Wahdatul Wujud
xmas
I have seen some refutations of the concept of Wahdatul Wujud or what is in
persian called Hama Ost. The argument seems to emphasise that there is
difference in two things:
1. Allah's Ayahs are in all things
2. Allah is in all things
The two statements are obviously different. Further there is some support from
Quran for the first statement. There is absolutely no explicit support from
Quran for the second statement.
Having admitted all this, it is still not clear to me on what grounds the second
statement can be regarded as WRONG.
There is difference between two statements:
1. A hypothesis is not explicitly supported by Quran
2. A hypothesis is WRONG.
I have no problem if the folks say that the concept of Wahdatulwujud can not be
explicitly supported (versus iondirectly argued) from Qurtan. I do have problem
in claiming that Wahdatulwujud is Wrong or Flawed from Islamic perspective.
To show that Wahdatulwujud is not consistent with Quran, one would have to
demonstrate some explicit contradictions between the Wahdatulwujud and Quran. I
do not think any such contradictions have been presented. Are you aware of any?
Hamid AzizPOP_Server=pop.freeuk.net
> Salam:
>
> I have seen some refutations of the concept of Wahdatul Wujud or what is
in
> persian called Hama Ost. The argument seems to emphasise that there is
> difference in two things:
>
> 1. Allah's Ayahs are in all things
> 2. Allah is in all things
>
> The two statements are obviously different. Further there is some support
>from Quran for the first statement. There is absolutely no explicit support
from
> Quran for the second statement.
> Having admitted all this, it is still not clear to me on what grounds the
second
> statement can be regarded as WRONG.
Comment:-
"He is the First and the Last and the Outer and the Inner, and He is Aware
of all things. " Quran 57:3
This verse has been translated in several different ways, but I think that
each of these is restriction of a more general meaning.
Walid Dabbous
>
>1. A hypothesis is not explicitly supported by Quran
>2. A hypothesis is WRONG.
>
> I have no problem if the folks say that the concept of
> Wahdatulwujud can not be explicitly supported (versus iondirectly
> argued) from Qurtan. I do have problem in claiming that Wahdatulwujud
> is Wrong or Flawed from Islamic perspective.
>
> To show that Wahdatulwujud is not consistent with Quran, one would
> have to demonstrate some explicit contradictions between the
> Wahdatulwujud and Quran. I do not think any such contradictions have
> been presented. Are you aware of any?
Allah says in the Qur'an:
AlHamdu lil-Lahi Rabi l-^alamin.
which means Praise be to Allah the Lord of the worlds.
Allah confirms to us his existence and the existence of
the worlds. He is the Lord of the worlds. He is not the worlds and the
worlds are not Him. So wahdatulwujud explicitly contradics Qur'an.
--
Walid Dabbous
http://www.inria.fr/rodeo/dabbous
INRIA U.R. de Sophia Antipolis | Email : dab...@sophia.inria.fr
2004, Route des Lucioles BP 93 | Phone : +33 4 92 38 77 18
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rja...@my-deja.com
[57:4]He it is who created the heavens and the earth in six periods, and
He is
firm in power; He knows that which goes deep down into the earth and
that which
comes forth out of it, and that which comes down from the heaven and
that which
goes up into it, and He is with you wherever you are; and Allah sees
what you
do.
I think the verse is pretty clear that Allah is with you and not in you.
[50:16]And certainly We created man, and We know what his mind suggests
to him,
and We are nearer to him than his life-vein.
If Allah is in everything then i don't see the point of saying Allah is
near you if He is in you.
Ibn 'Arabi was the first one to technically introduce the concept of
Wahdatul Wujud, sometimes translated as Pantheistic Monoism.
Then there have been many misrepresentations of what he claimed to
believe. It would be best to directly quote from his writing to
demonstrate his concept.
The closest thing that I can think of that comes close to this is the
Qur'anic "Tajalli" or Manifestation as Allah manifested Himself to the
Mountain and it crumbled to dust:
[7:143]And when Musa came at Our appointed time and his Lord spoke to
him, he
said: My Lord! show me (Thyself), so that I may look upon Thee. He said:
You
cannot (bear to) see Me but look at the mountain, if it remains firm in
its
place, then will you see Me; but when his Lord manifested His glory
(fatajalla) to the
mountain He made it crumble and Musa fell down in a swoon; then when he
recovered, he said: Glory be to Thee, I turn to Thee, and I am the first
of the
believers.
There are some really powerful gnostic supplications attributed to Imam
Husayn bin 'Ali namely his supplication of yawm al 'arafah which touches
alot on this aspect of Tajalli.
Henry Corbin discusses Tajalli in his work on Ibn 'Arabi and translates
it as Theophany. I can't comment much on what Ibn 'Arabi really meant
by Wahdat al Wujud but if it is Allah being in all things then it is
wrong as far as I can understand.
As far as Tajalli is concerned I don't have a problem with it. Some
lines from Imam Husayn's supplication are:
Oh Allah, you have manifested yourself to all things so all things are
aware of you and nothing is ignorant of you.
Oh Allah I have understood that your purpose is to manifest yourself to
me in all things so that whereever I look I see you (paraphrase).
It is a really wonderful supplication, I have never heard any
supplication that opens so many doors of gnosis like this one.
Even the Supplication of Kumayl has certain lines like "I ask you by
your names that fill the corners of all things".
The concept is that God has created all things by his names and
attributes. Some things manifest a few names while some manifest more
than others, like the mountains manifesting his glory and the oceans his
depth and the love of a mother for her child his compassion. The human
being is said to manifest or have the potential of manifesting more of
God's names than any other thing, especially the Prophet Muhammad (sawa)
who some gnositics term as the Mazhar Ism Allah al 'Adham (manifestation
of the greatest name of Allah). If you are interested in this topic you
may like to explore the last chapters of Imam Khomeini's "Forty Hadeeth"
available at:
http://al-islam.org/fortyhadith/
salaam,
RiDwaan
--
The Messenger Of Allah Said (sawa)
"I Am Leaving Two Things Behind With You That If You Follow You Will
Never Go Astray After Me: The Book Of Allah And My Ahlul-Bayt. These
Two
Shall Never Seperate Until They Meet Me On The Day Of Judgement."
Innee Tarik Feekum Maa In Tamassaktum Bihimaa Lan TaDilluu Ba'di
Kitaaballahi Wa 'Itrati Ahla Bayti Wa Innahumaa Lan Yatafarraqaa Hattaa
Yaridaa 'Alayal Hawd.
http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Launchpad/2291/astray1.jpg
http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Launchpad/2291/astray2.jpg
http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Launchpad/2291/astray3.jpg
http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Launchpad/2291/khalifatain1.jpg
http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Launchpad/2291/khalifatain2.jpg
References:
Sahih al-Tirmidhi, v5, pp 662-663,328, report of 30+ companions, with
reference to several chains of transmitters.
al-Mustadrak, by al-Hakim, Chapter of "Understanding (the virtues) of
Companions, v3, pp 109,110,148,533 who wrote this tradition is authentic
(Sahih) based on the criteria of the two Shaikhs (al-Bukhari and
Muslim).
Sunan, by Daarami, v2, p432
Musnad, by Ahmad Ibn Hanbal, v3, pp 14,17,26,59, v4, pp 366,370-372, v5,
pp 182,189,350,366,419
see http://al-islam.org/encyclopedia
The Prophet also said (sawa):
Behold! My Ahl al-Bayt are like the Ark of Noah, whoever embarked in it
was saved, and whoever turned away from it was drowned.
Inna Mathala Ahli Baytee Feekum Mathalu Safeenati NuH man rakibaha najaa
Wa Man Takhallafa 'Anhaa halak
sample of Arabic text taken from http://www.muhaddith.com
http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Launchpad/2291/safinah.jpg
References:
AlĸHakim records this tradition of the Prophet (S) in his Mustadrak, ii,
343, iii, 150:
Abu Nu`aym in Hilyat alĸ'awliya', iv, 306;
alĸKhatib in Ta'rikh Baghdad, xii, 19;
alĸSuyuti in alĸDurr alĸmanthur (al-Matba`at alĸMaymaniyyah,
Egypt,1314),
under verse 2:58 also in his Jami' al Sagheer.
alĸMuttaqi in Kanz alĸ`ummal, i, 250, vi, 216;
alĸHaythami in Majma` alĸzawa'id, ix, 167, 168;
alĸMuHibb alĸTabari in Dhakha'ir alĸ`uqba, 20; alĸManawi in Kunuz
alĸHaqa'iq, 132.
Yanabi Muwaddah, Qundoozi Hanafi, p 30, 370
al Sawaiq al Muhriqah, Ibn Hajar, p 184, 234
see http://al-islam.org/thaqalayn/nontl/index.HTM
xmas
May Allah reward you for your responses. I can not comment on any of these. I am
learning. I will look at the Quranic references. I will Also look at Khomeini's
Fourty Hadith.
Meanwhile please do throw more light on the subject through
more references
commentaries
articles
Wassalam
Rahim
Ali Butt
Please bear in mind that wahdatul wujud and wahdatul shuhud are states of
mind and the ideas cannot be found in books and classes.
Ibn Arabi and Sirhindi (RA) wrote about the two concepts because they had
mastered them and saw the world as they saw it.
Also bear in mind we are the creation of Allah and thus have no inkling of
Allah's being and how he is made up.
xmas
Ali Butt wrote:
>
> Sallam
> Please bear in mind that wahdatul wujud
I am not sure what the "standard meanings" of Wahdatul Wujud mean.
My own admittedly defective notion is this. Allah calls the phenomena of nature
as "ayatullah". By that one could mean a reminder for Allah or one could take it
to mean a "pointer" to Allah. If the latter meaning is taken, then the things in
nature point to Allah. Since different things usually point in different
directions, this notion somehow means that Allah is everywhere. The Wahdatul
Wujud would then mean a sum of all these manifestations that the phenomena of
nature point towards.
So if a flower is an ayatullah, then there is something associated with flower
that is a manifestation of Allah. One can construct a picture, just for human
consumption with no claim to real validity, that this manifestation may be taken
to be a representation of Allah. In that sense one can come to a picture that is
ONE and that ONE is distributed everywhere, so that He is actually closer to
each one of us than our Aerta i.e. He is part of us like Aeorta is part of us or
even more so.
I personally do not see anything wrong with this picture. Admittedly Quran says
not to invent examples for Allah: but at the same time the human limitation
impeded understanding without some model (e.g. the model consisting of the 99
names). Further there are Hadith Qudsi that come pretty close to striking
examples for Allah.
> and wahdatul shuhud are states of
Again I am not sure what the "standard meaning" of Wahdatul Shuhud are.
In the above picture, one can understand it to mean that though different
ayatullah point to different Shahadah but all these different shuhud (as
manifested in phenomena of nature) are actually ONE manifestation and that one
manifestation is that of Allah. So this concept stops at the level of shahadah
or manifestation. It does not make the additional axiom that the manifestation
of Allah is actually a representation of Allah. With this additional axiom the
Wahdatul Shuhud would become Wahdatul Wujud.
> mind and the ideas cannot be found in books and classes.
I agree. The reason seems to be manifold. The strongest reason seems to be that
the spirituality is something that requires experience (i.e. the result of
experimentations). So it can not be appreciated without experiencing it.
The other reasons are also present. Most Sufis had experienced spirituality but
most were not trained in analytical sciences to be able to put it down as an
axiomatic theory.
The other reason is the wide spread notion that spirituality can not be
theorized. However there is no Quranic basis for such a stance. Admittedly a
theory of spirituality has not so far been formulated. The reasons are many
including those mentioned above. However there is no reason that says that a
theory of spirituality is impossible.
In order to formulate a theory of spirituality, the first step would be to
liberate ourselves from a self imposed boundary condition that such a theory is
not possible. Then to actually formulate it, one needs to go no farther than
Quran. Alhamdolillah, we have Quran. The theory would come from the Hikmah part
of the Quran.
>
> Ibn Arabi and Sirhindi (RA) wrote about the two concepts because they had
> mastered them and saw the world as they saw it.
Can you share with us some writings of these scholars?
Now I have one comment. Assuming these people had mastered this aspect of
spirituality, and given the fact that I have not mastered the same: a corollary
is that I can neither confirm nor deny that they had mastered the aspect. Such a
determination is beyond the scope of my experience and capabilities as they
currently exist.
>
> Also bear in mind we are the creation of Allah and thus have no inkling of
> Allah's being and how he is made up.
Certainly so. However this has not stopped the Sufis from making attempts to
experience a relationship with Allah. Then they often describe this relationship
experience as if it was Allah Himself. This is like child trying to walk and
when he/she falls in the attempts, the parents are encouraging rather than
critical of the mistakes made. We go towards Allah one step, and Allah
approaches us 10 steps: but we have to take that one step which is a
precondition for spiritual progress.
Please brothers and sisters, I have expressed my self in a spirit of sharing. I
would love it if you share your own understanding and experience. I make no
claim to the validity of these thoughts. Wallaho Aalam.