Genealogy site finds links between Bush, Churchill and Princess Di
Sam Sloan
Bush.
http://www.usatoday.com/tech/webguide/2002-09-18-bush-genealogy_x.htm
What is the opinion here on this?
Sam Sloan
D. Spencer Hines
Sir Winston Churchill, of course.
Nothing new.
"It may be said that, thanks to the 'clercs', humanity did evil for two
thousand years, but honoured good. This contradiction was an honour to
the human species, and formed the rift whereby civilisation slipped into
the world." "La Trahison des clercs" [The Treason of the Intellectuals]
(1927) Julien Benda (1867-1956)
Ubique Quo Fas Et Gloria Ducunt --- Motto of the Royal Artillery
All replies to the newsgroup please. Thank you kindly. All original
material contained herein is copyright and property of the author. It
may be quoted only in discussions on this forum and with an attribution
to the author, unless permission is otherwise expressly given, in
writing.
------------------
D. Spencer Hines
Lux et Veritas et Libertas
Vires et Honor.
"Sam Sloan" <sl...@ishipress.com> wrote in message
news:3.0.6.32.2002110...@ishipress.com...
John Steele Gordon
Henry Spencer of Badley, Northamptonshire, the supposed mutual ancestor of
Diana, Princess of Wales (who was, of course, a Spencer), and Winston
Churchill (who was also a Spencer) is the ancestor of both Presidents Bush,
as well as George Washington, Calvin Coolidge, and Franklin Roosevelt
(twice). He is, through Kenelm Cheseldine, immigrant to Maryland, my
ancestor as well.
Diana is also distantly related, through other ancestors, to the Presidents
Adams, Herbert Hoover, Millard Fillmore, FDR (several times), Richard
Nixon, Woodrow Wilson, William Howard Taft, Harry Truman, and Calvin
Coolidge. And, again, me, also several times.
As Diana's great, great grandparents, Frank Work and Ellen Wood, were
Americans of colonial New England descent, there are millions of Americans
who are distantly related to her.
It won't get you a grace and favor apartment at Kensington Palace.
See Gary Boyd Roberts, Ancestors of American Presidents.
JSG
Ed Mann
Selected Descendants of Henry Spencer
1 Henry Spencer - 1477 ref #: AAP:239
+Isabella Lincoln ref #: AAP:239
2 Sir John Spencer ref #: AAP:239
+Anne Empson ref #: AAP:239
3 Jane Spencer ref #: AAP:239
+William Saunders
4 Alice Saunders
+John Cooke - 1515
5 Sir Anthony Cooke aka: Knt. ref #: (BPci:798)
+Ann FitzWilliam 1492 - 1588
6 Elizabeth Cooke 1528 - 1606 ref #: (BPci:182)
+Sir John Russell aka: Lord Russell 1521 - 1584 ref #: BPci:182
7 Anne Russell - 1639 ref #: BPci:182
+Sir Henry Somerset aka: 5th Earl / 1st Marquess of Worcester 1577 - 1646 ref #: F255:3
8 Sir Edward Somerset aka: 2d Marquess of Worcester 1600 - 1667 ref #: BPci:173
+Elizabeth Dormer - 1635 ref #: (BPci:173)
9 Sir Henry Somerset aka: 1st Duke of Beaufort 1629 - 1699/00 ref #: BPci:173
+Mary Capell 1630 - 1714/15 ref #: (BPci:173)
10 Sir Charles Somerset aka: 4th Marquess of Worcester 1660 - 1698 ref #: BPci:173
+Rebecca Child - 1712 ref #: (BPci:173)
11 Henrietta Somerset 1690 - 1726 ref #: BPci:173
+Sir Charles Fitzroy aka: K.G. / 2d Duke of Grafton 1683 - 1757 ref #: BPci:942
12 Isabella Fitzroy aka: Marchioness of Hertford 1726 - 1782 ref #: (BPci:942)
+Sir Francis Seymour aka: K.G. / 1st Marquess of Hertford 1718 - 1794 ref #: BPci:1090
13 Adm. Sir Hugh Seymour 1759 - 1801 ref #: BPci:1090
+Anna Horatia Waldegrave 1759 - 1801 ref #: (BPci:2228)
14 Sir Horace Beauchamp Seymour 1791 - 1851 ref #: BPci:1090
+Elizabeth Malet Palk - 1827 ref #: (BPci:1090)
15 Adelaide Horatia Elizabeth Seymour 1825 - 1877 ref #: BPci:1091
+Sir Frederick Spencer aka: 4th Earl Spencer 1798 - 1857 ref #: BPci:2045
16 Sir Charles Robert Spencer aka: K.G. / 6th Earl Spencer 1857 - 1922 ref #: BPci:2045
+Margaret Baring 1868 - 1906 ref #: BPci:1836
17 Sir Albert Edward John Spencer aka: 7th Earl Spencer 1892 - 1975 ref #: (see notes)
+Cynthia Eleanor Beatrix Hamilton aka: Lady Cynthia Hamilton D.C.V.O. 1897 - 1972
18 Sir Edward John Spencer aka: 8th Earl Spencer 1924 - 1992 ref #: (AACPW:22)
+Frances Ruth Burke Roche 1936 - ref #: AACPW:22.6
19 Diana Frances Spencer 1961 - 1997 ref #: AAP:347
6 Richard Cooke aka: Edward Cooke 1531 - 1576
+Alice Caunton 1548 -
7 Francis Cooke aka: Mayflower passenger 1583 - 1663 ref #: AAP:257
+Hester le Mahieu 1585 - 1666 ref #: AAP:257
8 Jane Cooke ref #: AAP:257
+Experience Mitchell ref #: AAP:257
9 Elizabeth Mitchell ref #: AAP:257
+John Washburn, Jr. ref #: AAP:257
10 Mary Washburn ref #: AAP:257
+Samuel Kingsley, Jr. ref #: AAP:257
11 Samuel Kingsley III ref #: AAP:257
+Mary ref #: AAP:257
12 Silence Kingsley ref #: AAP:257
+Samuel Herrick ref #: AAP:257
13 Sarah Herrick ref #: AAP:245
+Nathaniel Butler ref #: AAP:245
14 Samuel Herrick Butler 1785 - 1851 ref #: AAP:211
+Judith Livingston 1785 - 1858 ref #: AAP:211
15 Courtland Philip Livingston Butler 1813 - 1891 ref #: AAP:211
+Elizabeth Slade Pierce 1822 - 1901 ref #: AAP:211
16 Mary Elizabeth Butler 1850 - 1897 ref #: AAP:211
+Robert Emmet Sheldon 1845 - 1917 ref #: AAP:211
17 Flora Sheldon 1872 - 1920 ref #: AAP:209
+Samuel Prescott Bush 1863 - 1948 ref #: AAP:209
18 Sen. Prescott Sheldon Bush 1895 - 1972 ref #: AAP:209
+Dorothy Walker 1901 - ref #: AAP:209
19 Pres. George Herbert Walker Bush aka: 41st President of the United States 1924 - ref #: AAP:121
+Barbara Pierce 1925 - ref #: AAP:209
20 George Walker Bush aka: 43d President of the United States
D. Spencer Hines
[1819-1911] was a protégé of Commodore Cornelius Vanderbilt [1794-1877]
among his other talents.
Diana, Princess of Wales and President George W. Bush are 17th cousins,
once removed, by their descent from Henry Spencer and Isabella
Lincoln ---- not exactly kissing cousins.
Winston and George W. are 16th cousins, once removed. Can anyone guess
who the common ancestors are?
Diana is Winston's 4th cousin, twice removed, by another set of common
ancestors ---- Henry Paget, 1st Earl of Uxbridge, and Jane Champagné.
Here is some interesting information on him and his son:
From: "David Read" <da...@dreadful.demon.co.uk>
Newsgroups: soc.genealogy.medieval,soc.history.medieval
Sent: Sunday, February 24, 2002 10:32 AM
Subject: Re: Diana, Princess of Wales's Cousin?
| In article <KB1e8.405$7l5....@eagle.america.net>, D. Spencer Hines
| <D._Spence...@aya.yale.edu> writes
| >Indeed.
| >
| >Good Show, Leo.
| >
| >4th Cousins, twice removed.
| >
| >The common ancestors being Henry [formerly Bayly] Paget, [1744-1812],
| >3rd Earl [overall, although the 1st Earl of a new creation ---- DSH]
of
| >Uxbridge, and Jane Champagné [1742-1817], daughter of The Very
Reverend
| >Arthur Champagné, Dean of Clonmacnoise.
| >
| >The son of the 3rd Earl of Uxbridge, Henry William Paget, the 4th
Earl,
| >commanded the Anglo-Belgian cavalry at Waterloo and lost a leg there.
| >
| >There's a rather famous story surrounding that incident, which
perhaps
| >David Read will tell us. Rest assured that Sir Winston knew the
story
| >too ---- although this 4th Earl, is not the ancestor of Sir Winston.
He
| >_is_ the ancestor of Diana ---- and was created Marquis of Anglesey,
| >three weeks after the action at Waterloo.
The son, who lost the leg, is Diana's 4th Great-Grandfather.
| The fullest account I know of which describes this famous loss of
limb
| is to be found in the biography of the 1st Marquess Anglesey, written
by
| the 7th Marquess, and includes the following:-
|
| "'Just as Sir H. Vivian's Brigade were going down to the charge,'
| wrote Wildman the day after the battle, `Lord Uxbridge was struck
by
| a grape shot on the right knee which shattered the joint all to
| pieces. I did not see him fall & went on to the charge, but soon
| missed him and perceived Seymour taking him to the rear.' The Duke
| told his brother William (also on the day after the battle) that
| Uxbridge was wounded when talking to him `during the last attack,
| almost by the last shot'. To Stanhope Wellington explained that he
| was on the side from which the shot proceeded, and that it passed
| over the neck of his horse till it reached Uxbridge. The Duke
| supported him and prevented his falling from the saddle. `Writing
as
| a very old man, and thirty-seven years after the event, Uxbridge
| himself remembered that he was hit 'in the low ground beyond La
Haye
| Sainte, and perhaps 1/4 of an hour before Dusk, at the moment when
I
| was quitting the Duke to join Vivian's Brigade of Hussars which I
| had sent for, being the only fresh Corps I had'. In the popular
| version Uxbridge exclaims `By God, sir, I've lost my leg!'
| Wellington momentarily removes the telescope from his eye,
considers
| the mangled limb, says `By God, sir, so you have!' and resumes his
| scrutiny of the victorious field." p.149
|
| from _One-Leg: The Life and Letters of Henry William
Paget,
| First Marquess of Anglesey, K.G., 1768-1854_, Jonathan Cape 1961.
|
| A direly punning comic verse, _Epitaph for the Tablet in Memory of
the
| Marquess of Anglesey's leg_ by Thomas Gaspey runs thus:-
|
| Here rests, and let no saucy knave
| Presume to sneer and laugh,
| To learn that mouldering in the grave
| Is laid a British _calf_.
|
| For he who writes these lines is sure
| That those who read the whole
| Will find such laugh were premature,
| For here, too, lies a _sole_.
|
| And here five little ones repose,
| Twin-born with other five;
| Unheeded by their brother _toes_,
| Who now are all _alive_.
|
| A _leg_ and _foot_ to speak more plain
| Lie here, of one commanding;
| Who, though his wits he might retain,
| Lost half his _understanding_.
|
| And when the guns, with thunder fraught,
| Pour'd bullets thick as hail,
| Could only in this way be taught
| To give his foe _leg-bail_.
|
| And now in England, just as gay -
| As in the battle brave -
| Goes to the rout, review, or play,
| _With one foot in the grave_.
|
| Fortune in vain here showed her spite,
| For he will still be found,
| Should England's sons engage in fight,
| Resolved to stand his _ground_.
|
| But fortune's pardon I must beg,
| She meant not to disarm;
| And when she lopped the hero's leg
| By no means sought his _h-arm_,
|
| And but indulged a harmless whim,
| Since he could walk with one,
| She saw _two legs_ were lost on him
| Who never meant to _run_.
|
| ............
|
| Incidentally, the genealogical table included in this book has Jane
| Champagné (not Champagne) as being born in 1746 rather than 1742.
|
| cheers,
| --
| David Read
Deus Vult.
"It may be said that, thanks to the 'clercs', humanity did evil for two
thousand years, but honoured good. This contradiction was an honour to
the human species, and formed the rift whereby civilisation slipped into
the world." "La Trahison des clercs" [The Treason of the Intellectuals]
(1927) Julien Benda (1867-1956)
Ubique Quo Fas Et Gloria Ducunt --- Motto of the Royal Artillery
All replies to the newsgroup please. Thank you kindly. All original
material contained herein is copyright and property of the author. It
may be quoted only in discussions on this forum and with an attribution
to the author, unless permission is otherwise expressly given, in
writing.
------------------
D. Spencer Hines
Lux et Veritas et Libertas
Vires et Honor.
"John Steele Gordon" <ance...@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:Uqcz9.16122$XG3....@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net...
A Tsar Is Born
Can we get him the same chauffeur?
Jean Coeur de Lapin
Todd A. Farmerie
> On Sat, 9 Nov 2002 18:55:15 +0000 (UTC), edl...@earthlink.net ("Ed
> Mann") wrote:
>
>>6 Richard Cooke aka: Edward Cooke 1531 - 1576
>>+Alice Caunton 1548 -
>>7 Francis Cooke aka: Mayflower passenger 1583 - 1663 ref #: AAP:257
>>+Hester le Mahieu 1585 - 1666 ref #: AAP:257
>
> The line breaks down here. Francis certainly was not born seven years
> after the death of his "father".
And not just because of the chronology. The ancestry of
Mayflower passenger Francis Cooke remains unknown. IIRC, he is
said to have been from Norwich, but it is not entirely clear that
that was his place of nativity, rather than him simply being a
member of the expatriot Walloon community there.
Also, generally when you see something like "Richard Cooke, also
known as Edward Cooke" it does not bode well, as there were few
people at this time who were known by two such distinct names.
taf
D. Spencer Hines
I too thought that looked fishy.
So, the 13th cousins, once removed ---- for Diana and George W. seems to
be off the mark.
I have them as 17th cousins, once removed, by their descent from Henry
Spencer and Isabella Lincoln ---- not exactly kissing cousins ---- as I
stated previously.
There may be a closer relationship between the two ---- I suspect there
is. And I suspect WAR knows what it is.
Leo, do you have a closer relationship between George W. and Diana?
As it is, I have a closer relationship to Diana, several of them in
fact, not that I give a rat's tail about it.
Sorry to say, the woman was a total airhead and has done significant
damage to the British Monarchy, in my opinion.
Prince Charles should never have married her ---- and then, once he had,
he should have treated her far better.
So, he shares a significant part of the blame as well.
Deus Vult.
"It may be said that, thanks to the 'clercs', humanity did evil for two
thousand years, but honoured good. This contradiction was an honour to
the human species, and formed the rift whereby civilisation slipped into
the world." "La Trahison des clercs" [The Treason of the Intellectuals]
(1927) Julien Benda (1867-1956)
Ubique Quo Fas Et Gloria Ducunt --- Motto of the Royal Artillery
All replies to the newsgroup please. Thank you kindly. All original
material contained herein is copyright and property of the author. It
may be quoted only in discussions on this forum and with an attribution
to the author, unless permission is otherwise expressly given, in
writing.
------------------
D. Spencer Hines
Lux et Veritas et Libertas
Vires et Honor.
"Todd A. Farmerie" <farm...@interfold.com> wrote in message
news:3DCD8AB5...@interfold.com...
Sutliff
(or any documented) ancestry, but his parents and origin remain unknown. His
occupation was a wool carder, which was certainly not of a status to be
linked to anyone in this pedigree.
Anyone interested in Mayflower ancestry should visit Caleb Johnson's web
site:
http://members.aol.com/mayflo1620/welcome.html
This is simply the best, most reliable and up to date information on the
internet.
Henry Sutliff
""Ed Mann"" <edl...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:000b01c28821$91942a60$6401a8c0@Ed...