Correction to "Plantagenet Descent: Edward I to Symmes of Barnsley"
John P. Ravilious
Hello All,
In April 2005 I posted certain information to the SGM
thread, <Plantagenet Descent: Edward I to Symmes of Barnsley>,
and further noted the work by Worth Anderson on the same line
which had been published by Gary Boyd Roberts [1]. I hope
that all is well with Worth, as I have not heard from him
re: this or any subsequent query since.
I have lately noted two references in Hunter's South
Yorkshire that, if validated, would in fact disprove the
specific Bosvile link in the Symmes ancestry, and remove
the Hastings (and Plantagenet) ancestry of Hugh Lacy, Esq.
of Brearley.
1. The death date of Sir Thomas Bosvile of Ardsley has
to date been given only as a terminus ante quem,
of 10 June 1490, the date of the assignment of
dower to his widow Isabel (nee Hastings) [2]. Hunter
states with regard to his inspection of the MI and
heraldry at Darfield church,
' There is nothing to call to memory Thomas Bosvile
of the New-hall, who by his will, dated June 3, 1484,
directed tht he should be interred there;...' [3]
2. Further on in the same account re: the parish of
Darfield, Hunter provides a number of interesting
items concerning the Bosvile and Symmes families,
some of which was supplied by the antiquarian
Roger Dodsworth, himself a not disinterested
Bosvile descendant. Concerning the tenure of the
manor of Edderthorpe (or Ederthorpe) in Darfield, or
moieties thereof in the 1400's, Hunter wrote,
' In the next century, a part of the Bosviles became
seated here. At a court of the manor of Wood-hall,
15 Edward IV, it was found that Thomas Bosvile of
Ederthorpe was dead, holding lands of the manor,
and that Margaret the wife of William Symmes, and
Hellen the wife of Robert Pilley, his daughters and
coheirs, were of full age. Thomas Pilley, of Pilley,
in Tankersley, died seised of a moiety in
1 Edward VI.' [4]
If all the foregoing statements are correct, it is rather
obvious that Thomas Bosvile who died in or before 15 Edward
IV (i.e., no later than 3 March 1474/5) could not have been
the Thomas Bosvile of New-hall (i.e. Ardsley) who wrote a
will dated 3 June 1484. Further, Sir Thomas Bosvile of
Ardsley (d. after 3 June 1484, but before 10 June 1490) left
a number of children including a grandson and heir, John
Bosvile (d. 17 Oct 1506), so that the description of the
daughters and coheirs of Thomas of Edderthorpe further
serves to distinguish the two.
Should anyone have further relevant documentation (incl.
possibly details of a 1475 IPM for Thomas Bosvile of
Edderthorpe) that would be of great interest. I have
tentatively identified another Thomas Bosvile who was
likely the Edderthorpe tenant: if this is borne out, I will
post the relevant details (non-Plantagenet and otherwise).
Cheers,
John *
NOTES
[1] Gary Boyd Roberts, The Royal Descents of 600 Immigrants
to the American Colonies or the United States (Baltimore:
Genealogical Publishing Company, 2004), pp. 316-7.
[2] A2A, Sheffield Archives: Spencer Stanhope Muniments
[SpSt/1 - SpSt/172] , Deeds concerning Cannon Hall,
SpSt/140/1
[3] Joseph Hunter, South Yorkshire (1831), II:117.
[4] Hunter, ibid., II:119.
* John P. Ravilious
John P. Ravilious
Hello All,
In the prior message in this thread, I noted existence of
evidence that Thomas Bosvile of Edderthorpe, co. Yorks. could
not be the same individual as Sir Thomas Bosvile of Ardsley.
The history of the tenure of Edderthorpe, co. Yorks. as
provided by Rev. Hunter prior to the death of Thomas Bosvile,
prior to 3 March 1474/5, is of limited use in this matter, but
fortunately there is evidence that allows the
John Bosvile, Esq., of Ardsley died on 15 Aug 1442, having
married (1stly) Mary Barley, coheir of Woodhall in Darfield,
co. Yorks., and (2ndly) Isabel Cresacre, daughter of Percival
Cresacre of Barnborough, co. Yorks. and his wife Alice
Mounteney [1]. William Bosvile, eldest son and heir of John
by his 1st wife Mary Barley, inherited his father's lands at
Ardsley and elsewhere, but John's widow Isabel obviously held
lands in dower. Isabel lived for quite some time after John's
death, and married (2ndly) Henry Langton. There is a record
of the settlement of certain lands on Isabel and Henry
Langton, dated 20 Aug 1462:
' By William Norton of Bylburgh (Bilbrough, W.Yk.) to
Nicholas Wortlay, Robert Nevill, John Wodrove, Thomas
Everingam, esqs., and John Nevill of Leversege
(Liversedge, W.Yk.) of his manor of Newhall (p. Darfield)
with all his lands etc in Derfeld (Darfield), Wombuelhill
(Wombwell), Edyrthorp (Edderthorpe), Mylnhous (Millhouses)
and Midylwood (Middlewood) formerly the property of John
Bosewell father of William Bosewell, with a piece of land
called Elyntreflatt at Ederslay (Ardsley), for the lives
of Henry Langton and Isabella his wife, and after their
deaths, the manor etc. to go to Edward fitz William,
Robert Roclyff, John Dawnay and John Bosewell, clerk,
in fee simple.
Witnesses; John Sotell, esq., Adamer Burdhed, Thomas
Ann, Richard Syms, William Taillor, etc. ' [2]
This settlement was clearly intended for the support of
Isabel and her 2nd husband, but provides no detail as to
intent concerning the reversion of these lands following her
death, or possible subsequent sales or transfers. However, we
know that Edderthorpe was subsequently held in moieties. One
moiety was held by either William Bosvile of Ardsley or his
son and heir, the better-known Sir Thomas Bosvile of Ardsley
(d. after 3 June 1484). Gervase Bosvile of Ardsley,
ggg grandson of Isabel Cresacre's stepson William Bosvile,
was party to a fine by John Jackson concerning Edderthorpe in
Darfield in 1573 [3]. The second moiety is that found as
held by Thomas Bosvile of Edderthorpe at his death (1474/5),
and recorded as being subsequently divided among the
descendants of his daughter and coheir, Margaret (Bosvile)
Symmes. The record of fines between John Jackson of
Edderthorpe and the descendants of Margaret, as well as that
against Gervase Bosvile of Ardsley, evidences his successful
effort to acquire the entirety of Edderthorpe [4].
The problem then remains, where does Thomas Bosvile of
Edderthorpe enter into the picture. We know that Thomas'
daughter Margaret married William Symmes, son of Richard
Symmes of Barnsley, on or about 25 November 1462 [5]. Their
elder daughter Alice likely married Gerard Lacy, Esq. of
Brearley Hall sometime ca. 1480, as their youngest daughter
Joan was married to Robert Burton in 1484 or before [6].
Margaret Bosvile was herself likely born say 1444x1449, and
aged say 13 to 18 (probably closer to the middle of this
range) at the time of the marriage settlement. Based on
the foregoing, one would expect that her father Thomas
Bosvile was probably born within a comparatively wide range
of say 1420 to 1430.
This chronology would rule out any possibility that
Thomas Bosvile would be found among any grandchildren of John
Bosvile, whether by Mary Barley or Isabel Cresacre. Given
the holdings of Isabel Cresacre at Edderthorpe and elsewhere
under the 1462 settlement noted above, it would seem a good
possibility that Thomas could be a son of Isabel's by John
Bosvile. There is no evidence of a son Thomas given by Hunter
in his pedigree of Bosvile of Ardsley [7]. However, we are
fortunate to have the two following records that in fact
identify a Thomas Bosvile as a son of John Bosvile of Ardsley
and his wife Isabel Cresacre. First is a letter of attorney,
dated 4 May 1437, courtesy of the Access to Archives project:
' Reference: SpSt/4/11/9/32
Letters of Attorney, dated 4 May 1437:
' Of John Bossvyll of Newhall, Esq., and Isabella his
wife, to Thomas Bossvyll their son, and William Burden
their servant; to deliver seisin to John Barnby and
Margaret his wife, of a tenement in Barnbe, hamlet of
Calthorne.
Witnesses: Thomas Dodeworth, John Champnay, William
his son, Adam Chedyll, John Addy, and others.
Seals: 2 brown wax seals, on tags.
1) round, a shield lying aslant surmounted by a helm, with
a crest of a boar's head, background of foliage. Arms
& Legend defaced.
2) a round rectangle, an initial "O" (?)
Endorsed: Bossyvyle to Barnby.' [8]
The second record, interestingly, is the will of John
Bosvile of Ardsley, dated 10 Sep 1441 and proved 23 Aug 1442,
from which Rev. Hunter himself provided the following:
" His will bears date in the year of his death. He
desires to be buried in the church of All Saints at
Darfield. He mentions his wife Isabel, and Thomas and
Edmund his sons. He names as executors Isabel, James
Cresacre, and ___ Mirfield; and for supervisors, Maud
countess of Cambridge and Percival Cresacre.' [9]
Why Thomas and Edmund Bosvile were not included in the
pedigree of the family given by Rev. Hunter 2 pages earlier
is uncertain, but this was evidently either an oversight, or
was due to lack of space. Thomas Bosvile was evidently born
some time before 4 May 1416, as he was certainly of age when
directed to give seisin under the letter of attorney dated
4 May 1437 cited above. From the extract of John Bosvile's
will of 1442, it would appear that the older sons had been
provided for, hence only Thomas and Edmund being named. We
know from the court record of 1475 cited by Hunter that
Thomas Bosvile held Edderthorpe (or the moiety thereof) at
his death in or before that year: the history of the tenure
of the moieties of the manor is at least somewhat clearer
following his death.
Following then is a corrected (if partial) pedigree of
Bosvile, identifying the place of Thomas Bosvile of
Edderthorpe in his family:
Percival = Alice
Cresacre I Mounteney
of Barnborough I
I
<A> I
1) Mary = John Bosville = 2) Isabel = Henry
Barley I of Ardsley I Cresacre Langton
______I d. 1442 I
I __________I____________________
I I I I I I I
William Richard Percival <sibs> Thomas Bosvile
Bosvile of Bosvile of Bosvile of Edderthorpe
Ardsley Gunthwaite dspm 1474/5
I I I
V V _______________I____
I I
Margaret Helen
m. William m. Robert
Symmes Pylley
As given above, there is no direct evidence which states
that the moiety of Edderthorpe was granted to Thomas Bosvile,
son of John Bosvile of Ardsley. Should anyone note any such
evidence or reference to same, that would be of great interest
to myself and any other descendants (Farrar, Lacy, Holdsworth,
& c.).
Cheers,
John *
NOTES
[1] John Bosvile died 'on the Friday after the Feast of the
Assumption, 20 Henry VI. 1441 ' acc. to Hunter II:113;
however, the regnal year 20 Henry VI was from 31 August
1441 to 31 August 1442, so that the correct date is 18
Aug 1442. The will of John Bosvill was proved 23 Aug
1442 [Visitations of the North II:55, cites Wills in
the York Registry, 1389 to 1514, p. 20].
[2] A2A, Sheffield Archives: Title Deeds, SY293/Z/4/1
[3] 'Gervas Bossvyll, esq.', deforciant in a fine with John
Jackson (plaintiff) concerning lands in Ederthorppe in
Darfield, 1573 [Yorks. Feet of Fines II:37].
[4] Of the moiety of Edderthorpe which descended to the
coheirs of William Symmes of Barnsley, co. Yorks.
A. Descendants of Alice (Symmes) Lacy:
Hugh Lacy, Esq., of Brearley is recorded as having held
' one-sixth of the Manor of Ethesthorpe ' at his death
in 1573 [Holmes, The Farrar's Island Family and Its
English Ancestry (Baltimore: Gateway Press, 1986),
pp. 90-91. Details of Hugh Lacy's IPM (1573), from
Tom Sutcliffe, The Brearley Halls, Upper
and Lower, in Transactions of the Halifax Antiquarian
Society (Sept. 1922), IV:131.]
' John Lacye, esq., son and heir of Hugh Lacye, esq.',
deforciant in a fine with John Jackson, de Ederthrope
(plaintiff) concerning a third part of land in Mylnhowse
and Greathaughton, and a third part of the moiety of 3
messuages with lands in Derfeld and Edderthorppe als.
Eddirthorppe, before Easter term 20 Elizabeth (1578)'
[Yorkshire Archaeological and Topographical Association,
Feet of Fines of the Tudor Period [Record Series (1888),
Part II, Series V], II:115]
' John Lacye de Brereley, esq., and Ann his wife, and
John Lacye, gent., his son and heir apparent',
deforciants in a fine with John Jackson, de Edderthrope,
gent. (plaintiff) concerning the third part of lands in
Mylnhowse, and a third part of the moiety of 3 messuages
with lands in Derfeld and Edderthorpe als. Edirthorpe,
before Trinity term 21 Elizabeth (1579)' [Yorkshire
Archaeological and Topographical Association,
Feet of Fines of the Tudor Period [Record Series (1888),
Part II, Series V], II:137]
B. Descendants of Isabel (Symmes) St. Paul:
' John Seyntpall, esq. ' was deforciant in a fine of 1542
concerning " 4 messuages with lands and a third part of
a moiety of 6 messuages with lands in Barnesley, Holand,
Ederthorp, Derfeld, Thirnscoo, and Swayth. " [Yorkshire
Archaeological and Topographical Association, Feet of
Fines of the Tudor Period [Record Series (1887), Part
I, Series II], I:98]
C. Descendants of Joan (Symmes) Burton:
' Thomas Trygot and Johanna his wife ', deforciants in a
fine of 1528 concerning " the Manor of Highburton and 70
messuages, 4 mills, with lands in Riley, Melton, Shelley,
Collersley, North Crosland, Lokwood, Thurstonland,
Lyndtwayte, Cumberworth, Dodworth, Barnesley, Carleton
near Ruston, Harlyngton and Hulland, a third part of 2
messuages with land in Thurnsto and Worsburgh, and a
sixth part of 3 messuages with lands in Ederthorp, and
the advowson of the chantry of St. Mary in the parish of
Highburton. ' [Yorkshire Archaeological and Topographical
Association, Feet of Fines of the Tudor Period [Record
Series (1887), Part I, Series II], I:52]
Their son, ' Robert Trigott, esq. ', deforciant in a fine
of 1544 (1544 - Easter Term, 36 Henry VIII) concerning
" A third part of a moiety of 4 messuages with lands in
Edderthorp and Derfeld." [Yorkshire Archaeological and
Topographical Association, Feet of Fines of the Tudor
Period [Record Series (1887), Part I, Series II], I:109]
His son, 'Bartholomew Trygott, esq. ', deforciant in a
fine with John Jackson (plaintiff) concerning a third
part of the moiety of 3 messuages with lands in Darfeld
and Edderthorppe, 1577 [Yorkshire Archaeological and
Topographical Association, Feet of Fines of the Tudor
Period [Record Series (1888), Part II, Series V], II:97]
[5] Rev. Hunter kindly provided the following:
' I have seen the settlement made on William and Margaret
Symmes, by Richard Symmes, of Barnsley, father of
William, who settles upon them three messuages and thirty
acres of land, in Thurnscoe, four acres in Milnehouse,
near Darfield; and an annual rent of 2s. out of a messuage
at Barnsley; remainder, if no issue, to Henry, brother
of William. It is dated 25 Nov. 2 Edward IV. 1463.'
[Hunter, South Yorkshire, p. 119]. The regnal year 2
Edward IV was from 4 March 1461/2 to 3 March
1462/3, so the correct date was actually 25 Nov 1462.
[6] Concerning the marriage of Joan Symmes, younger daughter
of William Symmes and Margaret Bosvile, to Robert Burton,
Esq., of Kirkburton and North Crossland, co. Yorks.
in 1484 or before, we have the following from Alfred
Ellis:
' K. 66. Richard Symmes & Hugh Boseville, Rafe Dodworth &
Rafe Barnby delivered & confirmed to Robert Birton, son &
heire apparent of John Birton & Jone his wife, one of the
daughters of William Symmes lately deceased, their mann'r
of North Crossland & the rent of 4s. goeing out of the Land
of John Meathley of Horbury with the appurtenances in Ryley
in the tenure of Oliuer Lockwood, & the 4 part of the
mann'r of Meltham which they had of the guift of the
foresaid John Birton. Wittnesse John Kay of Woodsom Esq.
William Dodworth Esq. John Storthes, John Goldethorp.
Dat at North Crossland, 2 R. 3. (1484). ' [Alfred S.
Ellis, Yorkshire Deeds, YAJ XII:424, cites "the Writeings
of John Ramsden of Lascelhall, Esq." ]
[7] This pedigree gives William Bosvile of Ardsley as the
sole (indicated) issue of John Bosvile by Mary Barley.
By Isabel Cresacre, John Bosvile is shown as having
sons Richard ('settled by his parents at Gunthwaite in
Peniston'), Percival, James, and John, and a daughter
'Elizabeth, married Thomas Anne' [Hunter, South Yorkshire
II:111].
[8] A2A, West Yorkshire Archive Service, Bradford:
Spencer-Stanhope Manuscripts, SpSt/1-SpSt/4,
SpSt/4/11/9/32
[9] Hunter, South Yorkshire II:113.
* John P. Ravilious
John P. Ravilious
The first paragraph in this post should have ended as shown
below.
" In the prior message in this thread, I noted existence of
evidence that Thomas Bosvile of Edderthorpe, co. Yorks. could
not be the same individual as Sir Thomas Bosvile of Ardsley.
The history of the tenure of Edderthorpe, co. Yorks. as
provided by Rev. Hunter prior to the death of Thomas Bosvile,
prior to 3 March 1474/5, is of limited use in this matter, but
fortunately there is evidence that allows the identification
of his parentage and position in the Bosvile pedigree to be
resolved. "
Cheers,
John
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