Pearl Harbor Attack Quiz
Veritas
7th, 1941?
Take the free interactive test at
http://wwx2.tripod.com/cgi-bin/pearlquiz.htm
Think you are an expert?
There are 12 questions.
SCORE INTERPRETATION:
Score of 12 correct = God
10 or 11 = genius
8-9 = well informed
6-7 = good
4-5 = average
0-3 = typical idiot that posts on newsgroups about the Pearl Harbor
attack
Mark Willey
http://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/6315/pearl.html
Pearl Harbor: Mother of All Conspiracies
Geoffrey Sinclair
news:1140375185.3...@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> How much do you know about the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor >December
> 7th, 1941?
Most people know more useful information about the attack than those
trying to push the conspiracy theories, since the conspiracy theories
require so much fiction added in.
So now we have a push quiz,
Ah Mark Willey's version of events. How quaint.
Mark's opening quote,
""...everything that the Japanese were planning to do was known
to the United States..." ARMY BOARD, 1944
A more full version of the quote,
"Up to the morning of December 7, 1941, everything the Japanese were
planning to do was known to the US"
Mark drops the first phrase of the sentence in his advertising. The
attack happened after the "Up until the morning of December 7, 1941".
Also, from the same report as the above quote.
Page 297 of the Army Board:
"1. PEARL HARBOR ATTACK:
a. The attack on the Territory of Hawaii was a surprise to all
concerned: the nation, the War Department, and the Hawaiian Department.
It was daring, well-conceived and well-executed, and it caught the
defending forces practically unprepared to meet it or to minimize its
destructiveness."
> Take the free interactive test at
> http://wwx2.tripod.com/cgi-bin/pearlquiz.htm
>
> Think you are an expert?
>
> There are 12 questions.
>
> SCORE INTERPRETATION:
>
> Score of 12 correct = God
> 10 or 11 = genius
> 8-9 = well informed
> 6-7 = good
> 4-5 = average
> 0-3 = typical idiot that posts on newsgroups about the Pearl Harbor
> attack
Mark usually scores at the 0 to 3 level unless he can set the answers.
I like the way Mark decides it was the most important event for America
in the 20th century. After all the Japanese attack on the Philippines would
have brought the US into the war.
So we have question 1 with Harry Hopkins said to be a KGB agent. And of
course the idea the Japanese could have withdrawn from Southern Indo-
China and thereby avoided the final set of sanctions is to be ignored.
So we have question 2 telling us FDR did it. And gives us a heavy hint
to try the saved communism line. Given what happened to the IJA when
it took on the Red Army, and the large garrison Stalin left in the east,
replacing units shipped west with new ones, the Japanese were much more
likely to occupy the more weakly protected and more developed countries
to the south. Especially as the Germans did not tell the Japanese they
were going to attack the USSR, there was no time to set up an attack and
in any case the Japanese treaty with the USSR in April 1941 helps show
the thinking of the Japanese when it came to the USSR.
Question 3 is an attempt to say the IJN transmitted more information than
they actually did. The strike force was under radio silence orders and
there was no need to tell any other IJN ships where it was. As for reading
the IJN code the answer is no, they allies had some of the dictionary and
were working towards being able to read messages.
Question 4 is firstly advertising of the source, and puts the blame on FDR
for the military not sending a final timely warning. By the way what is the
day and the date mean anyway? Oh yes, the US Army intelligence people
came out for November 30 1941 as the start of the war. The whole idea
about these predictions is to throw away the ones that do not fit and add
ones that do, true or otherwise.
Question 5 is the usual attempt to portray Washington at fault for a
decision
taken in Hawaii, to not use anti torpedo nets in the harbour.
Question 6 is fun, Hawaii was not informed the Japanese had divided the
harbor into 4 areas and were reporting on the ships in each area. The
spy was of course in the Japanese consulate, that is a normal diplomat.
Using publicly available information. Later on the US tagged the message
setting up the system as the bomb plot because the harbour was bombed.
As opposed to say ships being sabotaged by Japanese agents or torpedoed
by midget submarines or simply a way to make the reports briefer and
therefore less expensive to send. In peacetime you defend your budget, in
wartime the country.
Question 7 is easy, no. Since Washington, like Hawaii did not know where
the main IJN carriers were.
Question 8 is quite simple, the Japanese did not think so, no doubt some
lawyer can give a contradictory opinion.
Question 9 is simple, the US had to activate any treaty for it to go to war,
not what the Dutch did.
Question 10 is the usual, convoy escorts is apparently sacrificing ships.
By
the way the USS Texas peacetime crew was around 1,300, this increased to
around 1,500 during the war, it did not carry 2,000 crew.
Question 11 tries to get around the fact the USS Enterprise was due back in
harbour on 6 December and USS Lexington was near Midway, where it risked
being caught by the withdrawing IJN force. The timing of these missions
was a Pacific Fleet affair, nothing to do with Washington, which had set the
ferry missions, not the sailing dates. Bad weather stopped Enterprise from
making it back on 6 December then 7.30 am on 7 December. Oh yes if the
people in Washington were micro managing the Pacific fleet they would have
been aware the Enterprise left the battleships behind. Also Enterprise
tried
to find the IJN fleet, with probably bad consequences for Enterprise if it
did.
Question 12 is an insight into Mark's mind, a rather dark place.
Traffic continuing to decline Mark? Not surprising.
Geoffrey Sinclair
Remove the nb for email.
Veritas
> "Veritas" <pha...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1140375185.3...@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> > How much do you know about the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor >December
> > 7th, 1941?
"...everything that the Japanese were planning to do was known
to the United States..." ARMY BOARD, 1944
Syncliar says
>'A more full version of the quote,
>"Up to the morning of December 7, 1941, everything the Japanese were
>planning to do was known to the US"
>Mark drops the first phrase of the sentence in his advertising. The
>attack happened after the "Up until the morning of December 7, 1941".'
So? This is a perfect illustration that even small children reading
Syncliar's crap cannot miss the fact that they are infinitely smarter
than he is.
Then he injects a random quote that, if anything, damages his position
-
>Also, from the same report as the above quote. Page 297 of the Army Board:
>a. The attack on the Territory of Hawaii was a surprise to all
>concerned: the nation, the War Department, and the Hawaiian Department.
>It was daring, well-conceived and well-executed, and it caught the
>defending forces practically unprepared to meet it or to minimize its
>destructiveness."
There are two glaring omissions here - the Navy Department and the
White House.
The Army Board implies, by giving a comprehensive list of those
surprised, that
those unnamed two parties were not surprised.
But I will retaliate with another quote from the Top Secret Army Board
Report -
"Now let us turn to the fateful period between November 27 and December
6, 1941. In this period numerous pieces of information came to our
State, War, and Navy Departments in all of their Top ranks indicating
precisely the intentions of the Japanese including the probable exact
hour and date of the attack."
For those gentle readers who believe that Syncliar is just a
misinformed retard, let me note that he has posted repeatedly that the
"Navy Court" was not a court. And the Army Board was not a court.
He is Australian and has never done any original research on Pearl
Harbor but even so, for someone to claim to know something that is
plainly false on its face shows a certain psychosis or intent to lie
and misinform his readers. These were military courts and the military
has nothing else. These were the only investigations of 10 into the
Pearl Harbor attack that had rules of evidence and allowed Kimmel and
Short to introduce evidence on their own behalf and cross examine
witnesses.
> Take the free interactive test at
> http://wwx2.tripod.com/cgi-bin/pearlquiz.htm
>So we have question 1 with Harry Hopkins said to be a KGB agent. And of
.>course the idea the Japanese could have withdrawn from Southern Indo-
>China and thereby avoided the final set of sanctions is to be ignored.
Right, and they could have unconditionally surrendered to Bali to
prevent the war as well. In fact every Japanese could have drunk poison
Koolaid to avoid war. So? "Blah, Blah Blah" Syncliar has verbal
diarrhea spilling out the crap between his ears into newsgroups. He
really should not post. And certainly no one should read his posts.
That is time you will never get back.
> So we have question 2 telling us FDR did it.
More blah blah blah. Syncliar doesn't say anything.
>Question 3 is an attempt to say the IJN transmitted more information than
>they actually did. The strike force was under radio silence orders and
>there was no need to tell any other IJN ships where it was. As for reading
>the IJN code the answer is no, they allies had some of the dictionary and
>were working towards being able to read messages.
Just lies. It is surprising that he lies about the radio orders the
fleet sailed under - it was not radio silence - because they are
published. Syncliar is psychotic. The Congressional Report explicitly
says the US Navy read the IJN code (Exhibit 151). Syncliar is trying to
destroy his own credibility! What a loser!
>Question 4 is firstly advertising of the source, and puts the blame on FDR
>for the military not sending a final timely warning.
So I sourced it, so what? Sources are good, right? Isn't Syncliar the
exact same fool that is always clamoring for me to give sources because
he is ignorant and doesn't know anything? Ya, it was him.
>Question 5 is the usual attempt to portray Washington at fault for a
>decision
>taken in Hawaii, to not use anti torpedo nets in the harbour.
Mercifully there is no Syncliar content here.
>Question 6 is fun, Hawaii was not informed the Japanese had divided the
>harbor into 4 areas and were reporting on the ships in each area...
Then more blah, blah confirming the correct answer to the question. I
guess even Syncliar can't think of how to lie about this.
>Question 7 is easy, no. Since Washington, like Hawaii did not know where
>the main IJN carriers were.
This is just false, but let's say "What if Washington didn't
know" then why was Hawaii lied to? Syncliar's lie doesn't explain
the facts.
>Question 8 is quite simple, the Japanese did not think so, no doubt some
>lawyer can give a contradictory opinion.
In fact, the greatest lawyer in the US argued over and over that FDR
had already declared war on August 17th.
>Question 9 is simple, the US had to activate any treaty for it to go to war,
>not what the Dutch did.
Here again we see the abysmal state of Syncliar's brain. "US had to
activate"? The ADB agreement was "activate(d) (sic)" by the fact
that the Japanese crossed 100 East and 10 North. Syncliar seems to have
the mistaken idea that a party to a treaty gets to decide whether or
not to honor it. No, no, please!
>Question 10 is the usual, convoy escorts is apparently sacrificing ships.
>Question 11 tries to get around the fact the USS Enterprise was due back in
By the way, it was not "due back," it was due back whenever the
commander got around to it. There was no schedule. This is a complete
misunderstanding of the way the US Navy worked and works.
> The timing of these missions
>was a Pacific Fleet affair, nothing to do with Washington, which had set the
>ferry missions, not the sailing dates.
Washington made a direct order both by telegram and more importantly by
a telephone call from CNO Stark to Kimmel which gave Kimmel no choice -
the carriers were ordered to sail "as soon as practicable." That is
a direct quote of the order Kimmel received as he gave in unrefuted
sworn testimony. So Syncliar is wrong - Washington forced the
carriers out, taking care that they would leave before the attack .
Mark Willey
Pearl Harbor Mother of All Conspiracies
Geoffrey Sinclair
"I like the way Mark decides it was the most important event for America
in the 20th century. After all the Japanese attack on the Philippines would
have brought the US into the war."
"Veritas" <pha...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1140463653.8...@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> Geoffrey Sinclair wrote:
>> "Veritas" <pha...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:1140375185.3...@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>> > How much do you know about the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor
>> > >December
>> > 7th, 1941?
>
> "...everything that the Japanese were planning to do was known
> to the United States..." ARMY BOARD, 1944
>
> Syncliar says
>>'A more full version of the quote,
>>"Up to the morning of December 7, 1941, everything the Japanese were
>>planning to do was known to the US"
>
>>Mark drops the first phrase of the sentence in his advertising. The
>>attack happened after the "Up until the morning of December 7, 1941".'
>
> So? This is a perfect illustration that even small children reading
> Syncliar's crap cannot miss the fact that they are infinitely smarter
> than he is.
Mark goes to a lot of trouble to insult, including the obviously deliberate
mis spelling of people's names.
Mark needs to find a way of avoiding the fact he chooses a phrase at a
time when trying to write his fiction, rather than the whole story.
> Then he injects a random quote that, if anything, damages his position
Ah yes, Mark needs to try and ignore the way he avoids this part of
the report. It is from the same section he quotes from, so I suppose Mark
is using "random" quotes.
>>Also, from the same report as the above quote. Page 297 of the Army
>>Board:
>>a. The attack on the Territory of Hawaii was a surprise to all
>>concerned: the nation, the War Department, and the Hawaiian Department.
>>It was daring, well-conceived and well-executed, and it caught the
>>defending forces practically unprepared to meet it or to minimize its
>>destructiveness."
>
> There are two glaring omissions here - the Navy Department and the
> White House.
You see, the idea is the Army board has a definition of "the nation"
that excludes the Navy and the White house.
> The Army Board implies, by giving a comprehensive list of those
> surprised, that those unnamed two parties were not surprised.
So I gather that the Senate was not surprised, nor the Congress, nor the
Interior department and so on, given the above logic. For that matter
Mark's relatives living at the time knew, since they are not listed as
surprised.
Alternatively the board reports specifically names its areas, the War and
Hawaiian departments and classifies everything else as "the nation".
> But I will retaliate with another quote from the Top Secret Army Board
> Report -
http://www.ibiblio.org/pha/pha/army/tsreport.html
If you want to see it for yourself.
> "Now let us turn to the fateful period between November 27 and December
> 6, 1941. In this period numerous pieces of information came to our
> State, War, and Navy Departments in all of their Top ranks indicating
> precisely the intentions of the Japanese including the probable exact
> hour and date of the attack."
The "attack" being referred to is the opening of hostilities by Japan, not
the specific attack on Pearl Harbor. See things like the sources of the
intelligence, the destruction of codes, the information in the diplomatic
messages.
The section ends with the following,
"There, therefore, can be no question that between the dates of December
4 and December 6, the imminence of war on the following Saturday and
Sunday, December 6 and 7, was clear-cut and definite.
Up the morning of December 7, 1941, everything that the Japanese were
planning to do was known to the United States except the final message
instructing the Japanese Embassy to present the 14th part together with
the preceding 13 parts of the long message at one o'clock on December 7,
or the very hour and minute when bombs were falling on Pearl Harbor."
> For those gentle readers who believe that Syncliar is just a
> misinformed retard,
Mark likes to use push insults, no other options allowed, the idea
Mark is the fiction writer has to be ignored.
>let me note that he has posted repeatedly that the
> "Navy Court" was not a court. And the Army Board was not a court.
By the way Mark you can no doubt provide evidence about what I
said, as opposed to deciding I said it.
> He is Australian and has never done any original research on Pearl
> Harbor
By the way mark 25% of the residents of Australia are overseas born,
so what makes you think you know my nationality or what I have or
have not researched?
>but even so, for someone to claim to know something that is
> plainly false on its face shows a certain psychosis or intent to lie
> and misinform his readers.
In other words Mark is describing himself.
>These were military courts and the military
> has nothing else. These were the only investigations of 10 into the
> Pearl Harbor attack that had rules of evidence and allowed Kimmel and
> Short to introduce evidence on their own behalf and cross examine
> witnesses.
It seems Congressional investigations are supposed to have no rules of
evidence. The list,
1) Roberts Commission, 1941/42 found against Kimmel and Short
2) Hart Inquiry in 1944, mainly evidence collecting
3) Pearl Harbor Army Board in 1944, criticised Short, Marshall and Gerow.
4) Naval Court of Inquiry, exonerated Kimmel.
5) Clausen Investigation, 1944/45, mainly evidence gathering. (He wrote
a book on it and gives Kimmel and Short the highest rankings in the
contributors to the defeat list.)
6) Hewitt Inquiry, 1945, follow on to Naval court, Kimmel denied access,
no report published.
7) Clarke Investigation, 1944/45 investigation into claims of documents
being destroyed, found this not to be the case.
8) Joint Congressional Committee, 1945/46, Hawaiian commanders guilty
of errors of judgement, not dereliction of duty.
>> Take the free interactive test at
>> http://wwx2.tripod.com/cgi-bin/pearlquiz.htm
>
>>So we have question 1 with Harry Hopkins said to be a KGB agent. And of
> >course the idea the Japanese could have withdrawn from Southern Indo-
>>China and thereby avoided the final set of sanctions is to be ignored.
>
> Right, and they could have unconditionally surrendered to Bali to
> prevent the war as well. In fact every Japanese could have drunk poison
> Koolaid to avoid war. So? "Blah, Blah Blah" Syncliar has verbal
> diarrhea spilling out the crap between his ears into newsgroups. He
> really should not post. And certainly no one should read his posts.
> That is time you will never get back.
Mark needs to try and convince people to ignore anything that contradicts
his fiction, note Mark does nothing in the above but insult. No attempt to
actually note the Japanese had other options. Which the peace faction in
the Japanese government was exploring.
>> So we have question 2 telling us FDR did it.
>
> More blah blah blah. Syncliar doesn't say anything.
Mark deletes what I say, rather than reply, here it is again,
"And gives us a heavy hint
to try the saved communism line. Given what happened to the IJA when
it took on the Red Army, and the large garrison Stalin left in the east,
replacing units shipped west with new ones, the Japanese were much more
likely to occupy the more weakly protected and more developed countries
to the south. Especially as the Germans did not tell the Japanese they
were going to attack the USSR, there was no time to set up an attack and
in any case the Japanese treaty with the USSR in April 1941 helps show
the thinking of the Japanese when it came to the USSR."
>>Question 3 is an attempt to say the IJN transmitted more information than
>>they actually did. The strike force was under radio silence orders and
>>there was no need to tell any other IJN ships where it was. As for
>>reading
>>the IJN code the answer is no, they allies had some of the dictionary and
>>were working towards being able to read messages.
>
> Just lies. It is surprising that he lies about the radio orders the
> fleet sailed under - it was not radio silence - because they are
> published. Syncliar is psychotic. The Congressional Report explicitly
> says the US Navy read the IJN code (Exhibit 151). Syncliar is trying to
> destroy his own credibility! What a loser!
Mark simply needs to declare everyone else wrong. In this case he has a
new definition of radio silence, no transmissions under any circumstances.
As opposed to the orders which were stay silent unless discovered.
As for exhibit 151, that is Captain Safford's 1945 statement. This is not
the
Congressional report, this is evidence tendered to the investigation. but
Mark turns a witness statement into the report itself.
http://www.ibiblio.org/pha/pha/misc/x18-151.html
Check out paragraph 3,
"The "5-numeral" system yielded no information which would arouse even
a suspicion of the Pearl Harbor Raid, either before the attack or
afterwards."
Remarkable that Mark decides Safford is supposed to be right when he says
the US could read the code but wrong when he says it told them nothing.
Trouble is Safford is wrong about Com 16, the Philippines, as the people
present at the time made clear. The allies were building the dictionary and
compiling the lists of the random numbers the IJN used to disguise the
code groups, but they were not reading messages. Not unless you use the
definition of reading, "able to see the code groups", that is they had
removed
the cipher (random numbers) hiding the groups.
Safford was in the intelligence code breaking unit in Washington in December
1941 and was removed as part of the post attack changes.
>>Question 4 is firstly advertising of the source, and puts the blame on FDR
>>for the military not sending a final timely warning.
The rest of my text,
"By the way what is the
day and the date mean anyway? Oh yes, the US Army intelligence people
came out for November 30 1941 as the start of the war. The whole idea
about these predictions is to throw away the ones that do not fit and add
ones that do, true or otherwise."
> So I sourced it, so what? Sources are good, right?
The source came with advertising.
So tell us the date and time for FDR's claimed prediction, that is when he
made it.
>Isn't Syncliar the
> exact same fool that is always clamoring for me to give sources because
> he is ignorant and doesn't know anything? Ya, it was him.
As opposed to pointing out Mark's sources contradict what he says
they imply or say.
>>Question 5 is the usual attempt to portray Washington at fault for a
>>decision taken in Hawaii, to not use anti torpedo nets in the harbour.
>
> Mercifully there is no Syncliar content here.
In other words Mark knows the torpedo net decision was taken in
Hawaii.
>>Question 6 is fun, Hawaii was not informed the Japanese had divided the
>>harbor into 4 areas and were reporting on the ships in each area..
>
> Then more blah, blah confirming the correct answer to the question. I
> guess even Syncliar can't think of how to lie about this.
In other words Mark is trying to do the usual thing, insult and use
hindsight
to decide what people should have known.
The rest of the text,
"The
spy was of course in the Japanese consulate, that is a normal diplomat.
Using publicly available information. Later on the US tagged the message
setting up the system as the bomb plot because the harbour was bombed.
As opposed to say ships being sabotaged by Japanese agents or torpedoed
by midget submarines or simply a way to make the reports briefer and
therefore less expensive to send. In peacetime you defend your budget, in
wartime the country."
An addition, a bomb plot is the results of the attack, not some sort of
grid put on the target before the attack.
>>Question 7 is easy, no. Since Washington, like Hawaii did not know where
>>the main IJN carriers were.
>
> This is just false,
No it is accurate.
>but let's say "What if Washington didn't
> know" then why was Hawaii lied to? Syncliar's lie doesn't explain
> the facts.
Ah semantics time, Mark decides Washington knew therefore lies were
told, the trouble is the lies are coming from Mark.
>>Question 8 is quite simple, the Japanese did not think so, no doubt some
>>lawyer can give a contradictory opinion.
>
> In fact, the greatest lawyer in the US argued over and over that FDR
> had already declared war on August 17th.
I see a lack of names and actions here.
>>Question 9 is simple, the US had to activate any treaty for it to go to
>>war,
>>not what the Dutch did.
>
> Here again we see the abysmal state of Syncliar's brain. "US had to
> activate"? The ADB agreement was "activate(d) (sic)" by the fact
> that the Japanese crossed 100 East and 10 North. Syncliar seems to have
> the mistaken idea that a party to a treaty gets to decide whether or
> not to honor it. No, no, please!
Amazing, it seems Mark believes countries do have these automatic
actions, and the US hands over things as serious as the declaration of
war to a third power. In this case the Dutch government in exile or the
administration of its East Indies colony.
In researching the web I found one site claimed the trigger
point for the Dutch was the IJN crossing the line 100 east
10 north, which makes no sense, 100 East is the Thai part of
the Malay peninsula, 10 North means the exact point is in Thai
territorial waters. Saigon by the way is at about 10 north
105 to 106 East. So the claim is the trigger point is the Japanese
moving on Thailand?
>>Question 10 is the usual, convoy escorts is apparently sacrificing ships.
deleted text,
"By
the way the USS Texas peacetime crew was around 1,300, this increased to
around 1,500 during the war, it did not carry 2,000 crew."
>>Question 11 tries to get around the fact the USS Enterprise was due back
>>in
deleted text,
"harbour on 6 December and USS Lexington was near Midway, where it risked
being caught by the withdrawing IJN force. "
> By the way, it was not "due back," it was due back whenever the
> commander got around to it. There was no schedule. This is a complete
> misunderstanding of the way the US Navy worked and works.
You know one day Mark will look up the details for the Enterprise mission
to Wake and the signals sent about when it would arrive back in Hawaii.
Halsey did want to let Kimmell know when he would be back. Also
apparently according to Mark, Halsey could return when he decided
with no reference to say Kimmell.
>> The timing of these missions
>>was a Pacific Fleet affair, nothing to do with Washington, which had set
>> >>the ferry missions, not the sailing dates.
deleted text,
"Bad weather stopped Enterprise from
making it back on 6 December then 7.30 am on 7 December. Oh yes if the
people in Washington were micro managing the Pacific fleet they would have
been aware the Enterprise left the battleships behind. Also Enterprise
tried to find the IJN fleet, with probably bad consequences for Enterprise
if it
did."
> Washington made a direct order both by telegram and more importantly by
> a telephone call from CNO Stark to Kimmel which gave Kimmel no choice -
> the carriers were ordered to sail "as soon as practicable." That is
> a direct quote of the order Kimmel received as he gave in unrefuted
> sworn testimony. So Syncliar is wrong - Washington forced the
> carriers out, taking care that they would leave before the attack .
So now the idea is "as soon as practicable" is apparently a firm date.
Ignore
the urgent need to boost the defences of Wake and Midway. Ignore the
"as soon as practicable" meant waiting until the aircraft were ready to be
ferried and that Enterprise left harbour on 28 November, plenty of time to
be back by 7 December, Lexington departed on 5 December for Midway,
all it needed were a couple of days delay to be in harbour.
http://www.history.navy.mil/faqs/faq66-9.htm
Oh yes, look at
http://www.ibiblio.org/pha/pha/narrative/19.html
The opening paragraph,
"It will be recalled that on November 26th dispatches had been sent to
CincPac by the Chief of Naval Operations concerning the proposed
reinforcement of Mid趴ay and Wake with Army planes and personnel, and
requesting that Admiral Kimmel confer with General Short about this and
advise the Chief of Naval Operations as soon as practicable (supra, page
56)."
Note what is as "soon as practicable" and note how the plan was modified
by the decision to send Marine Corps air units.
By the way as of December 1941 the USN had just completed two new
battleships, had 8 under construction and another 7 on order. They also
had just completed 1 new carrier, and had 5 carriers under construction
(2 laid down on 1 December) and another 6 on order, which helps put into
perspective the USN thinking on carriers versus battleships. Also the
first
of the carriers under construction was not due to be completed until 1944.
Question 12 is an insight into Mark's mind, a rather dark place.
Traffic continuing to decline Mark? Not surprising.
It is hard to push a 60 year old conspiracy when there are ones 1 or 2
years old to take its place. Being a pioneer in the "its all a conspiracy"
club does not pay today's bills when there are newer events to go write
fiction about.
Must be hard Mark, being stuck with the legacy of carrying on your
fathers' hates. Trying to sell junk conspiracy claims to a generation
that thinks Gulf War I is ancient history, Vietnam over what the
politicians did when young, the target audience being more and more
made up of people who know you are pushing fiction, the devoted few
becoming fewer and realising how little value for money the conspiracy
is. Leaving only the "all Americans are the source of all evil" crowd to
sell to, instead of the preferred "some Americans are the source of all
evil" straw man your father bought into. The propagandists aiming at
the current generation are busy inventing their own conspiracy theories
for current day events, not those from 60 years ago, they sell better.
Try Larry Jewell's site, http://www.ibiblio.org/pha/ for the real
information.
By the way the surviving logs from the IJN task force sent to Pearl Harbor,
the 1942 IJN after action report and the post war evidence from the
surviving IJN officers all say the task force kept radio silence from before
leaving port in Japan until a results achieved signal after the attack.
The various conspiracy theories about the "US knew" rely on
interpretations of US documents, you know the conspirators were
so brilliant as to pull off the conspiracy but too stupid to stop
documents going into the archives or making sure the archives
were purged.
Oh yes, the radio intercepts ideas also have Yamamoto being
stupid enough to park his most secret task force in a port only
contactable by radio. The island actually had a telegraph line
for example, and the IJN set up a courier service. Also despite
the task force being given cover by a system of fake messages
back in Japan the conspiracy requires that it broke radio silence.
Veritas
Geoffrey Sinclair wrote:
> > "...everything that the Japanese were planning to do was known
> > to the United States..." ARMY BOARD, 1944
I am not going to waste anyone's time by responding point by point
because almost everyone can easily refute Syncliar's worthless points
if they are bored enough but I will remark on three newish items -
>By the way mark 25% of the residents of Australia are overseas born,
>so what makes you think you know my nationality or what I have or
>have not researched?
Your posts have shown that you are completely ignorant about the Pearl
Harbor attack. All you do is cut and paste from posts by others to
pretend you know something you don't. It is an expression of your
psychosis.
>It seems Congressional investigations are supposed to have no rules of
>evidence.
Geez!! This shows everyone what an idiot we are dealing with in
Syncliar. Of course there are no rules of evidence in Congressional
investigations - anyone that has even the slightest knowledge of them
knows that fundamental fact. Just get out, Syncliar - you are so
stupid! You totally waste people's time. BTW, "Syncliar" is the
perfect nickname for you since you lie all the time and your lies
aren't original, you cut and paste them from your homo buddies like
Larry W. "the fool" Jool. Thus the prefix "Sync" which is short
for "synchronize." You synchronize your lies with other losers,
posers, idiots and liars.
>Oh yes, the radio intercepts ideas also have Yamamoto being
>stupid enough to park his most secret task force in a port only
>contactable by radio. The island actually had a telegraph line
>for example, and the IJN set up a courier service. Also despite
>the task force being given cover by a system of fake messages
>back in Japan the conspiracy requires that it broke radio silence.
This is a neat example of how Syncliar doesn't know anything but also
manages to lie. He doesn't care what the truth is. He is not
embarrassed to make a total ass of himself. There are published
eyewitness accounts from sailors in the Kido Butai that describe
Hippatu Bay as it was in November 1941. There were no buildings. It was
a completely remote uninhabited place. There was nothing but rock and
water. Telegraphs require a cable and were very expensive for a poor
country like Japan. They couldn't afford to string incredibly long
cables to nowhere. And if Syncliar had bothered to check a map, he
would have noticed that there was no possibility that "IJN set up a
courier service." That was impossible because of the distances.
There were no fake messages, either. That false claim was
authoritatively destroyed by the investigations in the 1940s. What can
one do about a liar like Syncliar that just spews garbage? Ignore him.
He is a sick, sick puppy. The administrators of his institution should
take his computer privileges away from him. Crayons are all he is
qualified to play with.
Mark Willey
D. Patterson
Veritas wrote:
You have just demonstrated that you are a craven liar. Several years ago
I contacted the Japanese company responsible for Japan's telegraphic
communications before and during the Second World War. I asked them
whether or not there had ever been a submarine telegraphic cable
installed from Hokkaido Island to Etorufu Island? They responded by
saying a telegraphic cable was installed between those two islands long
before 1900. They and other sources have reported a governmental post
office was established on Etorufu Island in 1880, and the telegraphic
service connecting this post office to Tokyo was installed about the
same time. One of the principal purposes of this governmental post
office was to provide communications services to Japan's governmental
officers and armed services.
"In 1880, village offices were established on the islands of Shikotan,
Kunashiri and Etorofu under the new administrative system...Road
networks and post offices were established on Kunashiri and Etorofu.
Life on the islands became more stable when a regular sea route
connecting the islands with Hokkaido was opened and a telegraphic
service began."
[...]
"Each village had a district forestry office, a marine product
examination center, a salmon hatchery, a post office, a police station,
an elementary school and other facilities. In 1930, 8,300 people lived
on Kunashiri Island and 6,300 on Etorofu Island, and most of them were
engaged in fishing."
[...]
"The Hokkaido government established the Chishima Research Center in the
village of Shana on Etorofu in 1939. All the northern islands were
surveyed by 74 staff members of this station who collected basic data
for development. Because the northern islands were also of strategic
importance for national defense, military bases were gradually
established, and the development of the islands were promoted under the
tense military situation."
http://www.pref.hokkaido.jp/soumu/sm-hrtsk/hp-en/hist-en.htm
Furthermore, it was standard practice for officer couriers to deliver
top secret dispatches by hand, and this would have been done at
Hittokapu Bay at Etorufu Island, if not by telegraph, then by some
combination of air and/or sea transport. Seaplanes were often used to
transport couriers between commands.
In any case, your comments are bare faced lies. You wrote, "There were
no buildings. It was a completely remote uninhabited place. There was
nothing but rock and water." Etorufu Island was anything but what you
falsely claim was a "remote uninhabited place" and "nothing but rock and
water", having as it did the village of Shana, a district forestry
office, a marine product examination center, a salmon hatchery, a post
office, a police station, an elementary school and other facilities,"
and a population of more than the 6,300 people who lived there in 1930.
You are not only a liar...you are a very stupid liar for thinking such a
stupid lie would not be discovered in an instant.
If you had any personal integrity whatsoever, you would apologize to Mr.
Sinclair and the rest of us for your abusive remarks and for lying about
knowing Etorufu was "uninhabited." Of course, we're not going to hold
our breath while waiting for you to develop a conscience.
Veritas
> Veritas wrote:
> > Geoffrey Sinclair wrote:
> >>>"...everything that the Japanese were planning to do was known
> >>>to the United States..." ARMY BOARD, 1944
Patterson, you don't even know what the debate is about. In the 1946
Congressional Report, the Japanese Navy High Command, under oath and
threatened with certain death if they did not tell the truth, quoted
radio messages they sent to the Kido Butai from November 15 to December
7th. One of these radio messages was the order to sail that upset
Roosevelt so much when he got the translation on November 26th, so much
that it lead instantly to the Hull ultimatum and the Washington order
to get the carriers out of Pearl (and cost FDR his breakfast, as well!)
--
" (a) The task force, keeping its movements strictly secret and
maintaining close guard against submarines and aircraft, shall advance
into Hawaiian waters and upon the very opening of hostilities, shall
attack the main force of the United States Fleet in Hawaii and deal it
a mortal blow. The raid is planned for dawn on X-day -- exact date to
be given by later order. (b) Should the negotiations with the US prove
successful, the task force shall hold itself in readiness forthwith to
return and reassemble. (c) The task force will move out of Hitokappu
Wan on the morning of 26 November and advance to the standing-by
position on the afternoon of 4 December and speedily complete
refueling."
What Syncliar does - with no sources, no evidence whatever - is
baldly state these radio messages, which the Congressional Report
explicitly states were radio messages (and no one previously has ever
been so dishonest to dispute), were not sent by radio with his
retarded argument "Yamamoto would not have been so stupid."
Yamamoto believed the Japanese codes were secure. He wasn't stupid.
Radio was the only way to communicate with his fleet.
Syncliar did not even know the Congressional Report had 40 volumes,
until I informed him a couple years ago - he thought it only had one
volume. The fool! This is the level of his "expertise." This is the
kind of joker we are dealing with.
Now, as to your "contribution" Patterson, look up the phrase "non
sequitur" in the dictionary - I referred to Hippatu Wan and you were
babbling about something else - and then flog yourself with 20 lashes
for being so abysmally stupid. You might take geography lessons. It
would do you good.
Sincerely,
Mark Willey
Geoffrey Sinclair
> D. Patterson wrote:
>> Veritas wrote:
>> > Geoffrey Sinclair wrote:
>> >>>"...everything that the Japanese were planning to do was known
>> >>>to the United States..." ARMY BOARD, 1944
Ah yes, the continuous attempts by Mark to put Mark's abbreviated quote
into my mouth.
A more full version of the quote,
"Up to the morning of December 7, 1941, everything the Japanese were
planning to do was known to the US"
Mark drops the first phrase of the sentence in his advertising. The
attack happened after the "Up until the morning of December 7, 1941".
Also, from the same report as the above quote.
Page 297 of the Army Board:
"1. PEARL HARBOR ATTACK:
a. The attack on the Territory of Hawaii was a surprise to all
concerned: the nation, the War Department, and the Hawaiian Department.
It was daring, well-conceived and well-executed, and it caught the
defending forces practically unprepared to meet it or to minimize its
destructiveness."
Mark tries to claim "the nation" excludes the White House and USN.
> Patterson, you don't even know what the debate is about. In the 1946
> Congressional Report, the Japanese Navy High Command, under oath and
> threatened with certain death if they did not tell the truth, quoted
> radio messages they sent to the Kido Butai from November 15 to December
> 7th.
What Mark does here is turn the post war interrogations of Japanese
officers mainly by the United States Strategic Bombing Survey into an
under oath and threat of death evidence to the US Congress.
The interesting thing is the order to sail text comes from these
interrogations.
So it is incredibly important for the conspiracy theory Mark prefers to have
the message sent by radio. Hence the major reaction to the way there were
other methods.
By the way Akagi, with Admiral Nagumo left for the rendezvous point on
17 November, no need to radio him before then.
>One of these radio messages was the order to sail that upset Roosevelt so
> >much when he got the translation on November 26th, so much
> that it lead instantly to the Hull ultimatum and the Washington order
> to get the carriers out of Pearl (and cost FDR his breakfast, as well!)
You see it works like this, the order to sail was sent on 25 November 1941,
to the strike force anchored in Hitokappu bay. Mark announces FDR received
an intercept, decryption and translation in near real time. No evidence of
course.
The trouble is the intercept stations sent their intercepts in by mail, and
usually in a bundle and they were then dealt with according to the amount
of people available. The intercept stations were in places like the Pacific
Islands, Alaska and the US West Coast.
The Philippines had their own interception station and were the biggest
US group working on the IJN JN-25 code.
One of the more interesting things is the way the US used the
mail system to ship copies of intercepts back to the US and
Washington, it saved money and avoided the chance of the
Japanese cracking the code the copies of the signals were sent in.
This is the reality of the 1940's, transport and communication costs
were much higher.
http://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/PTO/Magic/COMINT-CoralSea/PartOne.html
"For some time, OP-20-G had used air mail for the transport of vital
cryptographic material. In early January 1942, OP-20-G initiated a
desperate attempt to speed up delivery of current cryptographic
recoveries to each center. Washington authorized each center to
send code and additive recoveries in radio messages on a special
"COPEK" channel that linked CAST to HYPO and Washington, and
that, by the end of March, included Melbourne. The organization
continued to use surface mail for the basic traffic."
> " (a) The task force, keeping its movements strictly secret and
> maintaining close guard against submarines and aircraft, shall advance
> into Hawaiian waters and upon the very opening of hostilities, shall
> attack the main force of the United States Fleet in Hawaii and deal it
> a mortal blow. The raid is planned for dawn on X-day -- exact date to
> be given by later order. (b) Should the negotiations with the US prove
> successful, the task force shall hold itself in readiness forthwith to
> return and reassemble. (c) The task force will move out of Hitokappu
> Wan on the morning of 26 November and advance to the standing-by
> position on the afternoon of 4 December and speedily complete
> refueling."
http://www.ibiblio.org/pha/pha/pt_12/x12-008.html#392
To see how it the above text is a reconstruction from information obtained
by US interrogations in Japan.
The Congressional Investigation quotes the above as the source of the
message text.
Mark claims these were done under oath and of pains of death.
By the way how can the congressional investigation have evidence under
oath with death penalties for those being interrogated as well, and no rules
of evidence? As Mark is claiming.
> What Syncliar does - with no sources, no evidence whatever - is
> baldly state these radio messages, which the Congressional Report
> explicitly states were radio messages (and no one previously has ever
> been so dishonest to dispute), were not sent by radio with his
> retarded argument "Yamamoto would not have been so stupid."
> Yamamoto believed the Japanese codes were secure. He wasn't stupid.
> Radio was the only way to communicate with his fleet.
You see Mark has a problem with the Congressional report, since it says
"On November 25 the commander in chief, combined fleet, issued
the following order to the striking force, which had, since November
22, been assembled at Hitokappu bay"
Mark is trying to tell us the order was radioed, the Congressional
report does not say that. But then all through this latest attempt
Mark has been putting words into the Congressional report.
You see Mark needs the order radioed and intercepted and decrypted
and translated and sent to FDR in near real time, nearly the same day in
effect.
The last thing Mark needs is the idea that Yamamoto used the existing
telegraph links to the islands or couriers for important documents.
You see the IJN had been drilled by the RN, and understood how important
it was to limit radio traffic, even if the enemy could not read the code
things
like direction finding and call signs (who was talking to who) could tell
an enemy plenty. So minimise the use of radio.
Yamamoto was not stupid, he made sure he could contact the force in
harbour without using radio.
> Syncliar did not even know the Congressional Report had 40 volumes,
> until I informed him a couple years ago - he thought it only had one
> volume. The fool! This is the level of his "expertise." This is the
> kind of joker we are dealing with.
In other words folks, when I pointed out the fact the quote Mark was
trying to use was not in the online version of the report I found Mark has
decided to announce this as invalidating anything I said.
> Now, as to your "contribution" Patterson, look up the phrase "non
> sequitur" in the dictionary - I referred to Hippatu Wan and you were
> babbling about something else - and then flog yourself with 20 lashes
> for being so abysmally stupid. You might take geography lessons. It
> would do you good.
Note by the way nothing Dallas wrote has managed to make this non reply,
Mark receives information about the telegraph links to the islands and then
deletes it, and spends all that time insulting me then Dallas.
Gives a good clue as to how accurate Mark's claims are, to repeat Dallas'
key point,
"Several years ago
I contacted the Japanese company responsible for Japan's telegraphic
communications before and during the Second World War. I asked them
whether or not there had ever been a submarine telegraphic cable
installed from Hokkaido Island to Etorufu Island? They responded by
saying a telegraphic cable was installed between those two islands long
before 1900. They and other sources have reported a governmental post
office was established on Etorufu Island in 1880, and the telegraphic
service connecting this post office to Tokyo was installed about the
same time. One of the principal purposes of this governmental post
office was to provide communications services to Japan's governmental
officers and armed services."
http://www.pref.hokkaido.jp/soumu/sm-hrtsk/hp-en/hist-en.htm
For further information on the islands.
Geoffrey Sinclair
question are deleted, Mark needs to remove the evidence in order to
editorialise his preferred fiction.
As usual when the evidence appears Mark has to hide it
Some deleted text, about the Pearl Harbor attack.
"I like the way Mark decides it was the most important event for America
in the 20th century. After all the Japanese attack on the Philippines would
have brought the US into the war."
"Veritas" <pha...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1140731684....@p10g2000cwp.googlegroups.com...
>
> Geoffrey Sinclair wrote:
Ah yes, Mark edits down things in order to try and claim I used the
following
quote.
>> > "...everything that the Japanese were planning to do was known
>> > to the United States..." ARMY BOARD, 1944
A more full version of the quote,
"Up to the morning of December 7, 1941, everything the Japanese were
planning to do was known to the US"
Mark drops the first phrase of the sentence in his advertising. The
attack happened after the "Up until the morning of December 7, 1941".
Also, from the same report as the above quote.
Page 297 of the Army Board:
"1. PEARL HARBOR ATTACK:
a. The attack on the Territory of Hawaii was a surprise to all
concerned: the nation, the War Department, and the Hawaiian Department.
It was daring, well-conceived and well-executed, and it caught the
defending forces practically unprepared to meet it or to minimize its
destructiveness."
Mark tries to claim "the nation" excludes the White House and USN.
> I am not going to waste anyone's time by responding point by point
> because almost everyone can easily refute Syncliar's worthless points
> if they are bored enough but I will remark on three newish items -
In other words Mark cannot refute the points, so now he simply
ignores them with insult cluster.
>>By the way mark 25% of the residents of Australia are overseas born,
>>so what makes you think you know my nationality or what I have or
>>have not researched?
>
> Your posts have shown that you are completely ignorant about the Pearl
> Harbor attack. All you do is cut and paste from posts by others to
> pretend you know something you don't. It is an expression of your
> psychosis.
In other words' folks Mark claims to know my nationality but when asked
how he knows the above insults are the reply.
This was his claim,
"He is Australian and has never done any original research on Pearl
Harbor"
This could not even make Mark's non reply.
The above was the response to how was he able to claim this.
As you can see it is the same response when his Pearl Harbor fiction
is challenged.
>>It seems Congressional investigations are supposed to have no rules of
>>evidence.
>
> Geez!! This shows everyone what an idiot we are dealing with in
> Syncliar. Of course there are no rules of evidence in Congressional
> investigations - anyone that has even the slightest knowledge of them
> knows that fundamental fact.
Amazing with all those lawyers present there are no rules of evidence.
>Just get out, Syncliar - you are so
> stupid! You totally waste people's time. BTW, "Syncliar" is the
> perfect nickname for you since you lie all the time and your lies
> aren't original, you cut and paste them from your homo buddies like
> Larry W. "the fool" Jool. Thus the prefix "Sync" which is short
> for "synchronize." You synchronize your lies with other losers,
> posers, idiots and liars.
In other words folks Mark cannot say someone is wrong he has to spend
a paragraph insulting them. In fact insulting others as well.
Instead of investing the time evaluating the evidence, he insults.
By the way look up what the slang term Willie means.
Oh yes, the truth tends to be repetitive, the fiction changes.
The various investigations,
1) Roberts Commission, 1941/42 found against Kimmel and Short
2) Hart Inquiry in 1944, mainly evidence collecting
3) Pearl Harbor Army Board in 1944, criticised Short, Marshall and Gerow.
4) Naval Court of Inquiry, exonerated Kimmel.
5) Clausen Investigation, 1944/45, mainly evidence gathering. (He wrote
a book on it and gives Kimmel and Short the highest rankings in the
contributors to the defeat list.)
6) Hewitt Inquiry, 1945, follow on to Naval court, Kimmel denied access,
no report published.
7) Clarke Investigation, 1944/45 investigation into claims of documents
being destroyed, found this not to be the case.
8) Joint Congressional Committee, 1945/46, Hawaiian commanders guilty
of errors of judgement, not dereliction of duty.
>>Oh yes, the radio intercepts ideas also have Yamamoto being
>>stupid enough to park his most secret task force in a port only
>>contactable by radio. The island actually had a telegraph line
>>for example, and the IJN set up a courier service. Also despite
>>the task force being given cover by a system of fake messages
>>back in Japan the conspiracy requires that it broke radio silence.
>
> This is a neat example of how Syncliar doesn't know anything but also
> manages to lie.
One dictionary definition of the word lie includes "intentional false
statement". Hard to be intentionally wrong when you are not supposed
to know about the information.
But then Mark needs his above sort of logic.
>He doesn't care what the truth is. He is not
> embarrassed to make a total ass of himself.
Mark really describes himself when he insults, he appears to be recycling
what has been said to him down the years.
>There are published
> eyewitness accounts from sailors in the Kido Butai that describe
> Hippatu Bay as it was in November 1941.
You note by the way Mark does not tell anyone what these accounts are,
who wrote them and when and so on.
By the way Hitokappu Bay was the place, on Etorofu Island.
>There were no buildings. It was
> a completely remote uninhabited place. There was nothing but rock and
> water.
Yes folks, Mark is trying to pretend in order to make his conspiracy work.
A published account, Walter Lord's Day of Infamy,
"Now they were all there - 32 ships incongruously packed into a desolate
harbor. Snow crowned the mountains that ringed the cold, grey bay. Three
lonely radio masts stood against the sky. Three small fisherman's huts and
one bare concrete pier were the only other traces of civilization."
Apparently this is nothing but rock and water.
Finally John Prados, in Combined Fleet Decoded has the
recollections of 10 year old Sakurai Kazuko, the postmaster's
daughter on seeing the ships in the bay apparently vanish.
The bay was in Etorofu island.
>Telegraphs require a cable and were very expensive for a poor
> country like Japan
You know a battlefleet is an expensive item, much more than telegraph
cables. Good communications were important, you know things like
the Russo-Japanese war and the confrontations with the USSR meant
the Japanese ensured the islands had communications, firstly telegraph
then radio and telephone.
Now for the island of Etorofu. Note most places in the area have two
names the Japanese and the Russian.
Anyway I have been going through the book The Kuril Islands
by John J Stephan, looking at his references.
He states the population of Etorofu was 5,742 in 1939.
Then comes the quote,
"With the co-operation of the local police, the Navy succeeded
in keeping Iturups's (Etorofu's) 5,000 inhabitants as much in the
dark as were the Americans. From 20 November to 8 December
the island's communications with the outside world ceased to
function. Post offices and telegraph stations were shut down. All
boats were confined to shore."
Reference:
Japan, Boeicho, Boei Kenshujo, Senshishitsu, ed., Hawaii sakusen,
(Tokyo 1967), pages 255 to 268. Note the letter o in Boeicho and Boei
appear in the text with a horizontal bar across the top, as does the u
in Kenshujo, like,
_ _
o u
Finally on the section describing when the Soviets occupy the
southern islands in 1945 they are recorded as cutting telegraph
and telephone cables
From,
www.pref.hokkaido.jp/soumu/sm-hrtsk/hp-en/hist-en.htm
"[20th century / to the end of World War II]
At the end of the Taisho era, towns and villages were organized in the
Northern Territories and village offices were established on each island.
The Habomai Islands were all part of the village of Habomai. The town
and village system was not adopted on islands north of Uruppu, which
were under direct control of the Nemuro subprefectural office of the
Hokkaido government.
Each village had a district forestry office, a marine product examination
center, a salmon hatchery, a post office, a police station, an elementary
school and other facilities. In 1930, 8,300 people lived on Kunashiri
Island and 6,300 on Etorofu Island, and most of them were engaged in
fishing.
Towns and villages in April 1923
Island District Village
Habomai Hanasaki Habomai
Shikotan Shikotan Shakotan
Kunashiri Kunashiri Tomari, Ruyobetsu
Etorofu Etorofu Rubetsu
Shana Shana
Shibetoro Shibetoro
* Uruppu, Shimushiru and Shumushu districts on the Chishima Islands
were under direct control of the Nemuro subprefectural office of the
Hokkaido government.
The Hokkaido government established the Chishima Research Center
in the village of Shana on Etorofu in 1939. All the northern islands were
surveyed by 74 staff members of this station who collected basic data
for development. Because the northern islands were also of strategic
importance for national defense, military bases were gradually
established, and the development of the islands were promoted under
the tense military situation."
Apparently the idea is for Mark to claim the IJN could not carry a
message from the relevant village post office to the bay or alternatively
could not courier the message to the area.
Simply put the bay was inhabited and so was the island and the
telegraph cables were laid along the island chain.
Seen the population density of the mid US when telegraph cables
were laid?
>They couldn't afford to string incredibly long
> cables to nowhere.
Apparently this means Mark does not believe the Japanese linked the
islands with telegraph links in the 19th century.
And the entire Island chain is around 700 miles long.
>And if Syncliar had bothered to check a map, he
> would have noticed that there was no possibility that "IJN set up a
> courier service."
Remarkable as it seems Mark does not seem to have even heard of
Japanese seaplanes and flying boats and their ability to fly couriers
if needed.
The actual bay the ships assembled in is around 150 miles north of the tip
of Hokkaido, the northern most Japanese island. Ten hours at 15 knots
if you need to use a ship.
>That was impossible because of the distances.
Mark seems to thing couriers always walked or swam, not took trains,
planes, automobiles or ships.
> There were no fake messages, either. That false claim was
> authoritatively destroyed by the investigations in the 1940s.
Yet again Mark announces his view without any evidence to support
it. To return to Walter Lord's book he mentions it, including Admiral
Kusaka rebuking a radio man for breaking radio silence only to learn
it was a fake message sent as part of the cover. Lord's book was first
published in 1957.
>What can
> one do about a liar like Syncliar that just spews garbage? Ignore him.
Mark needs anyone who knows the facts about his preferred conspiracy
to go away.
> He is a sick, sick puppy. The administrators of his institution should
> take his computer privileges away from him. Crayons are all he is
> qualified to play with.
You note by the way how Mark has no ability to give a point by point
reply but does have immense amounts of time for insults.
Some of the deleted text,