Kings of Scotland
Leo Akershoek
Here is all I have. It is very, very little, almost not worth mentionning,
but, nevertheless, part of my own pedigree. It might not even be correct.
1. Duncan I, born 1001, murdered at Elgin (Moray) on August 1, 1040
He was married too Sybille of Northumberland, daughter of Siward Bjornsson
and Aelflaed of Bernicia. His parents were:-
2. Cronan Dunkeld
3. Bethoc Kenneth Mcalpin
For the other ancestors of Duncan, I have only the following male names,
ancestors of his mother, nothing at all on the ancestors of his father.
Their wifes, and consequently their ancestors, are a complete mystery to me.
6. Malcolm II, died 25-11-1034
12. Kenneth II, murdered 994
24. Malcolm I
48. Donald VI
96. Constantine II, died 952
192. Kenneth I, died 854
Kindest regards
Leo Akershoek
Stewart Baldwin
>I am looking for help to fill in the ancestors of Duncan I of Scotland.
>Here is all I have. It is very, very little, almost not worth mentionning,
>but, nevertheless, part of my own pedigree. It might not even be correct.
>1. Duncan I, born 1001, murdered at Elgin (Moray) on August 1, 1040
"Donnchad" in Gaelic. I don't know about the birthdate, as most
births are undocumented for this period. The list of Scottish kings
in "The New History of Ireland" [NHI] gives 15 Aug 1040 as the death
date.
>He was married too Sybille of Northumberland, daughter of Siward Bjornsson
>and Aelflaed of Bernicia. His parents were:-
>2. Cronan Dunkeld
Crínán, abbot of Dunkeld
>3. Bethoc Kenneth Mcalpin
Just Bethoc.
>For the other ancestors of Duncan, I have only the following male names,
>ancestors of his mother, nothing at all on the ancestors of his father.
>Their wifes, and consequently their ancestors, are a complete mystery to me.
> 6. Malcolm II, died 25-11-1034
[Máel Coluim mac Cináeda]
>12. Kenneth II, murdered 994
[Cináed mac Máel Coluim, d. 995 acc. to NHI]
>24. Malcolm I
[Máel Coluim mac Domnaill, d. 954]
>48. Donald VI
[Domnall mac Causantín, d. 900, usually called Donald II if a number
is used, as most historians don't count the Dalriadan kings in the
numbering scheme (and you would have to include some fictional kings
to number him as high as "VI" anyway).]
>96. Constantine II, died 952
Actually, Causantín mac Cináeda (Constantine I), who d. 876, and
should not be confused with his nephew Constantine II (son of Áed),
who died in 952.
>192. Kenneth I, died 854
Cináed mac Ailpín, d. 858, for whom see below for 12 additional
generations of ancestors.
The most detailed recent study is that of Marjorie O. Anderson, "Kings
and Kingship in Early Scotland" (Edinburgh and London, Scottish
Academic Press, 1973), which gives a very detailed account of the
primary source material. The line of descent from king Fergus (the
earliest ancestor who can be regarded as reasonably certain) is:
1. Fergus, King of Dál Riata (often anglicised as Dalriada)
2. Domangart mac Fergusa, King of Dalriada, d. ca. 503/7.
3. Gabrán mac Domangairt, King of Dalriada, d. ca. 558/560.
4. Áedán mac Gabráin, King of Dalriada, d. 17 Apr 608/9.
5. Eochaid Buide mac Áedáin, King of Dalriada, d. 629/31.
6. Domnall Brecc mac Echdach, King of Dalriada, d. 642.
7. Domangart mac Domnaill, King of Dalriada, d. 673.
8. Eochaid mac Domangairt, King of Dalriada, d. 697.
9. Eochaid mac Echdach, King of Dalriada, d. 733.
10. Áed Find mac Echdach, King of Dalriada, d. 778.
11. Eochaid mac Áeda, apparently did not rule, dates unknown.
12. Ailpín mac Echdach, King of Dalriada, d. 840?
13. Cinaed [Kenneth] mac Ailpín, King of the Scots and
Picts, d. 858.
To my knowledge, no good documentation exists for any female ancestors
of Bethoc. You will find occasional claims for wives of some of these
men in some sources, but they don't stand up well under close
scrutiny.
Stewart Baldwin
Sim Lee
>I am looking for help to fill in the ancestors of Duncan I of Scotland.
>Here is all I have. It is very, very little, almost not worth mentionning,
>but, nevertheless, part of my own pedigree. It might not even be correct.
>1. Duncan I, born 1001, murdered at Elgin (Moray) on August 1, 1040
>He was married too Sybille of Northumberland, daughter of Siward Bjornsson
>and Aelflaed of Bernicia. His parents were:-
>2. Cronan Dunkeld
>3. Bethoc Kenneth Mcalpin
>For the other ancestors of Duncan, I have only the following male names,
>ancestors of his mother, nothing at all on the ancestors of his father.
>Their wifes, and consequently their ancestors, are a complete mystery to me.
> 6. Malcolm II, died 25-11-1034
>12. Kenneth II, murdered 994
>24. Malcolm I
>48. Donald VI
>96. Constantine II, died 952
>192. Kenneth I, died 854
>Kindest regards
>Leo Akershoek
Hello there.
I use: http://www.dcs.hull.ac.uk/public/genealogy/royal/ to find stuff
about genealogy. I had a quick look for some of the names you asked
but _couldn't_ find anything. Perhaps you could look also. Good luck.
Sim.
Jared L Olar
few other things I can contribute.
On 21 Jan 1999 06:14:03 -0800 aker...@zeelandnet.nl (Leo Akershoek)
writes:
>I am looking for help to fill in the ancestors of Duncan I of
>Scotland.
[snip]
>1. Duncan I, born 1001, murdered at Elgin (Moray) on August 1, 1040
>He was married too Sybille of Northumberland, daughter of Siward
>Bjornsson and Aelflaed of Bernicia.
Sybil's parentage is unknown. Some sources show her as a daughter of
Siward Beornsson, Earl of Northumbria, but in fact all that is known is
that she was a kinswoman of Siward.
His parents were:-
>2. Cronan Dunkeld
About two or three years ago, Stewart Baldwin, Michael Davidson, and I
participated in a fascinating discussion here of the possible ancestry of
King Duncan's father Crinan, Lay Abbot of Dunkeld. Sir Iain Moncreiffe
of that Ilk, in his book THE HIGHLAND CLANS, offered the hypothesis that
Crinan's male lineage traced back to the kindred of St. Columba--a branch
of the great Irish family O'Neill--who were Abbots of Iona, Kells,
Dunkeld, etc. Nothing definite is known of Crinan's ancestry, but that
he was Lay Abbot of Dunkeld, and that Duncan mac Crinan's grandson
Aethelred was also Lay Abbot of Dunkeld, suggests that Crinan may have
belonged to that kindred.
Mike Davidson, however, argued that Crinan belonged to the Cinel
nGabhrain--that is, the Scottish royal family, the same family to which
Crinan's father-in-law King Malcolm II belonged. His reasons had to do
with succession customs in Gaelic culture--any man having or claiming
direct male descent from the founder of a royal family was eligible to
succeed, the closest male relatives being favored first. King Malcolm II
did a very good job of purging his dynasty of rival male claimaints, and
when he died the throne went to his daughter's son Duncan. But
succession could not go through the female line. That is why Mike
Davidson argued that Crinan must have been descended in the male line
from a cadet branch of the Cinel nGabhrain.
I'm not sure which hypothesis is correct, but Mr. Davidson's admittedly
deals respectfully with what we know of Gaelic succession customs of that
era. On the other hand, it is possible that Malcolm II may have done
just what many have thought he did--flouted the custom and insisted that
the throne pass through the female line to someone with no demonstrable
male ascent to the dynastic founder.
Hope this helps.
Jared
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sk...@ix.netcom.com
Baldwin) wrote:
>aker...@zeelandnet.nl (Leo Akershoek) wrote:
>
<SNIP>
>
>The most detailed recent study is that of Marjorie O. Anderson, "Kings
>and Kingship in Early Scotland" (Edinburgh and London, Scottish
>Academic Press, 1973), which gives a very detailed account of the
>primary source material. The line of descent from king Fergus (the
>earliest ancestor who can be regarded as reasonably certain) is:
>
> 1. Fergus, King of Dál Riata (often anglicised as Dalriada)
> 2. Domangart mac Fergusa, King of Dalriada, d. ca. 503/7.
> 3. Gabrán mac Domangairt, King of Dalriada, d. ca. 558/560.
> 4. Áedán mac Gabráin, King of Dalriada, d. 17 Apr 608/9.
> 5. Eochaid Buide mac Áedáin, King of Dalriada, d. 629/31.
> 6. Domnall Brecc mac Echdach, King of Dalriada, d. 642.
> 7. Domangart mac Domnaill, King of Dalriada, d. 673.
> 8. Eochaid mac Domangairt, King of Dalriada, d. 697.
> 9. Eochaid mac Echdach, King of Dalriada, d. 733.
>10. Áed Find mac Echdach, King of Dalriada, d. 778.
>11. Eochaid mac Áeda, apparently did not rule, dates unknown.
>12. Ailpín mac Echdach, King of Dalriada, d. 840?
>13. Cinaed [Kenneth] mac Ailpín, King of the Scots and
> Picts, d. 858.
Are there familiar modern-English equivalents of the names
Domangart
Gabran
Eochaid
Aed
Ailpin
above?
Todd A. Farmerie
>
> Are there familiar modern-English equivalents of the names
> Domangart
> Gabran
> Eochaid
> Aed
> Ailpin
> above?
>
None of them are in common use, although you do see Ailpin in the
surname M(a)cAlpin(e).
taf
Stewart Baldwin
>Are there familiar modern-English equivalents of the names
>Domangart
>Gabran
>Eochaid
>Aed
>Ailpin
> above?
None that I know of that would be considered genuine equivalents. It
was the case during the later Middle Ages that "Eugene/Eugenius" was
regarded as an equivalent for Eochaid, and "Hugh" was regarded as an
equivalent for Áed. (Modern Irish equivalents of thos two names are
Eochaidh and Aodh.) However, these were not genuine equivalents, as
the names did not have the same origin as their supposed equivalents.
Stewart Baldwin