Lineage to Charlemagne
Wells & Mary Behee
How authentic would you consider this lineage
I can prove my lineage back eleven generations to John Pomeroy b.
abt. 1510. d.?
Then the Pomeroy family history book claims ancestry back 13
generations to Rohesia, natural but illegitimate daughter of Henry I
England. She married a Henry de la Pomerei. How accurate is this family
History?
Then from the Encyclopaedia Britannica, I gleaned the following
1. Henry I 1028-1087
2. Matilda dau. Count Baldwin V of Flanders and wife of William the
Conqueror
3. Count Baldwin V of Flanders
4. Count Baldwin IV 988-1035
5. Count Arnuf II 965--988
6. Count Baldwin III d. 962
7. Count Arnuff I 918-965
8. Count Baldwin II 879-918 married Aelfthryth youngest daughter of
King Alfred the Great, England
9. Judith dau. King Charles II. She married (3)Count Baldwin I at
age 18/19 as well as (2) King Alfred's brother Aethelbald at age 15/16 , and
(1)King Alfred's father King Ethelwulf at age 11/12
As said above she was the daughter of King Charles II
10. King Louis I d. 840 King of Aquitaine
11. King Charlemagne(Charles the Great) b. 742- d. 814
12. King Pepin III d. 768
13. Charles Martel 688-741
14. Pepin II d. 714
15. Ansegisel------------wife-----------15 a.Doda Bagga dau. of 16 a
16. Bishop Arnuff of Metz 16 a. Pepin I
Then the Enclopedia indicates that the ancestor of the Bishop and of Pepin I
goes back into French myth.
If the above is true,my ancestry goes back 42 generations. I
believe that the weakest link in this is the material of 13 generations
obtained from the Pomeroy book. Yet the name Pomeroy originally meant "the
king's apple." So there was some connection with royalty. I am not sure of
the accuracy of the Pomeroy book. However. It seems as if it might be O.K.
I certainly would not ask anyone to check it out. I doesn't really
mean that much to be except out of curiosity. But just off the top of your
head, briefly, what would you think about all this?
Wells
Leslie Mahler
Perhaps you are referring to the ancestry of Eltweed Pomeroy. According
to what Ive read in various journals, his ancestry only goes back a
generation or two, and no connection has been proven between him and the
gentry family of Pomeroy.
JKent10581
In a message dated 98-01-28 21:07:43 EST, wbe...@bright.net writes:
<< Then the Enclopedia indicates that the ancestor of the Bishop and of Pepin
I
goes back into French myth. >>
How about Nero...and 83 generations? Jno
Alan B. Wilson
In article <1998012901...@sparticus.bright.net>, wbe...@bright.net
(Wells & Mary Behee) wrote:
> How authentic would you consider this lineage
> I can prove my lineage back eleven generations to John Pomeroy b.
> abt. 1510. d.?
> Then the Pomeroy family history book claims ancestry back 13
> generations to Rohesia, natural but illegitimate daughter of Henry I
> England. She married a Henry de la Pomerei. How accurate is this family
> History?
Rohese. wife of Henry de la Pomeroy, was probably not the daughter of
Henry I. See the discussion in Weis, Ancestral Roots, line 124A:29.
However if you do trace the ancestry of Rohese in Weis, lines 195 and 262
we see that her grandmother was Emma of Blois who was an illegitimate
daughter of Stephen Henry, Count of Blois, who has a Carolingian descent.
This can be traced in Weis: 137, 136, 159, 133, and 148 (or, of course,
in Europaische Stammtafeln and other sources).
The line, in brief, goes as follows:
1 Henry de la POMEROY. Born bef 1146. Henry died in of Berry Pomeroy
(Devon) England aft 1193; he was 47.
2 Henry de la POMEROY.
3 Rohese FitzHERBERT.
6 Herbert FitzHERBERT. Born ca 1107. Herbert died bef 1156; he was 49.
Archbishop of York.
7 Sibyl CORBET. Sibyl died aft 1157. lady of Alcester (Warwks), and of
Pontesbury and Woodcote (Salop).
12 Herbert of Winchester. Herbert of Winchester died in 1120/1130.
Chamberlain and Treasurer under William II & Henry I.
13 Emma of Blois.
26 Stephen Henry Count of Blois. Born in 1046. Stephen Henry died in
Battle of Ramleh, Holy Land on 27 May 1102; he was 56. Count of Champagne,
Brie, and Chartres. Count of Blois, Chartres, Chateaudun, Sancerre &
Meaux.
52 Thibaut III (I) of Blois Count. Born bef 1012. Thibaut III (I) of Blois
died in Epernay in Sep 1089; he was 77. Count of Blois, Chartres,
Chateaudun, Meaux, & Sancerre.
53 Gundrada.
104 Eudes II of Blois Count. Born ca 990. Eudes II of Blois slain in
Bar-le-Duc on 15 Nov 1037; he was 47. Count of Champagne, Chartres, Tours,
Beauvais.
105 Ermengarde of AUVERGNE. Ermengarde died aft 10 Mar 1042.
208 Eudes I of Blois Count. Born ca 950 in Mormontier. Eudes I of Blois
died in Marmontier on 12 Mar 995/996; he was 45. Count of Blois, Chartres,
Tours, Chateaudun, Beauvais, Meaux, and Provins.
209 Bertha of Burgundy Princess. Born ca 967/968. Bertha of Burgundy died
aft 16 Jan 1016; she was 49.
418 Conrad I "the Peaceful" King. Born ca 0925. Conrad I "the Peaceful"
died in Regensburg on 19 Oct 0993; he was 68. Buried in Saint Andrede Bas,
Vienne. King of both Burgundies {936-993}.
419 Matilda of France Princess. Born in 943 in of Laon. Matilda of France
died on 27 Jan 981/992; she was 38. Buried in la cathedral Saint-Maurice
de Vienne. Princess of France.
838 Louis IV "d'Outremer" of France King. Born on 10 Sep 920/921. Louis IV
"d'Outremer" of France died in Reims on 10 Sep 0954; he was 34. Buried in
l'abbaye de Saint-Remy, Reims.
839 Gerberge of Saxony. Born ca 913/914 in Nordhausen, Saxony. Gerberge of
Saxony died in Rheims, France on 5 May 984; she was 71. Buried in abbaye
at Reims.
1676 Charles III "the Simple" of France King. Born on 17 Sep 879 in
Peronne, Somme, France. Charles III "the Simple" of France died in
Peronne, Somme, France on 7 Oct 929; he was 50. Buried in St. Fursy. King
of West Franks {893}.
1677 Aedgifu of England Princess. Born ca 904 in Wessex, England. Aedgifu
of England died aft 951; she was 47. Buried in l'eglise Saint-Medard de
Soissons.
3352 Louis II "the Stammerer" of France King. Born on 1 Nov 846 in France.
Louis II "the Stammerer" of France died in Compiegne, Oise, France on 10
Apr 879; he was 32. Buried in l'eglise collegiale Saint-Corneille de
Compiegne. King of Neustria {856}; King of Aquitaine {867}. King of
France {877-879}; Emperor of the West {878-879}.
3353 Adelaide of Paris. Born in 855/860. Adelaide of Paris died aft 10 Nov
901; she was 46. Buried in l'eglise abbatiale Saint-Corneille a Compiegne.
6704 Charles II "the Bald" of France King. Born on 13 Jun 823 in
Frankfurt, H-Nss, Prussia. Charles II "the Bald" of France died in
Brides-les Bains/Savoyen on 6 Oct 877; he was 54. Buried in St. Denis.
King of West Franks, Emperor of the West {875}. King of Burgundy {869};
King of Italy {875}.
6705 Ermentrude of Orleans. Born on 27 Sep 830 in Orleans, France.
Ermentrude of Orleans died in l'abbaye de Saint-Denis on 6 Oct 869; she
was 39. Buried in l'eglise abbatiale.
13408 Louis I "the Pious" of Aquitaine King. Born in Aug 778 in
Casseneuil, France. Louis I "the Pious" of Aquitaine died on 20 Jun 840;
he was 61. {814} Roman Emperor. {781} King of Aquitaine.
13409 Judith of Bavaria. Born ca 805 in Bavaria. Judith of Bavaria died in
Tours, France on 19 Apr 843; she was 38.
26816 Charlemagne King. Born on 2 Apr 747 in Ingelheim. Charlemagne died
in Aachen, Rhineland, Prussia on 28 Jan 814; he was 66. King of Franks
{767-814} King of Lombards {774}. Emperor of Romans {800-814}.
26817 Hildegard of Linzgau Countess. Born in 758 in Aachen, Rhineland,
Prussia. Hildegard of Linzgau died on 30 Apr 783; she was 25. Countess of
Linzgau.
--
Alan B. Wilson
abwi...@uclink2.berkeley.edu
Richard Borthwick
At 06:54 AM 29/01/98 GMT, you wrote:
>In article <1998012901...@sparticus.bright.net>, wbe...@bright.net
>(Wells & Mary Behee) wrote:
>
>> How authentic would you consider this lineage
>> I can prove my lineage back eleven generations to John Pomeroy b.
>> abt. 1510. d.?
>> Then the Pomeroy family history book claims ancestry back 13
>> generations to Rohesia, natural but illegitimate daughter of Henry I
>> England. She married a Henry de la Pomerei. How accurate is this family
>> History?
>
> Rohese. wife of Henry de la Pomeroy, was probably not the daughter of
>Henry I. See the discussion in Weis, Ancestral Roots, line 124A:29.
>However if you do trace the ancestry of Rohese in Weis, lines 195 and 262
>we see that her grandmother was Emma of Blois who was an illegitimate
>daughter of Stephen Henry, Count of Blois, who has a Carolingian descent.
>This can be traced in Weis: 137, 136, 159, 133, and 148 (or, of course,
>in Europaische Stammtafeln and other sources).
>
> The line, in brief, goes as follows:
>
>1 Henry de la POMEROY. Born bef 1146. Henry died in of Berry Pomeroy
>(Devon) England aft 1193; he was 47.
>
>2 Henry de la POMEROY.
under Henry I* (Cambridge, 1986), there is notice of Henry, but it is also
noted that there is no known relationship to any other of the Henrican
administrative families. I don't have the page reference but Green has
separate biographies for each member of the administration noted in the
work. Strangely while Herbert the chamberlain gets a mention no biog. is
given for him. Green may of course be wrong in not connecting the Pomeroys
to the family of Herbert the Ch.
>3 Rohese FitzHERBERT.
>
>6 Herbert FitzHERBERT. Born ca 1107. Herbert died bef 1156; he was 49.
>Archbishop of York.
He was not Archbishop of York, his younger brother, William, was. See the
Hollister reference below p.268. Apart from his marriage to Henry I's
mistress. Herbert fitz Herbert he survived his father's disgrace and
mutilation in almost total obscurity. Hollister (below) p.268 note 2 points
out that Herbert is styled 'camerarius' i.e. chamberlain in the Winchester
Survey of 1148 and in a royal charter to his son Robert in 1155. However he
never attests for Henry I, Stephen or the Empress and is clearly not
functioning as a royal chamberlain in those years. He is recorded in the
Pipe Rolls 31 Henry I (p.37) as paying for his father's lands but not for
his father's office.
What are the sources for the dates given for Herbert fitz Herbert?
>7 Sibyl CORBET. Sibyl died aft 1157. lady of Alcester (Warwks), and of
>Pontesbury and Woodcote (Salop).
CP XI:108 note (b) states that Herbert fitz Herbert was dead in 1165 and
that Sibyl was alive in 1157 (as you state).
>12 Herbert of Winchester. Herbert of Winchester died in 1120/1130.
>Chamberlain and Treasurer under William II & Henry I.
Herbert is noted as camerarius in Domesday (Hampshire). He was evidently
part of a conspiracy to overthrow Henry I in 1118 and was dismissed and
Suger of St Denis indicates that he was treated with mercy and was only
castrated and blinded! See Hollister (below) p.267.
Hollister argues very convincingly that he was not in office in 1129/30 (the
date usually given for his death). It is much more likely that he died 1118/20.
See also Green (above) pp.32-33. C A Newman *Anlo-Norman Nobility in the
Reign of Henry I: the second generation* (Univ. Penn. Press, 1988) p.129
sticks with White and others in having Herbert die just before 1130. She
seems to suggest that his wife survived him. She also mention that he paid
relief on the marriage of his daughter. On p.79 she notes that Herbert
founded Weaverthorpe priory (I think this was in Yorkshire).
>13 Emma of Blois.
According to C Warren Hollister "The origins of the English Treasury"
*English Historical Review* XCIII 1978, 268 note 3, this marriage has no
basis. According to this note J H Round in his paper "The Weigher of the
Exchequer" shows that Herbert the Chamberlain married a daughter of Hunger
fitz Odin. Evidently there was also another Herbert the chamberlain of
Scotland at about the same time and the stories of these two got muddled. C
T Clay delineates the two families in *Early Yorkshire Charters* XI:213-219.
>26 Stephen Henry Count of Blois. Born in 1046. Stephen Henry died in
>Battle of Ramleh, Holy Land on 27 May 1102; he was 56. Count of Champagne,
>Brie, and Chartres. Count of Blois, Chartres, Chateaudun, Sancerre &
>Meaux.
>
>52 Thibaut III (I) of Blois Count. Born bef 1012. Thibaut III (I) of Blois
>died in Epernay in Sep 1089; he was 77. Count of Blois, Chartres,
>Chateaudun, Meaux, & Sancerre.
>
>53 Gundrada.
I think 53 should be Gersende of Maine, Thibaut III's 1st wife. Stephen
Henry was born in 1046 and Thibaut and Gersende did not separate until 1048.
ES II:46 gives these dates and mistakenly indicates Stephen Henry to be the
son of Gundrada. Also see M Bur *La formation du comte de Champagne* (Nancy,
1977), 199, 214-15 where Stephen Henry is stated to be the son of Gersende.
Alan B. Wilson
In article <1.5.4.32.1998013...@cyllene.uwa.edu.au>,
rg...@cyllene.uwa.edu.au (Richard Borthwick) wrote:
> At 06:54 AM 29/01/98 GMT, you wrote:
> >In article <1998012901...@sparticus.bright.net>, wbe...@bright.net
> >(Wells & Mary Behee) wrote:
> >
<snip>
> >
> >6 Herbert FitzHERBERT. Born ca 1107. Herbert died bef 1156; he was 49.
> >Archbishop of York.
> He was not Archbishop of York, his younger brother, William, was.
I stand corrected甊I misread my source.
>
> What are the sources for the dates given for Herbert fitz Herbert?
>
Weis, Ancestral Roots, 262:27 (prepared by Douglas Richardson) reads:
"HERBERT FITZ HERBERT, s. and h., adult by 1127, succeeded to his father's
lands in 1130, dead by 1155, brother of St. William (Fitz Herbert), d.
1154, Archbishop of York; . . ."
"Born ca 1107" was inferred from "adult by 1127"; "died bef 1156" was
inferred from "dead by 1155". I misassociated the modifier "Archbishop of
York".
Diana Trenchard
In this thread were the following messages from Alan Wilson and Richard
Borthwick:
>>>6 Herbert FitzHERBERT. Born ca 1107. Herbert died bef 1156; he was 49.
>> What are the sources for the dates given for Herbert fitz Herbert?
> Weis, Ancestral Roots, 262:27 (prepared by Douglas Richardson) reads:
>"HERBERT FITZ HERBERT, s. and h., adult by 1127, succeeded to his father's
>lands in 1130, dead by 1155, brother of St. William (Fitz Herbert), d. 1154,
>Archbishop of York; . . ."
> CP XI:108 note (b) states that Herbert fitz Herbert was dead in 1165
What are the sources for HERBERT FITZHERBERT being 'dead by 1155' and 'was
dead in 1165'? He appears to have been alive and witnessing at least two
deeds after 1170.
Both deeds are for Herbert FitzHerbert's half-brother Reginald, Earl of
Cornwall, (Deeds of the Redvers family, App II, 15a and 15b.)
The first deed is where Reginald grants lands to his [half-]sister Roheise
Pomeroy in free marriage. It is dated to c1170-June 1175; the earliest
date because it includes Reginald's grandsons as witnesses (born c1159-61),
and the latter date is Reginald's death.
The second deed is a confirmation of an earlier grant from Reginald to
William Boterell. It is dated to c1171/2-June 1175; the earlier date being
when one of the witnesses, Robert, became abbot of Malmesbury.
In the same thread Alan wrote that:
> Rohese. wife of Henry de la Pomeroy, was probably not the daughter of
>Henry I. See the discussion in Weis, Ancestral Roots, line 124A:29.
One of my lost references said that Roheise was the daughter of Thomas
Bardolph and Adela Corbet, the sister of Sybil Corbet - mother of Reginald,
Earl of Cornwall and Herbert Fitzherbert. Is this correct? Or was Roheise
the daughter of Sybil?
Diana Trenchard
Portculis
I recall that when I did research on Herbert Fitz Herbert and the line covered
in Ancestral Roots 262 (Weis, p. 238), there were specific problems, but it's
been so long now I can't remember.
>
>What are the sources for HERBERT FITZHERBERT being 'dead by 1155' and 'was
>dead in 1165'? He appears to have been alive and witnessing at least two
>deeds after 1170.
>
>Both deeds are for Herbert FitzHerbert's half-brother Reginald, Earl of
>Cornwall, (Deeds of the Redvers family, App II, 15a and 15b.)
>
>
Herbert Fitz Herbert who married Sibyl Corbet and died in 1154, or at least by
1165, was FATHER of another Herbert Fitz Herbert. The younger man was living
in 1165, and died about 1235. As Sibyl Cobet is supposed to be mistress of
Henry I and mother of Reginald, Earl of Cornwall, it's the younger Herbert
mentioned in your deeds.
Benjamin Hertzel
> The line, in brief, goes as follows:
>
> 1 Henry de la POMEROY. Born bef 1146. Henry died in of Berry Pomeroy
> (Devon) England aft 1193; he was 47.
>
> 2 Henry de la POMEROY.
>
> 3 Rohese FitzHERBERT.
>
> 6 Herbert FitzHERBERT. Born ca 1107. Herbert died bef 1156; he was 49.
> Archbishop of York.
Would this be the father (grandfather?) of the Herbert FitzHerbert who
married Lucy - (? - sorry, I don't have more on her) and was himself the
father of Reginald, Piers, and Matthew FitzHerbert? I show Piers as
marrying Isabella de Broase (born ca. 1215, daughter of William de Braose
and Eva Marshall) and dying ca. 1235.
Thanks.
Benjamin
Richard Borthwick
At 08:15 PM 31/01/98 -0800, you wrote:
>
>
>> The line, in brief, goes as follows:
>>
>> 1 Henry de la POMEROY. Born bef 1146. Henry died in of Berry Pomeroy
>> (Devon) England aft 1193; he was 47.
>>
>> 2 Henry de la POMEROY.
>>
>> 3 Rohese FitzHERBERT.
>>
>> 6 Herbert FitzHERBERT. Born ca 1107. Herbert died bef 1156; he was 49.
>>
Archbishop of York.
>
>Would this be the father (grandfather?) of the Herbert FitzHerbert who
>married Lucy - (? - sorry, I don't have more on her) and was himself the
>father of Reginald, Piers, and Matthew FitzHerbert? I show Piers as
>marrying Isabella de Broase (born ca. 1215, daughter of William de Braose
>and Eva Marshall) and dying ca. 1235.
>
>Thanks.
>
>Benjamin
>
lord of Blaen Llyfni (in right of his wife) and his wife Lucy dau. and
eventual coheir of Miles of Gloucester earl of Hereford. Piers fitz Herbert
(d.1235) heir of his father married (possibly) Alice dau. of Robert fitz
Roger of Whalton Nothumberland and Margaret de Cheney. My source for this
marriage is Turton *The Plantagenet Ancestry* 119 (a source which needs to
be treated with caution). Turton says this was a first marriage in 1204.
Piers' heir was Herbert who d.1248 and the latter was followed by his
brother Reginald fitz Piers (d.1286). CP V:465 notes (c) and (d) gives an
outline of the Fitz Herbert family and the marriages of Reginald fitz Piers.
There is no notice in the CP article of Piers' marriage(s). What is your
source for Piers' Braose marriage? William de Braose (d.1230) and Eve
Marshal had four coheirs, amongst them Isabel (d.after 1246) who married
David (d.1246) son of Llywelyn Mawr. She cannot be the Isabel you mention.
Except as indicated I have followed Sanders *English Baronies* (Oxford,
1963) pp.8-9, 21-22, 63.
Alan B. Wilson
*In article <Pine.GSO.3.95.98013...@midas.millcomm.com>,
ja...@midas.millcomm.com (Benjamin Hertzel) wrote:
<snip>
> > 6 Herbert FitzHERBERT. Born ca 1107. Herbert died bef 1156; he was 49.
> > Archbishop of York.
>
>
> Would this be the father (grandfather?) of the Herbert FitzHerbert who
> married Lucy - (? - sorry, I don't have more on her) and was himself the
> father of Reginald, Piers, and Matthew FitzHerbert? I show Piers as
> marrying Isabella de Broase (born ca. 1215, daughter of William de Braose
> and Eva Marshall) and dying ca. 1235.
>
Following Weis, Ancestral Roots, line 262, Herbert Fitz Herbert who
married Sibyl Corbet had a son, also Herbert Fitz Herbert, who married
Lucy of Hereford, daughter of Miles of Gloucester, Earl of Hereford.
Herbert and Lucy had a son, Piers Fitz Herbert, but he married,
firstly, Alice de Warkwarth (Fitz Robert), and, secondly, Isabel de
Ferrers, widow of Roger de Mortimer according to Weis.
Alan B. Wilson
In article <886276154...@trenchar.demon.co.uk>,
di...@trenchar.demon.co.uk (Diana Trenchard) wrote:
> In this thread were the following messages from Alan Wilson and Richard
> Borthwick:
>
<snip>
> One of my lost references said that Roheise was the daughter of Thomas
> Bardolph and Adela Corbet, the sister of Sybil Corbet - mother of Reginald,
> Earl of Cornwall and Herbert Fitzherbert. Is this correct? Or was Roheise
> the daughter of Sybil?
>
Henry de la Pomeroy and Rohese Fitz Herbert had a son, Henry (II) de
la Pomeroy who married, firstly Matilde de Vitrei, and, secondly, Rohesia,
daughter of Thomas Bardolph and Adela Corbet. Rohesia Bardolph survived
her first husband, Henry II, and married secondly John Russell. (I have a
photocopy of the chapter in front of me, but neglected to write a citation
on it. The chapter title is "The Pomeroy (de la Pomerai) family of County
Devon England". We both seem to be losing references :-)
Benjamin Hertzel
Richard,
> No.6 was the father of another Herbert fitz Herbert (d. 18 before July 1204)
> lord of Blaen Llyfni (in right of his wife) and his wife Lucy dau. and
> eventual coheir of Miles of Gloucester earl of Hereford. Piers fitz Herbert
> (d.1235) heir of his father married (possibly) Alice dau. of Robert fitz
> Roger of Whalton Nothumberland and Margaret de Cheney. My source for this
> marriage is Turton *The Plantagenet Ancestry* 119 (a source which needs to
> be treated with caution). Turton says this was a first marriage in 1204.
> Piers' heir was Herbert who d.1248 and the latter was followed by his
> brother Reginald fitz Piers (d.1286). CP V:465 notes (c) and (d) gives an
> outline of the Fitz Herbert family and the marriages of Reginald fitz Piers.
> There is no notice in the CP article of Piers' marriage(s). What is your
> source for Piers' Braose marriage? William de Braose (d.1230) and Eve
> Marshal had four coheirs, amongst them Isabel (d.after 1246) who married
> David (d.1246) son of Llywelyn Mawr. She cannot be the Isabel you mention.
My information comes from Burke's Dormant and Extinct Peerages. Under the
Braose lineage it says (among other things):
"William de Braose. This feudal lord fell a victim to the jealousy of
Llewellyn, Prince of Wales, who suspecting an intimacy between him and the
princess, his wife, King Henry's sister, invited him to an Easter feast,
and treacherously cast him into prison at the conclusion of the banquet.
He was soon afterwards put to death with the unfortunate princess. He had
married Eve, daughter of Walter Marschal [under the Marshall family,
Earls of Pembroke, "Walter" is given as William], and sister of Richard,
Earl of Pembroke, by whom he had four daughters, his co-heirs, viz.,
I. Isabel, married 1st to Prince David, who on the demise of his father,
1240, usurped the crown of North Wales, eldest son (by Joan, his 3rd
consort, natural daughter of John, King of England) of Llewelyn, the
Great King of North Wales. David ap Llewelyn d.s.p. Isabel his widow
married Peter FitzHerbert."
Under the FitzHerbert lineage is written:
"Herbert FitzHerbert. Then lord chamberlain to that monarch [King
Stephen], gave L333 in silver, for livery of his father's lands. This
Herbert married 1st --- the daughter and co-heiress of Robert Corbet, Lord
of Alcester, county Warwick, who had been some time concubine to King
Henry I. He married secondly Lucy, 3rd daughter of and co-heir of Milo,
Earl of Hereford, and by her had three sons, Reginald, who d.s.p; Peter,
his successor; and Matthew, sheriff of Sussex. The 2nd son,
Peter FitzHerbert... [I won't bore you with all that is written about
Peter] ... He married 1st, Alice, daughter of Robert FitzRoger, a great
baron in Northumberland, but by her had no issue; and 2ndly, the 3rd
daughter and co-heir of William de Braose, Baron of Brecknock, and died
1235, leaving a son,
Herbert FitzPeter..."
It gives Herbert FitzPeter's heir as his brother, Reginald, and Reginald's
heir as his own son, John. Of this John, Burke's writes: "...his
descendents, who all bore the surname of FitzHerbert, were never esteemed
barons, nor had any of them summons to parliament as such".
Burke's also seems to contradict previous postings on this List that give
Herbert FitzHerbert, husband of Sibyl Corbet as father of Herbert
FitzHerbert, husband of Lucy of Gloucester. Burke's appears to be saying
the two Herberts are one and the same. Any ideas on that one?
Benjamin