RS485 hardware communication

[zdenek...@pells.cz]

Is supported RS485 two wire communication (only RX/TX) , without third control PIN in SOULISS framework? I need one more free pin on arduino.

see attached pict.

Zdenek

[Di Maio, Dario]

Is supposed to work, in the usart drivers of vNet (located in conf/usart) you can disable the TxENABLE.

Dario.

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[Juan Pinto]

If you test share your results! It's interesting. As Dario say this must work.

 

Regards.

[Fulvio Spelta]

I'm using 2 pin communication on ProDINO2 without problems

[zdenek...@pells.cz]

what is your harware schema?

Zdenek

Dne sobota 14. února 2015 8:40:00 UTC+1 Fulvio Spelta napsal(a):

[Fulvio Spelta]

Sorry I missed your post. The schema is simple. I'm using "row" of 4 ProDINO connected using the RS485 pins that are already available onboard.

Connect all "A" together and all "B" together. If the boards have different power supply connect togher also the GND (in my case isn't needed because the boards are powered from the same power supply)

[zdenek...@pells.cz]

Here is misunderstanding , ProDino have harware chip on board RS485 is two wire (A,B) but from CPU are three pins  RX / TX / TXENpin - and I would like to save TXENpin for other purpose -  I do not have hardware chip on board - see my schematics

Dne čtvrtek 19. února 2015 9:17:46 UTC+1 Fulvio Spelta napsal(a):

[Fulvio Spelta]

Dario sent the hint:

Is supposed to work, in the usart drivers of vNet (located in conf/usart) you can disable the TxENABLE.

Have you a try ?

[zdenek...@pells.cz]

I will test it  on sunday

Dne čtvrtek 19. února 2015 9:45:43 UTC+1 Fulvio Spelta napsal(a):

[starfsh133]

Hello Zdenek,

Did u test the communications with this circuit?? and did it work?

I wan to use usart communications on RS485 with an Arduino Mega and a couple Pro mini clones.... Any one know how to change serial port on the Mega with friariello??

Best Regards,

Jan

Op donderdag 12 februari 2015 23:13:40 UTC+1 schreef zdenek...@pells.cz:

[Di Maio, Dario]

Here the answer
https://github.com/souliss/souliss/wiki/Transceiver%20Connection

Dario.

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[guyc]

I was testing the communication between 2 nodes over RS485. I also will not use the TXENABLE pin.

I usartUsrCfg.h I found that the TXENABLE is by default desabled (#define TXENABLE 0)

I also put in my code :
#define USARTDRIVER_INSKETCH
#define USART_TXENABLE     0
#define USARTDRIVER Serial1

but there is no communication

When I connect the TX-pin from one node to the RX from the other and vise versa, the communication is ok

[Di Maio, Dario]

If you are using rs485 txenable must be at 1 and you should wire that pin.

Dario.

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[guyc]

Dario,

When I read your answer of Febr. 12th on the question of Zdenek, it can work without the third pin for TXENABLE .

"Is supposed to work, in the usart drivers of vNet (located in conf/usart) you can disable the TxENABLE."

Was this answer wrong or is something changed meanwhile ?

guy

Op zaterdag 20 juni 2015 02:04:37 UTC+2 schreef Dario Di Maio:

[Di Maio, Dario]

Generally, if you have an rs485 drive with txenable, you must use it.

If you cross connect two usart directly, you don't need it.

Dario.

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[Fulvio Spelta]

I'm using RS485 on proDINo 2 without TXENABLE and A-A, B-B straight connection.

Check the communication over RS485 using a RS485-USB transceiver and e terminal emulator program on a pc that will capture all the traffic over the RS485 line.

[Di Maio, Dario]

On DINo TXENABLE is set by default once selected the configuration file for that board.

With rs485 the use of the TXEN is a must.

Dario.

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On 24 Jun 2015 09:29, "Fulvio Spelta" <fulvio...@gmail.com> wrote:

I'm using RS485 on proDINo 2 without TXENABLE and A-A, B-B straight connection.

Check the communication over RS485 using a RS485-USB transceiver and e terminal emulator program on a pc that will capture all the traffic over the RS485 line.

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[zdenek...@pells.cz]

Hi 

I am back, I have tested this communication wihout TxEnable and my advice is  - the best way is - use this pin ! 

because this hardware proper function depend on transfer speed  - in some case I must add capacitor to gate Q1 for proper function

and for high speed I must change Q1 with lower gate capacity.

Dne středa 24. června 2015 9:29:00 UTC+2 Fulvio Spelta napsal(a):

[Di Maio, Dario]

Goot tip. Q1 which pin is in your schematic?

Dario.

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[zdenek...@pells.cz]

The capacity depends on R4 and parasitic capacitance Q1 gate  - thats mean you must experiment on each circuit for each serial speed

this is cause for using TxEnable pin 

Zdenek

Dne středa 24. června 2015 10:35:21 UTC+2 Dario Di Maio napsal(a):

[guyc]

I was testing my communication with the souliss app.

1.  When I loaded the the database, the saw the 5 nodes, but no typicals. After pushing 'rebuild' it was OK;

2. node1 has 33 slots, but I can see only 21  slots ( 11 devices) in the app.
  I increased the payload to 66, but nu result.
 In the github  I found that max 25 slots  can be transferred. Is it possible to increase this to a higher value ?

3. The health of Node0 (gateway, is very good, but the health of the other nodes is very poor.

[Di Maio, Dario]

How many nodes have you on the rs485 bus? How long is it?

Keep those limits as are unless you have few nodes over a short line.

Dario.

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[guy caluwaerts]

I have 5 nodes. The distance between the nodes is very short. 3 nodes are in one cabinet and the others are also together in a cabinet 3 meter from the first

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Op za, jan. 30, 2016 om 8:26 schreef Di Maio, Dario

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[Di Maio, Dario]

How your healthy values are after at least 1h from a reset of all nodes?

Does your network behave properly?

Dario.

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[zdenek...@pells.cz]

Ho many Rz you have installed? There must be only two on the bus active.

Zdenek

On Saturday, January 30, 2016 at 9:40:04 AM UTC+1, guyc wrote:

I have 5 nodes. The distance between the nodes is very short. 3 nodes are in one cabinet and the others are also together in a cabinet 3 meter from the first

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Op za, jan. 30, 2016 om 8:26 schreef Di Maio, Dario

<dario....@souliss.net>:

How many nodes have you on the rs485 bus? How long is it?

Keep those limits as are unless you have few nodes over a short line.

Dario.

From Mobile.

On 30 Jan 2016 00:08, "'guyc' via souliss" <sou...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

I was testing my communication with the souliss app.

1.  When I loaded the the database, the saw the 5 nodes, but no typicals. After pushing 'rebuild' it was OK;

2. node1 has 33 slots, but I can see only 21  slots ( 11 devices) in the app.
  I increased the payload to 66, but nu result.
 In the github  I found that max 25 slots  can be transferred. Is it possible to increase this to a higher value ?

3. The health of Node0 (gateway, is very good, but the health of the other nodes is very poor.

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[guy caluwaerts]

Dario,

Gone do the test again today and wait for minimum one houre to see the result

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Op za, jan. 30, 2016 om 10:46 schreef Di Maio, Dario

<dario....@souliss.net>:

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[guy caluwaerts]

I did test without resistors and with the resistors. Result is the same. Rs485 is only 20 cm between the 2 nodes I' m testing with

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Op za, jan. 30, 2016 om 10:59 schreef zdenek...@pells.cz

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[zdenek...@pells.cz]

The 20cm is too short, could you test longer wire 5m or more (UTP cable for LAN network)  - test two nodes with Rz=120ohm 

Zdenek

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[Di Maio, Dario]

Zedneck are you using rs485 with Souliss?

Dario.

From Mobile.

[zdenek...@pells.cz]

I am in testing phase with my own design of hardware based on arduino micro (8 wall switch input and 8 relay output). 

Now testing gateway 2560 and two nodes and I have plan to run 6 nodes together

It take long time because I must finish my new house first.

[guyc]

Dario,  indeed after an longer period the health became green.

After I removed the node with the 33 slots, the system was working.

Back to my second question of Jan 30th :

In the github I found that only 25 slots can be transmit via RS485.
Is there a possibility to increase this to more slots ?

 guy

[Andreas Karl]

guyc which board are you using for your setup? I made a prototype which consists a Pro mini, onboard mini buck converter, 2 RJ45 jacks and a MAX485. So 2 wires of the RJ45 cable are 24V/ground and another 2 are RX/TX that's it.

[Di Maio, Dario]

Technically you can, but I suggest you to don't.

Dario.

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[guy caluwaerts]

Andreas,

I'm using 5 arduino Mega boards,

one ethernet board ENC28j60, but I gone replace that by a W5100 board, because sometimes I'm loosing communication specially whit scenes. The only possibility at that moment is to reset the gateway node.

guy

---

From: Andreas Karl <andreas...@gmail.com>
To: souliss <sou...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Monday, February 1, 2016 11:59 AM
Subject: Re: [souliss] Re: RS485 hardware communication

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[guy caluwaerts]

Don't think so. When I connect the node with the 33 nodes ( and sometimes I have communication with that node), the app shows only 21 nodes.

guy

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From: "Di Maio, Dario" <dario....@souliss.net>
To: sou...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Monday, February 1, 2016 12:24 PM

Subject: Re: [souliss] Re: RS485 hardware communication

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[Di Maio, Dario]

To get it, you need to change several parameters. Having longer frame will increase the chance that the collision avoidance will delay too much the transmission, that's why I say that's better if you don't.

Dario.

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[Andreas Karl]

Has anybody considered powering nodes by CAT5 cable and also handle RS485 TX/RX communication over the same cable?

[Electroguard]

It should work, it does for CCTV, where you can 'inject' power and RS485 PTZ control down the same Cat5 cable.

Two problems to watch out for are voltage drop on longer runs and possible crosstalk, so perhaps use bigger reservoir caps and slower baud rate.

You will also need to connect your RS485 grounds via the Cat5 cable, because you won't be able to 'cheat' as is often done by referencing each RS485 to ground via their psu's rather than running a ground wire between them (RS485 is supposed to have a ground wire between nodes).

[guyc]

I will give it a try to get all my slots visible on the app. I did the test now with a W5100 ethernet shield, but the result is the same as with the ENC28j60 shield. The app shows only 12 of 16 typicals in node 1. (27 slots)

my parameters :
      max payload : 66
      max number of nodes  : 10
      max number of slots 41

Which parameters do I have to change so that the node will transfer all the slots ?

[Di Maio, Dario]

You have to increase the vNet and MaCaco payloads of the same quantity and check that the same increase applies also for the USART max payload.

Dario.

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[Di Maio, Dario]

Yes, there were some design by Marco Signorini based on this assumption. Many anti-theft system use a single cable for both power and signal.

More than a CAT5 that has tiny wires, there are cables for anti-theft with bigger wires for power.

Dario.

[Andreas Karl]

I read the topics regarding the RS485 board by Marco Signorini but I didn't find anything about a cable. Can you give me some details?

[Di Maio, Dario]

Is generally like this

http://m.ebay.it/itm/CAVO-PER-ALLARMI-ALLARME-ANTIFURTO-6-FILI-TERRA-4x0-22-2x0-50-T-25-METRI-/301043896550?nav=SEARCH

Dario.
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[guy caluwaerts]

Dario,

I modified in

vNetCfg.h max payload to 66

vNetDriver_usart.h : max payload to 46

Everythings runs fine now. Can see all the slots in the app.

many thanks

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From: "Di Maio, Dario" <dario....@souliss.net>

To: "sou...@googlegroups.com" <sou...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, February 2, 2016 9:49 PM

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