RE: CARIBBEAN Digest, Vol 2, Issue 166‎

[Ann Q]

Lisa, It was not only girls, it was male and female, that were dumped on the island, some may have been hired as servants:, housekeepers, nannies, parlor maids, ect. but consider, just how many maids, nannies, parlor maids were really needed. Those types of jobs cost money, why pay when you had slaves to do it for free. However, more hands in the field, meant more profit. You also mentioned Native Americans, where exactly were those "Native Americans'?By the 1600's there were few, if any, indigenous people of the Caribbeans in the islands. St. Vincent, today, I believe is the only island that has descendents of the indigenous people.A 19 century slave register, or deed listing the name of a person, could have been a name that was given in the islands, as compared to a name of a newly arrived African. Names may have been passed down in families. A name popular on one island could move to another if the slave or slaveholder moved from one island to another, as in the case o!
f wars and capture of the Island.Example, my mother had a Dutch name, but lived on a Danish Island, her mother's family came from a Dutch holding.Because at the time period you are looking at, it might difficult to pin point when that person arrived in the Caribbean, if at all, they may have been third or fourth generation. It was also the time of 'seasoning' of slaves for resale to the US, and many slaves from Africe, were only in the Caribbean for a short time to be resold on the mainland.
A good source of information is: From Columbus to Castro, by Eric Williams.Ann"Sharing the information." Researching the USVI, St.Eustatius, St. Barths, Barbados

[Nevilla E Ottley]

I don't know where you got your information about the native Americans, and
who you are referring to. I would think you were speaking of the Caribs and
the Arawaks. If you are, there is information to be found online at

http://home.messiah.edu/~tstoudno/cunit-a3.htm

See especially No. 4.

And I quote:

1. The Pre-Columbus Amerindians

Adapted from: Ecommusee de Martinique (Guidebook), Riviere-Pilote,
Martinique---(1992)

1. 4,000 BC-Pre-Ceramist nomadic groups migrated from Venezuela to the
Antilles:

* Ciboney peoples were remnants of these nomadic groups
* daily life and economy centered around fishing and gathering
* lived in camps, scanty shelters, caves and rocky overhangs
* did not farm & were not familiar with pottery or ceramics

2. Just before the Christian Era, Arawak farmers moved up through the
islands:

* from Bolivia, Peru, Brazil then via the Orinoco Basin of Venezuela
* a very peaceful people
* introduced sedentary agriculture in the islands
* remarkable potters and excellent basket weavers
* a religious culture centered around complex relations with nature, ex.
birds, etc.
* lived in large round huts, housing clans of up to 50 people

3. 1200-1300AD-The Lesser Antilles were invaded by the warrior Caribs:

* originated in the Amazon Basin of South America
* pushed the Arawaks further north in the islands, while:
* capturing prisoners destined for domestic chores and cannibalistic
rites
* enslaving the women "slave wives"
* developing a social system built around gender lines

Women

* played a subordinate role in their society
* handled all the domestic chores, pottery & ceramics, & raised the
children

Men:

* warriors
* making weapons for war, hunting, fishing, & trapping
* usually did the basket-weaving
* typical village contained:
* 30-100 members of several generations
* Carbet(Men's Houses) the central building -100-120 hammocks inside
less important buildings surrounded the Carbet, wives & families lived here

4. At the time of the Spanish arrival:

* there were approximately 3-4 million Indians living in the Caribbean
* the general settlement patterns were:
* Greater Antilles & Bahamas -inhabited by the Arawaks
* Lesser Antilles-inhabited by the Caribs

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To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to
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[mreil...@aol.com]

There were and still are native Indian populations on Dominica and Trinidad as well as St. Vincent, but it's true there were few Caribbean Indians to be enslaved by the 1600s, and Barbados was already depopulated when it was first settled by Europeans.  European diseases spread rapidly through the islands from the time of Columbus and many Indians were wiped out w/o ever seeing a white person.  However Indians from North America and South America were sometimes shipped to the West Indies as slaves.  My gggrandmother was born on a sugar cane plantation on Bequia, the daughter of a slave, about 1835.  I have photos of her, and her facial features are obviously Indian but I haven't been able to determine where from.

-----Original Message-----
From: Nevilla E Ottley <clas...@erols.com>
To: cari...@rootsweb.com; 'CARIB...@rootsweb.com' <carib...@rootsweb.com>
Sent: Thu, 12 Jul 2007 9:05 am
Subject: RE: CARIBBEAN Digest, Vol 2, Issue 166‎

I don't know where you got your information about the native Americans, and

ho you are referring to. I would think you were speaking of the Caribs and

he Arawaks. If you are, there is information to be found online at
http://home.messiah.edu/~tstoudno/cunit-a3.htm
See especially No. 4.
And I quote:
1. The Pre-Columbus Amerindians
Adapted from: Ecommusee de Martinique (Guidebook), Riviere-Pilote,

artinique---(1992)
1. 4,000 BC-Pre-Ceramist nomadic groups migrated from Venezuela to the

ntilles:
* Ciboney peoples were remnants of these nomadic groups
* daily life and economy centered around fishing and gathering
* lived in camps, scanty shelters, caves and rocky overhangs
* did not farm & were not familiar with pottery or ceramics
2. Just before the Christian Era, Arawak farmers moved up through the

slands:
* from Bolivia, Peru, Brazil then via the Orinoco Basin of Venezuela
* a very peaceful people
* introduced sedentary agriculture in the islands
* remarkable potters and excellent basket weavers
* a religious culture centered around complex relations with nature, ex.

irds, etc.
* lived in large round huts, housing clans of up to 50 people
3. 1200-1300AD-The Lesser Antilles were invaded by the warrior Caribs:
* originated in the Amazon Basin of South America
* pushed the Arawaks further north in the islands, while:
* capturing prisoners destined for domestic chores and cannibalistic

ites
* enslaving the women "slave wives"
* developing a social system built around gender lines
Women
* played a subordinate role in their society
* handled all the domestic chores, pottery & ceramics, & raised the

hildren
Men:
* warriors
* making weapons for war, hunting, fishing, & trapping
* usually did the basket-weaving
* typical village contained:
* 30-100 members of several generations
* Carbet(Men's Houses) the central building -100-120 hammocks inside

ess important buildings surrounded the Carbet, wives & families lived here
4. At the time of the Spanish arrival:
* there were approximately 3-4 million Indians living in the Caribbean
* the general settlement patterns were:
* Greater Antilles & Bahamas -inhabited by the Arawaks
* Lesser Antilles-inhabited by the Caribs
-----Original Message-----
rom: caribbea...@rootsweb.com [mailto:caribbea...@rootsweb.com]
n Behalf Of Ann Q
ent: Thursday, July 12, 2007 9:22 AM
o: CARIB...@rootsweb.com
ubject: RE: CARIBBEAN Digest, Vol 2, Issue 166‎

isa, It was not only girls, it was male and female, that were dumped on the

sland, some may have been hired as servants:, housekeepers, nannies, parlor

aids, ect. but consider, just how many maids, nannies, parlor maids were

eally needed. Those types of jobs cost money, why pay when you had slaves

o do it for free. However, more hands in the field, meant more profit. You

lso mentioned Native Americans, where exactly were those "Native

mericans'?By the 1600's there were few, if any, indigenous people of the

aribbeans in the islands. St. Vincent, today, I believe is the only island

hat has descendents of the indigenous people.A 19 century slave register,

r deed listing the name of a person, could have been a name that was given

n the islands, as compared to a name of a newly arrived African. Names may

ave been passed down in families. A name popular on one island could move

o another if the slave or slaveholder moved from one island to another, as

n the case o!
f wars and capture of the Island.Example, my mother had a Dutch name, but

ived on a Danish Island, her mother's family came from a Dutch

olding.Because at the time period you are looking at, it might difficult to

in point when that person arrived in the Caribbean, if at all, they may

ave been third or fourth generation. It was also the time of 'seasoning' of

laves for resale to the US, and many slaves from Africe, were only in the

aribbean for a short time to be resold on the mainland.

good source of information is: From Columbus to Castro, by Eric

illiams.Ann"Sharing the information." Researching the USVI, St.Eustatius,

t. Barths, Barbados

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uotes in the subject and the body of the message

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ith the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of

he message

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[Edward Crawford]

I thought, because of the prevailing winds, that the Carb canoes had never
got to Barbados. So it was unpopulated.
Edward Crawford

> -------------------------------
> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to
> CARIBBEA...@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the
> quotes in the subject and the body of the message

[mreil...@aol.com]

Well I'm certainly not an expert but I have read that there is archeological evidence of pre-Columbian inhabitants on Barbados and that the early European visitors thought they saw signs that people had lived there recently.  It seems that if the Caribs and Arawaks could sail into the wind from St. Vincent to Dominica they could have made it to Barbados.  But every account I have read seems rather vague about the subject.

-----Original Message-----
From: Edward Crawford <tcra...@revhist.datanet.co.uk>
To: cari...@rootsweb.com
Sent: Thu, 12 Jul 2007 10:57 am
Subject: Re: CARIBBEAN Digest, Vol 2, Issue 166‎

I thought, because of the prevailing winds, that the Carb canoes had never

ot to Barbados. So it was unpopulated.

dward Crawford

[Edward Crawford]

Well I may be wrong but that is that I had always thought. Perhaps someone
better informed than me on the list knows.

Edward Crawford
----- Original Message -----
From: <mreil...@aol.com>
To: <cari...@rootsweb.com>

[Robert Mims]

Indians from the Carolinas were sent to Barbados as slaves in the mid 1600's.

Bob Mims
Cleveland Ohio

mreil...@aol.com wrote:
There were and still are native Indian populations on Dominica and Trinidad as well as St. Vincent, but it's true there were few Caribbean Indians to be enslaved by the 1600s, and Barbados was already depopulated when it was first settled by Europeans. European diseases spread rapidly through the islands from the time of Columbus and many Indians were wiped out w/o ever seeing a white person. However Indians from North America and South America were sometimes shipped to the West Indies as slaves. My gggrandmother was born on a sugar cane plantation on Bequia, the daughter of a slave, about 1835. I have photos of her, and her facial features are obviously Indian but I haven't been able to determine where from.

[Phillip Abbott - Abbott Farms]

Bob ,
Assume you are talking about American Indians . Where did this info come
from ?
Regards ,
Phillip

----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Mims" <bob...@ameritech.net>
To: <cari...@rootsweb.com>

Sent: Thursday, July 12, 2007 1:25 PM
Subject: Re: CARIBBEAN Digest, Vol 2, Issue 166ā

Indians from the Carolinas were sent to Barbados as slaves in the mid
1600's.

Bob Mims
Cleveland Ohio

mreil...@aol.com wrote:
There were and still are native Indian populations on Dominica and
Trinidad as well as St. Vincent, but it's true there were few Caribbean
Indians to be enslaved by the 1600s, and Barbados was already depopulated

when it was first settled by Europeans.Ā European diseases spread rapidly

through the islands from the time of Columbus and many Indians were wiped

out w/o ever seeing a white person.Ā However Indians from North America and
South America were sometimes shipped to the West Indies as slaves.Ā My

gggrandmother was born on a sugar cane plantation on Bequia, the daughter

ofĀ a slave, about 1835.Ā I have photos of her, and her facial features are

[Ann Q]

The Carolina Colony was started in 1663 by Sir. John Yeamans, a colonist from Barbados, North Carolina, becomes a seperate settlement in 1691, and thet is the end of the 17th Century."Sharing the information." Researching the USVI, St.Eustatius, St. Barths, Barbados> Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2007 11:25:09 -0700> From: bob...@ameritech.net> Subject: Re: CARIBBEAN Digest, Vol 2, Issue 166â> To: cari...@rootsweb.com> > Indians from the Carolinas were sent to Barbados as slaves in the mid 1600's.> > Bob Mims> Cleveland Ohio> > mreil...@aol.com wrote:> There were and still are native Indian populations on Dominica and Trinidad as well as St. Vincent, but it's true there were few Caribbean Indians to be enslaved by the 1600s, and Barbados was already depopulated when it was first settled by Europeans. European diseases spread rapidly through the islands from the time of Columbus and many Indians were wiped out w/o ever seeing a white person. However Indians from North America and South America were sometimes shipped to the West Indies as slaves. My gggrandmother was born on a sugar cane plantation on Bequia, the daughter of a slave, about 1835. I have photos of her, and her facial features are obviously Indian but I haven't been able to determine where from.> > > -----Original Message-----> From: Nevilla E Ottley > To: cari...@rootsweb.com; 'CARIB...@rootsweb.com' > Sent: Thu, 12 Jul 2007 9:05 am> Subject: RE: CARIBBEAN Digest, Vol 2, Issue 166‎> > > > I don't know where you got your information about the native Americans, and> ho you are referring to. I would think you were speaking of the Caribs and> he Arawaks. If you are, there is information to be found online at> http://home.messiah.edu/~tstoudno/cunit-a3.htm> See especially No. 4.> And I quote:> 1. The Pre-Columbus Amerindians> Adapted from: Ecommusee de Martinique (Guidebook), Riviere-Pilote,> artinique---(1992)> 1. 4,000 BC-Pre-Ceramist nomadic groups migrated from Venezuela to the> ntilles:> * Ciboney peoples were remnants of these nomadic groups> * daily life and economy centered around fishing and gathering> * lived in camps, scanty shelters, caves and rocky overhangs> * did not farm & were not familiar with pottery or ceramics > 2. Just before the Christian Era, Arawak farmers moved up through the> slands:> * from Bolivia, Peru, Brazil then via the Orinoco Basin of Venezuela> * a very peaceful people> * introduced sedentary agriculture in the islands> * remarkable potters and excellent basket weavers> * a religious culture centered around complex relations with nature, ex.> irds, etc.> * lived in large round huts, housing clans of up to 50 people > 3. 1200-1300AD-The Lesser Antilles were invaded by the warrior Caribs:> * originated in the Amazon Basin of South America> * pushed the Arawaks further north in the islands, while:> * capturing prisoners destined for domestic chores and cannibalistic> ites> * enslaving the women "slave wives"> * developing a social system built around gender lines > Women> * played a subordinate role in their society> * handled all the domestic chores, pottery & ceramics, & raised the> hildren> Men:> * warriors> * making weapons for war, hunting, fishing, & trapping> * usually did the basket-weaving> * typical village contained:> * 30-100 members of several generations> * Carbet(Men's Houses) the central building -100-120 hammocks inside> ess important buildings surrounded the Carbet, wives & families lived here> 4. At the time of the Spanish arrival:> * there were approximately 3-4 million Indians living in the Caribbean> * the general settlement patterns were:> * Greater Antilles & Bahamas -inhabited by the Arawaks> * Lesser Antilles-inhabited by the Caribs> -----Original Message-----> rom: caribbea...@rootsweb.com [mailto:caribbea...@rootsweb.com]> n Behalf Of Ann Q> ent: Thursday, July 12, 2007 9:22 AM> o: CARIB...@rootsweb.com> ubject: RE: CARIBBEAN Digest, Vol 2, Issue 166‎> > isa, It was not only girls, it was male and female, that were dumped on the> sland, some may have been hired as servants:, housekeepers, nannies, parlor> aids, ect. but consider, just how many maids, nannies, parlor maids were> eally needed. Those types of jobs cost money, why pay when you had slaves> o do it for free. However, more hands in the field, meant more profit. You> lso mentioned Native Americans, where exactly were those "Native> mericans'?By the 1600's there were few, if any, indigenous people of the> aribbeans in the islands. St. Vincent, today, I believe is the only island> hat has descendents of the indigenous people.A 19 century slave register,> r deed listing the name of a person, could have been a name that was given> n the islands, as compared to a name of a newly arrived African. Names may> ave been passed down in families. A name popular on one island could move> o another if the slave or slaveholder moved from one island to another, as> n the case o!> f wars and capture of the Island.Example, my mother had a Dutch name, but> ived on a Danish Island, her mother's family came from a Dutch> olding.Because at the time period you are looking at, it might difficult to> in point when that person arrived in the Caribbean, if at all, they may> ave been third or fourth generation. It was also the time of 'seasoning' of> laves for resale to the US, and many slaves from Africe, were only in the> aribbean for a short time to be resold on the mainland.> good source of information is: From Columbus to Castro, by Eric> illiams.Ann"Sharing the information." Researching the USVI, St.Eustatius,> t. Barths, Barbados > > ------------------------------> o unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to> ARIBBEAN...@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the> uotes in the subject and the body of the message> > ------------------------------> o unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to CARIBBEA...@rootsweb.com > ith the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of > he message> > > ________________________________________________________________________> AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at AOL.com.> > -------------------------------> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to CARIBBEA...@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message> > -------------------------------> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to CARIBBEA...@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

[Joan Seymour]

Hello there, The Barbados museum carries a section that deals with the
pre-Columbian period. YOu might want to contact them about what is
available. Joan Seymour

Joan T.Seymour,
Consultant

Edward Crawford wrote:
> Well I may be wrong but that is that I had always thought. Perhaps someone
> better informed than me on the list knows.
> Edward Crawford

> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <mreil...@aol.com>
> To: <cari...@rootsweb.com>

> Sent: Thursday, July 12, 2007 6:41 PM
> Subject: Re: CARIBBEAN Digest, Vol 2, Issue 166‎
>
>
>
>> Well I'm certainly not an expert but I have read that there is
>> archeological evidence of pre-Columbian inhabitants on Barbados and that
>> the early European visitors thought they saw signs that people had lived
>> there recently. It seems that if the Caribs and Arawaks could sail into
>> the wind from St. Vincent to Dominica they could have made it to Barbados.
>> But every account I have read seems rather vague about the subject.
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Edward Crawford <tcra...@revhist.datanet.co.uk>
>> To: cari...@rootsweb.com
>> Sent: Thu, 12 Jul 2007 10:57 am
>> Subject: Re: CARIBBEAN Digest, Vol 2, Issue 166‎
>>
>>
>>
>> I thought, because of the prevailing winds, that the Carb canoes had never
>> ot to Barbados. So it was unpopulated.
>> dward Crawford
>> ---- Original Message -----
>> rom: <mreil...@aol.com>
>> o: <cari...@rootsweb.com>

>> ent: Thursday, July 12, 2007 4:30 PM
>> ubject: Re: CARIBBEAN Digest, Vol 2, Issue 166‎
>>
>> There were and still are native Indian populations on Dominica and
>> Trinidad as well as St. Vincent, but it's true there were few Caribbean
>> Indians to be enslaved by the 1600s, and Barbados was already depopulated

>> when it was first settled by Europeans. European diseases spread rapidly

>> through the islands from the time of Columbus and many Indians were wiped

>> out w/o ever seeing a white person. However Indians from North America and
>> South America were sometimes shipped to the West Indies as slaves. My

>> gggrandmother was born on a sugar cane plantation on Bequia, the daughter

>> of a slave, about 1835. I have photos of her, and her facial features are

>> obviously Indian but I haven't been able to determine where from.
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----

>> From: Nevilla E Ottley <clas...@erols.com>
>> To: cari...@rootsweb.com; 'CARIB...@rootsweb.com'
>> <carib...@rootsweb.com>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.5.476 / Virus Database: 269.10.4/897 - Release Date: 7/11/2007 9:57 PM
>

[Robert Mims]

Phillip
listed are 3 books that I have gone through, listing Native Americans as being enslaved and well as Indian Slave trade. I obtained these books from Inter-library loans made through my county library.

Sugar and Slaves - The rise of the planter class in the English West indies 1624 - 1713
By Richard S. Dunn

Historical Geography of the British Colonies Vol.II - West Indies
By C. P. Lucas

Colonial South Carolina - A Political History 1663 - 1763
By M. Eugene Sirmans

Bob

Phillip Abbott - Abbott Farms <abb...@candw.ag> wrote:
Bob ,
Assume you are talking about American Indians . Where did this info come
from ?
Regards ,
Phillip

----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Mims"
To:
Sent: Thursday, July 12, 2007 1:25 PM
Subject: Re: CARIBBEAN Digest, Vol 2, Issue 166ā

Indians from the Carolinas were sent to Barbados as slaves in the mid
1600's.

Bob Mims
Cleveland Ohio

mreil...@aol.com wrote:
There were and still are native Indian populations on Dominica and
Trinidad as well as St. Vincent, but it's true there were few Caribbean
Indians to be enslaved by the 1600s, and Barbados was already depopulated

when it was first settled by Europeans.Ā European diseases spread rapidly

through the islands from the time of Columbus and many Indians were wiped

out w/o ever seeing a white person.Ā However Indians from North America and
South America were sometimes shipped to the West Indies as slaves.Ā My

gggrandmother was born on a sugar cane plantation on Bequia, the daughter

ofĀ a slave, about 1835.Ā I have photos of her, and her facial features are

-------------------------------

[Phillip Abbott - Abbott Farms]

Bob ,
Thanks for that info . I must admit I was unaware that American Indians were
ever sent to the West Indies as slaves . Will have to check this out further
.
Always good to learn .

[Robert Mims]

No problem Phillip. I have a few more books on order if there's any info in them I will let you know.
Bob

Phillip Abbott - Abbott Farms <abb...@candw.ag> wrote:
Bob ,

Thanks for that info . I must admit I was unaware that American Indians were
ever sent to the West Indies as slaves . Will have to check this out further
.
Always good to learn .
Regards ,
Phillip

----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Mims"
To:
Sent: Friday, July 13, 2007 6:04 AM
Subject: Re: CARIBBEAN Digest, Vol 2, Issue 166ā

Phillip
listed are 3 books that I have gone through, listing Native Americans
as being enslaved and well as Indian Slave trade. I obtained these books
from Inter-library loans made through my county library.

Sugar and Slaves - The rise of the planter class in the English West
indies 1624 - 1713
By Richard S. Dunn

Historical Geography of the British Colonies Vol.II - West Indies
By C. P. Lucas

Colonial South Carolina - A Political History 1663 - 1763
By M. Eugene Sirmans

Bob

[Phillip Abbott - Abbott Farms]

Bob
Thanks so much .
Phillip

Bob

Bob Mims
Cleveland Ohio

when it was first settled by Europeans. European diseases spread rapidly

through the islands from the time of Columbus and many Indians were wiped

out w/o ever seeing a white person. However Indians from North America and
South America were sometimes shipped to the West Indies as slaves. My

gggrandmother was born on a sugar cane plantation on Bequia, the daughter

of a slave, about 1835. I have photos of her, and her facial features are

[John Weiss]

The last pure Caribs in Trinidad died before 1800, but today there are
many who claim Carib ancestry in the area around Arima.

John Weiss, London

mreil...@aol.com wrote:
> There were and still are native Indian populations on Dominica and Trinidad as well as St. Vincent [ . . . ]