Thiering pesher overrides surface text and drastically changes context - Feeding of the Multitude Miracle
crunch
so that the reader may understand how Thiering
pesher works. After that comes testing for the
validity of it.
I propose an interactive process with usenet
readers wherein I answer questions as they
arise. Hopefully, the explanations will be
conveyed step-by-step and the reader will not
think Dr. Thiering's methodology bizarre.
-----
Jesus the Man: Decoding the Real Story of Jesus and Mary Magdalene
By Barbara Thiering - page 332
Extract -
Appendix III - Hierarchy
On the surface, the gospels and Acts appear to deal with unlimited
numbers of people and many different individuals. Jesus teaches
"many", or
"crowds", or "a multitude". There are individuals without clear
delineation,
and individuals called by a feature but not named: a leper, a blind
man,
a lame man. Leaders appear in groups: "the chief priests", "the
scribes".
The reader is left with a feeling that the identity of individuals
other than
Jesus is of little importance to the history, and that curiosity about
them cannot
be satisfied.
By the application of the pesher technique that has been described,
however, a very definite set of individuals emerges, and of a limited
number.
Jesus was interacting, in the wilderness centres, with individual men
who
had come to the quarterly councils as representatives of numbers of
other
people. Some were treated as if the whole group they represented
were
present. "The chief priests" (hoi archiereis) were incorporated in
one man, the head of a group of twelve, and he alone is meant when the
the term
is used. Similarly "the scribes" (hoi grammateris), and "the
Pharisees"
(hoi Pharisaioi) refer to one man each.
"The Many", and "the crowds" were one man only, an important figure
who represented a very large class. When Jesus was teaching "the
crowds",
he was instucting one person, who would pass on what he had learned
to
the whole class.
-----
Devices of the Text
http://www.pesherofchrist.infinitesoulutions.com/index_Devices_of_the_text.html
Extract -
Plural of representation
The narrative frequently uses plurals that would normally mean a
number of unspecified persons, eg "scribes", "Pharisees", "Jews",
"disciples", "apostles". These mean specific persons in the singular,
the single head of a group or party. He represented his party, so
could be spoken of in the plural in his function as leader. "Scribes"
means the Chief Scribe, who in the gospel period was Judas Iscariot,
and after his death his successor. "Pharisees" was the Chief Pharisee,
who in the gospel period was Caiaphas the high priest. "Jews" means
Antipas Herod, a Herod who had adopted all aspects of orthodox Judaism
including ordinary marriage. His position in the system was later
taken by other Herods with the same definition.
"Disciples" means the Chief Disciple, a Gentile. There were two main
Gentiles to whom this term applies, John Mark and James Niceta, one of
the "sons of Zebedee." At the schism of the post-crucifixion period
James Niceta replaced John Mark as the Chief Gentile. In the gospels,
the two are distinguished by the addition of "his" to John Mark, its
omission with James Niceta. Thus "his disciples", with "his" referring
to Jesus, is John Mark, and "the disciples" means James Niceta. (James
Niceta and John Aquila were two Gentiles, called "sons of Zebedee " in
the gospels, whose history is given in the Clementine Homilies
2:19-31, a major source.)
This device is applied even to adjectives. As has been seen in Special
Meanings, the adjective "all", pas in Greek, refers to a royal Herod.
When it is used in the plural, pantes, it means a representative of
the Herods. In the gospel period this was Antipas Herod, who had been
the only Herod left in the country after the abolition of the
monarchy. The word is subsequently used of his successors.
-----
FEEDING OF THE MULTITUDE. A SUCCESSFUL PICNIC?
http://www.pesherofchrist.infinitesoulutions.com/index_Summary.html
Extract -
There were not 5000 men present, only one man, the head of the whole
sub-division of the 12000 Gentiles who - on the model of the
Pythagorean right-angled triangle - were divided 3 (3000), 4 (4000)
and 5 (5000). The 5000 were the lowest grade, equal to married men who
had meetings every month, 12 times a year, under 12 leaders, the
"baskets". The 4000 were a higher grade, holding meetings every day of
the week, so used 7 loaves, their leaders forming 7 "baskets". The
3000 appear in Acts 2:41, under a different kind of leadership
appearing only once a year; these did not continue in the system in
this form.
-----
David Christainsen
crunch
> On 2009-11-10, crunch <pchristain...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > My purpose on usenet is to lay down a foundation
> > so that the reader may understand how Thiering
> > pesher works.
>
You fail to get into the material and so make
an ignorant remark.
> > After that comes testing for the
> > validity of it.
>
> This is pointless. If it's not valid, no one cares how it works.
You fail to understand scientific/scholarly method.
> > I propose an interactive process with usenet
> > readers wherein I answer questions as they
> > arise.
>
> I've asked you questions. You haven't answered them.
You did not ask on Thiering pesher and that is mainly what counts
in this thread. Further, your questions, such as they
were, did not relate to Christian Origins per se or to
quaker issues as I lived them over 28 years.
> This suggests that the interactive process won't work, because when I
> ask you questions, you refuse to answer them. You asked me to propose
> a topic related to Quakerism to discuss. I did, and you refused to
> discuss it, but demanded that I put out more material. I did, and you
> still haven't discussed it.
If you believe this, you are no teacher (interactive process).
I was a teacher. Further, I will not discuss your questions, which
are
misframed.
> I do not trust you. I will perhaps begin to trust you if and when I see
> you answer the questions I have already asked.
You damaged your usenet relationship with me and I
don't see how it can be repaired.
> Most importantly: You have never given me a solid answer as to why I should
> care *whether* the Thiering pesher works, let alone *how* it works.
I told you point-blank that whether or not the HISTORY
in detail re: Christian Origin is something you care
about is entirely up to you. I NEVER said Thiering
pesher is spiritually uplifting. However, Thiering pesher
allowed me to find out who the real Jesus Christ really
was. I NEVER promised you a rose garden; Thiering
pesher is a very demanding discipline.
As for how it works, the relevant sections are on
the official Thiering website. I might go into it
more if SRQers ask me questions.
> I wish to love my neighbor. How will the Thiering pesher help me do this?
>...
Hillel said it first before Jesus Christ.
David Christainsen
Matt Giwer
> I told you point-blank that whether or not the HISTORY in detail re:
> Christian Origin is something you care about is entirely up to you. I
> NEVER said Thiering pesher is spiritually uplifting. However, Thiering
> pesher allowed me to find out who the real Jesus Christ really was. I
> NEVER promised you a rose garden; Thiering pesher is a very demanding
> discipline.
So is Scientology but that does not save the fools from their folly.
--
When one says a thing is 'no worse than' he is also saying it is
no better than.
-- The Iron Webmaster, 4197
http://www.giwersworld.org/holo3/ a12
Tue Nov 10 21:14:18 EST 2009
Sir David
> I propose an interactive process with usenet
> readers wherein I answer questions as they
> arise.
But you won't answer them. There are already several dozen questions
awaiting your answers, but you can't answer any of them. You have
shamelessly boasted that you never had any intention of answering them
(effectively admitting that you are a liar). You've also whined and
whimpered about questions not being polite enough, or well-informed
enough, or properly framed, et lame-Crunchy-exuse cetera. You never
answer simple questions. Even after promising to do so. Even after
begging for the questions to be asked. You've dodged at least six
questions in the last two days, using the flimsiest of excuses. So no,
you will not answer questions as they arise. You have proven this
yourself.
You never engage in discussion or dialogue, just your incessant
monologue and your links and quotes. Ride, Crunchy, ride, upon your
hobbyhorse!
Hopefully, the explanations will be
> conveyed step-by-step and the reader will not
> think Dr. Thiering's methodology bizarre.
>
> -----
>
> Jesus the Man: Decoding the Real Story of Jesus and Mary Magdalene
> By Barbara Thiering - page 332
>
> http://books.google.com/books?id=WBZNU3lZZPIC&printsec=frontcover&dq=...
> Devices of the Texthttp://www.pesherofchrist.infinitesoulutions.com/index_Devices_of_the...
> FEEDING OF THE MULTITUDE. A SUCCESSFUL PICNIC?http://www.pesherofchrist.infinitesoulutions.com/index_Summary.html
Matt Giwer
> On Nov 10, 1:13�pm, crunch <pchristain...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> I propose an interactive process with usenet readers wherein I answer
>> questions as they arise. �
> But you won't answer them. There are already several dozen questions
> awaiting your answers, but you can't answer any of them. You have
> shamelessly boasted that you never had any intention of answering them
> (effectively admitting that you are a liar). You've also whined and
> whimpered about questions not being polite enough, or well-informed
> enough, or properly framed, et lame-Crunchy-exuse cetera. You never answer
> simple questions. Even after promising to do so. Even after begging for
> the questions to be asked. You've dodged at least six questions in the
> last two days, using the flimsiest of excuses. So no, you will not answer
> questions as they arise. You have proven this yourself.
> You never engage in discussion or dialogue, just your incessant monologue
> and your links and quotes. Ride, Crunchy, ride, upon your hobbyhorse!
Unfortunately there is no way to get the putz to suicide honorably.
--
Government is a necessary evil. Religion is an unnecessary evil.
-- The Iron Webmaster, 4187
http://www.giwersworld.org/environment/aehb.phtml a2
Wed Nov 11 18:03:18 EST 2009
jerry warner
Matt Giwer
> has your pesher got you in trouble? Get medical advice!
Is that the pesher with the pestle or kthe potion with the lotion?
--
Holocaust denial is not as bad as the Goldstone Report on Gaza.
Michael Oren, Israeli Ambassador to the US, September 2009
-- The Iron Webmaster, 4195
http://www.giwersworld.org/holo3/ a12
Sat Nov 21 09:55:54 EST 2009