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90210

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FJ!!

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Jul 2, 1992, 6:18:46 AM7/2/92
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So, Dutch commercial TV has done us the favor of starting to screen
this show about teenagers on the edge of decadence and depravity,
called 'Beverly Hills 90210' (I always get to see everything you do,
only somewhat later. We're building-up for C.J. to kiss Abby this
season. Nobody is carrying 'Designing Women,' though).

I've just seen the second episode. Couple o' things:

1. I looked closely at males. They've all got highlights in their
hair. All of them, except the big hyperblond. Maybe he's got them too,
but who can tell. Perfectly executed highlights of course.

2. Does teenage-acne not exist in California? :)

3. What kid do I look out for who is going to come out?

FJ!! (who is extremely happy that the Dutch
subtitle instead of dub. 'Funny Face' was on
German TV, but I had to quit watching because I
couldn't stand Audrey in German. Elizabeth
Taylor bitching 'Cat on a hot tin roof' in
Italian on Rai Uno has to be heard to be
believed as well. I just luuuuuv Europe.)

William Tsun-Yuk Hsu

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Jul 2, 1992, 2:40:39 PM7/2/92
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fjv...@cs.vu.nl (FJ!!) writes:

>2. Does teenage-acne not exist in California? :)

Ahhh, but Luke Perry is way past his teen years. He just *looks* like
a little brat.

Bill, who's embarrassed to admit that he thinks Luke Perry has nice
nipples, I mean he's not even pierced or tattooed or anything ;-)

Nelson Minar

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Jul 3, 1992, 5:28:03 AM7/3/92
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In article <15...@star.cs.vu.nl> fjv...@cs.vu.nl (FJ!!) writes:
>So, Dutch commercial TV has done us the favor of starting to screen
>this show about teenagers on the edge of decadence and depravity,
>called 'Beverly Hills 90210'

Isn't that show absolutely *fabu*. It's quite popular at Reed College.
We all sit around and watch it together and feel superiour. I actually
went to a high school like that. It was awful.

>1. I looked closely at males. They've all got highlights in their
>hair. All of them, except the big hyperblond. Maybe he's got them too,
>but who can tell. Perfectly executed highlights of course.

90210 is single-handedly responsible for sideburns becoming a fashion
trend again in America. Too bad - I think sideburns are perfectly
hideous on most people.

>2. Does teenage-acne not exist in California? :)

Of course not, at least for the actors.

>3. What kid do I look out for who is going to come out?

I'm not sure. One does, but he's only on for one or two episodes. The
one to watch for is the nerdly kid from Oklahoma - he gets to have a
big accident with a gun and it's awful and tragic and really funny the
way they lead up to it with foreshadowing before. Oh yeah, and the
weird woman who comes into the kids' lives and doses the main boy
character with MDMA. So earnest, such serious issues.. it's so *real* :-)

And if you can't get enough of 90210, Fox has a new show - Melrose
Place, that's coming out soon. It's for all the actors who are too
tall to be on 90210..
--
__
nel...@reed.edu \/ D is for lots of things

Roger B.A. Klorese

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Jul 3, 1992, 1:48:31 PM7/3/92
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In article <1992Jul3.0...@reed.edu> nel...@reed.edu (Nelson Minar) writes:
>90210 is single-handedly responsible for sideburns becoming a fashion
>trend again in America. Too bad - I think sideburns are perfectly
>hideous on most people.

Actually, it started to take off in queer fashion before anyone was watching
90210 much.
--
ROGER B.A. KLORESE +1 415 ALL-ARFF
rog...@unpc.QueerNet.ORG {ames,decwrl,pyramid}!mips!unpc!rogerk
"Normal is not something to aspire to, it's something to get away from."
-- J. Foster

William Tsun-Yuk Hsu

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Jul 3, 1992, 3:52:14 PM7/3/92
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nel...@reed.edu (Nelson Minar) writes:

>90210 is single-handedly responsible for sideburns becoming a fashion
>trend again in America.

No, no, sideburns have been fashion items with hip bigcity queers since
the late '80s.

You ought to cruise guys with short hair more often, Nelson. If their
hair's too long, you can't see the sideburns :-)

Bill


Nelson Minar

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Jul 3, 1992, 4:38:25 PM7/3/92
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In article <1992Jul3.1...@csrd.uiuc.edu> h...@sp24.csrd.uiuc.edu (William Tsun-Yuk Hsu) writes:
>nel...@reed.edu (Nelson Minar) writes:
>>90210 is single-handedly responsible for sideburns becoming a fashion
>>trend again in America.

>No, no, sideburns have been fashion items with hip bigcity queers since
>the late '80s.

Ok, ok, maybe so. I understand that bell bottoms were originally a
queer fashion, too. I guess that homosexual is not always equivalent
to good taste. Were bell bottoms ever attractive? Are sideburns ever
attractive, unless matched with a handlebar mustache, a pith helmet,
khakis and a barrel chest?

>You ought to cruise guys with short hair more often, Nelson. If their
>hair's too long, you can't see the sideburns :-)
>Bill

well, Bill, do you have short hair or long? Sideburns or no? Will you
be in Portland in a few weeks?

What you're really saying is "you ought to cruise guys more often."
But it seems like the kind of guys that I find attractive just aren't
available in places I think to go cruise. I always find attractive men
in non-cruisy situations (like the bookstore, although the bathroom of
Powell's used to be a tearoom). That makes cruising more frustrating,
though, as there's a good chance the object of attraction is not
interested in motss.

And when I *do* try to cruise in established areas (like yesterday, at
this new coffeeshop sandwiched between several gay bars) it's a total
failure. In this case, the coffeeshop was completely empty.
--
nel...@reed.edu \/ What in this room is alive in this room and what isn't?

Rod Williams

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Jul 3, 1992, 5:07:59 PM7/3/92
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> nel...@reed.edu (Nelson Minar) writes:
>
>Ok, ok, maybe so. I understand that bell bottoms were originally a
>queer fashion, too. I guess that homosexual is not always equivalent
>to good taste. Were bell bottoms ever attractive? Are sideburns ever
>attractive, unless matched with a handlebar mustache, a pith helmet,
>khakis and a barrel chest?

Hmph. It's certainly not equivalent to good taste to mock
your elders' fashion phases. Pith on you, thonny!
--
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
rod williams -=- pacific bell -=- san francisco -=- rjw...@pacbell.com

Jess Anderson

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Jul 3, 1992, 5:50:19 PM7/3/92
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In article <1992Jul3.2...@PacBell.COM>
rjw...@PacBell.COM (Rod Williams) writes:

>> nel...@reed.edu (Nelson Minar) writes:

>>Ok, ok, maybe so. I understand that bell bottoms were originally a
>>queer fashion, too. I guess that homosexual is not always equivalent
>>to good taste. Were bell bottoms ever attractive? Are sideburns ever
>>attractive, unless matched with a handlebar mustache, a pith helmet,
>>khakis and a barrel chest?

>Hmph. It's certainly not equivalent to good taste to mock
>your elders' fashion phases. Pith on you, thonny!

Leave the lad alone, you curmudge! He don't know no better,
that's all. Now Nelson, we must educate you about sailors,
whose button-up summer white bell-bottoms (and no rear
pockets, which did something rather wonderful for *their*
bottoms, as well) were to this (then) young man *quite
irresistible. In Chicago, in Norfolk, in San Diego, wherever
sailors could be found in quantity.

As for the hippy styles of the 60s and 70s, we who were
among the first to wear bells in this town (to wolf whistles
from construction workers who coveted our all-too-available
hinders, doubtless) and who wore our sideburns to the length
of the bottom of our ears, and who wore our hair at least as
long as yours (a good deal longer, in my case, and quite
blond besides), we can't have been *too* ugly, for we
remember (more and more dimly, as the years pass) being all
but assaulted by lusty types who found us fetching.

I remember an FBI man in Washington who particularly liked
my hair, which drove him wild. He started out as a
meat-cutter in Brownsville, Oregon (I have no idea where
that is), and he had the kind of arms that conjures up. Oh
dear, oh dear, whatever happened to Patrick?

Heavens, the stuff we used to do, and the get-ups we wore to
do it in (and out of)! Fashion's like that, honey. In
about five years nobody will be caught dead in what you're
likely to see on the smart set these days. I'm glad 501s
lasted as long as they did and the plain old cotton t-shirt
seems destined to live forever; these two things alone have
saved me a major fortune.

Some kid who's now 14 will come on the net at 20 and say:
Eeeuuww, Doc Martins, eeeuuww, short hair, eeeuuww, whatever
it is.

--
Jess Anderson <> Madison Academic Computing Center <> University of Wisconsin
Internet: ande...@macc.wisc.edu <-best, UUCP:{}!uwvax!macc.wisc.edu!anderson
NeXTmail w/attachments: ande...@yak.macc.wisc.edu Bitnet: anderson@wiscmacc
Room 3130 <> 1210 West Dayton Street / Madison WI 53706 <> Phone 608/262-5888

Nelson Minar

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Jul 3, 1992, 7:29:25 PM7/3/92
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motss.relevance - 1.5. What could be more motss relevant than fashion?

In article <1992Jul3.2...@macc.wisc.edu> ande...@macc.wisc.edu (Jess Anderson) writes:
>Now Nelson, we must educate you about sailors, whose button-up summer
>white bell-bottoms (and no rear pockets, which did something rather
>wonderful for *their* bottoms, as well) were to this (then) young man
>*quite irresistible.

Oh, but handsome sailors are something different. If a person is going
to be wearing a costume as striking as naval whites, then the fact
that they flare around the ankles is just going to make it look more
striking. And while I can't say that I share a general attraction to
military types, I do appreciate the effect of lack of pockets. In
fact, isn't that why rear pockets exist at all, to break up the effect
of tight fitting fabric across a muscled ass?

>we can't have been *too* ugly [in our hippy fashion], for we remember


>(more and more dimly, as the years pass) being all but assaulted by
>lusty types who found us fetching.

well, if everyone's wearing the same things, then everyone's equally
tacky :-)

>In about five years nobody will be caught dead in what you're likely
>to see on the smart set these days. I'm glad 501s lasted as long as
>they did and the plain old cotton t-shirt seems destined to live
>forever; these two things alone have saved me a major fortune.

>Some kid who's now 14 will come on the net at 20 and say: Eeeuuww,
>Doc Martins, eeeuuww, short hair, eeeuuww, whatever it is.

I might be inclined to say "Eeeuww, Doc Martins" now, but it really
depends on what they're worn *with*. If Docs become the centerpiece of
the wardrobe, then I usually think "eeuww".

I guess what I'm saying is that I don't like "fashion". Certainly not
on me - I usually wear very boring, functional clothing. I just don't
feel like dressing in costume from day to day. Oh, occasionally I drag
out my black turtleneck and look imposing, but I like the usefulness
of the basic turtleneck. And I suppose my hair is a bit of a costume:
it's certainly not convenient.

If other people are going to dress "fashionably", I prefer that they
do something either so *outrageous* that you know they know it's a
costume (say a green quilted satin jacket) and they look great anyway,
or something unusual and distinguished.

Nelson, who's actually jealous because he can't afford nice clothes.
--
nel...@reed.edu \/ You can't have the revolution without good typesetting

William Tsun-Yuk Hsu

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Jul 3, 1992, 9:19:46 PM7/3/92
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nel...@reed.edu (Nelson Minar) writes:

>In fact, isn't that why rear pockets exist at all, to break up the effect
>of tight fitting fabric across a muscled ass?

Rear pockets are for hankies, of course :-) :-) :-)

>I guess what I'm saying is that I don't like "fashion". Certainly not
>on me - I usually wear very boring, functional clothing.

Hey, I've always worn t-shirts, jeans and huge baggy shirts. I can't
help it if, all of a sudden, everyone's wearing them too.

>Nelson, who's actually jealous because he can't afford nice clothes.

T-shirts, jeans and oversized shirts are cheap, if you look in the right
places...

Bill

William Tsun-Yuk Hsu

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Jul 3, 1992, 9:27:01 PM7/3/92
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nel...@reed.edu (Nelson Minar) writes:

>Are sideburns ever attractive, unless matched with a handlebar mustache,
>a pith helmet, khakis and a barrel chest?

Hey, I love sideburns, but I don't care for mustaches or barrel chests.
That lycanthropic look always gets me :-)

>well, Bill, do you have short hair or long?

Both :-). (Almost shaved all over, ponytail in the back. Satisfies both
my fetishes for short hair and long hair.)

>Sideburns or no?

No. Us Asians have to work *very* hard at facial hair.

>Will you be in Portland in a few weeks?

Unfortunately no... I have this exciting appointment for a dissertation
defense coming up...

>And when I *do* try to cruise in established areas (like yesterday, at
>this new coffeeshop sandwiched between several gay bars) it's a total
>failure. In this case, the coffeeshop was completely empty.

Street cruising is such a hit-and-miss thing anyway (yah yah, I know
somebody will say "no it's not, works for me all the time" :-).

Bill

Jeff Putnam

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Jul 3, 1992, 8:50:33 PM7/3/92
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In article <1992Jul3.2...@reed.edu> nel...@reed.edu (Nelson Minar) writes:
>motss.relevance - 1.5. What could be more motss relevant than fashion?

>I guess what I'm saying is that I don't like "fashion". Certainly not
>on me - I usually wear very boring, functional clothing. ...

>If other people are going to dress "fashionably", I prefer that they
>do something either so *outrageous* that you know they know it's a
>costume (say a green quilted satin jacket) and they look great anyway,
>or something unusual and distinguished.

>Nelson, who's actually jealous because he can't afford nice clothes.

Didnt you get an "Artificial Life" t-shirt?

Black with white cockroaches transforming into cockroach shaped
robots.

I wear odd t-shirts most of the time and have had a number of
compliments on this one, so i guess it stands out. I cant tell
for sure as I have absolutely no sense of fashion and hate
shopping for clothes. (A friend of mine says that for these
reasons (and a few others) that I cant really be gay, I must
be a spy sent by the straight world.)

jeff - who seems to be posting a lot, just one of those statistical
peaks, i guess.

--
je...@jupiter.nmt.edu -- Jeff Putnam, New Mexico Tech, Socorro, NM
"The Government is not only contrary to law, but the character of its members
is very miscellaneous and it is to be assumed that it wont last long."

George Dalton Madison

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Jul 4, 1992, 12:54:00 AM7/4/92
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Nelson Minar writes:
>90210 is single-handedly responsible for sideburns becoming a fashion
>trend again in America. Too bad - I think sideburns are perfectly
>hideous on most people.

Indeed. A full beard would be *MUCH* better; or failing that, a
nice Van Dyke or set of muttonchops.

() What sane person could live in this world and not be
() crazy?
() -- Ursula LeGuin
-----
[> George D. Madison | NBCS: B8f+t+w-e+s+k+a!cv | Just say NO to razors! <]
[> It's a BEAR thing -- you wouldn't understand. <|> fu...@cup.portal.com <]

George Dalton Madison

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Jul 4, 1992, 12:59:37 AM7/4/92
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Jess Anderson writes:
>I'm glad 501s lasted as long as they did
^^

What? Jess, 501s are *timeless* -- they will never ever EVER
go out of fashion -- except among people too brainless to worry
over in the first place.

Or as a friend of mine put it once: "Levi's 501s; the ORIGINAL
Designer Jeans."

() The universe is not only queerer than we suppose, but
() queerer than we *can* suppose.
() -- J.B.S. Haldane

Frank R.A.J. Maloney

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Jul 4, 1992, 12:45:39 PM7/4/92
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In article <1992Jul3.2...@reed.edu> nel...@reed.edu (Nelson Minar) writes:
[deletion]

>
>Ok, ok, maybe so. I understand that bell bottoms were originally a
>queer fashion, too. I guess that homosexual is not always equivalent
>to good taste. Were bell bottoms ever attractive? Are sideburns ever
>attractive, unless matched with a handlebar mustache, a pith helmet,
>khakis and a barrel chest?
>

Nelson, you history-free young pup! As a civilian fashion, bell bottoms
were the bee's knees in the Roaring Twenties, even evening clothes. The
style re-emerged in the 60s, especially when we hippies found out how
cheaply we could buy bell bottomed Navy surplus dungarees. I found them
wonderfully sexy, especially since they were tight in the thigh and
crotch and ass and loose in the calf and ankle; there was an erotic
rhythm of capture and release, of revelation and invitation, that I
(and many of my fellow longhairs) found irre-fucking-sistible.

Of course, one of the distant early warning signs of my own
prepubescent queerness was the fascination and attraction I felt even
at very early ages for sailors in their blue wool
bell-bottom-and-blouse outfits. These were probably one of the reasons
by the homophobes of the 50s were always whispering to me about how
queer all sailors were. It's a wonder I didn't sign up then and there
as cabin boy.

Of course, in those halcyon days of I Like Ike and I Love Lucy, it was
well known that only queer men wore their trousers tight in the ass and
crotch. It was also well known that all dykes were dominatrices of
automechanics (except for the femmes, of course) and wore only greasy
levis, but that's someone else's thread.

As for sideburns, the attraction was lost on me even in the 50s, but
big, anachronistic muttonchops on hippy boys were the cream in my
coffee in the 60s.

--
Frank Richard Aloysius Jude Maloney
"Only the mediocre can always be at their best." -- Mencken
For an average time write uunet!microsoft!frankm
For an even more mediocre time try fra...@microsoft.com

adolphson

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Jul 4, 1992, 8:57:04 PM7/4/92
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In article <1992Jul3.0...@reed.edu>
nel...@reed.edu (Nelson Minar) writes:
| In article <15...@star.cs.vu.nl> fjv...@cs.vu.nl (FJ!!) writes:
| >So, Dutch commercial TV has done us the favor of starting to screen
| >this show about teenagers on the edge of decadence and depravity,
| >called 'Beverly Hills 90210'
|
...

| And if you can't get enough of 90210, Fox has a new show - Melrose
| Place, that's coming out soon. It's for all the actors who are too
| tall to be on 90210..

Too *tall* to be on 90210? I knew Grant Show (the star) when
he was an undergrad at UCLA and, unless he's grown in the intervening
8+ years (he's playing a teenager?!), I can say that he's anything
but tall. Cute, yes. Buff, absolutely. Nice, well, he was then.
But he's about 5'6" or 5'7". Or are the actors on 90210 under 5'?

Arne

Message has been deleted

John Dorrance

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Jul 5, 1992, 5:55:28 AM7/5/92
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jo...@jwt.UUCP (John Temples) writes:

>Are you referring to Emily? I saw her the other night on a pay per
>view movie called (I think) "Defenseless" with Barbara Hershey. I
>thought it was silly enough that she was playing a 17 year old in
>90210; in the movie she was playing a 14 year old porn actress.

You *paid* to see this? Woah. You've got some explaining to do, bucky
boy...

--
John Dorrance ** Disco Diva y Flamenco Chico ** tha...@odin.unomaha.edu

I always thought of you as my brick wall
Built like an angel, six feet tall.

Jess Anderson

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Jul 5, 1992, 11:30:06 AM7/5/92
to

In article <1992Jul04....@microsoft.com>

fra...@microsoft.com (Frank R.A.J. Maloney) writes:

>As for sideburns, the attraction was lost on me even in the 50s, but
>big, anachronistic muttonchops on hippy boys were the cream in my
>coffee in the 60s.

Even though I am a self-appointed coffee super-maven, into the
coffee was not where I put the cream of hippy boys, no, no, no,
not in the 60s, not since.

Oh, you meant ...

Nevermind.

jgl...@ducvax.auburn.edu

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Jul 5, 1992, 10:30:01 PM7/5/92
to

Oh Arne, dear sweet Arne. You KNOW that boy?!?!?!? Can I shine your
shoes, walk your dog, take out your trash, wash your dishes (if you only
knew what THAT one means :-)? BTW, he's not playing a teenager, just
a 20-something, only a little stretch by your statement.

OK, so the extremely cute Grant Show is one good reason to watch the
show. There is a better one however. NEWSFLASH, direct from
Entertainment This Week. ( I was flipping channels, OK? I don't
normally watch it.)

Actor Doug Savant will be portraying the character Matt on the show.
Matt will be an openly gay man comfortable with his lifestyle!! To
paraphrase Mr. Savant; he will be a non-stereotypical gay character
who will not be played for laughs.

Yes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I can't wait. Wednesday night at 7:30 CDT.

- Jay G.

Rob Bernardo

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Jul 6, 1992, 1:53:05 AM7/6/92
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nel...@reed.edu (Nelson Minar) wrote:
>And if you can't get enough of 90210, Fox has a new show - Melrose
>Place, that's coming out soon. It's for all the actors who are too
>tall to be on 90210..

A few minutes after reading this posting, Entertainment Tonight had
a long spot on the new show, mentioning that one character is an
openly gay man.
--
Rob Bernardo
r...@mtdiablo.Concord.CA.US

Jess Anderson

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Jul 6, 1992, 7:57:27 AM7/6/92
to

In article <1992Jul6.0...@mtdiablo.Concord.CA.US>
r...@mtdiablo.Concord.CA.US (Rob Bernardo) writes:

>nel...@reed.edu (Nelson Minar) wrote:

>>And if you can't get enough of 90210, Fox has a new show - Melrose
>>Place, that's coming out soon. It's for all the actors who are too
>>tall to be on 90210..

>A few minutes after reading this posting, Entertainment Tonight had
>a long spot on the new show, mentioning that one character is an
>openly gay man.

What astounds me even more is that Entertainment Tonight
read Nelson's posting. That's *very* modern of them!

adolphson

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Jul 6, 1992, 4:36:03 PM7/6/92
to
In article <1992Jul5...@ducvax.auburn.edu>
| adol...@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson) wrote about
| Melrose Place and its star:

|
| > Too *tall* to be on 90210? I knew Grant Show (the star) when
| > he was an undergrad at UCLA and, unless he's grown in the intervening
| > 8+ years (he's playing a teenager?!), I can say that he's anything
| > but tall. Cute, yes. Buff, absolutely. Nice, well, he was then.
| > But he's about 5'6" or 5'7". Or are the actors on 90210 under 5'?
|
| Oh Arne, dear sweet Arne. You KNOW that boy?!?!?!? Can I shine your
| shoes, walk your dog, take out your trash, wash your dishes (if you only
| knew what THAT one means :-)? BTW, he's not playing a teenager, just
| a 20-something, only a little stretch by your statement.

I KNEW that boy when he WAS a boy. A very cute boy, too. A very
cute and nice boy who never seemed to mind that he was directed to
appear shirtless, at least, in every play he had a part in. Everyone
knew Grant would make it. He played Prince Charming on an After School
Special, was all set to play the runner in "Front Runner" when Paul
Newman owned the property, was on a soap opera. And now he's the
mega-hunk star of his own television show. I have to say that the
title of this show is a bit strange. Melrose Place, the actual
West Hollywood street, is a three block long collection of antique
stores and interior design firms. Is this a show about decorators?

Arne

Shawn Hicks

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Jul 6, 1992, 9:36:19 PM7/6/92
to
In article <1992Jul3.2...@reed.edu>, nel...@reed.edu (Nelson Minar) writes:
>motss.relevance - 1.5. What could be more motss relevant than fashion?

>well, if everyone's wearing the same things, then everyone's equally
>tacky :-)

This reminds me of something an old friend of mine said:

"Fashion is Fine, but Tacky is Timeless" --Teece Jurgenson


>I might be inclined to say "Eeeuww, Doc Martins" now, but it really
>depends on what they're worn *with*. If Docs become the centerpiece of
>the wardrobe, then I usually think "eeuww".

Hmnmmmm, what if they are the *only* piece of the wardrobe???? ;>

>I guess what I'm saying is that I don't like "fashion". Certainly not
>on me - I usually wear very boring, functional clothing. I just don't
>feel like dressing in costume from day to day. Oh, occasionally I drag
>out my black turtleneck and look imposing, but I like the usefulness
>of the basic turtleneck. And I suppose my hair is a bit of a costume:
>it's certainly not convenient.

I have a flat top... simple, easy, and finally back in fashion.... but I've
had one since my tour in Korea, 1985.

Fashion really isn't that hard. Just buy simple chinos, 501s, and other fairly
timless clothes. Then, purchase a few fashion bits that you can mix in with
the old standbys. Viola, you're in enough fashion to count as cool and not
enough to be confused for a member of Deeee-lite. (is that enough e's??)
The basics may change over time, but then clothes wear out over time, too.
Unfortunately, those polyester nighmares from the 70's aren't biodegradable,
and they don't seem to fade much with age. Can we nuke 'em? Or will that give
us radioactive tacky tube tops and bemusing biohazardous bell bottoms?

>Nelson, who's actually jealous because he can't afford nice clothes.

Shawn, who wan't Nelson to know that nice clothes don't make nice people. :)

Ron Buckmire

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Jul 6, 1992, 11:22:11 PM7/6/92
to
So can anyone tell me WHEN the thing is on? Wednesday night when?

Also, is DOUG SAVANT, the gay character who works at a homeless shelter (??!!),
the same Doug Savant who was in MASQUERADE with Meg Tilly and Rob Lowe from the
early 80s? [Masquerade was a *bad* movie about murder and inheritances...]

--
RON BUCKMIRE, 54 Colvin Circle, Troy, NY 12180-3735. ``D.C. in 93!''
vox:(518)-276-8919 fax:(518)-276-6920 buc...@rpi.edu buc...@rpitsmts.bitnet
``Racist, sexist, anti-gay! Operation Rescue GO AWAY!'' --heard in Buffalo.

John Dorrance

unread,
Jul 7, 1992, 5:17:12 AM7/7/92
to
bali...@big-brother.nevada.edu (Shawn Hicks) writes:

>>I might be inclined to say "Eeeuww, Doc Martins" now, but it really
>>depends on what they're worn *with*. If Docs become the centerpiece of
>>the wardrobe, then I usually think "eeuww".

>Hmnmmmm, what if they are the *only* piece of the wardrobe???? ;>

Depends on the body they're on. Really. When wearing only one article
of clothing, make sure it matches your build and personal color scheme.

>Fashion really isn't that hard. Just buy simple chinos, 501s, and other fairly
>timless clothes. Then, purchase a few fashion bits that you can mix in with
>the old standbys.

Listen to the man - he knows of what he speaks. My fashion hint for the
day: *ties*. Lots of 'em with pretty or unusual prints. Spices up the
wardrobe, makes you look like you know what you're doing fashion-wise,
and they're really not that uncomfortable; just make sure the shirt
collars aren't too tight.

>Viola, you're in enough fashion to count as cool and not
>enough to be confused for a member of Deeee-lite. (is that enough e's??)

Too many! D*eee*-lite. I mean, show some restraint, man. And what's wrong
with them? The mens' fashions tend to be *awful*, I'll admit, but Lady
Miss Kier is a fashion *goddess*! She knows her evening wear.

Hoping beyond hope to hear their new song sometime before year's end,

Ailsa N.T. Murphy

unread,
Jul 7, 1992, 12:15:31 AM7/7/92
to
i lie sideburns, always have. when i was trying to be straight,
i always thought it was a pity that i couldn't find a guy who had
sideburns and wore silk smoking jackets.

and bell nottoms are cool. i remember wearing them when i was
in 6th through 8th grade. i had long thick hair and envisioned
myself as looking rather like a cocker spaniel. but i loved
looking at women in hip-hugger bell bottoms and tight sweaters...
*sigh* young peopel these days are sooooooo dull. you can'r
even BUY a t-shirt in small anymore! everyone wears everything
so stupidly baggy... B( not that i wear size small tshirts, or
have since 7th grade, but i wish OTHER PEOPLE did...

there was a woman in a tight purple sweater moderating the state
NOW convention earlier this year/late last year (i forget which).
i had forgotten how much i miss them... if i ordered all women
whose boobs do not graze their waists to recommence wearing
tight shirts, do you think they'll oblige me?

-ailsa
--
It's not what you got, it's what you give _______________
It ain't the life you want, it's the life you live. \ DYKE /
It's not what you got, it's what you give \ PRIDE! /
And it ain't what it's not, but what it is. \ /
(IO8...@maine.maine.edu or wang.com!ailanth!ailsa) \/

jgl...@ducvax.auburn.edu

unread,
Jul 7, 1992, 9:50:12 AM7/7/92
to

Well, maybe not quite. But the report on the show did say they were
shooting on location and would include lots of local color. The
video the had did show them shooting right on the street. The ETW
reporter did seem to mention that it was a "hip and trendy" area.

- Jay G.

adolphson

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Jul 7, 1992, 1:14:17 PM7/7/92
to
In article <1992Jul7...@ducvax.auburn.edu>
jgl...@ducvax.auburn.edu writes:

| In article <l5hblj...@mizar.usc.edu>,
| adol...@mizar.usc.edu (adolphson) writes:
|

| > [...] I have to say that the


| > title of this show is a bit strange. Melrose Place, the actual
| > West Hollywood street, is a three block long collection of antique
| > stores and interior design firms. Is this a show about decorators?
|
| Well, maybe not quite. But the report on the show did say they were
| shooting on location and would include lots of local color. The
| video the had did show them shooting right on the street. The ETW
| reporter did seem to mention that it was a "hip and trendy" area.

"Local color"? I live a 15 minute walk away...hmmmmm. As for "hip
and trendy", Melrose *Avenue* was hip and trendy 10 years ago, but
it's nothing but Japanese tourists and hipster wannabes from the
suburbs now. Melrose *Place* is a mile or so west of what used to
be the hip part of Melrose Ave, and it has never been either hip
or trendy. It's the kind of street where one sees rather effeminate
gentlemen _d'un certain age_ with a poodle in one arm, a clutch purse
in the other.

Arne

J. N. Shaumeyer

unread,
Jul 7, 1992, 6:45:56 PM7/7/92
to

Arne Adolphson (adol...@mizar.usc.edu) writes:

> .... It's the kind of street where one sees rather effeminate

> gentlemen _d'un certain age_ with a poodle in one arm, a clutch purse
> in the other.

Are they gentlemen 'd'un certain age', who are in their prime?

--jns

[temporarily: js...@umail.umd.edu]

Shawn Hicks

unread,
Jul 7, 1992, 8:51:54 PM7/7/92
to
In article <thaaang.710500632@odin>, tha...@odin.unomaha.edu (John Dorrance) writes:
>bali...@big-brother.nevada.edu (Shawn Hicks) writes:

>>Viola, you're in enough fashion to count as cool and not
>>enough to be confused for a member of Deeee-lite. (is that enough e's??)
>
>Too many! D*eee*-lite. I mean, show some restraint, man. And what's wrong
>with them? The mens' fashions tend to be *awful*, I'll admit, but Lady
>Miss Kier is a fashion *goddess*! She knows her evening wear.


Ack! Well, three *is* a much better number.... ;> I didn't mean to imply
that there is anything wrong with Deee-lite, only that their fashion
sense is ...uh.... the cutting edge. I much prefer a more sedate palate
of colors, mixed in a more harmonious pattern: IOW, batteries not required.
The music... well, that's just dreamy. ;)

Growing up in the 70's gave me fashion shock.


Shawn

Nelson Minar

unread,
Jul 7, 1992, 9:29:44 PM7/7/92
to
In article <1992Jul7.2...@wam.umd.edu> j...@wam.umd.edu (J. N. Shaumeyer) writes:
>Are they gentlemen 'd'un certain age', who are in their prime?

but there are lots of people I would consider "gentlemen" who are in
their prime: men who are 23, or 37, or 43, or 59, or...
--
__
nel...@reed.edu \/ Where do you conceal the gun in a bikini?

Jess Anderson

unread,
Jul 8, 1992, 2:48:01 AM7/8/92
to

In article <1992Jul8.0...@reed.edu> nel...@reed.edu
(Nelson Minar) writes:

>but there are lots of people I would consider "gentlemen" who are in
>their prime: men who are 23, or 37, or 43, or 59, or...

10,000,019.

(Not many, though.)

Kathy Beatty

unread,
Jul 7, 1992, 5:22:36 PM7/7/92
to
IO8...@MAINE.MAINE.EDU (Ailsa N.T. Murphy) writes:
:
: and bell nottoms are cool. i remember wearing them when i was

: in 6th through 8th grade. i had long thick hair and envisioned
: myself as looking rather like a cocker spaniel. but i loved
: looking at women in hip-hugger bell bottoms and tight sweaters...
: *sigh* young peopel these days are sooooooo dull. you can'r
: even BUY a t-shirt in small anymore! everyone wears everything
: so stupidly baggy... B( not that i wear size small tshirts, or
: have since 7th grade, but i wish OTHER PEOPLE did...
:
: there was a woman in a tight purple sweater moderating the state
: NOW convention earlier this year/late last year (i forget which).
: i had forgotten how much i miss them... if i ordered all women
: whose boobs do not graze their waists to recommence wearing
: tight shirts, do you think they'll oblige me?
:

Well, I sometimes wear baggy stuff, but I like tight stuff too, especially
when I get to be in good shape from bicycling all summer. My favorite
summer look is spandex cycling shorts and a tank top or small t-shirt.

Is that obliging enough? ;-)


Kathy

George Dalton Madison

unread,
Jul 8, 1992, 3:27:51 AM7/8/92
to
John Dorrance gushes:

>My fashion hint for the
>day: *ties*. Lots of 'em with pretty or unusual prints. Spices up the
>wardrobe, makes you look like you know what you're doing fashion-wise,
>and they're really not that uncomfortable; just make sure the shirt
>collars aren't too tight.

Ties are a PLAGUE FROM HELL. I've often wondered if perhaps
ties aren't the female population's retribution for inventions
such as the girdle and stiletto heel shoes.....

() You can fool some of the people some of the time, and
() jerk the rest off.
() -- Robin Williams

John Dorrance

unread,
Jul 8, 1992, 4:30:45 AM7/8/92
to
Fu...@cup.portal.com (George Dalton Madison) whines, obviously not coming
from the 'it is better to look good than to feel good' school of thought:

>Ties are a PLAGUE FROM HELL. I've often wondered if perhaps
>ties aren't the female population's retribution for inventions
>such as the girdle and stiletto heel shoes.....

Heathen. As far as comfort goes, even loosened ties look good (they just
*scream* casual fop!!!), and it's the collar more than the tie that causes
discomfort. And I'm sure girdles and spike heels (along with bras and
pantyhose and makeup and heavily spritzed hair and...) are *tons* more
annoying than a little scrap of material around the neck. Besides, ties
are phallic symbols, and there's no such thing as a bad phallic symbol.
Now wear one, you pig. And shave, willya? That beard's blocking your
Perry Ellis.

Roger Phillips

unread,
Jul 8, 1992, 12:41:50 PM7/8/92
to
In article <thaaang.710584245@odin>,

tha...@odin.unomaha.edu (John Dorrance) writes:
> Heathen. As far as comfort goes, even loosened ties look good (they just
> *scream* casual fop!!!), and it's the collar more than the tie that causes
> discomfort.

Jeffie, can you keep a check on that boy, please!
Tell him that wanting to look like Rupert Everett is *so* eighties.
And why isn't he wearing T-shirts?
Doesn't he know collars stimulate the hair follicles on the neck?

Honestly!
--
Roger Phillips ro...@quantime.co.uk
"pooter, n. an entomological collecting bottle into which small
arthropods are introduced by suction." -- Chambers English Dictionary

Donn F. Pedro

unread,
Jul 8, 1992, 3:10:29 PM7/8/92
to
In article <61...@cup.portal.com> Fu...@cup.portal.com (George Dalton Madison) writes:
>
>Ties are a PLAGUE FROM HELL. I've often wondered if perhaps
>ties aren't the female population's retribution for inventions
>such as the girdle and stiletto heel shoes.....

Apparently Jerry Garcia hand painted some neckties and Nordstroms,
a local high class store is marketing them. He was here to promote
the product and talk to buyers recently and the store asked him
to wear one.

Apparently the response was not positive.


Donn Pedro ...................{uunet, sequent}!uswnvg!dfpedro

There are no ordinary moments.

Gary Klein, bear at heart

unread,
Jul 8, 1992, 8:50:26 PM7/8/92
to
In article <thaaang.710500632@odin>, tha...@odin.unomaha.edu
(John Dorrance) writes:

> ... My fashion hint for the

> day: *ties*. Lots of 'em with pretty or unusual prints. Spices up the
> wardrobe, makes you look like you know what you're doing fashion-wise,
> and they're really not that uncomfortable; just make sure the shirt
> collars aren't too tight.
|||||||

As one of "those people" who has worn t-shirts to work, non-stop for the
past month, I have to ask, WHY OUWLD I EVER WANT TO WEAR A TIE!

If I was into some sort of auto-erotic-strangulation fantasy, then I tie
would certainly be on my agenda!

TODAY's SHIRT:

The Three Bears -- Grizzly Bear (Ursus arctos)
Polar Bear (Ursus maritimus)
Black Bear (Ursus americanus)

"Librarian, Leather bound"
Gary Klein, Business Librarian, (Univ of Toledo) * * * *
PO Box 12650 Toledo OH 43606-0250 * *
(w): 419-537-2629 fac2813@uoft01 *
(h): 419-243-2740 fac...@uoft01.utoledo.edu B4 t+ w- g s+ k

J. N. Shaumeyer

unread,
Jul 8, 1992, 9:15:38 PM7/8/92
to

> John Dorrance (tha...@odin.unomaha.edu) had advised on fashion:

> > Heathen. As far as comfort goes, even loosened ties look good (they just
> > *scream* casual fop!!!), and it's the collar more than the tie that causes
> > discomfort.

prompting my sweet but sartorially-challenged brother,
Roger Phillips (ro...@quantime.co.uk), to ask:

> Jeffie, can you keep a check on that boy, please!

Rog, I've tried and tried, but he just doesn't like
checks! Once he had a *terribly* nice hound's-tooth
jacket, but it just didn't suit his fancy. So, then
I tried subdued solids, but he insisted on stripes,
even when I told him that they are *much* too slimming.

> Tell him that wanting to look like Rupert Everett is *so* eighties.

Well, why don't *you* tell him while you two are
camping it up?

> And why isn't he wearing T-shirts?

I suspect it's because he hasn't figured out what he
wants them to say yet.

> Doesn't he know collars stimulate the hair follicles on the neck?

I'm sure that's why he does it; he seems to have
developed a strong interest lately in stimulating
hair follicles.

--jns

[happy to report: mail is working again]

Jeff Putnam

unread,
Jul 8, 1992, 8:36:17 PM7/8/92
to
In article <1992Jul8.0...@reed.edu> nel...@reed.edu (Nelson Minar) writes:
>In article <1992Jul7.2...@wam.umd.edu> j...@wam.umd.edu (J. N. Shaumeyer) writes:
>>Are they gentlemen 'd'un certain age', who are in their prime?

>but there are lots of people I would consider "gentlemen" who are in
>their prime: men who are 23, or 37, or 43, or 59, or...

How about 19, 29, 31, 41, 47, 53, ... (one of which I happen to be).


--
je...@jupiter.nmt.edu -- Jeff Putnam, New Mexico Tech, Socorro, NM
"The Government is not only contrary to law, but the character of its members
is very miscellaneous and it is to be assumed that it wont last long."

George Dalton Madison

unread,
Jul 8, 1992, 11:13:22 PM7/8/92
to
John Dorrance spews flatulently:

>Fu...@cup.portal.com (George Dalton Madison) whines, obviously not coming
>from the 'it is better to look good than to feel good' school of thought:

Of course. Comfort is paramount.

>>Ties are a PLAGUE FROM HELL. I've often wondered if perhaps
>>ties aren't the female population's retribution for inventions
>>such as the girdle and stiletto heel shoes.....
>
>Heathen. As far as comfort goes, even loosened ties look good (they just
>*scream* casual fop!!!), and it's the collar more than the tie that causes

You would like screaming casual fops. I agree with the father of
a good friend of mine who refers to ties as "those strangulation
things." Someone made the mistake of giving this wise gentleman a
tie as a gift once; it wound up nailed to his workshop wall. ;-)

>Now wear one, you pig. And shave, willya? That beard's blocking your
>Perry Ellis.

No. Absolutely never. That's one of the best things about beards.

() Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable
() that we have to alter it every six months.
() -- Oscar Wilde

John Dorrance

unread,
Jul 8, 1992, 11:51:56 PM7/8/92
to
ro...@quantime.co.uk (Roger Phillips) writes:

>Jeffie, can you keep a check on that boy, please!
>Tell him that wanting to look like Rupert Everett is *so* eighties.

Hey! That's an insult, isn't it? I can't quite tell... who's Rupert
Everett?

>And why isn't he wearing T-shirts?

I usually do. Shirts with ties are for high-makr fashion days.

>Doesn't he know collars stimulate the hair follicles on the neck?

Is that bad?

>Honestly!

Really.

John Dorrance

unread,
Jul 9, 1992, 12:52:23 AM7/9/92
to
tha...@odin.unomaha.edu (John Dorrance) errs:

>I usually do. Shirts with ties are for high-makr fashion days.

^^^^ mark

Michelle Elliott

unread,
Jul 9, 1992, 11:46:50 AM7/9/92
to
In article <92189.001...@MAINE.MAINE.EDU> Ailsa N.T. Murphy <IO8...@MAINE.MAINE.EDU> writes:
>
>if i ordered all women
>whose boobs do not graze their waists to recommence wearing
>tight shirts, do you think they'll oblige me?

Possibly, but you'd have to be *very* forceful...

Michelle

Angela Gilham

unread,
Jul 9, 1992, 6:24:40 PM7/9/92
to
In article <1992Jul9.1...@rlgvax.Reston.ICL.COM>

No chance! Can't *stand* tight shirts. Damn things are almost as
uncomfortable as bras.

But I do a very nice line in revealing cream silk camisoles, if that's
any compensation ;-)

Ang

--
Angela Gilham. \ a...@aber.ac.uk \ "You should have fallen in
Department of Computer Science \ \ love with a happy man, if
University of Wales, Aberystwyth,\ +44 970 622433 \ you wanted happiness. But
Penglais, Aberystwyth, \ \ you fell for the breath-
SY23 3BZ. United Kingdom. \ \ taking beauty of pain."

Scott Campbell

unread,
Jul 9, 1992, 4:31:27 PM7/9/92
to
[] nel...@reed.edu (Nelson Minar) writes:
>> Article-I.D.: reed.1992Jul8.012944.25566

>> In article <1992Jul7.2...@wam.umd.edu> j...@wam.umd.edu (J. N. Shaumeyer) writes:
>Are they gentlemen 'd'un certain age', who are in their prime?

>> but there are lots of people I would consider "gentlemen" who are in
>> their prime: men who are 23, or 37, or 43, or 59, or...
>> --

What a concept! I'll be in my prime next year when I turn 37. This
has made my day.

Scott
--
Scott Campbell
scam...@scotty.webo.dg.com
from DG CEO: Scott Campbell:DGC

Gary Klein, bear at heart

unread,
Jul 12, 1992, 7:57:42 PM7/12/92
to
In article <1992Jul8.1...@quantime.co.uk>, ro...@quantime.co.uk
(Roger Phillips) writes:
> Doesn't he know collars stimulate the hair follicles on the neck?

I wore collared shirts for all of my 11 years at the bank wihtout any
noticeable difference to my (lack of) chest hairs, until 3 years after I left
the banking industry & switched to t-shirts.

But if you do have some scientific evidence of a correlation between shirt
collars & chest hairs, then the subscribers to BEARS_MAILING_LIST are going to
look forward to seeing your research in print!

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