Henry VIII and Mary Boleyn
Leo van de Pas
as there are several lines that end up in the USA, I thought this
information would be of interest to more people :
In the March 1997 issue of the Genealogist Magazine, the magazine of the
Society of Genealogists in England, a compelling case was made that Mary
Boleyn's children attributed to William Carey, were really fathered by
Henry VIII. I had heard this claim before, but this magazine's article came
with dates and very strong evidence. But still, officially they remain
William Carey's.
Mary Boleyn
born circa 1500/1504, died 19 July 1543
married (1) 31 January 1520/1521
William Cary, son of Thomas Carey, of Chilton, and Margaret Spencer (she is
a descendant of Edward III)
born circa 1495, died 22 June 1528
married (2)
Sir William Stafford
born circa 1512, died 1556
children :
(1st marriage?)
1.Catherine/Mary Cary
born circa 1524, died 15 January 1569 Hampton Court Palace
buried April 1569 Westminster Abbey
married circa April 1540
Sir Francis Knollys, son of Robert Knollys and
Lettice Penystone
born circa 1514, died 19 July 1596
children Generation II-1
2.Henry Carey, Baron Hunsdon
born 4 March 1526, died 23 July 1596 Somerset House
marriage contract 21 May 1545
Anne Morgan, daughter of Sir Thomas Morgan and Anne Whitney
died 19 January 1607
children Generation II-2
2nd marriage
3.NN Stafford (boy ? girl?)
born circa 1534/1535, died circa 1543
Generation II-1
1.Lettice Knollys
born 1539, died 25 December 1634 Drayton Basset
married (1) circa 1560/1565
Walter Devereux, 1st Earl of Essex, 2nd Viscount Hereford
son of Sir Richard Devereux and Lady Dorothy Hastings
born 16 September 1539, died 22 September 1579 Dublin Castle
married (2) 21 September 1578 Wanstead, Essex
Robert Dudley, Earl of Leicester, son of John Dudley,
Duke of Northumberland and Jane Guildford
born 24 June 1532/1533
died 4 September 1588 Cornbury
married (3) before August 1589
Sir Christopher Blount, son of James Blount, 6th Lord
Mountjoy amd Katherine Leigh
beheaded 18 March 1601 Tower Hill
children Generation III-1
2.Henry Knollys
born circa 1542, died 1582
married 1565
Margaret Cave, daughter of Sir Ambrose Cave and Margaret
Willington
died 1606
children Generation III-2
3.William Knollys, Earl of Banbury, Viscount Wallingford
born circa 1545, died 25 May 1632 London
married (1) after March 1573
The Hon. Dorothy Braye, daughter of Edmund Braye,
Lord Braye, and Jane Halliwell
born 1530, died 31 October 1605 Minty
buried Rotherfield Greys, Oxon.
married (2) contract 23 December 1605
Lady Elizabeth Howard, daughter of Lord Thomas Howard,
1st Earl of Suffolk, and Catherine Knyvett
baptised 11 August 1586 Saffron Walden
died 17 April 1658, buried Dorking, Surrey
he was childless
4.Edward Knollys
born circa 1546, died 1575
5.Sir Robert Knollys
born circa 1547, died 1619
6.Richard Knollys
born circa 1548, died 1596
7.Sir Francis Knollys
born circa 1550, died 1648
8.Sir Thomas Knollys
died after August 1596
9.Anne Knollys
born 1553 ?, died after 30 August 1608
married 19 November 1571
Thomas West, 2nd Lord Delawere, son of William West,
1st Baron Delawere and Elizabeth Strange
born circa 1556, died circa 24 March 1602
children Generation III-3
10.Elizabeth Knollys
married 1578
Sir Thomas Leighton
born 1535, died circa 1611
children ?
11.Katherine Knollys
buried 20 December 1632 Watton, Stone
married (1) October 1578
Gerald Fitzgerald, Baron Offaly, son of Gerald Fitzgerald,
11th Earl of Kildare, and Mabel Browne
born 28 December 1559 Maynooth, died June 1580
buried St.Alban's Abbey
married (2)
Sir Philip Boteler, of Watton Woodhall
died January 1592
children Generation III-4
Generation II-2
1.George Carey, 2nd Lord Hunsdon
born 1547, died 8 September 1603
buried Westminster Abbey
marriage contract 29 December 1574
Elizabeth Spencer, daughter of Sir John Spencer, of
Wormleighton, and Catherine Kitson
buried 2 March 1618 Westminster Abbey
children Generation III-5
2.John Carey, 3rd Lord Hunsdon
died April 1617 Hunsdon, buried Hunsdon
marriage contract 20 December 1576
Mary Hyde, daughter of Leonard Hyde
died 4 April 1627 London
children Generation III-6
3.The Hon. Henry Carey
4.The Hon. Thomas Carey
5.The Hon. Thomas Carey
6.The Hon. William Carey
7.The Hon. Sir Edmund Carey
married (1) Mary Crocker
married (2) Elizabeth Nevill
married (3) Judith Humphrey
children Generation III-7
8.Robert Carey, 1st Earl of Monmouth
born circa 1560, died 12 April 1593 Berwick-upon-Tweed
Elizabeth Trevannion, daughter of Sir Hugh Trevannion
and Sybilla Morgan
died before July 1641 (date will proven)
buried Rickmansworth
children Generation III-8
9.The Hon.NN Carey
10.The Hon. Catherine Carey
died 25 February 1603 Arundel House, London
married July 1563
Charles Howard, 1st Earl of Nottingham, son of
Lord William Howard, 1st Baron Howard of Effingham,
and Margaret Gamage
born circa 1536, died 14 December 1624 Haling House
nr.Croydon, Surrey
children Generation III-9
11.The Hon.Philadelphia Carey
died 3 February 1627, buried Langar, Notts.
married circa 1584
Thomas Scrope, 10th Lord Scrope of Bolton,
son of Henry Scrope, 9th Lord Scrope of Bolton,
and Lady Margaret Howard
born circa 1567, died 2 September 1609
buried Langar, Notts.
children Generation III-10
12.The Hon. Margaret Carey
married Sir Edward Hoby
children ?
Generation III-1
1st marriage :
1.Lady Penelope Devereux
born circa 1561, died 7 July 1607 Westminster
married (1) October 1581 Divorced 15 November 1605
Robert Rich, 1st Earl of Warwick, son of Robert Rich,
2nd Lord Rich, and Elizabeth Baldry
born December 1559, died 24 March 1619
married (2) 26 December 1605 Wanstead, Essex
Charles Blount, Earl of Devon, 8th Lord Mountjoy
son of James Blount, 6th Lord Mountjoy, and Katherine
Leigh
born circa 1562, died 3 April 1606 Savoy House, the Strand
children
2.Lady Dorothy Devereux
died 3 August 1619, buried Petworth
married (1) July 1583
Sir Thomas Perrott, son of Sir John Perrott, of
Haroldstone, and Anne Cheney
died February 1594
married (2) 1594
Henry Percy, 9th Earl of Northumberland, son of Henry Percy
8th Earl of Northumberland, and Catherine Nevill
born before 27 April 1564 Tynemouth Castle
died 5 November 1632, buried Petworth
4.Robert Devereux, 2nd Earl of Essex, 3rd Viscount Hereford
born 19 November 1566, beheaded 25 February 1601 Tower Hill
married 1590
Frances Walsingham, daughter of Sir Francis Walsingham
and Ursula St.Barbe
died 1632, buried 17 February 1632
children
4.Hon.Walter Devereux
died nr Roan (killed)
2nd marriage
5.Robert Dudley, Lord Denbigh
died 19 July 1584 Wanstead, buried Beauchamp Chapel, Warwick
Generation III-2
1.Lettice Knollys
died 1655, buried West Drayton
married before 15 October 1602
William Paget, 4th Lord Paget, son of Thomas Paget,
3rd Lord Paget, and Nazaret Newton
born 1572, died 29 August 1629, buried West Drayton
children
Generation III-3.
1.Elizabeth West
born 11 September 1573, died 15 January 1633
married 12 February 1594 Wherwell, co.Hants.
Herbert Pelham, son of Anthony Pelham and Margaret Hall
born circa 1564
children
2.Governor Thomas West, 3rd Lord Delawere
born 9 July 1577, died 7 June 1618 in Nova Scotia
married Cecily Sherley
3.Penelope West
born 9 September 1582, died circa 1619
married circa 1599
Herbert Pelham, son of Herbert Pelham and Catherine
Thatcher
born circa 1580, died 20 July 1624 Boston, County Lincoln
children
4.Governor Francis West
born 25 October 1586
died before 28 April 1634 (date will proven)
5.Capt. John West
born 14 December 1590, died circa 1659
married Anne
children
6.Nathaniel West
born 30 November 1592, died before February 1624
married Frances Greville
children
Generation III-4
1st marriage
1.Lettice Fitzgerald, Baroness Offaly
died 1 December 1658
married 1600
Sir Robert Digby, of Coleshill, son of Sir George Digby,
of Coleshill and Abigail Heveningham
died 24 May 1614
children
Generation III-5
1.Elizabeth Cary
died 23 April 1635
married
Sir Thomas Berkeley, son of Henry Berkeley, 7th Lord
Berkeley, and Lady Catherine Howard
born 11 July 1575 Callowdon
died 22 November 1611 Callowdon, buried St.Michael's
Coventry
children
Generation III-6
1.Hon. Blanche Carey
died 6 November 1651
married (1)
Christopher Peyton
married (2) 16 June 1605 Hunsdon, Herts.
Sir Thomas Wodehouse, 2nd Baronet, son of Sir Philip
Wodehouse, 1st Baronet, and Grizell Yelverton
died 18 March 1658
children
2.Hon.Anne Carey
married Sir Francis Lovell
children ?
3.Henry Carey, 1st Earl of Dover, 4th Lord Hunsdon
born circa 1580, buried 13 April 1666 Hunsdon
married (1) before 1608
Judith Pelham, daughter of Sir Thomas Pelham, of
Laughton, 1st Baronet, and Mary Walsingham
baptised 21 June 1590 Laughton
buried 1 November 1629 Hunsdon
married (2) 6 July 1630 London
Mary Morris, daughter of Richard Morris and Maud Daborne
baptised 10 May 1573 St.Leonard's, Eastcheap
buried 8 January 1649 St.Paul's Cathedral, London
children
Generation III-7
1.Sir Robert Carey
married Alletta Hogenhove
Generation III-8
1.Henry Carey, 2nd Earl of Monmouth
baptised 27 January 1596 Denham
died 13 June 1661 buried Rickmansworth
marriage contract 16 February 1620
Lady Martha Cranfield, daughter of Lionel Cranfield,
1st Earl of Middlesex, and Elizabeth Shepherd
baptised 12 July 1601 St.Michael's Bassishaw
died 10 April 1677 London
children
2.Hon.Thomas Carey
buried 1649 Westminster Abbey
married Margaret Smith
children
3.Lady Philadelphia Carey
died before 27 February 1655 (date will proven)
married 11 April 1611 St.Margaret's, Westminster
Sir Thomas Wharton, son of Philip Wharton, 3rd Lord Wharton
and Lady Frances Clifford
born circa 1587 Wharton Hall, died 17 April 1622
children
Generation III-9
1.Lady Elizabeth Howard
buried 31 March 1646 Greenwich, Kent
married (1)
Sir Robert Southwell
married (2) 26 October 1604 Chelsea, Midx.
John Stewart, Earl of Carrick, son of Robert Stewart,
Earl of Orkney, and Lady Janet Kennedy
died 22 June 1643/1645
children
2.Lady Frances Howard
buried 11 July 1628 Westminster Abbey
married (1) before 22 February 1590
Henry Fitzgerald, 12th Earl of Kildare, son of Gerald
Fitzgerald, 11th Earl of Kildare, and Mabel Browne
born 1562, died 30 September 1597 Drogheda
buried Kildare Cathedral
married (2) contract 27 May 1601
Henry Brooke, 11th Lord Cobham, son of William Brooke,
10th Lord Cobham, and Frances Newton
born 22 November 1564 Cobham Hall,
died 24 January 1619
children
3.Lady Margaret Howard
married Sir Richard Leveson
children ?
4.William Howard, Baron Howard of Effingham
born 27 December 1577, died 28 November 1615 Hampton, Midx
buried Chelsea
married 7 February 1597 Chelsea
Anne St.John, daughter of John St.John, 2nd Lord St.John
of Bletso, and Catherine Dormer
died 7 June 1638 London, buried Westminster Abbey
children
5.Charles Howard, 2nd Earl of Nottingham
born 17 September 1579 The Manor Place, Bletchingley
died 3 October 1642 Leatherhead, buried Reigate
married (1) 19 May 1597 Sheffield, in Fletching
Charity White, daughter of Robert White
died 18 December 1618
buried 20 December 1618 Fletching
married (2) 22 April 1620 London
Mary Cokayne, daughter of Sir William Cokayne
and Mary Morris
baptised 12 October 1598 London
died 6 February 1651, buried Reigate
childless
Generation III-10
1.Emanuel Scrope, Earl of Sunderland
born 1 Aughust 1584 Hunsdon, Herts.
died 30 May 1630
married 1609
Lady Elizabeth Manners, daughter of John Manners,
4th Earl of Rutland, and Elizabeth Charlton
died 16 March 1594 Langar
children by Martha Jeanes
Sources :
Burke's Extinct Peerages
London 1866, by Sir Bernard Burke
Burke's Peerage, 1938
The Complete Peerage
The Lineage and Ancestry of HRH Prince Charles
by Gerald Paget
Living Descendants of Blood Royal in America
by Count d'Angerville
The Complete Baronetage,
by George Edward Cokayne
Genealogists' Magazine
Journal of the Society of Genealogists
London
Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists who came
to America before 1700
by Weis and Sheppard
Hope this helps
Leo van de Pas
Sharp, Ann
Though I did not read this article, I wonder whether the author
considered the fact that Henry VIII did not acknowledge Mary Boleyn's
children born during her marriage to William Carey.
Henry acknowledged and provided for the Duke of Richmond
appropriately, for instance.
Mary's children, if also Henry's, would not have been Henry's first,
and Catherine/Mary Carey was married in Henry's lifetime, in fact at a
moment when he was temporarily single. Did Henry dower her?
Henry Carey would have been twenty at Henry VII's death; did Henry
provide for him or acknowledge him? Was his wife suitable for a Tudor?
Catherine/Mary and Henry Carey outlived William Carey (d. 1528) and
Mary Boleyn (d. 1543). Did Henry VIII take a parental interest in them
between the time they were orphaned and his own death in 1547?
These people did not have Victorian attitudes about illegitimacy,
especially offspring of the King.
A. Sharp
ax...@pge.com
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
John Carmi Parsons
by the then-unmarried Elizabeth Blount. Some sort of provision had to be
made for that son, including a surname. Mary Boleyn's children were born
after she was married, so their legal father was her husband Carey; they
needed no surname, and strictly speaking apart from whatever wealth he chose
to bestow on Mary and her husband, Henry didn't have to provide for Mary's
children in the same way he did for Henry FitzRoy. Likewise, the king never
acknowledged John Parrott, whose mother (a Beaumont) was married, nor Audrey,
whose mother, a court laundress, was unmarried but whose paternity was
acknowledged by another servant Henry paid handsomely for doing so.
Henry provided well for Audrey, who made a good marriage but died childless in
early adulthood. Edward VI made John Parrott a knight of the Bath, and he did
well in various official capacities in the reign of Elizabeth I, who also
provided well for the Careys.
John Parsons
Leo van de Pas
The article points out that Henry Fitzroy was only acknowledged, aged
about five, when it was obvious that Catherine of Aragon was not going to
have any sons. There
has been speculation Henry VIII may have intended to make
this illegitimate son the next king.
In those days certain hypocritical rules applied. To have an affaire
with an unmarried girl was a TERRIBLE thing to do as this ruined her
chances to get married. As a result a compliant spouse was found. Having an
affaire with a married woman seemed different.
The article points out that the daughter of Mary Boleyn
was born at the height of the affaire between Henry VIII and Mary Boleyn.
And this person found that William Carey was given estates and all sorts of
things at the time of the birth of both children.
The laws of the church did not differentiate between marriages and
affaires in certain instances. Henry VIII wanted his marriage to Catherine
of Aragon voided because she had been married to his own brother. The
affaire with Mary Boleyn placed Anne Boleyn in the same position and therefor
he could not/should not marry her either...........
Pretending there had nothing been between Mary and Henry VIII was the
easiest, as otherwise Queen Elizabeth I would have been illegitimate, in
catholic eyes she already was.
You really should try to find that article. I had heard the rumours before
and thought 'withful' thinking but this article made a lot of sense.
Another point this article gave was the selfishness of Henry VIII, would he
share the favours of his mistress? Even with her husband?
Leo
Leo van de Pas
>Leo van de Pas wrote:
>> Mary Boleyn
>> born circa 1500/1504, died 19 July 1543
>> married (1) 31 January 1520/1521
>> William Cary, son of Thomas Carey, of Chilton, and Margaret Spencer (she is
>> a descendant of Edward III)
>
>
....with apologies to Mike Talbot :-)
Edward III
1312-1377
I
John of Gaunt Duke of Lancaster
1340-1399
I
John Beaufort, Earl of Somerset
1373-1410
I
Edmund Beaufort, Duke of Somerset
1406-1455
I
Eleanor Beaufort
I
Margaret Spencer
>> born circa 1495, died 22 June 1528
>> married (2)
>> Sir William Stafford
>> born circa 1512, died 1556
>
>Any relations with other Staffords?
....Sadly I don't know the names of his parents otherwise
I would have recorded them. Does anyone know? (Ed Mann?)
>
>> 3.William Knollys, Earl of Banbury, Viscount Wallingford
>> born circa 1545, died 25 May 1632 London
>> married (2) contract 23 December 1605
>> Lady Elizabeth Howard, daughter of Lord Thomas Howard,
>> 1st Earl of Suffolk, and Catherine Knyvett
>> baptised 11 August 1586 Saffron Walden
>> died 17 April 1658, buried Dorking, Surrey
>> he was childless
>
>Didn't his second wife bear several children while she
>was married to William Knollys, but who were fathered
>by her lover and later second husband, lord Vaux of
>Harrowden? I remember that tis topic discussed here
>last June (or maybe it was in a.t.r?)
.........that is why I 'delicately' said 'he' was childless
because yes you are quite right. One of those sons tried
to claim his titles.
>
>> 8.Robert Carey, 1st Earl of Monmouth
>> born circa 1560, died 12 April 1593
................my apologies, this is a typing error
it should be 12 April 1639
Berwick-upon-Tweed
>> Elizabeth Trevannion, daughter of Sir Hugh Trevannion
>> and Sybilla Morgan
>> died before July 1641 (date will proven)
>> buried Rickmansworth
>> children Generation III-8
>
>and later...
>
>> Generation III-8
>> 1.Henry Carey, 2nd Earl of Monmouth
>> baptised 27 January 1596 Denham
>
>Was he really baptised 3 years after his father's death?
>Or maybe 1593 is the date of 1st earrl's marriage, not
>his death?
>
>> 2.Lady Dorothy Devereux
>> died 3 August 1619, buried Petworth
>> married (1) July 1583
>> Sir Thomas Perrott, son of Sir John Perrott, of
>> Haroldstone, and Anne Cheney
>
>Was this that Sir John Perrott who also alleged to be
>a Henry VIII's son?
>
.........Yes.
>> Generation III-3.
>> 1.Elizabeth West
>> born 11 September 1573, died 15 January 1633
>> married 12 February 1594 Wherwell, co.Hants.
>> Herbert Pelham, son of Anthony Pelham and Margaret Hall
>> born circa 1564
>
>> 3.Penelope West
>> born 9 September 1582, died circa 1619
>> married circa 1599
>> Herbert Pelham, son of Herbert Pelham and Catherine Thatcher
>> born circa 1580, died 20 July 1624 Boston, County Lincoln
>
>Here two sisters married to two different Herberts Pelhams.
>Are they related somehow?
.........Yes, father and son. Herbert as a widower married a West and his
son her sister.
Any relations to later duke of
>Newcastle?
...........I couldn't tell.
>
>> 3.Henry Carey, 1st Earl of Dover, 4th Lord Hunsdon
>> born circa 1580, buried 13 April 1666 Hunsdon
>> married (1) before 1608
>> Judith Pelham, daughter of Sir Thomas Pelham, of
>> Laughton, 1st Baronet, and Mary Walsingham
>
>Is this Sir Thomas Pelham a great-great-grandfather
>of Thomas Pelham-Holles, Duke of Newcastle, british
>18-century prime minister?
...........Yes.
>
>> 1.Emanuel Scrope, Earl of Sunderland
>> born 1 Aughust 1584 Hunsdon, Herts.
>> died 30 May 1630
>
>Was he also 11th Lord Scrope of Bolton?
............Yes.
Best wishes
Leo van de Pas
ED MANN
>
> Leo van de Pas wrote:
> > born circa 1500/1504, died 19 July 1543
> > married (1) 31 January 1520/1521
> > William Cary, son of Thomas Carey, of Chilton, and Margaret Spencer (she is
> > a descendant of Edward III)
>
Direct Descendants of Edward III of England
1 King Edward III of England b: 13 Nov 1312 d: 21 Jun 1377 ref #:
F229:12
+Philippa de Hainault b: 24 Jun 1311 d: 15 Aug 1369 ref #: Ä103-34
2 Sir John of Gaunt aka: John Plantagenet b: Mar 1339/40 d: 3 Feb
1398/99 ref #: F15:11
*2nd Wife of John of Gaunt:
*3rd Wife of John of Gaunt:
+Katherine Röet aka: Katherine Swynford b: 1350 d: 10 May 1403
3 Sir John Beaufort aka: Marquess of Dorset b: Abt. 1372 d: 16 Mar
1409/10 ref #: F16:10
+Margaret de Holand b: 1385 d: 30 Dec 1429 ref #: F140:8ii
4 Sir Edmund Beaufort aka: 4th Earl / 1st Duke of Somerset b: Abt.
1406 d: 22 May 1455 ref #: F17:9
+Alianor Beauchamp b: 1407 d: 4 Mar 1466/67 ref #: F13:9i
5 Alianor Beaufort aka: Countess of Wilshire d: 16 Aug 1501 ref #:
F53:5
*2nd Husband of Alianor Beaufort:
+Sir Robert Spencer aka: Knt. b: Abt. 1435 d: Abt. 1510 ref #:
BxP:424
6 Margaret Spencer b: Abt. 1472 ref #: F54:4
--
FWIW; AFAIK; IMHO; YMMV; yadda, yadda, yadda.
Regards, Ed Mann mailto:edl...@mail2.lcia.com
References:
Ä = Weis, _Ancestral_Roots_, 7th ed.
AACPW = Roberts & Reitwiesner, _American Ancestors and Cousins of
the Princess of Wales_, [page].
AAP = Roberts, _Ancestors_of_American_Presidents_, [page] or
[Pres. # : page].
BP1 = _Burke's_Presidential_Families_, 1st ed. [page].
BPci = _Burke's_Peerage_, 101st ed., [page].
BRF = Weir, _Britain's_Royal_Families_, [page].
BxP = _Burke's_Dormant_&_Extinct_Peerages_, [page].
EC1 = Redlich, _Emperor_Charlemagne's_Descendants_, Vol I, [page].
EC2 = Langston & Buck, _Emperor_Charlemagne's_Descendants_, Vol II,
[page].
EC3 = Buck & Beard, _Emperor_Charlemagne's_Descendants_, Vol II,
[page].
F = Faris, _Plantagenet_Ancestry_, [page:para].
Π= Hardy, _Colonial_Families_of_the_Southern_States_of_America_,
[page].
S = Stuart, _Royalty_for_Commoners_, 2d ed. Caveat emptor.
W = Weis, _Magna_Charta_Sureties,_1215_, 4th ed.
WFT = Broderbund's World Family Tree CD, [vol]:[num] Caveat emptor.
WMC = Wurt's Magna Charta, [vol]:[page]
Andrew S. Kalinkin
> born circa 1500/1504, died 19 July 1543
> married (1) 31 January 1520/1521
> William Cary, son of Thomas Carey, of Chilton, and Margaret Spencer (she is
> a descendant of Edward III)
How? Can you give a line of descent, please?
> born circa 1495, died 22 June 1528
> married (2)
> Sir William Stafford
> born circa 1512, died 1556
Any relations with other Staffords?
> 3.William Knollys, Earl of Banbury, Viscount Wallingford
> born circa 1545, died 25 May 1632 London
> married (2) contract 23 December 1605
> Lady Elizabeth Howard, daughter of Lord Thomas Howard,
> 1st Earl of Suffolk, and Catherine Knyvett
> baptised 11 August 1586 Saffron Walden
> died 17 April 1658, buried Dorking, Surrey
> he was childless
Didn't his second wife bear several children while she
was married to William Knollys, but who were fathered
by her lover and later second husband, lord Vaux of
Harrowden? I remember that tis topic discussed here
last June (or maybe it was in a.t.r?)
> 8.Robert Carey, 1st Earl of Monmouth
> born circa 1560, died 12 April 1593 Berwick-upon-Tweed
> Elizabeth Trevannion, daughter of Sir Hugh Trevannion
> and Sybilla Morgan
> died before July 1641 (date will proven)
> buried Rickmansworth
> children Generation III-8
and later...
> Generation III-8
> 1.Henry Carey, 2nd Earl of Monmouth
> baptised 27 January 1596 Denham
Was he really baptised 3 years after his father's death?
Or maybe 1593 is the date of 1st earrl's marriage, not
his death?
> 2.Lady Dorothy Devereux
> died 3 August 1619, buried Petworth
> married (1) July 1583
> Sir Thomas Perrott, son of Sir John Perrott, of
> Haroldstone, and Anne Cheney
Was this that Sir John Perrott who also alleged to be
a Henry VIII's son?
> Generation III-3.
> 1.Elizabeth West
> born 11 September 1573, died 15 January 1633
> married 12 February 1594 Wherwell, co.Hants.
> Herbert Pelham, son of Anthony Pelham and Margaret Hall
> born circa 1564
> 3.Penelope West
> born 9 September 1582, died circa 1619
> married circa 1599
> Herbert Pelham, son of Herbert Pelham and Catherine Thatcher
> born circa 1580, died 20 July 1624 Boston, County Lincoln
Here two sisters married to two different Herberts Pelhams.
Are they related somehow? Any relations to later duke of
Newcastle?
> 3.Henry Carey, 1st Earl of Dover, 4th Lord Hunsdon
> born circa 1580, buried 13 April 1666 Hunsdon
> married (1) before 1608
> Judith Pelham, daughter of Sir Thomas Pelham, of
> Laughton, 1st Baronet, and Mary Walsingham
Is this Sir Thomas Pelham a great-great-grandfather
of Thomas Pelham-Holles, Duke of Newcastle, british
18-century prime minister?
> 1.Emanuel Scrope, Earl of Sunderland
> born 1 Aughust 1584 Hunsdon, Herts.
> died 30 May 1630
Was he also 11th Lord Scrope of Bolton?
> Hope this helps
It really does.
Andrew S. Kalinkin
Moscow, Russia
Alex Polenov
Why Spencers is such popular name in England? What it means?
sincerely,
Alex
ED MANN
>
> >> Mary Boleyn
> >> born circa 1500/1504, died 19 July 1543
> >> married (1) 31 January 1520/1521
> >> William Cary, son of Thomas Carey, of Chilton, and Margaret Spencer (she is
> >> a descendant of Edward III)
> >> married (2)
> >> Sir William Stafford
> >> born circa 1512, died 1556
> >
> >Any relations with other Staffords?
>
> I would have recorded them. Does anyone know? (Ed Mann?)
I didn't even have the 2d marriage.
William Addams Reitwiesner
>Henry VIII acknowledged only one illegitimate child, the son born to him
>by the then-unmarried Elizabeth Blount. Some sort of provision had to be
>made for that son, including a surname. Mary Boleyn's children were born
>after she was married, so their legal father was her husband Carey; they
>needed no surname, and strictly speaking apart from whatever wealth he chose
>to bestow on Mary and her husband, Henry didn't have to provide for Mary's
>children in the same way he did for Henry FitzRoy. Likewise, the king never
>acknowledged John Parrott, whose mother (a Beaumont) was married, nor Audrey,
^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^
The normal spellings are "Perrot" and "Berkeley", respectively.
>whose mother, a court laundress, was unmarried but whose paternity was
>acknowledged by another servant Henry paid handsomely for doing so.
>
>Henry provided well for Audrey, who made a good marriage but died childless in
>early adulthood. Edward VI made John Parrott a knight of the Bath, and he did
>well in various official capacities in the reign of Elizabeth I, who also
>provided well for the Careys.
The only evidence I've seen for Perrot being a child of Henry VIII was
Perrot's own self-aggrandizing hints when he was middle-aged. Do you know
of anything more substantial to support Perrot's alleged Tudor parentage?
William Addams Reitwiesner
wr...@erols.com
"Sic gorgiamus allos subjectatos nunc."
D. Spencer Hines
2. No doubt some genealogical wag will now prove that H. Ross Perot
is a descendant of this "John Perrot."
3. Other genealogical wags will then claim that Ross Perot is a
bastard descendant of Henry VIII.
D. Spencer Hines
Lux et Veritas
--
D. Spencer Hines --- "Words ought to be a little wild for they are the
assault of thoughts on the unthinking." John Maynard Keynes
[1883-1946] In The New Statesman and Nation, 15 July 1933
William Addams Reitwiesner wrote in message
<365c6e3c...@news.erols.com>...
John Carmi Parsons
than that for Mary Boleyn's children. Perrott certainly did refer to
himself on occasion as Elizabeth I's brother--and she never contradicted
him nor told him to stop it. The early stages of his public career were
accelerated for someone of Perrott's otherwise-undistinguished birth. He
was brought to court shortly before Henry VIII's death, when Perrott's
striking physical resemblance to the king was already much remarked, and
John was made a knight of the Bath for Edward VI's coronation in 1547, when
he can hardly have been more than 22 and had never had an opportunity to
distinguish himself militarily. In the early years of Elizabeth I's reign he
was prominent in her immediate entourage; in fact he is the only individual
other than Elizabeth herself mentioned by name in the official account of her
coronation procession through London.
John Parsons
U...@aol.com
leov...@IINET.NET.AU writes:
<< Edward III
1312-1377
I >>
Descendants of Edward III, King of England\\
Generation No. 1
1. EDWARD III, KING OF ENGLAND (EDWARD II, KING OF ENGLAND, EDWARD I, KING
OF ENGLAND, HENRY III, KING OF ENGLAND, JOHN PLANTAGENET, KING OF ENGLAND,
HENRY II, KING OF ENGLAND, GEOFFREY V PLANTAGENET, FULK V OF ANJOU, FULK IV OF
ANJOU, GEOFFREY II OF GATINAIS, GEOFFREY I OF GATENOIS1) was born 13-Nov-1312
in Windsor Castle, Windsor, BRK, ENG, and died 21-Jun-1377 in Sheen Palace,
now Richmond, SRY, ENG. He married PHILIPPA DE HAINAULT 24-Jan-1328/29 in
York Minster, ENG, daughter of GUILLAUME and JEANNE.
Notes for EDWARD III, KING OF ENGLAND:
Edward of Windsor, King Edward III. (1327-1377), Earl of Chester and Duke of
Aquitaine, was born at Windsor November 13, 1312 and succeeded to the throne
of England January 13, 1327, while his father was still alive. The Queen
Mother and Roger de Mortimer governed in his name for a time, until he
rejected their assistance and had Mortimer executed. The reign of King Edward
III. was filled with great domestic achievements and foreign wars. He
renounced his right to Scotland in 1328, but to make good his claim to France
in right of his mother, he invaded that country in 1339. He defeated the
French at Crecy (Cressy) August 24, 1346. During his absence in France, the
Scots invaded England. At the battle of Neville's Cross on October 17, 1346,
Edward took King David of Scotland prisoner. He took Calais on August 3, of
the following year. In 1350 he defeated the Spaniards at sea, and in 1356,
winning the battle of Poitiers, he took King John of France captive. He died
at Richmond, co. Surrey, June 21, 1377, and was buried at Westminster. He
married on January 24, 1329 Philippa of Hainault, daughter of William, Count
of Holland and Hainault. She died August 15,
1369 and was also buried at Westminster.
Notes for PHILIPPA DE HAINAULT:
aka d'Avesnes
Children of EDWARD and PHILIPPA are:
2. i. EDWARD OF WALES, b. 15-Jun-1330; d. 8-Jun-1376.
3. ii. ISABELLA PLANTAGENET, b. 16-Jun-1332; d. 1382.
iii. JOAN PLANTAGENET, b. Jan-1334/35; d. 2-Sep-1348.
Notes for JOAN PLANTAGENET:
Contracted to marry Pedro, King of Castile, but died enroute to Spain
iv. WILLIAM OF HATFIELD, b. 1337; d. 1337.
4. v. LIONEL OF ANTWERP, b. 29-Nov-1338, Antwerpen; d. 17-Oct-1368, Piedmont.
5. vi. JOHN OF GAUNT, b. Mar-1339/40, St. Bavon's Abbey, Ghent, Flanders,
Netherlands; d. 3-Feb-1398/99, Leicester Castle, ENG.
6. vii. EDMUND OF LANGLEY, b. 5-Jun-1341, King's Langley, HRT, ENG; d.
1-Aug-1402, King's Langley, HRT, ENG.
viii. BLANCHE PLANTAGENET, b. 1342; d. 1342.
ix. MARY PLANTAGENET, b. 10-Oct-1344; d. 1362; m. JEAN OF BRITTANY.
Notes for JEAN OF BRITTANY:
Duke
x. MARGARET PLANTAGENET, b. 20-Jul-1346; d. 1361; m. JOHN DE HASTINGS, 1359.
Notes for JOHN DE HASTINGS:
2nd Earl of Pembroke
xi. WILLIAM PLANTAGENET, b. 1348; d. 1348.
7. xii. THOMAS OF WOODSTOCK, b. 7-Jan-1354/55, Woodstock, OXF, ENG; d.
Sep-1397, Calais.
Generation No. 2
2. EDWARD OF WALES (EDWARD III, KING OF ENGLAND, EDWARD II, KING OF ENGLAND,
EDWARD I, KING OF ENGLAND, HENRY III, KING OF ENGLAND, JOHN PLANTAGENET, KING
OF ENGLAND, HENRY II, KING OF ENGLAND, GEOFFREY V PLANTAGENET, FULK V OF
ANJOU, FULK IV OF ANJOU, GEOFFREY II OF GATINAIS, GEOFFREY I OF GATENOIS) was
born 15-Jun-1330, and died 8-Jun-1376. He married JOAN PLANTAGENET
10-Oct-1361, daughter of EDMOND and MARGARET WAKE.
Notes for EDWARD OF WALES:
Edward Plantaganet, the Black Prince, Prince of Wales, an original Knight of
the Garter, married his cousin, Joan, "The Fair Maid of Kent", widow of Thomas
de Holand, descended from Surety Saire de Quincy, and of a family that settled
at Holand in Lancashire. By this previous marriage they had Thomas de Holand,
who married Alice Fitz Alan; John de Holand, Earl of Huntingdon, who married
Elizabeth Plantaganet, left issue; Joan Holand, who married John, Duke of
Brittany; and Maud, married (1) Hugh de Corteney, and (2) Waleran, Earl of St.
Paul. Edward and Joan were parents of Richard of Bordeaux, Prince of Wales and
afterwards King Richard II. of England, who reigned from 1377 to 1399, and who
died without issue. The Black Prince died in 1376. Joan died in 1385.
Always optimistic--Dave
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------
Edward, The Black Prince [1330-1376] was one of the original Knights of the
Garter. He had won both his spurs and the well known ostrich plumes at the
Battle of Crecy, 26 Aug 1346, when he was but 16 and commanded the cavalry, on
the right. He fought at Crecy under his Father Edward III's overall command.
He himself originated the motto first used by him as Prince of Wales and by
all subsequent Princes of Wales. Edward's precise spelling of the motto was:
"Homout; Ich Dene" [Courage, I serve] --- an interesting linguistic
medley --- and there have been later variant spellings.
With independent command, he won a second famous victory over the French at
the Battle of Poitiers, 19 Sep 1356. He captured the French King, Jean II,
treated him well and with chivalry --- but forced him to pay a ransom of
3,000,000 gold crowns and to cede Aquitaine to the English.
D. Spencer Hines
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
----------------------------------------------------
Actually, the Black Prince was the victor at the battle of Poitiers in which
King Jean le Bon of France was captured. He participated at Crecy 26 Aug 1346
and commanded one division or battle, but Edward III was present and commanded
the forces. He, not his son, was the victor at Crecy.
Ky W. White
your friendly neighborhood military history buff
Notes for JOAN PLANTAGENET:
The Fair Maid Of Kent
Joan became Countess of Kent in her own right after the death of her
brother, but the title of Countess of Salisbury is dubious at best. She
married Sir Thomas Holland clandestinely at the age of twelve and, as an
adult, had two children by him. But when he went off to Prussia the
next year, she was married off to William Montagu, Earl of Salisbury, in
the house of whose parents she lived.. When Holland returned, he pressed
a suit of nullity, and got his wife back. So Joan was never legally
married to Montagu, and thus never legally Countess of Salisbury. Her
marriage to the Black Prince was also clandestine and, at first, most
irregular as they needed a dispensation because they were first cousins.
When things got straightened out, she became the mother of Richard II.
She must have been something, leading what is probably the most
fascinating life of any English woman of the 14th century. The gossip
columns would have had a field day.
If anyone knows of a good modern biography of her, I would appreciate
hearing about it.
John Steele Gordon
Child of EDWARD and JOAN is:
i. RICHARD13 II, KING OF ENGLAND, d. 1399; m. ISABELLA OF FRANCE.
Notes for RICHARD II, KING OF ENGLAND:
Prince of Wales, King from 1377-1399, deposed in 1399, died without issue.
Notes for ISABELLA OF FRANCE:
2nd wife of Richard II
3. ISABELLA PLANTAGENET12 (EDWARD11 III, KING OF ENGLAND, EDWARD10 II, KING
OF ENGLAND, EDWARD9 I, KING OF ENGLAND, HENRY8 III, KING OF ENGLAND, JOHN7
PLANTAGENET, KING OF ENGLAND, HENRY6 II, KING OF ENGLAND, GEOFFREY V
PLANTAGENET5, FULK V OF ANJOU4, FULK IV OF ANJOU3, GEOFFREY II OF GATINAIS2,
GEOFFREY I OF GATENOIS1) was born 16-Jun-1332, and died 1382. She married
ENGUERRAND DE COUCY 27-Jul-1365.
Notes for ENGUERRAND DE COUCY:
Earl of Bedford, VII Count of Coucy
Children of ISABELLA and ENGUERRAND are:
8. i. MARIE DE COUCY13, d. Abt. 1405.
ii. PHILIPPA DE COUCY.
4. LIONEL OF ANTWERP12 (EDWARD11 III, KING OF ENGLAND, EDWARD10 II, KING OF
ENGLAND, EDWARD9 I, KING OF ENGLAND, HENRY8 III, KING OF ENGLAND, JOHN7
PLANTAGENET, KING OF ENGLAND, HENRY6 II, KING OF ENGLAND, GEOFFREY V
PLANTAGENET5, FULK V OF ANJOU4, FULK IV OF ANJOU3, GEOFFREY II OF GATINAIS2,
GEOFFREY I OF GATENOIS1) was born 29-Nov-1338 in Antwerpen, and died
17-Oct-1368 in Piedmont. He married (1) ELIZABETH DE BURGH 9-Sep-1342 in
Tower of London, daughter of WILLIAM and MAUD. He married (2) VIOLANTE
VISCONTI 25-Apr-1368, daughter of GALEAZZO VISCONTI.
Notes for LIONEL OF ANTWERP:
Lionel Plantaganet of Antwerp, Duke of Clarence, Knight of the Garter, born
November 29, 1338, died at Piedmont October 17, 1368, married (1) Elizabeth
Burgh, daughter of William de Burgh, a descendant of the Surety, William de
Lanvellei. She died in 1363, leaving an only daughter, Philippa, who married
Edmund Mortimer, Earl of March. They in turn were parents of Roger Mortimer,
Earl of March. He was father of Edmund Mortimer, Earl of March, and Anne
Mortimer, who married Richard, Earl of Cambridge. They were parents of
Richard, Duke of York, father of Edward IV., King of England (1461-1483), and
Richard III., King of England (1483-1485). Edward IV. was father of (1) Edward
V., King of England (1483); (2) Richard, Duke of York; and (3) Elizabeth, who
married Henry VII., King of England. Lionel married (2) Violante Visconti,
daughter of Galeazzo Visconti, Prince of Milan, but they had no children.
Notes for ELIZABETH DE BURGH:
Countess of Ulster
Child of LIONEL and ELIZABETH is:
9. i. PHILIPPA OF CLARENCE13, b. 16-Aug-1355, Eltham Palace, KEN, ENG; d.
1-Jan-1381/82.
5. JOHN OF GAUNT12 (EDWARD11 III, KING OF ENGLAND, EDWARD10 II, KING OF
ENGLAND, EDWARD9 I, KING OF ENGLAND, HENRY8 III, KING OF ENGLAND, JOHN7
PLANTAGENET, KING OF ENGLAND, HENRY6 II, KING OF ENGLAND, GEOFFREY V
PLANTAGENET5, FULK V OF ANJOU4, FULK IV OF ANJOU3, GEOFFREY II OF GATINAIS2,
GEOFFREY I OF GATENOIS1) was born Mar-1339/40 in St. Bavon's Abbey, Ghent,
Flanders, Netherlands, and died 3-Feb-1398/99 in Leicester Castle, ENG. He
married (1) BLANCHE OF LANCASTER 13-May-1359 in Reading, daughter of HENRY and
ISABEL. He married (2) PRINCESS OF CASTILE COSTANZA Sep-1371 in Bordeaux,
daughter of PEDRO and MARIA. He married (3) KATHERINE DE ROËT 13-Jan-1395/96
in Lincoln Cathedral, LIN, ENG, daughter of PAYNE DE ROËT.
Notes for JOHN OF GAUNT:
John Plantaganet of Gaunt, created 1st Duke of Lancaster in consequence of his
marriage to Blanche, Earl of Richmond on 20 Sep 1342 Knight of the Garter. He
was born in 1340 and died in 1399. He married (1) Blanche of Lancaster,
daughter of Henry, Duke of Lancaster, granddaughter of Henry, Earl of
Lancaster, and great-granddaughter of Edmund Plantaganet, Crouchback, Earl of
Lancaster. She died in 1369. Their first son, Henry, surnamed Bolingbroke,
Duke of Hereford, became King Henry IV. (1399-1413). By the right of his 2nd
wife Constanza, he assumed the title of King of Castile and Léon in 1371.
Henry also married Mary Bohun, daughter of Humphrey de Bohun X. Their son was
King Henry V. (1413-1422), and his grandson was King Henry VI. (1422-1461).
The second son of John and Blanche was John Beaufort, Marquess of Somerset,
Earl of Somerset, the great-grandfather of Henry VII., King of England
(1485-1509), who married Elizabeth, daughter of Edward IV.
From 1376 until his death his diplomatic and military services in France, and
Guienne, and in Scotland, and his Spanish expedition [1386-1388] formed
interludes in the factious life of politics in which, as eldest uncle of King
Richard II and his chief subject, he was involved. He was created Duke of
Aquitane on 2 March 1394. Buried at St. Paul's Cathedral with 1st wife.
[N.B. *Gent*, Dutch. The English is "Ghent" and it is now in Belgium. The
term "Gaunt" is a corruption of Ghent. It was never employed after he was
three years old. It stuck, and became the popularly accepted form of his
name because William Shakespeare, in "Richard II" referred to him by the
name John of Gaunt.]
Notes for BLANCHE OF LANCASTER:
Received Pontefract, Lancashire, and Chesire, etc.. Buried at St. paul's
cathedral. Chaucer's Boke of the Duchesse is the author's tribute to her
memory.
Notes for KATHERINE DE ROËT:
Was at first the governess of John Gaunt's daughters, then his mistress, by
whom she had four children, then his wife. This marriage was ratified and
confirmed durin the Great Schism by the Roman pope, Boniface IX. Their three
sons were legitimized, with the assent of Parliament, on 9 February 1396/7,
the patent confirmed by King Henry IV on 10 February 1406/7, but with a saving
clause barring them from succession to the throne. Their children were given
the name Beaufort from their father's [lost] castle in Champagne which had
devolved on him through his first wife, Blanche of lancaster, a descendant of
Blanche d'Artois who had purchased the lordship of Beaufort in 1270.
Buried at Lincoln Cathedral.
Children of JOHN and BLANCHE are:
10. i. PHILIPPE OF LANCASTER13, b. 31-Mar-1360; d. 1415.
ii. JOHN OF LANCASTER, b. Abt. 1362; d. young.
11. iii. ELIZABETH OF LANCASTER, b. 1362; d. 24-Nov-1425.
iv. EDWARD OF LANCASTER, b. Abt. 1365; d. young.
v. JOHN OF LANCASTER, b. Abt. 4-May-1366; d. young.
12. vi. HENRY IV, KING OF ENGLAND, b. Apr-1366, Bolingbroke Castle. LIN, ENG;
d. 20-Mar-1412/13, Westminster.
vii. ISABEL OF LANCASTER, b. Abt. 1368; d. young.
Children of JOHN and PRINCESS COSTANZA are:
13. viii. CATHERINE OF LANCASTER13, b. Abt. 1372, Hertford; d. 2-Jun-1418,
Vallalodid.
ix. JOHN OF LANCASTER, b. 1374, Ghent; d. young.
Children of JOHN and KATHERINE are:
14. x. JOHN13 BEAUFORT, b. Abt. 1371; d. 16-Mar-1409/10, London, ENG.
15. xi. HENRY BEAUFORT, b. Abt. 1375; d. 11-Apr-1447, Winchester, ENG.
16. xii. THOMAS BEAUFORT, b. Abt. Jan-1376/77; d. 31-Dec-1426, Greenwich.
17. xiii. JOAN BEAUFORT, b. Abt. 1379, Beufort, Anjou, FRA; d. 13-Nov-1440,
Howden, YKS, ENG.
6. EDMUND OF LANGLEY12 (EDWARD11 III, KING OF ENGLAND, EDWARD10 II, KING OF
ENGLAND, EDWARD9 I, KING OF ENGLAND, HENRY8 III, KING OF ENGLAND, JOHN7
PLANTAGENET, KING OF ENGLAND, HENRY6 II, KING OF ENGLAND, GEOFFREY V
PLANTAGENET5, FULK V OF ANJOU4, FULK IV OF ANJOU3, GEOFFREY II OF GATINAIS2,
GEOFFREY I OF GATENOIS1) was born 5-Jun-1341 in King's Langley, HRT, ENG, and
died 1-Aug-1402 in King's Langley, HRT, ENG. He married (1) ISABELLA DE
CASTILLA 1-Jan-1370/71 in HRT, ENG, daughter of PEDRO and MARIA. He married
(2) JOAN DE HOLAND 4-Nov-1393, daughter of THOMAS and ALICE.
Notes for EDMUND OF LANGLEY:
1st Duke of York, buried at Church of the Mendicant Friars, HRT, ENG
Notes for ISABELLA DE CASTILLA:
Buried King's Langley Church, Langley, HRT, ENG
Notes for JOAN DE HOLAND:
Joan Holand Plantagenet Willoughby Scrope Bromflete
Children of EDMUND and ISABELLA are:
i. DUKE OF YORK13 EDWARD.
Notes for DUKE OF YORK EDWARD:
Edward [1373-1415] 2nd Duke of York was killed at Azincourt, nobly and
chivalrously commanding the van, the position of honour.
Edward, Duke of York was also an accomplished scholar. He translated Gaston
Phoebus' *Livre de la Chasse* into English for Prince Hal, as *The Master of
the Game.*[Vide CP XII, p. 903] Shakespeare and Ken Branagh give *him* his
fair innings in the film *Henry V* as well.]
18. ii. CONSTANCE OF YORK, b. Abt. 1374; d. 29-Nov-1416, Reading Abbey, BRK,
ENG.
19. iii. RICHARD OF CONISBURGH, b. Abt. 1375, Conigsburgh Castle, YKS, ENG; d.
5-Aug-1415, Southampton Green, HAM, ENG.
7. THOMAS OF WOODSTOCK12 (EDWARD11 III, KING OF ENGLAND, EDWARD10 II, KING OF
ENGLAND, EDWARD9 I, KING OF ENGLAND, HENRY8 III, KING OF ENGLAND, JOHN7
PLANTAGENET, KING OF ENGLAND, HENRY6 II, KING OF ENGLAND, GEOFFREY V
PLANTAGENET5, FULK V OF ANJOU4, FULK IV OF ANJOU3, GEOFFREY II OF GATINAIS2,
GEOFFREY I OF GATENOIS1) was born 7-Jan-1354/55 in Woodstock, OXF, ENG, and
died Sep-1397 in Calais. He married ALIANOR DE BOHUN 24-Aug-1376, daughter of
HUMPHREY and JOAN.
Notes for THOMAS OF WOODSTOCK:
Knight, K.G., sixth son, was summoned to Parliament on 1 Dec. 1376, and
created Earl of Buckingham on 16 July 1377 at the Coronation of King Richard
II when he acted as Constable, and Duke of Gloucester on 6 Aug. 1385. He was
Earl of Essex jure uxoris, but not of Hereford or Northampton, and was
recognised as Constable of England jure uxoris. He was active in the French
and Scottish wars, and was the leader of the opposition against the autocratic
rule of his nephew King Richard II. After ten years of quarrelling with
Richard, he was said to have conspired to imprison the King. THOMAS OF
GLOUCESTER, Duke of Gloucester, was arrested at Pleshey, taken to Calais where
he was murdered by suffocation, it is said in a house called the Prince's Inn,
on 8 or 15 Sep. 1397 according to the confessions of his murderers, and was
buried at Westminster Abbey. His widow died testate at Minoresses Convent in
Aldgate 3 Oct. 1399, and was buried at Westminster Abbey.
Children of THOMAS and ALIANOR are:
20. i. ANNE OF GLOUCESTER13, b. Apr-1383; d. 16-Oct-1438.
ii. PHILIPPA OF GLOUCESTER, b. Abt. 1389; d. 3-Oct-1399.
iii. ISABEL OF GLOUCESTER, b. 12-Mar-1385/86; d. Apr-1402.
iv. JOAN OF GLOUCESTER, b. 1384; d. 16-Aug-1400; m. GILBERT TALBOT, Aft.
20-May-1392.
v. HUMPHREY OF GLOUCESTER, b. Apr-1382; d. 2-Sep-1399, Chester.
Notes for HUMPHREY OF GLOUCESTER:
2nd Duke of Gloucester
sk...@ix.netcom.com
Reitwiesner) wrote:
>jpar...@chass.utoronto.ca (John Carmi Parsons) wrote:
>
>>Henry VIII acknowledged only one illegitimate child, the son born to him
>>by the then-unmarried Elizabeth Blount. Some sort of provision had to be
>>made for that son, including a surname. Mary Boleyn's children were born
>>after she was married, so their legal father was her husband Carey; they
>>needed no surname, and strictly speaking apart from whatever wealth he chose
>>to bestow on Mary and her husband, Henry didn't have to provide for Mary's
>>children in the same way he did for Henry FitzRoy. Likewise, the king never
>>acknowledged John Parrott, whose mother (a Beaumont) was married, nor Audrey,
> ^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^
>The normal spellings are "Perrot" and "Berkeley", respectively.
I have Mary Berkeley; anyone know her pedigree?