Medieval Music in Film
Brian
I am presently formulating an idea for a paper, in which I'd
originally intended to discuss the use of Medieval music in film.
After a scouring of the usual movie databases, academic databases, and
the newsgroups, I now find myself with a new question: *what*
Medieval music in film?
Other than a 10 second reference to John Dowland in "Ladyhawke," the
use of medieval music in movies seems nearly nonexistant.
There seems to be no practical way to search, so posting this
question, and hoping for some "word-of-mouth" information. Can anyone
point me to the use of medieval music in films, even vaguely
quasimedieval or pseudomedieval music in films, and/or any resources
regarding this topic?
Thank you very much, in advance,
Brian
(post or email to: [brian dot choc at umontana dot edu] -- replace the
dots with, well, dots... you get the idea)
Aruvqan
shrew, burton/taylor] had period music. iirc both hamlets, and most all
branaugh shakespears when they sing in the original, they sing in the
movie and iirc the tunes are the traditional ones.... um, the advocate
[lawyer defends a pig] ladyhawke uses themes based on period music, and
of course carl orffs carmina burana make the list as based loosley on
the [eriod carmina and have made it into lots of moies as the theme
'ruler of the world'
margali
Charlene Charette
"medieval". "Jouyssance vous donnerai" from Arbeau appears in "What's
Up Doc?" with Barbra Streisand and Ryan O'Neil. It's playing in the
background during the musicology convention.
--Perronnelle
--
PEDIATRIC REFLECTION
Many an infant that screams like a calliope
Could be soothed by a little attention to its diope.
--Ogden Nash, Hard Lines, 1931
--
email perronnelle at earthlink . net
Greg Lindahl
Brian <bc...@netscape.net> wrote:
>After a scouring of the usual movie databases, academic databases, and
>the newsgroups, I now find myself with a new question: *what*
>Medieval music in film?
Asking around is probably a good idea.
"Conan the Barbarian" actually has one medieval tune, the music when
they're slithering down the rope inside is one of the Cantigas de
Santa Maria. It's # 166.
-- Gregory Blount
Helen Pinto
around 1970. New York Pro Musica played large parts of the score, which was
comprised of a lot of early 16c. music interspersed with bits by Georges
Delerue, the soundtrack composer.
-Aidan
Erik A-U
find it in the archives.
The films who came up were (as far as I can remember):
- Perceval le Gallois, by Eric Rohmer (1979) - haven't seen it myself, but
supposedly contains lots of medieval music and musicians. The cast is listed
on imdb.com ( http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0078073/ ) and indeed shows many
musicians.
- Franco Zeffirelli's (or Mel Gibson's) Hamlet (1990) has a group (the Dufay
Collective?) playing one of the Ductias at a banquet.
- The BBC miniseries Ivanhoe (1997) has a few scenes showing musicians or
minstrels.
- There is some piping (naturally) in Braveheart, hardly "medieval",
though - onscreen we see a Highland pipe but the sound is from the
19th-century Uilleann pipe...
- I think there are some musicians somewhere in Charlton Heston's old matiné
El Cid. The score by Miklós Rózsa uses numerous Cantigas, though in a 1960's
movie-orchestra setting.
- I'm quite certain that Ladyhawke also sports a Saltarello (somtimes called
Trotto) played on recorder and lute. It is heard from inside a tavern and
the characters of Broderick and Pfeiffer dance to it.
Good luck
Erik Ask-Upmark
"Brian" <bc...@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:591f583d.03100...@posting.google.com...
Rob
> the [eriod carmina and have made it into lots of moies as the theme
The lyrics/ideas behind the music are based on the texts from Carmina
Burana. But the actual music has absolutely no relation at all to the
music from the original text nor mediaeval music in general. No
mediaeval music I'm aware involves two pianists banging away
fortissimo on two grand pianos and choir a couple hundred strong.
There was a version of Carmina Burana done by Phillip Picket which
actually researched the music from the text and attempted to create an
authentic version of the songs.
Rob
E. C. Lee
I remember Eric Rohmer's "Perceval" used Medieval music. In the scene
where Perceval was saying goodbye to him mother, Richard the Lion
Hearted's "Prisoner's Song" was the background. It stuck out in my
mind because even though it worked period wise the context of the song
was inappropriate. There may well have been other songs used, but that
was the only one that stuck in my mind.
Eve
Todd Michel McComb
Rob <rk...@travel-net.com> wrote:
>There was a version of Carmina Burana done by Phillip Picket which
>actually researched the music from the text and attempted to create
>an authentic version of the songs.
There have been many, many recordings using the music from the
medieval manuscript. Pickett did a multi-volume set, as did Rene
Clemencic.
Todd McComb
mcc...@medieval.org
Edgar De Blieck
Do you know there is a group dedicated to early music? They may help too.
)- rec.music.early -(
EDEB.
Aruvqan
version and a couple discs of actualy carmina burana. [i adore sic mea
fata...and will sing it repeatedly in the shower to the horror of hubby
and cats=)]
aru
Anthony J. Bryant
> Other than a 10 second reference to John Dowland in "Ladyhawke," the
> use of medieval music in movies seems nearly nonexistant.
>
Check out Rohmer's "Parsifal." <G>
Effingham
Anthony J. Bryant
> There was a similar thread a while back on rec.music.early, maybe you can
> find it in the archives.
> The films who came up were (as far as I can remember):
> - Perceval le Gallois, by Eric Rohmer (1979) - haven't seen it myself, but
> supposedly contains lots of medieval music and musicians. The cast is listed
> on imdb.com ( http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0078073/ ) and indeed shows many
> musicians.
Oh, my God, man! You've not seen this yet? Every SCA person or medieval junkie
should be required to watch it. I ordered the DVD when I heard it was available,
and I think I watch it twice or three times a month. It's truly a unique film.
Absolutely incredible.
Effingham
>
Anthony J. Bryant
> There was a version of Carmina Burana done by Phillip Picket which
> actually researched the music from the text and attempted to create an
> authentic version of the songs.
Yeah, but it doesn't get used in making movie trailers or battle scenes. <G>
Effingham
Anthony J. Bryant
> I remember Eric Rohmer's "Perceval" used Medieval music. In the scene
> where Perceval was saying goodbye to him mother, Richard the Lion
> Hearted's "Prisoner's Song" was the background. It stuck out in my
> mind because even though it worked period wise the context of the song
> was inappropriate. There may well have been other songs used, but that
> was the only one that stuck in my mind.
You need to see it again. *All* the music was from the 12th and 13th century, as
virtually the whole thing was sung by an odd assortment of chorusfolk, and only
some of the lines were spoken by the actors.
Effingham
E. C. Lee
Unfortunately seeing it again would be difficult as I had to
interlibrary loan it the first time! But I'm glad to hear that. We
need MORE Medieval music in our movies! ;-)
Eve
katriana
After spending his first night in the woods, Robin whistles (part
of) "Sumer is Incumen In".
katriana
Anthony J. Bryant
> Mm, the chanty thing in Star Wars 1, Phantom of the Menace, was a real
> old chanty-thing from... well, some country. The song that plays
> during the bigfight scene... Duel of Fates, that's what it's called.
> I'm not sure if that's what you're after though, or anything else--
> I'm still not quite awake.
Um... Unless I'm badly mistaken (based on an interview with John Williams), that
"chanty" thing is random Sanskrit syllables chosen for their sound.
Effingham
Jouni Filip Maho
>
[snip]
>
Don't some of P. P. Pasolini's movies contain period music? Not sure how
many of them would be set in medieval times, though.
---
jouni maho
Peter Jason
that go on for hours, together with exciting pictures of hooded monks
singing them, all without the encumbrances of noisy strings, woodwinds and
brass etc. Heady stuff! Especially for those enlightened few snogging and
snorting illicit substances.
"Jouni Filip Maho" <jouni...@african.RE.gu.MO.se.VE> wrote in message
news:3F88903D...@african.RE.gu.MO.se.VE...
David B. Appleton
whistling at the beginning of "Jabberwocky".
Da'ud Bob ibn Briggs
Historical Drive-In Movie Critic
of the Barony of the Steppes
Barbara Nostrand
Greetings from Solveig! Is New York Pro Musica still around? I attended
one of their concerts when I was an undergraduate.
Your Humble Servant
Solveig Throndardottir
Amateur Scholar
Mike Andrews
> Noble Cousins!
> Greetings from Solveig! Is New York Pro Musica still around? I attended
> one of their concerts when I was an undergraduate.
From <http://www.bartleby.com/65/ne/NewYorkPM.html>:
: (New York Pro Musica Antiqua), vocal and instrumental
: ensemble, founded in New York City in 1952 by Noah
: Greenberg. One of the earliest groups to attempt
: historically correct performances of early music, it
: specialized in compositions of the era 1200 to 1700
: and researched and reconstructed much of the music it
: performed. Instruments such as the sackbut, shawm,
: crumhorn, zinke, viola da gamba, and portative organ
: were also restored or constructed. The ensemble was
: famous for its annual production of the Play of Daniel,
: a medieval music drama. The group disbanded in 1974.
I was privileged to attend one of their performances, in 1973 or
thereabouts. It was ... instrumental[1] in causing me to form a
consort of my own, and to put a weekly early-music radio program
on the air a few years later. The consort is in its 20th year and
going strong: they played at my wedding this past April; the radio
show ran from 1977 to 1986, and I still get asked about it.
[1] Sorry; no pun intended. Really!
--
Mike Andrews / Michael Fenwick Barony of Namron, Ansteorra
mi...@mikea.ath.cx
Tired old music Laurel
Susan C. Mitchell
Would I be killed if I mentioned Disney's version of _Hunchback of
Notre Dame_?
<relurks and flees>
Think globally, act locally.
Susan
--
=============== Remove what you find annoying in my address ==============
"Gadfly is what they call you when you are no longer | Seditious libel
dangerous. I much prefer troublemaker, malcontent, | for fun and
desperado." -- Harlan Ellison | profit
Greg Lindahl
E. C. Lee <afro...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>Unfortunately seeing it again would be difficult as I had to
>interlibrary loan it the first time! But I'm glad to hear that. We
>need MORE Medieval music in our movies! ;-)
The DVD, issued in 2000, is being remaindered -- look at half.com
under "Perceval", $2.90 plus shipping.
-- Gregory
Martha
> Can anyone point me to the use of medieval music in films, even vaguely
> quasimedieval or pseudomedieval music in films, and/or any resources
> regarding this topic?
I just saw Luther last night, and it includes a fair bit of
late-medieval church music and Reformation-era hymns. (Well, not
nearly enough of the latter, in my opinion, but that's probably
because Luther doesn't get around to starting the Lutheran church
until, oh, the last 20 minutes of the movie.)
I also have to recommend the movie for the costuming. Yum. :)
--
Martha
(don't google to email)
OldWilmington
"Martha" <mpalota...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:a68e0a77.03101...@posting.google.com...
> bc...@netscape.net (Brian) wrote ...
> > Can anyone point me to the use of medieval music in films, even vaguely
> > quasimedieval or pseudomedieval music in films, and/or any resources
> > regarding this topic?
>
> I just saw Luther last night, and it includes a fair bit of
> late-medieval church music and Reformation-era hymns. (Well, not
> nearly enough of the latter, in my opinion, but that's probably
> because Luther doesn't get around to starting the Lutheran church
> until, oh, the last 20 minutes of the movie.)
>
I had to chuckle at the scene where Luther, shown throughout the flick as
his well-known overly-scrupulous Augustinian self, is serenaded by his
wife-to-be, the ex-nun. In stark contrast to the grim seriousness of the
rest of the movie, this episode led me to wonder if the film's creators felt
that young romantic lead Joseph Fiennes' attractions would have been
otherwise wasted. ;->
I've been recommending this movie, although I understand a good bit of
historical inaccuracy has been allowed.
D. Lewandowski Guerra
David B. Appleton
> I had to chuckle at the scene where Luther, shown throughout the flick as
> his well-known overly-scrupulous Augustinian self, is serenaded by his
> wife-to-be, the ex-nun. In stark contrast to the grim seriousness of the
> rest of the movie, this episode led me to wonder if the film's creators felt
> that young romantic lead Joseph Fiennes' attractions would have been
> otherwise wasted. ;->
It's a shame that so much of the movie can be desribed as "grim
seriousness"; Luther himself seems to have had a sense of humor. In
an episode described by Bainton in "Here I Stand: A Life of Martin
Luther" (a book I _highly_ recommend to anyone interested in Luther's
life), and which I am likely to describe at least partially
incorrectly since I'm at work and away from my books right now, Luther
was sitting in the kitchen with some of his students discussing
theology, while his children were acting, well, like children. He
turned to his students, and said something close to: "The Savior tells
us that to enter the kingdom heaven, we must become as little
children. Dear Lord, this is too much. Have we got to become such
idiots?"
Da'ud
Martha
> historical inaccuracy has been allowed.
Actually, considering that it's a movie, it actually got the gist of
things correct. The biggest inaccuracy is probably the casting of
Fiennes; the real Martin Luther was kind of short and dumpy. The guy
who plays his father would have been a more accurate casting choice,
appearance-wise anyway.
Other fudging that I noticed was the compression of the various
peasant and knightly revolts into one event, adding a personal
interview/conversation between Luther and Frederick which -as far as
we know- never happened, and of course greatly simplifying the
theology and Luther's teachings (and leaving out the unpleasant
parts).
The costuming was certainly accurate enough for me. :)
Michael Grossberg
"David B. Appleton" <davidap...@cs.com> wrote in message
news:2c3977fe.03101...@posting.google.com...
>>That's not neccessarily having a sense of humor; that's just being a
parent.
>As the father of two boys myself, I can definitly understand why he would
>say that.
Gart(h) Guntarson
>
> Da'ud
Brian
someone else will find use if they should search this thread, I should
mention a short segment of Hildegard von Bingen in "A Beautiful Mind."
Brian
bc...@netscape.net (Brian) wrote in message news:<591f583d.03100...@posting.google.com>...
> Greetings, All,
>
> I am presently formulating an idea for a paper, in which I'd
> originally intended to discuss the use of Medieval music in film.
> After a scouring of the usual movie databases, academic databases, and
> the newsgroups, I now find myself with a new question: *what*
> Medieval music in film?
>
> Other than a 10 second reference to John Dowland in "Ladyhawke," the
> use of medieval music in movies seems nearly nonexistant.
>
> There seems to be no practical way to search, so posting this
> question, and hoping for some "word-of-mouth" information. Can anyone
> point me to the use of medieval music in films, even vaguely
> quasimedieval or pseudomedieval music in films, and/or any resources
> regarding this topic?
>
Queztionz
here's a great link to a very bare bones site that lists medieval
music and has the music files that you can download.
http://www.kirkwood.cc.ia.us/faculty/ryost/stereographs/music/
I hope this helps you...
Nancy
bc...@netscape.net (Brian) wrote in message news:<591f583d.0310...@posting.google.com>...
Greg Lindahl
> >Unfortunately seeing it again would be difficult as I had to
> >interlibrary loan it the first time! But I'm glad to hear that. We
> >need MORE Medieval music in our movies! ;-)
>
> The DVD, issued in 2000, is being remaindered -- look at half.com
> under "Perceval", $2.90 plus shipping.
I finally watched my copy of this -- it's a very strange movie, which
seems to have resulted from a high-speed collision among an early
music ensemble (consisting mostly of women with long hair), a medieval
epic, french cinematography, and a surrealist stage set artist. Well
worth the price -- it's still getting remaindered for US$7.79 at
half.com.
-- Gregory