods et al one is fine.

The best translations into English are currently not in the public domain (and were published in the 1970s and later). All the other translation reviews I've been able to find were for non-PD ones.

So if you're okay with this, then I'll move forward.

Alex Cabal

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Oct 12, 2025, 10:33:27 PMOct 12
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OK, that sounds fine. Looks like this will be a top tier difficulty book
with almost 1000 print pages and 1400 endnotes. Send a repo link once
you start. Good luck!

On 10/12/25 9:28 PM, Devin O'Bannon wrote:
> Yikes, I pasted the wrong link! (I had to switch from one scan to
> another for volume 2 and accidentally clicked the wrong link.) The
> correct scans for volume two are in the link below.
>
> And yes, you're correct, I misspoke. Marcus Dods was the principal
> translator, but not the only one.
>
> As far as translations go, there's only two in English that are in the
> public domain: John Healey (which was done in the 1600s) and the Marcus
> Dods et al. translation (done in the 1800s). As far as reviews of those
> translations, I've found this one <https://www.jstor.org/
> stable/2854495>, which says that he thought Healey's was more accurate
> on the whole, but that Dods was satisfactory and much easier to read for
> modern-day readers than Healey's. However, Marcus Dods, in the first
> volume of the translation I've linked to above, called John Healey's
> "unaccountably bad." I haven't been able to find any other reviews to
> "break the tie," as it were. But it seems that the Marcus Dods et al one
> is fine.
>
> The best translations into English are currently not in the public
> domain (and were published in the 1970s and later). All the other
> translation reviews I've been able to find were for non-PD ones.
>
> So if you're okay with this, then I'll move forward.
>
> Transcription (vol. 1): https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/45304 <https://
> www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/45304>
> Transcription (vol. 2): https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/45305 <https://
> www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/45305>
>
> Page scans (vol. 1): https://archive.org/details/
> cityofgodtransla01auguuoft/page/n3/mode/2up <https://archive.org/
> details/cityofgodtransla01auguuoft/page/n3/mode/2up>
> Page scans (vol. 2): https://archive.org/details/TheCityOfGodV2/page/n5/
> mode/2up <https://archive.org/details/TheCityOfGodV2/page/n5/mode/2up>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Devin
>
> On Sunday, October 12, 2025 at 6:22:56 PM UTC-5 Alex Cabal wrote:
>
> OK, But I don't think your scans of vol 2 match. They're published by
> John Grant and have a different translator. Vol 1 is published by T & T
> Clark and apparently has at least 3 translators.
>
> If John Healy translated a different edition, we want to see which
> translation is better. Are there any other translations?
>
> There is typically some scholarly consensus on which translation is
> better, or at least which ones are bad, for works this old.
>
>
> On 10/12/25 2:02 PM, Devin O'Bannon wrote:
> > Hello all,
> >
> > For my next project, I feel like doing something longer, so I'd
> like to
> > do /The City of God /by Augustine of Hippo. (Rather than
> "Augustine" or
> > "St. Augustine," I'll go with what the placeholder <https://
> > standardebooks.org/ebooks/augustine-of-hippo/the-city-of-god
> <http://standardebooks.org/ebooks/augustine-of-hippo/the-city-of-
> god>> already
> > has.) Also, to make the references easier to understand, I'll be
> > expanding the abbreviated references in the footnotes.
> >
> > Transcription (vol. 1): https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/45304
> <https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/45304> <https://
> > www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/45304 <http://www.gutenberg.org/
> ebooks/45304>>
> > Transcription (vol. 2): https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/45305
> <https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/45305> <https://
> > www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/45305 <http://www.gutenberg.org/
> ebooks/45305>>
> >
> > Page scans (vol. 1): https://archive.org/details/ <https://
> archive.org/details/>
> > cityofgodtransla01auguuoft/page/n3/mode/2up <https://archive.org/
> <https://archive.org/>
> > details/cityofgodtransla01auguuoft/page/n3/mode/2up>
> > Page scans (vol. 2): https://archive.org/details/ <https://
> archive.org/details/>
> > cityofgodtransla02auguuoft/page/n5/mode/2up <https://archive.org/
> <https://archive.org/>
> > details/cityofgodtransla02auguuoft/page/n5/mode/2up>
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Devin
> >
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> > Groups "Standard Ebooks" group.
> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,
> send
> > an email to standardebook...@googlegroups.com
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> > To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/
> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/>
> > standardebooks/
> d22ee285-4c9b-42fe-9c33-87d5dbf60f45n%40googlegroups.com
> <http://40googlegroups.com>
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> <http://40googlegroups.com>?
> > utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>.
>
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Devin O'Bannon

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Oct 13, 2025, 9:53:27 AMOct 13
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That's why it sounded like fun!


Since there were only 3 translators, I put all three names in the filename, but if I should replace it with "various translators," let me know.

Thanks,

Devin

Alex Cabal

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Oct 13, 2025, 12:34:14 PMOct 13
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OK, Emma will manage this with Lukas reviewing.

On 10/13/25 8:53 AM, Devin O'Bannon wrote:
> That's why it sounded like fun!
>
> Repo: https://github.com/Survey0r/augustine-of-hippo_the-city-of-
> god_marcus-dods_george-wilson_j-j-smith <https://github.com/Survey0r/
> augustine-of-hippo_the-city-of-god_marcus-dods_george-wilson_j-j-smith>
> <https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/45304> <https://
> > www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/45304 <http://www.gutenberg.org/
> ebooks/45304>>
> > Transcription (vol. 2): https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/45305
> <https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/45305> <https://
> > www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/45305 <http://www.gutenberg.org/
> ebooks/45305>>
> >
> > Page scans (vol. 1): https://archive.org/details/ <https://
> archive.org/details/>
> > cityofgodtransla01auguuoft/page/n3/mode/2up <https://archive.org/
> <https://archive.org/>
> > details/cityofgodtransla01auguuoft/page/n3/mode/2up>
> > Page scans (vol. 2): https://archive.org/details/TheCityOfGodV2/
> page/n5/ <https://archive.org/details/TheCityOfGodV2/page/n5/>
> > mode/2up <https://archive.org/details/TheCityOfGodV2/page/n5/
> mode/2up <https://archive.org/details/TheCityOfGodV2/page/n5/mode/2up>>
> >
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Devin
> >
> > On Sunday, October 12, 2025 at 6:22:56 PM UTC-5 Alex Cabal wrote:
> >
> > OK, But I don't think your scans of vol 2 match. They're
> published by
> > John Grant and have a different translator. Vol 1 is published by
> T & T
> > Clark and apparently has at least 3 translators.
> >
> > If John Healy translated a different edition, we want to see which
> > translation is better. Are there any other translations?
> >
> > There is typically some scholarly consensus on which translation is
> > better, or at least which ones are bad, for works this old.
> >
> >
> > On 10/12/25 2:02 PM, Devin O'Bannon wrote:
> > > Hello all,
> > >
> > > For my next project, I feel like doing something longer, so I'd
> > like to
> > > do /The City of God /by Augustine of Hippo. (Rather than
> > "Augustine" or
> > > "St. Augustine," I'll go with what the placeholder <https://
> > > standardebooks.org/ebooks/augustine-of-hippo/the-city-of-god
> <http://standardebooks.org/ebooks/augustine-of-hippo/the-city-of-god>
> > <http://standardebooks.org/ebooks/augustine-of-hippo/the-city-of-
> <http://standardebooks.org/ebooks/augustine-of-hippo/the-city-of->
> > god>> already
> > > has.) Also, to make the references easier to understand, I'll be
> > > expanding the abbreviated references in the footnotes.
> > >
> > > Transcription (vol. 1): https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/45304
> <https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/45304>
> > <https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/45304 <https://
> ebooks/45304> <http://www.gutenberg.org/ <http://www.gutenberg.org/>
> > ebooks/45304>>
> > > Transcription (vol. 2): https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/45305
> <https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/45305>
> > <https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/45305 <https://
> ebooks/45305> <http://www.gutenberg.org/ <http://www.gutenberg.org/>
> > ebooks/45305>>
> > >
> > > Page scans (vol. 1): https://archive.org/details/ <https://
> archive.org/details/> <https://
> > archive.org/details/ <http://archive.org/details/>>
> > > cityofgodtransla01auguuoft/page/n3/mode/2up <https://
> archive.org/ <https://archive.org/>
> > <https://archive.org/ <https://archive.org/>>
> > > details/cityofgodtransla01auguuoft/page/n3/mode/2up>
> > > Page scans (vol. 2): https://archive.org/details/ <https://
> archive.org/details/> <https://
> > archive.org/details/ <http://archive.org/details/>>
> > > cityofgodtransla02auguuoft/page/n5/mode/2up <https://
> archive.org/ <https://archive.org/>
> > <https://archive.org/ <https://archive.org/>>
> > > details/cityofgodtransla02auguuoft/page/n5/mode/2up>
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > >
> > > Devin
> > >
> > > --
> > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> > > Groups "Standard Ebooks" group.
> > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,
> > send
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Devin O'Bannon

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Oct 14, 2025, 1:54:57 PMOct 14
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Hello Emma,

While I'm working on moving the 20 gajillion footnotes to endnotes, here is my cover proposal, from The Met: https://www.metmuseum.org/art/collection/search/436282

coverexample.jpg

Thanks,

Devin

Devin O'Bannon

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Oct 14, 2025, 8:30:21 PMOct 14
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Hello Emma,

One issue I'm running into is bridgehead titles. There are a lot of bridgeheads in this book, but they're generally quite straightforward to code. However, I'm unsure how to program the bridgeheads for the books, since they are titled with "Argument," as seen below. My preference is to do an editorial commit and just delete the word "Argument" from each book's bridgehead, as the text below them clearly indicate that they are bridgeheads for the book. (Which would also make it easier to program.) However, if I should keep in the word "Argument," I'm unsure how to program the book heading with its bridgehead, in that case.

Screenshot 2025-10-14 at 7.15.13 PM.png

Thanks,

Devin

Emma Sweeney

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Oct 14, 2025, 9:37:20 PMOct 14
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1. The cover looks good! I've added it to the art db.

2. Delete the "Argument" titles and use bridgehead formatting.


Emma
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