BRUS / ROS connexion
Caro...@aol.com
Dear Ed,
I have several lines that seem to overlap these, but I can't tell how to
connect them. Could you take a look at those at the bottom of this message
and make some suggestions? Thanks!
In a message dated 5/10/97 3:16:15 PM, <GEN-ME...@MAIL.EWORLD.COM> wrote:
>
>Subject: BRUS / ROS connexion
>From: Ed Mann <edm...@MAIL2.COMMNECTIONS.COM>
>Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 23:16:46 -0500
>
>GE>Using several different sources I've pieced this line together:
>
>GE>Stephen, Count of Aumale & Earl of Holderness (d. 1127)
>GE>Agnes of Aumale
>GE>Peter I de Brus, Baron of Skelton & Danby (d. 1247)
>GE>Peter II de Brus
>GE>Margaret de Brus, m. Robert de Ros
>GE>William de Ros
>GE>Thomas de Ros (d. 1390)
>GE>etc.
>
>GE>Can someone please tell me whether I've thoroughly mixed up my Brus's?
>GE>Is further ancestry of Peter I known?
>
>This seems to work, although I had Peter II de Brus double-listed and
>had to clear that up.
>
>See Burke's Dormant and Extinct Peerages, (1883 ed., 1996 reprint), page
>80; Weis, Ancestral Roots, 7th ed. (136-25 through 136-26).
>
>Robert de Brus = Emma de Bretagne
>Robert de Bruce = Agnes Paynell
>Adam de Bruce
>Adam de Brus = Ivetta de Arches
>Adam II de Brus = Agnes de Aumale
>
>Send me your E-Mail address for more detail.
Ancestry of Adam DE BRUS. Died 1186:
First Generation
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------
1 Adam DE BRUS. Died 1186. He married Joanna DE MESCHINES.
Second Generation
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------
2 Adam I DE BRUS. Born About 1126 in Skelton,Yorkshire,England.
Died 1196 in
Skelton,Yorkshire,England. He married Ivetta DE ARCHES.
3 Ivetta DE ARCHES. Born About 1130 in Skelton,Yorkshire,England.
Third Generation
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------
4 Adam DE BRUS. Born About 1099 in Skelton,Yorkshire,England. He
married
Agnes.
5 Agnes. Born About 1103 in Skelton,Yorkshire,England.
6 William DE ARCHES. He married Ivetta.
7 Ivetta.
Fourth Generation
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------
8 Robert DE BRUS. Born About 1072 in Skelton,Yorkshire,England.
Died 1141 in
Skelton,Yorkshire,England. He married Agnes (Paynell or) PAGANELL.
9 Agnes (Paynell or) PAGANELL. Born About 1076 in
Skelton,Yorkshire,England.
10 Stephen.
Fifth Generation
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------
16 Adam DE BRUS. Born 1050 in Normandy,France. Died 1080. He
married Emma
RAMSAY.
17 Emma RAMSAY. Born in Normandy,France.
18 Fulk PAGANELL. Born About 1050 in Dudley,Staffordshire,England.
He
married Beatrice FITZANSCULF.
19 Beatrice FITZANSCULF. Born About 1054 in
Dudley,Staffordshire,England.
Sixth Generation
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------
32 Robert (de Brussi or) DE BRUS. Born About 1030 in
Normandy,France. He
married Emma DE NORMANDY.
33 Emma DE NORMANDY. Born About 1034 in Brittany,France. Died About
1094.
34 William RAMSAY Sir.
36 William PAGANEL. He married Lesceline.
37 Lesceline.
38 William FITZANSCULF.
Seventh Generation
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------
66 Alan Earl of Brittany. Born About 1000. Died 1046.
72 Gervaise PAGANEL.
AND descendants of Etienne (Stephen) I Cte de Troyes, died Circa 1048:
Etienne (Stephen) I Cte de Troyes ( - Circa 1048) & Adele N
| Eudes III Cte de Troyes ( - After 1096) & Adelaide (Adela ) DE GAND Cnts.
of Aumale (Sep 1029 - 1081/1084)
| | Etienne (Stephen) Cte d'Aumale ( - Circa 1127) & Hawise de Mortimer
| | | William "le Gros" Cte d'Aumale ( - 20 Aug 1179) & Cicely Lady of
Skipton
| | | | Hawise Cts d'Aumale* ( - 11 Mar 1214) & William DE MANDEVILLE Ear
of Essex ( - 1189)
| | | | Hawise Cts d'Aumale* ( - 11 Mar 1214) & William DE FORZ (des
Forts) Cte d'Aumale ( - 1195)
| | | | Hawise Cts d'Aumale* ( - 11 Mar 1214) & Baldwin (Baudoin) de
Bethune Cte d'Aumale ( - 1211)
| | | Stephen d'Aumale ( - After 1150)
| | | Ingelram d'Aumale ( - After 1150)
| | | Agnes d'Aumale* & William de Roumare ( - 1150)
| | | Agnes d'Aumale* & Peter BRUCE Lord of Skelton
Now, how does this connect with Robert the Bruce's line?
Robert de BRUCE V, Lord of Annan ( - 1245) & Isabella ( - 1251)
| Robert VI `the Competitor' BRUCE Lord Annandale* (1215 - 1295) & Isabella
DE CLARE (1226 - 1254)
| | Robert BRUCE VII, Earl of Car* (1240 - 1304) & Marjorie Countess of
Carr (1245 - )
| | | Five sons, one daughter
| | | Robert I BRUCE King of Scotland* (11 Jul 1274 - 7 Jun 1329) &
Elizabeth DE BURGH ( - 1327)
| | | | John ( - SeeNotes)
| | | | David II BRUCE King of Scotland* (1324 - 1371) & Joanna
PLANTAGENET Princess (1321 - 1362)
| | | | David II BRUCE King of Scotland* (1324 - 1371) & Margaret
DRUMMOND ( - 1375)
| | | Robert I BRUCE King of Scotland* (11 Jul 1274 - 7 Jun 1329) & Isabel
(1275 - )
| | | | Marjorie BRUCE (1295 - 1316) & Walter STEWART 6th High Steward
(1295 - 1327)
| | | Mary BRUCE & Neil CAMBEL Sir ( - 1316)
| | | | John CAMBEL Earl of Athol ( - 19 Jul 1333) & Joanna MENTEITH
| | | | Dougal CAMBEL
| | | | Duncan CAMBEL
| | | Edward BRUCE King of Ireland ( - 1318)
| | Robert BRUCE VII, Earl of Car* (1240 - 1304) & Alianora
| Robert VI `the Competitor' BRUCE Lord Annandale* (1215 - 1295) &
Christiana DE IREBY
AND how do the Brus lines connect with the de Ros line? Here's the line I
have:
Peter DE ROS (About 1088 - 1157) & Adeline ESPEC (About 1092 - )
| Robert DE ROS (About 1124 - About 1150) & Sybella DE VALOINES (About 1129
- )
| | Everard DE ROS (1153 - 1186) & Roysia (or Rose) TRUSBUT (About 1155 - )
| | | Robert DE ROS (About 1170 - Before 23 Dec 1226) & Isabel of Scotland
(About 1165 -
| | | | William DE ROS Sir (After 1192 - About 1264/1265) & Lucy
FITZPIERS
| | | | | William DE ROS Sir & Eustache FITZHUGH
| | | | | | Lucy DE ROS & Robert PLUMBTON Sir
| | | | | Robert DE ROS Sir (1223 - 17 May 1285) & Isabel D'AUBIGNY ( -
15 Jun 1301)
| | | | | | William DE ROS B. of Helmsley (About 1250 - 15 Aug 1316) &
Maud DE VAUX (Before 1270 - )
| | | | | | | Agnes DE ROS & Pain DE TIBETOT (1274 - 1314)
| | | | | | | William DE ROS B. of Helmsley (1290 - 3 Feb 1342/1343) &
Margery DE BADLESMERE (1315 - 18 Oct 1363)
| | | | | | | | Maud DE ROS & John DE WELLES Lord Welles
Beatrice/Beatrix STAFFORD (About 1339 - 1384)
| | | | | | | | | John DE ROS 5th Baron de Ros ( - 6 Aug 1393) &
Mary DE PERCY
| | | | | | | | | William DE ROS 7th Baron Ros of (About 1368 - 1
Sep 1414) & Margaret de ARUNDEL FITZALAN (About 1372 - 3 Jul 1438)
| | | | | | | | | | Margaret DE ROS & James TOUCHET 2nd Baron
Audley
| | | | | | | | | | John DE ROS ( - 1421) & Margery le DESPENSER
| | | | | | | | | | Thomas DE ROS 9th Baron ( - 18 Aug 1431) &
Eleanor de BEAUCHAMP (1408 - 1467/1468)
| | | | | | | | | | | Thomas DE ROS 10th Baron ( - 4 Nov 1461) &
Philippe TIPTOFT
| | | | | | | | | | | | Edmund DE ROS 11th Baron ( - 13 Oct 1508)
| | | | | | | | | | | Eleanor DE ROS & Robert MANNERS Sir
| | | | | | | | | | | | George MANNERS
| | | | | | | | | William DE ROS Lord (About 1368 - 1 Sep 1414) &
Margaret de ARUNDEL FITZALAN (About 1372 - 3 Jul 1438)
| | | | | | | | | | Margaret DE ROS & Reginald DE GREY 3rd Lord
Grey (1362 - 20 Sep 1440)
I can't figure out which William de Ros and Thomas de Ros fit in with the
Brus's.
Help? Thanks.
CarolynCC
Ed Mann
GE>There was an earlier submission (see below) for DE BRUS.
GE>Question: does anyone have ties from Adam de Brus to Isabel de Brus, born
GE>about 1160, who married Henry de Percy and had sonWilliam de Percy (b. 1192?
She is apparently his sister as her parents were Adam de Brus and Ivetta
de Arches.
See Burke's Dormant and Extinct Peerages, 1883 ed., 1996 reprint, p.
423.