The facts on the "Clinton body count"
Gila Jones
. Widen your viewing window quite a bit to get the proper formatting.
I suggest that those interested in this subject read the entire web
page, which contains sources and quite a lot of text not included
here.
1. Mary Mohane - former White House intern gunned down in a
coffee shop.
Nothing was taken. It was suspected that she was about to
testify about sexual
harassment at the White House.
Former White House intern Mary Mahoney, manager of a Georgetown
Starbucks,
was killed along with two co-workers on 6 July 1997 during what
police believe was
a robbery of the shop. Their killers have yet to be found. No
evidence has surfaced
that Mahoney had anything to say about sexual harrassment in the
White House,
let alone was on the verge of coming forward. Mahoney and her
co-workers were
murdered. Why and by whom is anyone's guess.
2. Vincent Foster - former White House Counsel, found dead
of a gunshot wound
to the head and ruled a suicide. He had significant
knowledge of the Clintons'
financial affairs and was a business partner with Hillary.
If the Clintons are guilty of
the crimes they are accused of by Larry, Vincent Foster
would have detailed
knowledge of those crimes.
This laundry list of deaths always refers to someone taking his
life as "ruled a
suicide," thus implying another conclusion of equal likelihood
was capriciously
dismissed by someone who had the power to do so. From here on,
read "ruled a
suicide" as "an investigation was carried out, arriving at this
as the only reasonable
conclusion."
Vince Foster committed suicide on the night of 20 July 1993 by
shooting himself
once in the head. A note in the form of a draft resignation
letter was found in the
bottom of his briefcase a week after his death. Foster cited
negative Wall Street
Journal editorials about him. He was also upset about the
much-criticized role of
the counsel's office in the controversial firing of seven White
House travel office
workers.
Two separate investigations were held into his death. Both
concluded Foster died
by his own hand.
3. C. Victor Raiser, II - former National Finance
Co-Chairman of Clinton for
President, and Montgomery Raiser, his son. Both died in a
suspicious private
plane crash in Alaska. No cause determined. Raiser was
considered to be a major
player on the Clinton team.
By definition, all plane crashes are suspicious. Airplanes are
supposed to stay in
the air, and when they don't it's because something went terribly
wrong. Pilot error
and mechanical failure are by far the most common causes
underlying any crash.
The National Transportation Safety Board investigates every
downed plane in the
U.S. Though they might not always pin down the exact cause of a
crash, they're
generally pretty good about ruling out the use of explosives or
of something
mechanical being tampered with. Putting it more clearly, if they
don't find evidence
of tampering or explosives, that's not what downed the plane.
We're then back to
our old friends pilot error and mechanical failure.
Raiser, his son, and three others died in a plane crash in Alaska
on 30 July 1992
during a fishing trip. The pilot and another passenger survived
and were
hospitalized with severe burns. As for no cause for the crash
being determined, a
small plane was flying in bad weather. It's awfully easy for
something to go wrong
in those conditions.
4. Paul Tully - DNC Political Director, was found dead in a
Little Rock hotel room.
No cause was ever determined and no autopsy was allowed.
Tully was a key
member of the damage control squad and came up with some of
the Clinton
strategies.
Paul Tully died on 24 September 1992. Contrary to the claim that
an autopsy
wasn't allowed, one was performed and Tully's cause of death
determined (massive
heart attack). According to news reports at the time, "An autopsy
by the Arkansas
medical examiner's office discovered advanced coronary artery
disease," said Steve
Nawojczyk, the Pulaski County coroner. He added that
investigators found no
evidence of external trauma to the body. At the time of his
death, Tully was
massively overweight and a heavy drinker and smoker.
5. Ed Willey - Clinton fund raiser. Found in the woods in
Virginia with a gunshot
wound to the head. Ruled a suicide.
Ed Willey had stolen $275,000 of a client's money and was about
half a million
dollars in debt to the IRS. He was a desperate, unstable man. He
took his own life
on 29 November 1993. A note found by his wife said, "Saying I'm
sorry doesn't
begin to explain. I hope one day you will forgive me." Murder
victims don't leave
suicide notes.
Interestingly enough, at the same time as Willey was killing
himself, his wife was
being groped by Clinton. She'd gone to the Chief Executive
looking for a job to help
her family out of its financial crisis and found herself fending
off Clinton's
advances. Clinton admits to the meeting but denies her version of
what went on
during it. Kathleen Willey testified in Paula Jones' harrassment
suit against
Clinton.
6. Hershell Friday - Clinton fund-raiser. His plane
exploded.
Herschel Friday died on 1 March 1993. His plane did not explode,
it crashed during
an attempted landing on his private airfield. The 73-year-old
Friday was its pilot.
No one else was aboard. It was a dusk landing in drizzle with an
elderly man at the
controls.
7. Jerry Parks - former security team member for Governor
Clinton. Prior to his
death he had compiled an extensive file on Clinton's
activities. His family had
reported being followed and his home broken into just before
being gunned down
at a deserted intersection.
On 26 September 1993, Jerry Parks was hit with ten bullets as he
left a Mexican
restaurant in Little Rock. His murderer has yet to be found.
Parks' security company guarded Clinton's campaign headquarters
in 1992. His
son, Gary, asserts in both Circle of Power and The Clinton
Chronicles (both videos are
products of Linda Thompson's American Justice Federation) that
his father
collected a secret file of the president's alleged indiscretions.
The younger Parks' allegations aside, a suspect in the killings
is Jerry Parks'
former partner.
8. John Wilson - former Washington D.C. council member. Had
ties to Whitewater.
Died of a very suspicious hanging suicide.
There was nothing suspicious about this suicide. John Wilson had
tried to kill
himself on four previous occasions. On 19 May 1993 he finally
succeeded. Police
said he did not leave a note and there were no signs of foul
play.
9. Kathy Ferguson - former wife of Arkansas State Trooper
Danny Ferguson, the
co-defendant with Bill Clinton in the Paula Jones lawsuit.
Found dead in her living
room of a gunshot wound to the head. Ruled a suicide.
Interestingly, her packed
suitcases seemed to indicate she was about to go somewhere.
Kathy Ferguson killed herself in the manner described on 11 May
1993. A suicide
note was found beside her body but I can find no record of packed
bags by the
door. The relationship between Ferguson and her live-in
boyfriend, Bill Shelton,
had fallen on hard times. Her daughter told police Ferguson had
been upset over a
note from Shelton. Now which is more likely: a live-in
relationship gone bad
prompting a suicide, or an ex-husband passing sensitive
information to the woman
he's no longer married to?
10. Bill Shelton - Arkansas state trooper and fiance of
Kathy Ferguson. Allegedly
committed suicide by shooting himself at her grave.
Shelton killed himself over Ferguson's grave on 12 June 1993. A
suicide note was
found beside his body. There's nothing mysterious about his death
or his reasons
for taking his life.
11. Gandy Baugh - attorney for Dan Lasater in a financial
misconduct case.
Supposedly jumped out the window of a tall building to
commit suicide.
I can find no record of anyone with that name. No obituary
notice, no news story
on the death, nothing. Even searches for lawyers committing
suicide by jumping
out of a window don't turn up anyone with a similar name or
associated with
Lasater.
12. Dr. Donald Rogers - dentist. Killed in a suspicious
plane crash on his way to an
interview with reporter Ambrose Evans-Pritchard to reveal
information about
Clinton.
On 3 March 1993 the Cessna carrying a pilot, Donald Rogers and
two other
passengers crashed. The pilot had earlier radioed in that he was
experiencing
electrical trouble. The plane went down far off its planned route
and judging from
the map and magnifying glass found in the front of the plane, the
pilot was good
and lost when they went down.
13. Stanley Huggins - lawyer investigating Madison Guaranty.
Suicide. His
extensive report has never been released.
How anyone can confuse dying of pneumonia with suicide is beyond
me. Huggins
died on 23 June 1994. According Dr. Richard Callery, Delaware's
top medical
examiner, viral myocarditis and bronchial pneumonia killed
Huggins. Lt. Joel Ivory
of the University of Delaware police said his "exhaustive"
investigation of Huggins's
death turned up "no sign at all of foul play."
14. Florence Martin - Accountant for the CIA and had
information on the Barry Seal
case. Three gunshot wounds to the head.
Try as I might, I can't find any record of this person. No
obituary, no news stories
about the shooting, nothing.
15. Suzane Coleman - reportedly had an affair with Clinton.
Was seven months
pregnant at the time she was found dead of a gun shot wound
to the back of the
head, ruled suicide.
At the time of Susan Coleman's suicide, Bill Clinton was her law
professor. In 1992
an overzealous supporter of George Bush hired investigators to
probe this girl's
1977 suicide. They found no evidence that the two had even had an
affair. It was
an old rumour and a baseless one, and even a determined attempt
at muckraking
turned up nothing to substantiate it.
16. Paula Grober - Clinton's interpreter for the deaf.
Traveled with Clinton from
1978 until her death in 1992 in a one-car accident. There
were no witnesses.
The accident took place during the afternoon of 7 December 1992.
Paula Gober's
car overturned at a curve in the highway, throwing her 33 feet
from the vehicle. No
one witnessed the accident.
17. Paul Wilcher - attorney investigating corruption. He had
investigated federal
elections, drug and gun smuggling through Mena, the Waco
incident, and had just
delivered a lengthy report to Janet Reno. He died in his
home of unknown causes.
Nothing surfaces about this man, no record of his death, no
record of his being
part of any investigation, no ties to Janet Reno.
18. Jon Parnell Walker - RTC investigator who mysteriously
fell to his death from
an apartment balcony.
I can find nothing about this man, not a report of his death or
of his being an
Resolution Trust Corporation investigator. Various lists state
this tragedy
happened on 15 August 1993 at the Lincoln Towers in Arlington,
Virginia, but
nothing shows up in the newspapers about it.
19. Ron Brown - former DNS Chairman, Commerce Secretary.
Reported to have
died in a plane crash, but new evidence reveals he may have
been shot in the
head. He was being investigated by a special investigator
and was about to be
indicted with 54 others. He spoke publicly of his
willingness to "make a deal" with
the prosecutors to save himself a few days before the fatal
trip. He was not
supposed to be on the flight but was asked to go at the last
minute. (This count
does not include the other business leaders and other
passengers who died on
this government-sponsored trade mission.)
What new evidence? Ron Brown and 34 others were killed in a plane
crash in
Croatia on 3 April 1993. The plane slammed into a mountain during
a violent storm
while on landing approach. There were no survivors.
As for this nonsense about Brown being shot in the head,
immediately after the
crash pathologists on the scene said most of the bodies (Brown's
among them)
were so badly burned DNA testing had to be performed to identify
who was who. A
body has to be in really bad shape if fingerprints can't be
lifted, dental charts can't
be compared to remains. Had Brown been shot in the head, no one
at the crash
site would have known from looking at him, and an autopsy likely
would have
missed the wound as all the bodies were severely mashed up. In
other words,
there'd be no evidence of Brown being shot even if he had been.
As for someone
witnessing the shooting and later telling of it, everyone on that
flight died.
20. Barbara Wise - Commerce Department secretary. Worked
with Ron Brown and
John Huang and had extensive knowledge of their activities.
Found dead in her
locked office the day after Thanksgiving. It was ruled a
suicide. Interestingly, she
was found partially clothed, bruised, and in a pool of
blood.
There was no pool of blood, no bruising, and Barbara Wise's death
was never ruled
a suicide by anyone. She was discovered in her Commerce
Department office on
29 November 1996 after last being seen alive on 27 November 1996,
the day before
Thanksgiving. A thorough investigation uncovered no evidence of
foul play or
suicide. Wise had a history of frequent and severe health
problems, including liver
ailments. Her death was attributed to natural causes.
21. Charles Meissner - Assistant Secretary of Commerce. John
Huang was given a
special security clearance by Meissner. Shortly thereafter,
he died in the crash of a
small plane.
Charles Meissner died in the same plane crash that took the life
of Ron Brown, the
one on in Croatia on 3 April 1993. 14 Commerce Department
staffers died in that
crash, Meissner and Brown among them.
22 & 23. Kevin Ives and Don Henry - seventeen-year-old boys
who apparently saw
something related to drugs in Mena by accident late at
night. Officially ruled an
accidental death on the train tracks, but evidence shows
they died before being
placed on the tracks - one of a crushed skull and the other
of a knife wound in the
back.
We're now entering an involved segment of the list wherein a
number of deaths will
be said to be tied to those of Ives and Henry. Ives and Henry
were murdered,
something a piss-poor medical examiner missed when he didn't
bother to look
beyond the obvious.
Henry and Ives were run over by a train on 23 Aug 1987. Dr. Fahmy
Malak,
Arkansas' former state medical examiner, ruling the deaths
accidental, said the
teens fell asleep on the tracks after smoking marijuana. A 1988
Saline County
grand jury determined the boys were murdered and their bodies
afterwards laid on
the tracks, but no other conclusions were reached and no
indictments were
returned. The FBI is still investigating the deaths.
A number of Malak's determinations had been challenged and
overturned during
his career. He certainly wasn't always a conscientious medical
examiner, and his
Ives and Henry rulings were only two of many such botchings.
Getting back to the real meat of who killed the boys, nothing
ties Ives and Henry to
Clinton. Though various of these lists will claim the boys
accidentally stumbled
onto a "protected" drug drop and were killed for it, there's no
reason to believe
even that. In a 25 May 1990 hearing before U.S. Magistrate Henry
Jones Jr.,
Katherine Brightop said her ex-boyfriend Paul William Criswell
told her he and
three other men were involved in the teen-agers' deaths. Brightop
said Criswell
told her the boys tried to steal cocaine from Callaway's home and
they were caught
and beaten to death before their bodies were placed on the
tracks.
Ripping off a drug dealer will get you killed.
24. Keith Koney - had information on the Ives and Henry
deaths. Died in a
motorcycle accident with reports of a high-speed car chased
involved.
19-year-old Keith Coney died on 17 May 1988 when the motorcycle
he was driving
struck the back of a tractor-trailer. He was riding a motorcycle
he'd stolen the day
before. There were no reports of a high-speed car chase.
25. Keith McKaskle - had information on the Ives and Henry
deaths. Stabbed to
death.
In August 1989, Ronald Shane Smith was sentenced to ten years for
the
10 November 1988 murder of Keith McKaskle. McKaskle had earlier
expressed
fears for his life, linking them to his knowing something about
"the railroad track
thing". Smith may have been paid to kill McKaskle as a prison
inmate said he had
been approached and offered $4,000 to kill McKaskle.
26. Gregory Collins - had information on the Ives and Henry
deaths. Gunshot
wound to the head.
25-year-old Greg Collins of Bryant was found shot in woods near
Rosston on
2 Dec. 1989.
27. Jeff Rhodes - had information on the Ives and Henry and
McKaskle deaths.
Tortured, mutilated, shot, body burned in a dumpster.
In July 1989 Frank Pilcher was arrested for the April 1989 murder
of Jeffrey
Rhodes. Rhodes had earlier told his father he feared for his life
because he'd
witnessed a narcotics transaction.
Rhodes was last seen alive on April 3. His body was discovered in
a dumpster on
April 19. He'd been shot twice in the head and his body was badly
burned. The
body was likely burned in an effort to destroy forensic evidence
that would led
investigators to the murderer.
28. James Milam - had information on the Ives and Henry
deaths. He was
decapitated. The coroner ruled death due to natural causes.
I've a feeling this is going to be my favourite entry. Remember
that Arkansas
medical examiner, the one I said wasn't always the most
conscientious investigator
on God's green earth? Yep, we're about to see him again. Fahmy
Malek listed
James Milam's cause of death as a perforated ulcer, adding that
Milam's small dog
afterwards ate the dead man's head, accounting for Milam's
headless condition.
Milam's daughter-in-law insists Milam was murdered. She claims
Malak showed
her photographs of the headless corpse, and the neck was cut
clean. The Milam
family has not attempted to legally challenge the ruling because
of the expense, so
we'll never know which way the cat jumps, ulcer or murder.
The best for last though. Ives and Henry died three months after
the 72-year-old
man Milam was called to glory. What are we supposed to believe
here, the Clinton
conspirators knocked off someone who "had information on the Ives
and Henry
deaths" three months before they did away with Ives and Henry?
Wow; talk about
a preemptive strike!
29. Jordan Kettleson - had information on the Ives and Henry
deaths. Found shot
in the front seat of his pick up truck.
21-year-old Jordan Ketelsen died on 25 June 1990.
30. Dr. Stanley Heard - Chair, National Chiropractic Health
Care Advisory
Committee. He personally treated Clinton's mother,
stepfather, and brother. His
personal small plane developed problems so he rented
another. Fire broke out in
flight and he crashed.
Stanley Heard and Stephen Dickson died on 10 September 1993 when
their
single-engine Cherokee caught fire shortly after takeoff from
Dulles airport then
crashed. They'd attended a briefing that morning on the Clinton
administration's
health care plan. Dickson's plane developed mechanical problems
on the way to
Washington the week before, so Dickson and Heard rented the
Cherokee in
St. Louis to make the trip.
I've found nothing on the National Chiropractic Health Care
Advisory that Heard
was supposedly the chair of.
31. Steve Dickson - attorney for Heard. Died in same plane
crash.
Dickson attended the same briefing Heard did. I do not know if he
was there as
Heard's lawyer or independent of him.
32. John Hillier - video journalist and investigator. He
helped to produce the
documentaries "Circle of Power," and "The Clinton
Chronicles." He mysteriously
died in a dentist's chair for no apparent reason.
Again, I can find no record of this man's death or of his work.
There have been a
few dental chair deaths, but I find nothing on his.
33. Maj. Gen. William Robertson
34. Col. William Densberger
35. Col. Robert Kelly
36. Spec. Gary Rhodes
37. Steve Willis
38. Robert Williams
39. Conway LeBleu
40. Todd McKeehan
41. Sgt. Brian Haney
42. Sgt. Tim Sabel
43. Maj.William Barkley
44. Capt. Scott Reynolds
* all former Clinton bodyguards who are dead.
There's no reason to believe any of these lads were bodyguards
who attended
Clinton. Steve Willis, Robert Williams, Todd McKeehan and Conway
LeBleu were
Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms agents killed during the Waco
confrontation on
28 February 1993.
Brian Haney, Timothy Sabel, William Barkley and Scott Reynolds
died in a
helicopter crash on 19 May 1993. These four were members of
Marine Helicopter
Squadron One, the unit responsible for transporting the
President. They died
when the Blackhawk helicopter they had taken out for a
maintenance-evaluation
flight crashed. There was no evidence of sabotage. Clinton had
set foot in the
aircraft on only one occasion, two months before, when he
traveled from the White
House to the USS Theodore Roosevelt.
Jarrett Robertson, William Densberger, Robert Kelly and Gary
Rhodes died in a
helicopter crash in Weisbaden, Germany on 23 February 1993.
45. Gary Johnson - former attorney for Larry Nichols,
severely beaten and left for
dead.
Again, I can find nothing on this incident or even this man's
life.
46. Dennis Patrick - had millions of dollars laundered
through his account at
Lasater & Co. without his knowledge. There have been several
attempts on his life,
all unsuccessful.
It's hard to know what to say about this one. Though I find
credible reference to
Patrick's life having been in danger a few times, I'm unable to
trace back to news
reports on the original incidents. Without seeing them, I'm not
confident in stating
an opinion on whether or not those attempts took place.
Patrick was a client of Lasater, albeit a reluctant one. He was
asked to open an
account there, he refused, one was opened for him anyway, and he
was handed
"profits" from one transaction for his part in allowing whatever
was going on to take
place. Again, someone who got involved with drug dealers ended up
in trouble. In
this case, an otherwise upstanding man took money he knew to be
dirty to keep
quiet about what his account was being used for. If he's now
being chased by drug
dealers who don't want the details of the transactions to come to
light, is that all
that surprising?
47. L.J. Davis - reporter. While investigating the Clinton
scandals he was attacked
in his hotel room and his notes were taken. He survived.
Davis said he had awakened in his hotel room with a big bump on
his head. He
soon after admitted drinking at least four martinis that night.
No pages were
missing from his notebook, and he had no idea how he ended up on
the floor. "I
certainly wasn't about to conclude that somebody cracked me on
the head," Davis
said at the time.
48. Larry Nichols - former marketing director of ADFA.
Responsible for bringing
forth more evidence and witnesses on Clinton corruption than
any other source.
Very public about his claims against Clinton. He has
suffered six beatings, arrest
on trumped up charges, and a near arrest.
In 1988 Larry Nichols, then a marketing director for the Arkansas
Development
Finance Authority, was fired from his job for making hundreds of
calls to the
Nicaraguan contras from his office. In 1990 he filed a lawsuit
against Clinton
claiming the then-Governor of Arkansas and others made him the
scapegoat in a
misappropriation-of-funds charge that cost him his job. In that
suit he also tossed
in claims of extramarital affairs, naming five women Clinton was
supposed to have
chased across the sheets. Nichols withdrew his lawsuit in 1992
and issued a
round of apologies to everyone involved. He admitted what he'd
said had been an
attempt to destroy the Governor by innuendo.
Nichols has since changed his tune yet again, and has returned to
making
allegations against Clinton, always being careful to stop just
short of asserting
Clinton is involved in various murders and other crimes Nichols
points to as
"suspicious."
Since his dismissal from the AFDA, Nichols has made a career of
peddling anti-Bill
Clinton books and tapes to the lunatic fringe. Take anything
claimed about or by
this man with a huge grain of salt.
Gary Galloway
> I suggest that those interested in this subject read the entire web
> here.
Well, golly, gee whiz, if its published on the internet is must be true.
Gary
____________________________________________________
"Be careful what you ask for, you might get it."
Dave64052
In article <361CD014...@home.com>, Gila Jones <gila...@home.com>
writes:
>[snip]
> Nichols has since changed his tune yet again, and has returned to
>making allegations against Clinton, always being careful to stop just
>short of asserting Clinton is involved in various murders and other crimes
Nichols
>points to as "suspicious."
>
> Since his dismissal from the AFDA, Nichols has made a career of
>peddling anti-Bill Clinton books and tapes to the lunatic fringe. Take
anything
>claimed about or by this man with a huge grain of salt.
>
Given all the dead people who were once "friends" or "bodyguards", or
attorney's for the Cliinton's, then why are we having impeachment hearings only
about "sexual indiscretions" and lieing before a Grand Jury about it?
Seems to me that we had a couple murders in K.C. Mo., too, right down the
street from Arthur Bryant's Bar B. Q, just a few hours after Clinton ate there.
I'm sure there must be a connection.
Let's see, there are about 1,000,000 federal employees who work for Clinton.
I think disgruntaled, killer postmen also must be connected someway to Slick
Willie too. I'm sure we can pin all these crimes on him. If only one-half of
one percent of these are suicidal, or killers, that means we may find 5,000
more people to add to the long list of Clinton crimes/murders.
My questions is, however, why are sworn "enemies" like Nichols and Kenneth
Starr allowed to live; Monica Lewinsky, and Linda Tripp are still healthy and
breathing. Yet, his friends/associates/former interns are all dieing like
flies? Could it have something to do with natural longevity, and the hazardous
work that some of them perform, i.e,like the Waco raiders, for example?
Let's see, if you have listed 50 suspicious/violent deaths, when there could be
up to 5,000, then somewhere we have 4,950 undiscovered deaths/crimes. Using
statistics like this, anything can be proven. A dead body does not prove
murder, no more than someone dieing in China everytime I sneeze prove that my
sneeze did it.
Regards,
Dave
Glendower
POB 520291
Independence, Mo. 64052
RDeschene
>Well, golly, gee whiz, if its published on the internet is must be true=
>.
Well, golly, gee whiz, if it's circulated via e-mail, it must be true.
After all, that's what the authors of the "Clinton body count" spam would
have us believe.
I go with Gila on this one; check out the website:
http://snopes.simplenet.com/spoons/faxlore/clinton.htm
It lists what are, IMO, very reasonable responses to a bunch of ludicrous
claims. Though, given the hysterical "get 'em any way we can" climate
that's polluting Washington these days, conspiracy theories circulating via
e-mail and the 'net are hardly surprising.
Sue
Gary Galloway
>> Well, golly, gee whiz, if its published on the internet is must be true=
>>.
> Well, golly, gee whiz, if it's circulated via e-mail, it must be true.
> After all, that's what the authors of the "Clinton body count" spam would
> have us believe.
>I go with Gila on this one; check out the website:
As you suggested I did. I misinterpreted the intent of the original post. I
quess
I have heard this so much already, I didn't take the time to check it out. My
apologies.
I do have a question, I does seem odd that so many people that WERE
associated with Clinton have died. I don't believe he was in any way
involved in any of them, but statistically speaking, it does seem to be a high
number of people. Can someone offer a reasonable explaination? Not trying
to open a can of worms here, just wondered if there might be some kind
of commonality here.
Regards,
RDeschene
>I do have a question, I does seem odd that so many people that WERE
>associated with Clinton have died. I don't believe he was in any way
>involved in any of them, but statistically speaking, it does seem to be=
> a high
>number of people. Can someone offer a reasonable explaination? Not try=
>ing
>to open a can of worms here, just wondered if there might be some kind
>of commonality here.
>
I think that the website actually provides a reasonable explanation for
each one. I don't think there's any "commonality" among all these people,
unless it's the fact that they knew or were associated with Clinton. Their
deaths are pure coincidence. I would think that if you checked into
anyone's background, and did a trace of all the people that individual had
known in their lifetime, there would be deaths; after all, we all die
sometime, right? Most of the deaths would be attributed to natural causes,
but I suspect we'd all be surprised at the number of people we'd known over
the years who died as a result of some act of violence, or for whom the
cause of death could be labeled as "suspicious." Somebody just decided to
get busy -- *real* busy -- and track down all of Clinton's friends and
associates who have died over the years. People have done the same thing
with Kennedy, for example, but I remain unconvinced that the deaths
associated with either president were the result of any conspiracy.
Sue
ED
>
> I do have a question, I does seem odd that so many people that WERE
> associated with Clinton have died. I don't believe he was in any way
> number of people. Can someone offer a reasonable explaination? Not trying
> to open a can of worms here, just wondered if there might be some kind
> of commonality here.
>
These things happen. There doesn't have to be a reason. Someone could
make a similar case against me. In less than a year I lost several
close friends, my best friend, my SO, my mom and my cat. In the 8 years
since I have lost my dad, a couple of more best friends and numerous
friends and acquaintenances. Did their association with me cause their
deaths?
--
Love & Peace Ed B.
"We covenant to affirm and promote acceptance of one another and
encouragement to spiritual growth in our congregations."
Unitarian Universalist 3rd Principle
Dave64052
In article <361E5C87...@mindspring.com>, ED <huma...@mindspring.com>
writes:
>These things happen. There doesn't have to be a reason. Someone could
>make a similar case against me. In less than a year I lost several
>close friends, my best friend, my SO, my mom and my cat. In the 8 years
>since I have lost my dad, a couple of more best friends and numerous
>friends and acquaintenances. Did their association with me cause their
>deaths?
So, are you admitting any guilt? I bet you must be a Democrat too, that's
obvious with so much bad luck. Do Democrats ever win the Lottery? <grin>
No, seriously, I find it very sad that some people seem to suffer more tragedy
in a short time than others. I also find it extremely hateful that many will
take all this as some indication that they are evil, or involved in some form
of conspiracy to dispose of their "enemies." Heck, if Presidents do that,
they'd be no one around to write about their legacy after they are dead and
buried.
I cannot explain tragedy, nor why so many deaths are associated with the
Clinton's, except statisticly. (especially using "your" bad odds)
.
But everyone is mortal. The President has more friends (and friends in high
places) than anyone else. (also many friends in low places). Hence,
statisticly, a larger number of them may be found dead, but not a greater
percentage than what might occur to our own friends/aquantenances.
Ed, I guess you are just unlucky that "you" are have not died first, as then
they'd be talking about the poor luck of your friends that survived you, and
all "their" friends dieing. You can't win, dead or alive, someone will
complain of unfairness.
Me, given a choice, I'd rather be unlucky to survive so many friends.
:-)
Gary Galloway
> Their deaths are pure coincidence. I would think that if you checked into
> anyone's background, and did a trace of all the people that individual had
> known in their lifetime, there would be deaths; after all, we all die
> sometime, right?
I suspect you are right that it is meerly coincidence. Things
happen. It just struck me as a statistical anomaly.
Holli Emore
Clinton actually does have a connection with. He has made a career of meeting and
interacting with thousands and thousands of people. He is the President, you
know.
Gary Galloway wrote:
> On 8 Oct 1998 11:04:04 -0400, Gary Galloway <gga...@us.ibm.com> wrote:
>
> >> Well, golly, gee whiz, if its published on the internet is must be true=
> >>.
> > Well, golly, gee whiz, if it's circulated via e-mail, it must be true.
> > After all, that's what the authors of the "Clinton body count" spam would
> > have us believe.
>
> >I go with Gila on this one; check out the website:
>
> As you suggested I did. I misinterpreted the intent of the original post. I
> quess
> I have heard this so much already, I didn't take the time to check it out. My
> apologies.
>
> I do have a question, I does seem odd that so many people that WERE
> associated with Clinton have died. I don't believe he was in any way
> involved in any of them, but statistically speaking, it does seem to be a high
> number of people. Can someone offer a reasonable explaination? Not trying
> to open a can of worms here, just wondered if there might be some kind
> of commonality here.
>
> Regards,
Holli Emore
Gary Galloway wrote:
> > I suggest that those interested in this subject read the entire web
> > cpage, which contains sources and quite a lot of text not included
> > here.
>
> Well, golly, gee whiz, if its published on the internet is must be true.
>
> Gary
>
> ____________________________________________________
>
> "Be careful what you ask for, you might get it."
Here is a copy of my recent correspondence with the creator of that web
site. If I remember correctly, they are folklorists connected with a
university.
Subject:
Re: Urban Legends Reference Pages: Wooden Spoons
Date:
Tue, 20 Oct 1998 00:42:51 -0700 (PDT)
From:
Barbara Mikkelson <hben...@email.csun.edu>
To:
holli...@mindspring.com
CC:
David Mikkelson <sno...@snopes.com>
> Anyway, thank you for doing the research,
You're very welcome. A number of our site's visitors had asked about
those silly lists, so I finally set aside time to tear into it.
> I don't have time to check *your* assertions, but at least you have
> offered citations as some basis.
The four or five articles I list at the end of the page have to do
with these lists as a whole, not the individual deaths. Should you
be curious about any one particular death, drop me an email and I'll
mail you whichever articles I have about that particular case. (Were
I to list all of these newspaper articles on the page, the References
section would run on for four screens.)
- Barbara
Gary Galloway
says...
> 'd say it's a statistically very low number when you think about how many people
> Clinton actually does have a connection with. He has made a career of meeting and
> interacting with thousands and thousands of people. He is the President, you
> know.
When put it that light yes it does seem pretty low. That is really what
I was looking for, a connection that explains the numbers.
Regards,
Gary